Talk:Eighth generation of video game consoles

End the generational articles

I've been reading the debates on this page and propose that we delete all the 'generation of video game consoles' articles.

The articles for the specific consoles replicate all this information anyway, and typically have comparisons to contemporary consoles in those articles.

This generation of consoles idea made some sense when it started, but makes less sense as console makers are updating their hardware within generations, and now Nintendo may be forever off track from the other console cycles. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 146.129.140.158 (talk) 23:09, 18 January 2018 (UTC)

The generations are notable topics; we can't eliminate them. I do think there's other ways to present similar information and avoid the issue we're having with the Switch, for example, but they are not simple solutions. When both Sony and MS release their next console (5 some years?) the picture may be more obvious. --Masem (t) 23:53, 18 January 2018 (UTC)

I do think it's dumb and mainly a Wikipedia-lead creation on the naming (sources mainly go with "current" or "next" gen, not "8th" and "9th") but as long as sources do compare them with other generations, then there isn't really anything we can do here. Perhaps we could get rid of the generation number and go with timeframes? Although I supposed when exactly a generation started and end would be highly controversial at worst and hard to source at best. ~ Dissident93 ^(talk) 21:37, 11 March 2018 (UTC)

Feel free to make proposals, but I've edited/maintained these articles for coming up on a decade, and if there's one thing I've learned, it's that we can almost never get a consensus on major changes to the generations... Sergecross73 msg me 21:44, 11 March 2018 (UTC)

There could be confusion and overlap between generations though, which could be an issue (in regard to timeframes). Besides that, I think numbered generations are fine in the long term, but people understand last-gen, next-gen, etc. terms because of context. Zoom (talk page) 13:25, 27 March 2018 (UTC)

Do keep in mind that "8-bit generation" and "16-bit generation" were not WP-made aspects - those just became the 3rd and 4th for us when we created the numbering scheme when we tried to extend that to the rest of console history. --Masem (t) 14:34, 27 March 2018 (UTC)

Generations are still a useful means of categorizing systems. For the most part, consoles really are released in discrete generations, with several systems being released in a similar time frame, existing contemporaneously with each other over most of their lives, and nominally serving as direct competition with each other. Back in the 80s & 90s we referred to them as the "8-bit," "16-bit," and "32/64-bit" eras, so even back then it was clear that there were clear generations of consoles.

The Switch does seem to run afoul of this system, but A) the NPD considers it as being the same gen as the PS4 & XBO, and B) we do have the precedent of the Atari 2600 & 5200 existing in the same gen (though the 5200 was made to be a higher-end complement for the 2600 rather than its replacement). However, the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X most certainly do not run afoul of the notion of discrete generations. Spec upgrades to existing platforms are nothing new. They're par for course for handhelds (see the Game Boy Color, DSi, and New 3DS), and they've even happened with home consoles before, though it's been a long time (the Super-Grafx was an upgraded PC Engine/TG-16, the Sega Mark III/Master System was an upgraded SG-1000, and the Atari 7800 was an upgraded 2600). There's really nothing confusing about it if you're familiar with the history of game consoles. JGoodman (talk) 09:03, 29 March 2018 (UTC)

There are no credible sources that state the console generations have no more cultural relevance. WP:IDONTLIKEIT aplies. Sleyece (talk) 21:39, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Sales source

• http://variety.com/2018/gaming/news/xbox-one-sales-2-1202804149/amp/?__twitter_impression=true Sergecross73 msg me 13:29, 9 May 2018 (UTC)

Nintendo Switch is Eighth Generation?/Where are the Credible Sources?

The Nintendo Switch is currently listed in the eighth generation. The last I remember, there was a discrepancy as to which (8th or 9th) the switch would fall, and there would not be a decision until credible sources were available. Is the Switch listed this way for Encyclopedic reasons, or was this for convenience with zero credible sources? -- Sleyece (talk) 12:55, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

See archived discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games/Archive 137#Nintendo Switch generation -- ferret (talk) 12:57, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

WP:DEMOCRACY,WP:NOT I, or another user, will eventually be forced to challenge that vote without sufficient credible sources to back it up. Can we vote that the sky is green? Can we vote that T-Rex roam the African wilderness? -- Sleyece (talk) 13:08, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

Whether the Switch is 8th or 9th is an issue we have to decide by consensus because we don't have a strong body of RSes that suggest either route. On the other hand, we do have a huge body of references that prove why the sky is blue or why dinos don't exist any more, so consensus cannot override those. --Masem (t) 13:36, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

Sleyece, can you chill out? Not only is there a strong Wikiproject-wide consensus, as Ferret linked to above, but there was a whole table of sources being collected by someone at a talk page somewhere. I'll find it for you, since you seem to be more content on freaking out and making bad faith assumptions rather than figuring it out on your own. Sergecross73 msg me 13:37, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

Sleyece - Even worse, its in the archives of this very talk page - see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Eighth_generation_of_video_game_consoles/Archive_4#Source_list Sergecross73 msg me 13:38, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

(edit conflict) I am wondering if you fully read the discussion and its opening statement? It was based on the sourcing such as has been presented here at this talk page in the past (See archives), i.e. NPD grouping Switch as "current generation" with other 8th generation consoles, and how the various vendors and sources speak of them as competing with each other as "current generation". The discussion was not to simply "declare" that Switch was 8th generation, but to weigh and seek a consensus that these types of sources were sufficient, and the result was to place Switch here. -- ferret (talk) 13:39, 12 June 2018 (UTC):

That isn't a very large body of evidence, but it'll do for now. The consensus is good unless sourcing trends in a different direction over the next couple of years. Sergecross73, for the record, I have no chill. -- Sleyece (talk) 13:50, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

Consensus evolves, if sourcing changes or moves in another direction. The consensus is based on what (limited) sourcing we have available today. -- ferret (talk) 13:52, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

Yes, I'm open to discussing further too should things change over time. But nothings changed in these last few months, and there's even less sourcing (if any) for calling it ninth generation, so opening new discussions right now would not be beneficial. It'd likely lead to a lot of arguing without any change (or would be squashed instantly due to how strong the consensus was at the discussion.) Sergecross73 msg me 14:33, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

Updated *estimated* Xbox figures

IHS via Wall Street Journal via Gamasutra puts total sold estimated at 39M. I know we are sticking to hard MS numbers right now, I'm mostly dropping this in case there is a decision to change that. --Masem (t) 17:23, 13 June 2018 (UTC)

I forget where the discussions/consensus was, but we have started to use the the estimates or remove the old figures in other articles. The compromise at the Xbox One infobox was to drop the extremely outdated official sales figure from the infobox and just link to the sales section, where a few RS estimates are made. (This estimate would be perfect to be added there.) List of best selling game consoles uses the estimate with notes explaining the context. I wouldn't be opposed to adapting something like that here. Sergecross73 msg me 18:37, 13 June 2018 (UTC)

When?

I know there is a lot of discussion whether or not Switch began the 9th generation of video game consoles, but, considering as if it is in the 8th generation, how long do you think it is till the 9th generation? Ramesty (talk) 04:23, 18 June 2018 (UTC) Ramesty (talk) 04:23, 18 June 2018 (UTC)