Talk:Anabaptist Association of Australia and New Zealand

Untitled

The AAANZ is greatly influenced by progressive? mennonite missionaries from(? the mennonite USA denomination with its 'confession of faith in a (progressive?) mennonite perspective')and does not represent all anabaptists, eg conservative, plain, communal - collective etc. It certainly does not speak for or represent all anabaptists in Australia. Mennonite USA itself is only a very small part of the Mennonite world.It should be noted that Mennonite USA is JUST a denomination and does not speak for all anabaptists even in north America. There are already a number of visible anabaptist presense in Australia. The AAANZ is just one of many anabaptist groups in Australia. Other 'visible presences' of the anabaptist tradition in Australia include: The Mennonite Church of Hope in Fennel Bay The Australian Christian Brotherhood in Queensland The Community at Rocky Cape, in Tasmania (check the web under 'The Common Life') The Bruderhof in Inverell , New South Wales. The Perth Anabaptists (check the web under 'Perth Anabaptist'). How does the aaanz achieve accountability when they are not a congregation? Also how do they manage to have 'real community' when they are not a church? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.237.86.174 (talk) 05:45, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

Association purpose

Changing the group's goal from created to form a network to created to form another network is inconsistent with the sources provided and introduces an unhelpful and unnecessary association with other groups. It is clear that the anonymous editors making this change and other not-so-subtle changes carry a certain amount of animosity toward this group and appear to want to tear it down. Wikipedia is not the place to carry out this type of petty quarreling. It would make more sense to talk about and compare various Anabaptist groups in a general article titled "Anabaptists of Oceania" or something similar (but remember to cite reliable sources). ✤ JonHarder ^talk 11:37, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

The fact is that they ARE associated with other groups, namely Eastern Mennonite Missions and Mennonite church USA.Also it would appear from their mailings, that they are also associated with anabaptist groups in Korea and the UK. Also at one stage, according to a print out that I have, they were (externally) linked directly to the website 'Third Way Cafe'.Also the AAANZ has appeared on the Eastern Mennonite Missions web site along with their Pastors who came from the U.S. So obviously they do have a very real association with other groups.Also is it not obvious that if there is more than one anabaptist group in Australia then obviously they are another group, not the only anabaptist group in Australia as the article seems to suggest.

Also they are only one anabaptist group among others which make it 'another' anabaptist group.

And how they function in regards to accountability and as a community has not been adressed.

Also, it would appear that your have mistaken the need for clarity and information about other anabaptist groups in Australia for animosity.I have supported AAANZ and I still make mention of them in my emails to others who are searching for anabaptist groups in Australia. So it is not a case of trying to tear it down, it is rather an attempt to help others when they are searching for anabaptist groups in Australia.But I must say it is extremely exasperating and frustrating to have to continually inform others about other anabaptists group that I do get rather annoyed at times and that remarks are less than favorable.

Why is there not any mention of other anabaptists groups in Australia? I feel AAANZ is over represented at Wikapedia while there is no mention of other anabaptists groups in Australia. As one searches anabaptism on wikapedia the AAANZ gets a lot of mention and one gets the impression that the authors of these articles seem to suggest that the AAANZ is the be all and end all of anabaptism in Australia. It seem that there is a lot of bias for AAANZ? If you were to do a web search of the other Anabaptist groups that have been mentioned on this discussion page you would get plenty of information/sources about other anabaptist groups that could be mentioned in this article and other articles about anabaptism in Australia.When other anabaptist groups in Australia are mentioned in wikapedia articles concerning anabaptism I am sure that others will be happy to stop editing anabaptist articles that only mention the AAANZ.

I feel where Australian anabaptism is concerned, if a person were to search anabaptism articles about anabaptist groups in Australia they would get the impression that the AAANZ is the only anabaptist group in Australia. That is/was not helpful (and it did not help me)when one is trying to get an accurate picture of anabaptism in Australia.If Wikapedia's anabaptist work group could help in giving a fair and equitable mention of other anabaptists groups in Australia it would not only save me a lot of time and trouble it would also be just. Also, the AAANZ in a recently mailing, confessed that there are other anabaptist groups in Australia that also have an anabaptist vision, so why can't the wikapedia articles about anabaptism also include these groups? Why not mention them as well? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.237.86.174 (talk) 04:35, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

This is an article about a specific group, so there is no need, nor is it helpful to include other groups here. You concerns are best addressed by creating a separate, more general article. Changing the purpose of this group to something not supported by the references makes the lead sentence factually incorrect and is not a good way to try to indicate that there are other groups out there. ✤ JonHarder ^talk 12:07, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

How can I change the purpose of a group? That does not make any sense.You could indicate that there are other anabaptist groups by mentioning then in the external links section as you have done with 'Mennonites in Australia'. In the externa links you have, in fact, put in a link to an article at third way cafe. Therefore you also have mentioned Mennonite Church of Hope. Why not put external links to other anabaptist groups in Australia. They too have web sites. It is YOU who do not have the facts. Do you support the AAANZ? - is this your reason for wanting to exclude mention of the following?:

Australian Christian Brotherhood The 'Common Life' Rocky Point Tasmania (They have a website by the same name). The Bruderhof,'Danthonia Community',Inverell, New South Wales(They have a web site search under Danthonia). 'The Australia Anabaptist' -Tasmania (a link to this organization can be found on the web site of The Australian Christian Brotherhood) The Mennonite Church of Hope at Marmong Point -Fennel Bay. The 'Australia Christian Brotherhood' (They also have a web site by the same name). Include these in your external links or articles about anabaptism will probably just keep getting edited. It is offensive to not include these groups in the articles about anabaptism. I believe you are showing your bias. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.237.86.174 (talk) 22:04, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

This is an article about a specific organization. It is appropriate to link to websites that are used as references for the article topic. There is only one link in the external link section, and that is to the apparent official website of AAANZ. It is not appropriate to make this article into a general piece about all of the Mennonite or Anabaptist groups in the region. This is a style convention covered in the stay on topic section of the writing better articles guideline. That information belongs in a separate, more general article. I expect someone will eventually create one, but you could sign up for an account and do it yourself. You also might want to familiarize yourself with talk page guidelines, particularly the parts about signing posts and layout. ✤ JonHarder ^talk 12:41, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

Membership

I question their membership numbers. Third Way Cafe puts their numbers at 30. I feel that this article needs updating from a reliable, non - AAANZ source.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.111.130.132 (talk) 22:59, 27 June 2008 (UTC) Third Way Cafe puts their membership at 35, not 30. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.108.196.146 (talk) 07:26, 9 July 2008 (UTC) In the article it says that a hall mark of anabaptism is that Church membership is voluntary: Well, in my lifetime of going to church I am yet to see anyone screaming and kicking against being dragged to ANY church service, (no more than some Mennonites dragging their kids to church when the kids don't want to go). In the article it says that baptism upon confession of faith. True, but infant baptizing churches confirm their confession of faith in the creed they recite each Sunday morning - anabaptist don't. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.108.167.20 (talk) 22:51, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

"church membership is voluntary and members are accountable to the Bible (read through the revelation of Jesus) and to each other" how does accountability work when they don't belong to the same congregation? As for being accountable to the Bible. Well my expereince is that the members are more accountable to their political idealogy than the bible. those text which support their politcal view, especially when it comes to the State of Isreal and the Palestinian cause, are the ones they reverence. As far as I have expereinced this organization is nothing more than a rabid political activist group who use selected sayings of Jesus, (or those attributed to Him),to support their political cause. They seem to spend so much time patting each other on the back is seems to be more of a mutual admiration society. They differ very litle to secular peace activists. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.108.167.20 (talk) 23:00, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Anabaptist Association of Australia and New Zealand/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

The AAANZ is just one of many 'presenses' of the anabaptist tradition which exist in Australia. See discussion page for references to other anabaptists groups in Australia.

Last edited at 04:47, 4 April 2008 (UTC). Substituted at 07:40, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

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As you can see from the below listed articles shows that MCC has a history of lies by omission and cover ups. This is who this group looks to for inspiration.

Based on their involvement with Nazis Mennonites, American Mennonites are a pretence at being anabaptists and I can't see any connection between them and historical non resistant Anabaptism. The Amish are a group more aligned with historical Anabaptism. https://lisaschirch.wordpress.com/2018/05/09/mennonites-nazism-white-supremacy-and-the-holocaust-a-summary/

https://themennonite.org/daily-news/scholars-address-nazi-influence-on-mennonites/

https://anabaptisthistorians.org/2018/06/14/five-myths-about-mennonites-and-the-holocaust/