Talk:Model minority: Difference between revisions

Content deleted Content added

Inline

Revision as of 16:54, 13 August 2019

The contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to the intersection of race/ethnicity and human abilities and behaviour, which is a contentious topic. Please consult the procedures and edit carefully.

Arbitration Ruling on Race and Intelligence

The article Model minority, along with other articles relating to the area of conflict (namely, the intersection of race/ethnicity and human abilities and behaviour, broadly construed), is currently subject to active arbitration remedies, described in a 2010 Arbitration Committee case where the articulated principles included:

Pillars: Wikipedia articles must be neutral, verifiable and must not contain original research. Those founding principles (the Pillars) are not negotiable and cannot be overruled, even when apparent consensus to do so exists.
Original research: Wikipedia defines "original research" as "facts, allegations, ideas, and stories not already published by reliable sources". In particular, analyses or conclusions not already published in reliable, third-party, published sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy are not appropriate for inclusion in articles.
Correct use of sources: Wikipedia articles should be based on reliable, published secondary sources and, to a lesser extent, on tertiary sources. Primary sources are permitted if used carefully. All interpretive claims, analyses, or synthetic claims about primary sources must be referenced to a secondary source, rather than to original analysis of the primary-source material by Wikipedia editors.
Advocacy: Wikipedia strives towards a neutral point of view. Accordingly, it is not the appropriate venue for advocacy or for advancing a specific point of view. While coverage of all significant points of view is a necessary part of balancing an article, striving to give exposure to minority viewpoints that are not significantly expressed in reliable secondary sources is not.
Single purpose accounts: Single purpose accounts are expected to contribute neutrally instead of following their own agenda and, in particular, should take care to avoid creating the impression that their focus on one topic is non-neutral, which could strongly suggest that their editing is not compatible with the goals of this project.
Decorum: Wikipedia users are expected to behave reasonably, calmly, and courteously in their interactions with other users; to approach even difficult situations in a dignified fashion and with a constructive and collaborative outlook; and to avoid acting in a manner that brings the project into disrepute. Unseemly conduct, such as personal attacks, incivility, assumptions of bad faith, harassment, or disruptive point-making, is prohibited.
Tag-team editing: Tag teams work in unison to push a particular point of view. Tag-team editing – to thwart core policies (neutral point of view, verifiability, and no original research); or to evade procedural restrictions such as the three revert rule or to violate behavioural norms by edit warring; or to attempt to exert ownership over articles; or otherwise to prevent consensus prevailing – is prohibited.

If you are a new editor, or an editor unfamiliar with the situation, please follow the above guidelines. You may also wish to review the full arbitration case page. If you are unsure if your edit is appropriate, discuss it here on this talk page first.

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Model minority article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: Index, 1, 2: 365 days

Model minority is a former featured article candidate. Please view the links under Article milestones below to see why the nomination failed. For older candidates, please check the archive.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
August 2, 2005	Featured article candidate	Not promoted

United States: Asian Americans / History C‑class Low‑importance

	United States portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions. Template Usage Articles Requested! Become a Member Project Talk Alerts United StatesWikipedia:WikiProject United StatesTemplate:WikiProject United StatesUnited States articles
C	This article has been rated as C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Asian Americans (assessed as High-importance).
	This article is supported by WikiProject U.S. history.

Discrimination C‑class Mid‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Discrimination, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Discrimination on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.DiscriminationWikipedia:WikiProject DiscriminationTemplate:WikiProject DiscriminationDiscrimination articles
C	This article has been rated as C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the importance scale.

Archives

Index 1, 2

This page has archives. Sections older than 365 days may be automatically archived by when more than 10 sections are present.

This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Aprodis97 (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Aprodis97. This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Lilpichu, Mchang38 (article contribs). This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Ejia1 (article contribs). This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Peer reviewers: Gshreya.

re: --Nectarflowed 22:28, 20 Mar 2005 (UTC

You stated that numerical restrictions on Asian immigration to America were irrelevent; I disagree vigorously. Consider this: where are new immigrants likely to find adapting to a new country the most easy? Answer: within a group of their national/ethnic peers. So, Asian-American immigrants would have a far easier time after immigration if larger numbers of their group were present in established communities.

I believe you're referring to my mention above of my removal of the sentence:

"The Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882 barred Chinese from immigrating to the United States."

The dynamic you describe sounds possible. I think though that this topic is currently dealt with adequately in the section Model_minority#History_of_discrimination, and going into too detailed history there is beyond what is needed for this article's purpose. --Nectarflowed ^(talk) 08:22, 22 April 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Recent African Immigrants

It may be relevant for this article to also highlight the experience of recent African Immigrants to the United States. Recent African and Caribbean migrants have a different experience from Black Americans whose ancestors endured slavery, persecution, and discriminatory laws for centuries. Recent black migrants, without the mental hindrance of centuries of racism, have generally performed socio-economically better than native-born minorities. They are typically middle to upper-middle class in status, and their crime rates are far below the national average. In many areas in fact, recent black migrants out-perform every other group in the United States. Nigerians for instance according to the US Census Bureau, are the best educated group in the United States, ahead of Whites and Asians. Their children as second generation Americans, also tend to be well-educated above the national average.

While it may not be possible to examine every subset of a population, demographic variations within the "African-American" population deserves some attention when discussing the notion of "model minority". Merlin1935 (talk) 16:54, 13 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Chinese Exclusion Act

I don't get what the 100 Chinese per year is taken from. Actually, I happen to have a copy of the 2001 version of the US　Immigration and Naturalization service in front of me. Unfortunately, it'll only give me the numbers for decades. However, it should like like this

1871-80： 123,201 1881-90: 61,711 1891-1900: 14,799 1901-10: 20,605 1911-20: 21,278 1921-30: 29,907 1931-40: 4,928 1941-50: 16,709 1951-60: 9,657 1961-70: 34,764 1971-80: 124,326

(Taiwan included from 1957)

Even in the decade with the smallest number of immigrants, it's almost 500 people a year. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tangsiuje (talk • contribs) 04:35, 5 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

More Information for different races

There are lots of information for specific races, but if they had more information about different races, I think that would be better. Also, if they would have links or articles on real stories about model minority from different people. Maybe have a counterargument about model minority on the page. It would help when someone wanted to grab more information about the subject for an essay and then want a counterargument.^[1] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Janeeejang (talk • contribs) 23:35, 7 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ http://cmhc.utexas.edu/modelminority.html

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Model minority. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120915032008/http://www.iomlondon.org/doc/mapping/IOM_SUDAN.pdf to http://www.iomlondon.org/doc/mapping/IOM_SUDAN.pdf
Added {{dead link}} tag to http://news.walla.co.il/item/279897
Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090327124211/https://confines.mty.itesm.mx/articulos2/GarciaRE.pdf to http://confines.mty.itesm.mx/articulos2/GarciaRE.pdf

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}).

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 23:05, 10 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Microaggression

Model Minority is another form of stereotype towards different ethnic groups. But it's interesting that you don't hear much of how model minority can also be seen as racial microaggression if you think in terms of the eight themes of microaggression. Scholars and activism can discuss how it's denial one's racial reality when people argue about the education and socioeconomic disadvantages that Asian American faces. Another issue is when Asian Americans are being stereotyped by their "ascription of intelligence" that intertwines to how Whites assume that all Asian Americans are "alike". Whites assume that all Asian Americans look like that they all are intelligence and bright that it creates the ideal image of them having a higher degree in socioeconomic.Thus, racial microaggression is very subtle, but can be direct and indirect in how people use it in a sends a "put down" messages. <ref>[1] Kliu38 (talk) 07:18, 11 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Evaluation of this article

This article gives detailed background and a wonderful understanding of why it is that East Asians and South Asians (specifically Pakistani and Indians) are considered the model minority. It also gives insight that the "model minority" stereotype is not limited to the United States and it occurs in European countries as well.

The information offered in the article is neutral as it is mostly historical and connections made in history. It shows a bit of bias in wanting to prove that being a model minority is a myth; it is a myth because contributors of this article made sure to exemplify the stereotypes, adversities, and injustice that Asian Americans have also faced in the U.S., but others may have disregarded.

The article offers statistics/percentages of Asian Americans who obtain Bachelors degrees. The sources and references given for the article are reliable as many of them are through universities or scholarly journals.

Mchang38 (talk) 16:50, 14 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Model minority. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 18:05, 24 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Possible additions?

Hello all,

I would like to add these sources.

Kim, R. Y. (2002). Ethnic differences in academic achievement between Vietnamese and Cambodian children: Cultural and structural explanations. The Sociological Quarterly, 43(2), 213-235.

Ngo, B., & Lee, S. J. (2007). Complicating the image of model minority success: A review of Southeast Asian American education. Review of educational research, 77(4), 415-453.

Tran, N., & Birman, D. (2010). Questioning the model minority: Studies of Asian American academic performance. Asian American Journal of Psychology, 1(2), 106.

Wong, P., Lai, C. F., Nagasawa, R., & Lin, T. (1998). Asian Americans as a model minority: Self-perceptions and perceptions by other racial groups. Sociological perspectives, 41(1), 95-118.

Mnlim (talk) 22:50, 5 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified (February 2018)

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 3 external links on Model minority. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 07:51, 3 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Additions on Indian-Asians & Affects on Blacks

I added a paragraph to the Indian-Asian section of the article because it did not discuss the differences in treatment that Indians face because of social and physical factors - regardless of the money they make. I also added a new section concerning the affects of the model minority concept on Black Americans because the article didn't acknowledge in depth the direct contrast that is often made between the two minorities and why that contrast is unfair and damaging. Gi4444 (talk) 22:23, 6 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[1] ttp://cmhc.utexas.edu/modelminority.html

[1]

@@ Line 35: / Line 35: @@
 *"The [[Chinese Exclusion Act]] of 1882 barred Chinese from immigrating to the [[United States]]."
 :The dynamic you describe sounds possible.  I think though that this topic is currently dealt with adequately in the section [[Model_minority#History_of_discrimination]], and going into too detailed history there is beyond what is needed for this article's purpose. --[[User:Nectarflowed|Nectarflowed]] [[User_talk:Nectarflowed|<sup>(talk)</sup>]] 08:22, 22 April 2005 (UTC)
+== Recent African Immigrants ==
+It may be relevant for this article to also highlight the experience of recent African Immigrants to the United States. Recent African and Caribbean migrants have a different experience from Black Americans whose ancestors endured slavery, persecution, and discriminatory laws for centuries. Recent black migrants, without the mental hindrance of centuries of racism, have generally performed socio-economically better than native-born minorities. They are typically middle to upper-middle class in status, and their crime rates are far below the national average. In many areas in fact, recent black migrants out-perform every other group in the United States. Nigerians for instance according to the US Census Bureau, are the best educated group in the United States, ahead of Whites and Asians. Their children as second generation Americans, also tend to be well-educated above the national average.
+While it may not be possible to examine every subset of a population, demographic variations within the "African-American" population deserves some attention when discussing the notion of "model minority".  [[User:Merlin1935|Merlin1935]] ([[User talk:Merlin1935|talk]]) 16:54, 13 August 2019 (UTC)
 ==Chinese Exclusion Act==