Talk:Mohun Bagan Super Giant

This page should remain independent

This page is not for Mohun Bagan club which was founded in 1989. In 2020, Atletico Kolkata (ATK Football Club) and Mohun Bagan merged to form e new entity which is ATK Mohun Bagan. ATK Mohun Bagan, thus, formed only in 2020. Both the previous clubs, Mohun Bagan and ATK, their football division cease to exist now. If at all, at some point in the future, ATK Football Club and Mohun Bagan part their ways, both Mohun Bagan and ATK Football Club will be functional again. Rightfully, ATK Football Club's Wikipedia entry says the same, Mohun Bagan's wiki page is filled with misinformation.

In the upcoming ISL, neither Mohun Bagan nor ATK Football club, but ATK Mohun Bagan will compete. The prudent to keep the ATK Mohun Bagan wiki page independent.

Few links:

1. The world's leading stat keepers use ATK Mohun Bagan, which is formed in 2020 and will compete in the ISL. https://www.transfermarkt.co.in/atk-mohun-bagan-fc/transfers/verein/83266

2. The website shows Mohun Bagan as discontinued. https://www.transfermarkt.co.in/mohun-bagan-ac/startseite/verein/14101

3. The merger news, not acquisition or sponsor. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/sports/football/indian-super-league/top-stories/aiffs-kushal-das-terms-atk-mb-merger-as-very-significant-for-both-clubs/articleshow/76944939.cms https://www.outlookindia.com/newsscroll/atkmb-merger-will-help-indian-football-grow-globally-feels-osman/1894030 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Iamjplusm (talk • contribs) 06:52, 3 September 2020 (UTC)

This is an article from the ISL official website. This article uses ATK FC and ATKMB interchangeably but not MB. https://www.indiansuperleague.com/news/jobby-justin-playing-for-atk-mohun-bagan-is-a-dream-come-true — Preceding unsigned comment added by Iamjplusm (talk • contribs) 07:37, 3 September 2020 (UTC)

Merger reports from ISL websites https://www.indiansuperleague.com/news/habas-mohun-bagans-history-and-atks-energy-is-the-perfect-combination — Preceding unsigned comment added by Iamjplusm (talk • contribs) 07:41, 3 September 2020 (UTC)

Let them edit the ATK page and turn it to ATK Mohan Bagan. As the club never got dissolved it just got merged Darkarmy241998 (talk) 02:55, 7 September 2020 (UTC)

This page is fake... One team mohun bagan... Who was born 1889 Aonblack (talk) 08:18, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Why this page redirecting to Mohunbagan, ATK Mohun Bagan is new Entity. This page should remain independent SiyadKm (talk) 10:06, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Merger proposal

I propose to merge ATK Mohun Bagan F.C. into ATK Mohun Bagan FC. @ArsenalFan700: ❯❯❯ S A H A 11:27, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

I prefer the redirect but feel free to take stuff from the last revision at ATK Mohun Bagan F.C. and bring it over here. The redirect just makes things easier. --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 11:31, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

ArsenalFan700, okay. ❯❯❯ S A H A 11:43, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

ArsenalFan700, also, User:जितेंद्र33 is vandalising. ❯❯❯ S A H A 11:44, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

I am happy that we are in agreement Arnab :) --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 11:48, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

ArsenalFan700, ya. me too. btw, I think there are 2 files of the logo. lemme delete one. ❯❯❯ S A H A 11:51, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

Nominate one for deletion. Whichever one doesn't use the white space. --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 11:53, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

ArsenalFan700, done ❯❯❯ S A H A 12:06, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

ArsenalFan700, but as per press release, they will use both the stadiums. ❯❯❯ S A H A 14:33, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

Are you talking about this? If so, this doesn't confirm that they will be using the Mohun Bagan Ground, just that they hope to have it renovated so that ISL games can be held there. It isn't confirmed yet and as per the ISL website it will be the Salt Lake Stadium. --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 15:10, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

ArsenalFan700, ok. ❯❯❯ S A H A 15:46, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

No this article shouldn't be merged with atk Ganesh Tirupati (talk) 16:59, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 10 July 2020

Founded in 15th August, 1889 Adelfredmaxwell (talk) 19:15, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

Why should it be that? This is a new club. --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 20:30, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

Adelfredmaxwell,  Not done. This is a brand new club ❯❯❯ S A H A 05:56, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

New entity.Cannot have old foundation date Sonabhaumik87 (talk) 20:50, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

Atk mohun bagan is a mohun Bagan who established 1889 Aonblack (talk) 08:25, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Arnab saha giving wrong information.... Club was established 1889 Aonblack (talk) 08:27, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Arnab saha tor gar bangbe mohun bagan fan ra wait kor Aonblack (talk) 08:28, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Kolkata Derby

@ArsenalFan700:. now what to do with Kolkata Derby? ❯❯❯ S A H A 06:22, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

Kolkata derby will be there though it's a new entity Mohun Bagan loose nothing except the atk name add before it just like Paris FC and stade Saint Germain collaboration stade Saint Germain is there as Paris Saint german Avi1962 (talk) 10:01, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

This has been far more different to PSG than what most people thought. Actually the page should not exist now. The previous professional football teams for Mohun Bagan A.C. were also registered under different company names. Those did not yield separate pages simply because the hype wasn't similar. This entity should not be looked at with any other sense. This should be added to the original MBAC page actually. M Kariyappa (talk) 11:07, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

M Kariyappa, atkmb is a completely different entity, so legally mbac has no relation with atkmb ❯❯❯ S A H A 11:27, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

You are wrong see what official statement said that it's a new Avatar of Mohun Bagan .. mbac er football unit er 80% share atk kine nieche that's all Avi1962 (talk) 21:30, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

This is not a new club and this page should not exist. This is just a renaming and change of ownership. No new club can use a copyrighted previous logo. And most importantly this club will get an AFC slot because Mohun Bagan won I-League. If it was a new club then it would not have been eligible in AFC Tournament and would need to fulfill club licensing criteria. People should look at the the example of Al Duhail of Qatar. Lekhiwa page was just renamed after mereger with EL-Jaish and renaming it as AL-Duhail. AFC gave the spot to the old Lekhiwa club. So for me the history, foundation everything remains unchanged and there is no need for this page. Debarghya89 (talk) 05:55, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

Linking a reference which clearly states that owners of ATK has bought a majority stake in Mohun Bagan Football Club. The share details are also given.(https://www.business-standard.com/article/sports/rp-sanjiv-goenka-group-buys-majority-stake-in-mohun-bagan-football-club-120011601336_1.html). Debarghya89 (talk) 06:00, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

Debarghya89 u r right Avi1962 (talk) 06:18, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

I do also feel the same way. There have been change of ownership of different Indian football club teams but those didn't yield separate pages. Minerva Punjub became Punjab FC due to transfer of footballing rights, East Bengal FC became Quess East Bengal FC due to similar rights transfer. I cannot really understand, as an 'outsider', what is going on in West Bengal football fraternity that is leading to creation of unnecessary Wikipedia pages. Please post deletion requests. M Kariyappa (talk) 14:47, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

I recommend making a merger request. See this basically saying that Mohun Bagan's name was changed to ATK Mohun Bagan. You guys have a case, this article won't be deleted but instead should be merged. --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 15:28, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

Also there is another way to do that. If there is a rough consensus, a targeted redirect can be put. I can create a section in the original Mohun Bagan AC page stating the current avatar of its footballing entity. M Kariyappa (talk) 16:32, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

kari did vandalism by posting players on mb page so now got 2 pages for 1 team, cant you all see that old mb is now for other sports and new atkmb football only!!! its most correct technical way bcos old logo wouldnt cover football team at all. doesnt change any facts, copy all history on atkmb page and done! (just add founded 2020 as atk mb after initial year). other question for other talks why atk owners were like fools giving club away but thats current situation, end the mess for gods sake!!!

last...update i league map and list where mb still remains! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.131.73.212 (talk) 17:19, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

I understand your concern as an ATK or some other fan but try to understand that the logo of the footballing entity was not same as the club logo from almost start of the I-league era though that didn't yield separate pages, so why now? The other more interesting points have already been written about. M Kariyappa (talk) 03:34, 14 July 2020 (UTC)

im afc fan only...and if you keep two pages for one team its nothing but vandslism...delete one finally all of you, such shame edit wars! afc should ban club bcos indian users have 2 pages of same thing!

you say isl will have atkmb vs mb, and afc cup two bagan teams! half of players from same squads against each other? or cricket and other mb sports vs atkmb footballers? unbelievable!

either make sub pages of all mb multi sport teams including football, or as it was link mb history with atkmb page!

and wrong i league team list is another sad lie. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.131.73.212 (talk) 04:04, 14 July 2020 (UTC)

Armando Sosa Peña

@ArsenalFan700: ISL website mentions Armando Sosa Peña and not Mandi. So I think we should go with the website data. ❯❯❯   S A H A 08:22, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

You go with the article title. This is not hard. Propose a name change if you want. --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 13:40, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

ok. better to keep it as it is. ❯❯❯   S A H A 16:15, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

MB players

I incorporated the few players who are a part of ATKMB but had played previously with MB as cited by transfermarkt but there should no anticipation of reverts. Plz check this out to improve the article.

transfermarkt is not a reliable source so please don't cite it on wikipedia. --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 19:56, 15 July 2020 (UTC)

ATK Mohun Bagan Mohun Bagan AC link up

I suggest this page need to link as Mohun Bagan AC football department Avi1962 (talk) 10:00, 25 July 2020 (UTC)

I support PratyushDas1999 (talk) 17:54, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Mohun Bagan A.C. which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 14:01, 3 September 2020 (UTC)

Multiple links are not correct

Need to amend the page links. 1.Indian super league page is not pointing to this atk mohun bagan page. 2.current season of isl also not pointing to this page. Sonabhaumik87 (talk) 21:01, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

This is a redirect page. ISL league/season page will point to Mohun Bagan, that what it is, achieved through consensus. Drat8sub (talk) 21:04, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

Protect this page from misuse

Sonabhaumik87 (talk) 01:43, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

Fully protected page request

Need to fully protect from redirecting Sonabhaumik87 (talk) 01:51, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. ◢  Ganbaruby!  (Say hi!) 02:28, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

Restoring the Article

There is no consensus to redirect this page. The previous RFC was based on the votes by SPAs. It has been discussed on the Admins' noticeboard twice Administrators' noticeboard 1. 2, and those who participated in the discussion expressed the same opinion. Further discussion related to the same can be found here and here. Future discussions related to restoring the merger can be discussed here on the article's talk page. Pinging established users who participated in the RFC and the other discussions related to this subject for their comments @ArsenalFan700:, @ArnabSaha:, @GiantSnowman:, @Drat8sub: @Ludost Mlačani:, @Paine Ellsworth:, @SportingFlyer: @ChrisTheDude:.— Akhiljaxxn (talk) 04:18, 27 November 2020 (UTC)

I have tried to compile the articles I found in the form of this table. I hope it helps/clarifies.  Saha ❯❯❯ Stay safe  07:29, 27 November 2020 (UTC)

I've put the articles into a separate sub-category so that discussion can go up here if that's okay. I'm not entirely sure of the procedure here, but there should be three articles based on everything I've read, Mohun Bagan, ATK, and the new club, ATK Mohun Bagan. SportingFlyer T·C 19:08, 27 November 2020 (UTC)

I agree with the sources, ATKMB is either a new club or a continuation of ATK. If having to choose I would maybe go for the latter, as they are refered to as defending champions everywhere and ATK player contracts seem to be still valid for ATKMB. But in any case Mohun Bagan page should not be redirected. Ludost Mlačani (talk) 23:13, 27 November 2020 (UTC)

Nowhere it is said that ATKMB is the defending champions. The league website clearly has mentioned that this is the debut season of the club in ISL.[1] Don't put your delusional thoughts without sources. I am simply amazed by the bias of this user Saha to selectively put references of his choice to put forward his propaganda.The official club handle has said in an official tweet "The 1960s was a golden period in our illustrious history", which once again goes on to show that it is a continuation of Mohun Bagan and nothing else [2]. Debarghya89 (talk) 14:24, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Debarghya89 The league website provided by you mentions that this is the debut season of the club in ISL. Then why are you still redirecting the page to the Mohun Bagan A.C. article?. I hope you have already seen the two discussions on the admins' noticeboard related to the previous AFC and the meatpuppetery and sockpuppetery allegations related to the AFC. We are therefore just keeping the status quo before the AFC. You need to obtain consensus before redirecting the page, or else your edits will consider as vandalism and will have to be reported as such.— Akhiljaxxn (talk) 16:56, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Debarghya89, kindly come out of the delusion you are in, and read the articles properly. And maintain civility  Saha ❯❯❯ Stay safe  16:58, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

I noticed this after a recent AfD. It's clear there should be three articles here - one for Mohun Bagan, one for ATK, and one for the merged club, ATK Mohun Bagan. This is not equivalent but not dissimilar to how US clubs which start in MLS with the same brand as a former lower division club get new articles, since they are new organisations. Those discussions have been similarly contentious, but the outcome is correct. This is similar to what we do with other merged clubs, and it's supported by the sources below. I'm not sure the redirect should have been boldly removed, but I support restoring the article. SportingFlyer T·C 17:14, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Consensus was already reached that this is not a new club and continuation of Mohun Bagan. Official twitter handles has also repeatedly made posts about the history of the club emphasizing that it is not a new club. All of that has been conveniently ignored here repeatedly to support a particular propaganda.Akhiljaxxn please provide an explanation of why and how the so called "new club" post about the history of the club in 1960s? Or did you chose to ignore the second link I provided because it did not support your viewpoint? So convenient of you!! Debarghya89 (talk) 18:08, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

If ATK Mohun Bagan is the continuation of Mohun Bagan, why would they rename the old Twitter account of ATK instead of that of Mohun Bagan? Why are there still two accounts for both Mohun Bagan and ATK Mohun Bagan?

The decision of the RFC was not an accurate reflection of the discussion. Multiple established users have expressed this opinion already. It was clearly hijacked by the votes of multiple new editors and IPs. There were lots of tweets and FB posts that can be seen as canvassing attempts.— Akhiljaxxn (talk) 05:23, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Debarghya, the thing you are saying is WP:SYNTH  Saha ❯❯❯ Stay safe  06:43, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Akhiljaxxn Your twitter account logic is so laughable. By that logic this club should be the old ATK FC, and not even a "new club" which your trying to push so hard. And Mohun Bagan has a separate twitter account because it is a multi sports club and they tweet everything from it. Again you have conveniently chose to ignore the fact that the old Mohun Bagan account also tweets about ISL Matches. Also this "ATK MOHUN BAGAN FC" page itself is just a copy paste which at the same time talks about historical rivalries and the Kolkata derby and at the same time calls itself a new club founded in 2020. So much hypocrisy about this page and about users like you. If you are trying to push your propaganda, try harder next time. Be a better liar. Cheers!! Debarghya89 (talk) 15:29, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

this is clearly vandalism. stop it.  Saha ❯❯❯ Stay safe  16:33, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

As below, I support the longstanding WP:FOOTY consensus of having a new article for a merged team, so there should be no redirect here. Spike 'em (talk) 17:26, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Found articles

Month	Website	Heading	What does it say?	New/ merged	MBFC	ATKFC	Note
JAN	themohunbaganac.com	RP-Sanjiv Goenka Group acquires majority stake in Mohun Bagan Football Club (India) Private Limited	The new football club will have brand names of ATK and Mohun Bagan. RPSG Group will become 80 % majority shareholder alongside Mohun Bagan Football Club (India) Private Limited owning the remaining 20 % shares.	Y
	indiansuperleague.com	RP-Sanjiv Goenka Group acquires majority stake in Mohun Bagan Football Club	The new football club will have brand names of ATK and Mohun Bagan.	Y
	thestatesman.com	RIP Mohun Bagan! ATK acquire 80% of ‘sinking ship’	Mohun Bagan may have saved their ship from sinking but they have let their century-old identity and a part of Bengali culture go down the Ganges.			Y
	scroll.in	Mohun Bagan to merge into ATK after selling majority stake to RPSG Group	The new club will come into existence from June 1, 2020, and will feature the brand names of both ATK and Mohun Bagan.	Y
	goal.com	Mohun Bagan enters ISL after merger with ATK	The century-old club along with two-time ISL champions ATK will form a new club and enter the cash-rich league in the next season...	Y
	espn.in	ATK, Mohun Bagan confirm merger; new club to compete in ISL 2020-21	Two-time Indian Super League champions ATK will merge with I-League club Mohun Bagan in June 2020 and will compete as one team in the next ISL season.	Y
	outlookindia.com	Mohun Bagan merges with ATK; to play as one team in next ISL	The merged club will come into existence in June and will compete in the ISL 2020-21.	Y
	business-standard.com	RP-Sanjiv Goenka Group buys majority stake in Mohun Bagan Football Club	Kolkata Games and Sports (KGS), an RPSG venture, which owns the ATK brand, will be merged with Mohun Bagan Football Club Pvt Ltd to form a new company. This new entity will come into effect by June 1 this year.	Y
	sportstar.thehindu.com	Mohun Bagan, ATK announce merger; to play ISL next season	The merged club will come into existence from June 1, 2020 and will compete in the 2020-21 Indian Super League season and the other competitions organised by the All India Football Federation. The new football club will have brand names of ATK and Mohun Bagan.	Y
	telegraphindia.com	Mohun Bagan merge with Goenka’s ATK	Indian Super League side ATK and Mohun Bagan Football Club (India) Private Limited have decided to merge and form a new club that would play as one team from the 2020-21 season.	Y
MAR	indianexpress.com	As ATK, Mohun Bagan reign supreme, what happens to India’s AFC slots?	But since the Mariners have entered into a merger with ATK, after the RP-Sanjiv Goenka (RPSG) Group acquired 80 percent stake in the Mohun Bagan Football Club (India) Private Limited on January 16, the new ATK-Mohun Bagan entity will likely avail the spot.	Y
	scroll.in	Indian football: Antonio Habas set to coach merged ATK-Mohun Bagan, confirms co-owner Sanjiv Goenka	ATK, however, would compete in the AFC Cup as a merged team with Mohun Bagan who have sealed the berth by clinching the I-League title.	Y
JUN	newsclick.in	Chronicle of a Merger Foretold: Swift Death of the Legacy of Mohun Bagan	But the merger is far from equal. All decision making power resides in the hands of the ATK management, who have chosen to simply cut loose several players who were part of Bagan’s title winning squad.			Y
	news18.com	After Merger, ISL and I-League Champions to Go By ATK Mohun Bagan from 2020-21 Season	ISL champions ATK and I-League champions Mohun Bagan, who have merged and will take part in the ISL from next season, will be known as ATK Mohun Bagan.	Y
JUL	thesprintnews.com	Sourav Ganguly as one of directors of merged ATK-Mohun Bagan	BCCI president Sourav Ganguly has been delegated as one of the directors of the newly merged Indian Super League franchise ATK-Mohun Bagan. The New Kolkata ISL team will compete in the Indian Super League (ISL) in the upcoming season.	Y
	timesofindia.com	Ganguly already co-owner, so eligible to become director of ATK-MB	Mohun Bagan had joined forces with ISL champions ATK as a merged entity which started from June 1.	Y
SEP	firstpost.com	Sandesh Jhingan joins ATK-Mohun Bagan on five-year contract from Kerala Blasters	Defending Indian Super League champions ATK Mohun Bagan on Saturday announced the signing of high-profile defender Sandesh Jhingan.			Y
	espn.in	Sandesh Jhingan joins ATK Mohun Bagan ahead of new season	Defending Indian Super League champions ATK Mohun Bagan on Saturday announced the signing of defender Sandesh Jhingan for an undisclosed fee.			Y
	outlookindia.com	ATK Mohun Bagan sign Indian defender Jhingan	Defending Indian Super League champions ATK Mohun Bagan on Saturday announced the signing of high-profile defender Sandesh Jhingan.			Y
OCT	the-afc.com	The most popular football clubs: India	They recently merged with ATK to become ATK Mohun Bagan and will make their Indian Super League bow in 2020-21.	Y
	indiansuperleague.com	Hero ISL embarks upon a unique season with unprecedented 115 games	Marking the return of the first major live sporting action in the country, the 7th season of India's premier football league kicks off with the defending champions ATK Mohun Bagan squaring off against Kerala Blasters FC on Friday			Y
	sportstar.thehindu.com	Teams begin pre-season training in Goa ahead of ISL season	Defending champion ATK Mohun Bagan FC and Jamshedpur FC were among the first clubs to arrive in Goa, which will host the entire ISL season behind closed doors owing to the coronavirus pandemic.			Y
NOV	indianexpress.com	Roy Krishna’s Covid dribble from Fiji to Goa: 40 days, quarantine in 3 countries	The 33-year-old spent 30 days in quarantine, in three countries, to make it in time to play for defending champions ATK Mohun Bagan.			Y
	khelnow.com	ISL: Five things that defined the first Kolkata Derby	But, the ISL holders were wearing their shooting boots.			Y
Coach Player	khelnow.com	Fran Gonzalez breaks silence on future in Indian football	The player revealed that the club have not communicated with him or his lawyer, despite having a year remaining in his contract.			Y	Player of MB with long term contract wasnt even contacted.
	espn.in	Antonio Habas to be ATK-Mohun Bagan coach in ISL	Fresh from winning a third Indian Super League title, ATK boss Sanjiv Goenka on Sunday announced that Antonio Habas will remain the coach of the team that is set to merge with I-League club Mohun Bagan.	Y		Y	At that time ATKMB wasn't formed Still Habas got automatically contracted. Same goes with Sanjay Sen.
	scroll.in	Indian football: Antonio Habas set to coach merged ATK-Mohun Bagan, confirms co-owner Sanjiv Goenka	ATK boss Sanjiv Goenka on Sunday announced that Antonio Habas would remain the coach of their team that has merged with the country’s oldest club, Mohun Bagan.	Y		Y
	newsclick.in	Chronicle of a Merger Foretold: Swift Death of the Legacy of Mohun Bagan	several Indian footballers in Mohun Bagan are without contracts for the new season as no club official has come forward to talk to them.			Y	It says players are clubless.
	ATKMB twitter	The Irish midfielder has penned down a one-year extension that will keep him in the City of Joy till 2021				Y	Says "EXTENSION". He was ATK's player
		Sheikh Sahil signs with the club and will represent ATK Mohun Bagan FC in the ISL for the next three years		Y		Y	Says "SIGNING". He was MB's player
Others	ISL club profile	New ATKMB profile.				Y	Previously retained ATK's profile
	AIFF club profile	New ATKMB profile.		Y
	Facebook	Retained the ATK one. Says "This new merged club was formed as part of a merger between football section of multi-sport club Mohun Bagan AC and former ISL side ATK"		Y		Y
	Twitter	Retained the ATK one.				Y
	RPSG website	The Group acquired a majority stake in Mohun Bagan Football in 2020. The clubs were merged and will play as one ISL 2020-21 onwards.		Y

Wikipedia should reflect reliable sources regarding the club's history, including reflecting any current lack of agreement

Is it possible that the "real world" outside Wikipedia is itself unclear or confused as to the "official history" of the current club? If reliable sources that haven't changed their minds since disagree, then Wikipedia should probably reflect that, at least until the then-current reliable sources agree.

Do the reputable, reliable sources that cover football in India all say pretty much the same thing these days (late November 2020) about the history of this club?

In some ways, this feels like the United States Presidential Election between the time the first reliable source "called it" for Biden and the time almost every reliable source did (let's ignore the technicalities of the Electoral College system, the court cases, and the technicalities of the "Biden transition," that's not the point of this analogy). There was a period for a few hours, maybe a few days, when it would have been improper for Wikipedia to say "Biden is the President-elect" or even "News sources agree that Biden is the President-elect [implying that almost all reputable news sources were saying this]," but at the same time it would have been inappropriate for Wikipedia to ignore the fact that at least one reputable, reliable source did "call it" for him. Why? Because reliable, reputable, up-to-date sources were in enough disagreement that ignoring the lack of consensus among major reputable media outlets would itself be un-encyclopedic. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 19:09, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

• This has nothing to do with US politics. What we have here are two teams which merged. The reliable sources above discuss the new team as a merged team. We typically create articles when a new team is formed out of a merger, or even when a new entity is formed. But yet we can't reach agreement on splitting the article for some reason I'm not around. SportingFlyer T·C 21:51, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

  @SportingFlyer: Agreed that it has nothing to do with US politics, that was just the first example I could think of where different reliable sources were giving different results. I made this post because somewhere in the discussion, either here or on a discussion page of a related article I forget exactly where, someone mentioned a reliable source that considered this team was a "true successor" to one of the two "old" teams, and someone else, possibly on a different talk page, mentioned a reliable source that either considered the other team the "true successor" or it considered that this was a "true merger." I don't remember the details but I think one case was based on the league or team's official web site or twitter site calling it a merger (making it a PRIMARY source, which is usually considered reliable for some bare facts), and the other had to do with one of the old team's players' contracts being carried over but the other team's players' contracts NOT being carried over, which strongly suggests this was NOT a "true merger." I didn't pay close attention, but it did get me wondering - what do reliable sources, especially reliable independent sources, say? Are they in agreement, or are they arguing with each other? davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 01:00, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

  I think the table above is insightful with regards to sources, most of which have identified this as a "new" club. Might you be thinking of the AfD of Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/FC Cincinnati (MLS)? SportingFlyer T·C 01:28, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

  No, I don't even remember that AFD or that club. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 04:10, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

  Davidwr, 95% of the reliable sources say its a new merged club.  Saha ❯❯❯ Stay safe  06:47, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

  This article was linked in the poorly closed merge discussion earlier which makes absolutely clear that this should be a new article. Based on this, Mohun Bagan continues to exist as a sports and cricket club, while ATK Mohun Bagan is a new football club which uses the Mohun Bagan brand. A spin-off article for the football club is warranted. SportingFlyer T·C 21:18, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

  SportingFlyer, agree.  Saha ❯❯❯ Stay safe  07:45, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 December 2020

The club ATK MOHUN BAGAN FC is a continuation of Mohun Bagan AC and the foundation date of the club is 15th August 1889 and not 1 July 2020. Co-owner Sanjeev Goenka said that it is the continuation of Mohun Bagan's 131 years of history, so, please change it because it is a huge disrespect towards the biggest club of India and ALSO THE NATIONAL CLUB OF INDIA. Parjanyo Pahari (talk) 18:38, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

As noted above, most of the sources treat the merged club as a new club. The history is noted in the body of the article. —C.Fred (talk) 18:41, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

It is a new club in the Indian Super League and not a new club. We also have to remember that only the ownership of Mohun Bagan has changed it is like SC East Bengal with the only difference that ATK was a FC before but now it is just a brand. Only you will fall into danger of being disrespected by billions of MB fans if the foundation date is not 15th August,1889. Parjanyo Pahari (talk) 03:57, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

Please change it. ATK Mohun Bagan is not a new club it is 131 years old Parjanyo Pahari (talk) 03:58, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

The biggest proof that it is not a new club is that they showed that ATK Mohun Bagan is the most experienced team in India. They also said that it was the 370th Kolkata derby Parjanyo Pahari (talk) 04:04, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

I don't believe it should be named ATK Mohun Bagan FC, it is a merger with Mohun Bagan to play under that club and keeps that clubs history as you can see from this article here. Then you have The valuation of 20 per cent of the merged entity will be deemed as the value ATK is paying to acquire the footballing rights of the 130-year-old club. this article] that states The valuation of 20 per cent of the merged entity will be deemed as the value ATK is paying to acquire the footballing rights of the 130-year-old club.. The key there is acquirie the rights of the 130 year old club. So I think it should keep the [[Mohun Bagan A.C.|ATK Mohun Bagan]] linking and then each season article is the Football name of the Mohun Bagan team 2020–21 ATK Mohun Bagan FC season. NZFC^(talk)(cont) 20:47, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

We typically create new articles for merged clubs, and it's pretty clear from the other references (see the table above) that this is a new entity entirely, not a "continuation." I also don't see anything in your article which shows that it's keeping the Mohun Bagan club but rather the "brand." SportingFlyer T·C 20:57, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

Thanks SportingFlyer, I should pay more attention to the rest of the talk page. I don't have any strong feelings on it but clearly from that, there is a number of sources showing it is a new club and if previous processes is to treat merged clubs as a new article, why is this waiting then to get changed? Does it need another RFC and more notice in that one to look for SPAs? NZFC^(talk)(cont) 21:02, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

@NZFC: We need more people without strong feelings on this in order to get it right! There's a redirect war going on at the moment because some users think the article should be at Mohun Bagan. I think the last restoration of the redirect was misguided and I discussed it with Onel5969, who restored the redirect. I'd just restore the page now, but I don't want to keep the controversy going. SportingFlyer T·C 21:08, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

Never mind, I figured it out: there was a merge request here which was a poor non-admin close via a canvassed discussion which has gotten us into this mess. SportingFlyer T·C 21:14, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

@SportingFlyer: Ok, let me know if you do a new one that requires comment. NZFC^(talk)(cont) 21:24, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

I support the longstanding WP:FOOTY consensus of having a new article for a merged team. Spike 'em (talk) 17:23, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Spike 'em Doesn't matter what you think or support unless you can back it up with any evidence to show this is a new club while conviniently ignoring the consensus and evidence in support of deletion of this article. Stop the vandalism and educate yourself.Debarghya89 (talk) 05:39, 5 December 2020 (UTC)

Debarghya89, as I said earlier, read properly.  Saha ❯❯❯ Stay safe  13:06, 5 December 2020 (UTC)

Spike 'em, we do not usually "have a new article for a merged team", it is all case to case dependent on the sources. Ludost Mlačani (talk) 14:00, 5 December 2020 (UTC)

List of football club mergers shows we do usually create new articles for merged teams. The exception is rare and appears to be when one team is "absorbed" by the other which is not the case here. SportingFlyer T·C 16:09, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

I know. But I would not say that the "exception is rare", we just do not list "absorptions" on the above list. I think they are at least as common as the listed mergers. Ludost Mlačani (talk) 06:29, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Well the case here is simple, the team named ATK has been absorbed by Mohun Bagan. Ownership pattern or the continuation of contracts do not matter here. What matters is the branding and club licensing. It is the Mohun Bagan that has been renamed as ATK Mohun Bagan at IFA (the regional local football body) and accordingly in all bodies above it, national and continental. As a virtue of which the club has inherited Mohun Bagan's spot in Kolkata's local football league as well as in AFC Cup. Had the entity been an entirely fresh club, it would have had to apply for fresh licensing and would not have been allowed inherit any particular club's position. Sayanha7 (talk) 14:24, 25 January 2021 (UTC)

Talk to each other here rather than edit-war

I have this page on my watchlist and have noticed that there has been some recent edit-warring, most recently between BarcelonaFan995 and Sinan 2004. One of you may be more "right" than the other, but could I make a plea to both of you to talk to each other here rather than carry on in this way. Phil Bridger (talk) 18:39, 26 January 2021 (UTC)

And what happens a few minutes after I make that plea? BarcelonaFan995 reverts the article rather than talking here. I despair. Phil Bridger (talk) 18:57, 26 January 2021 (UTC)

Phil Bridger ATK Mohun Bagan FC is a new club founded in 2020.How it was formed had been discussed in full details in the article so there is no meaning of mentioning the honours of ATK and Mohun Bagan in this article and there is no need to mention the foundation date of both ATK and Mohun Bagan.this article is for ATK Mohun Bagan BarcelonaFan995 (talk) 19:04, 26 January 2021 (UTC)