User talk:Kwamikagami

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Word/quotation of the moment:

Astrology has no effect on reality, so why should reality have any effect on astrology? – J.S. Stenzel, commenting on astrological planets that astrologers acknowledge don't really exist

(Previous quotes)

The official state rainbow flag of Russia (official in JAO since 1996) Do you think the liberals are using these school shootings to further their anti-tragedy agenda? — Col. Erran Morad, Who Is America?, s01e01 yod-dropper — (when you need something that sounds like an insult)[1] ALL keys matter — response to the scale-wandering rendition of the national anthem at CPAC 2021 The Lunatic-in-Charge becomes the Lunatic-at-Large Lame duck à l'orange (AKA canard à l'orange) It is a mortifying circumstance, which greatly perplexes many a painstaking philosopher, that nature often refuses to second his most profound and elaborate efforts; so that often after having invented one of the most ingenious and natural theories imaginable, she will have the perverseness to act directly in the teeth of his system, and flatly contradict his most favorite positions. This is a manifest and unmerited grievance, since it throws the censure of the vulgar and unlearned entirely upon the philosopher; whereas the fault is not to be ascribed to his theory, which is unquestionably correct, but to the waywardness of Dame Nature, who, with the proverbial fickleness of her sex, is continually indulging in coquetries and caprices, and seems really to take pleasure in violating all philosophic rules, and jilting the most learned and indefatigable of her adorers. [...] The philosophers took this in very ill part, and it is thought they would never have pardoned the slight and affront which they conceived put upon them by the world had not a good-natured professor kindly officiated as a mediator between the parties, and effected a reconciliation. Finding the world would not accommodate itself to the theory, he wisely determined to accommodate the theory to the world. — Washington Irving, Knickerbocker's History of New York Pela primeira vez na sua vida a morte soube o que era ter um cão no regaço. For the first time in her life, death knew what it felt like to have a dog in her lap. — José Saramago, Death with Interruptions / Death at Intervals It is now generally accepted that the megaliths that make up Stonehenge were moved by human effort. — as opposed to by what? Anybody who says you only have yourself to blame is just not very good at blaming other people. — It's Happy Bunny When poppies pull themselves up from their roots and start out, one after the other, toward the sunset – don't follow them. — Slavko Janevski, 'Silence' And the dough-headed took their acid fermentation for a soul, the stabbing of meat for history, the means of postponing their decay for civilization. — Stanislaw Lem, Return from the Stars The Church says that the Earth is Flat, but I know that it is Round, for I have seen its Shadow on the Moon, and I have more Faith in a Shadow than in the Church. — (commonly misattributed to Magellan) In the early years of the study there were more than 200 speakers of the dialect, including one parrot. — from the WP article Nancy Dorian Mikebrown is unusually eccentric and not very bright. [...] Astronomers have not noticed any outbursts by Mikebrown. — from the WP article 11714 Mikebrown Ecce Mono Keep Redskins White! "homosapiens are people, too!!" a sprig of spaghetti "I've always had a horror of husbands-in-law." awkwardnessful anti–zombie-fungus fungus "Only an evil person would eat baby soup." (said in all sincerity)

Happy New Year, Kwamikagami!

Happy New Year!

Kwamikagami,
Have a prosperous, productive and enjoyable New Year, and thanks for your contributions to Wikipedia.
— Moops ^⋠T⋡ 20:13, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

   Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year fireworks}} to user talk pages.

— Moops ^⋠T⋡ 20:13, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

Thanks! — kwami (talk) 20:23, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

Happy New Year to you too! Double sharp (talk) 03:55, 2 January 2023 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:2003 EL61 Haumea, with moons.jpg

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Thanks for uploading File:2003 EL61 Haumea, with moons.jpg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described in section F5 of the criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. --B-bot (talk) 18:04, 4 January 2023 (UTC)

Yes, it's since been replaced by better images from Hubble, so no longer needed. — kwami (talk) 20:01, 4 January 2023 (UTC)

Replaceable fair use File:2003 EL61 Haumea, with moons.jpg

[boilerplate notification]

Just notifying you as a courtesy after see your post on the file's page. -- Marchjuly (talk) 21:40, 4 January 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for the courtesy, but I made that comment because I don't contest deletion. When I uploaded that file, there were no PD equivalents. Now there are, and the (c) file is no longer needed, indeed is not in use on any Wiki. Therefore there's no issue with deleting it. — kwami (talk) 21:48, 4 January 2023 (UTC)

unified English spelling

Well, IUPAC usage is indeed aluminium, but it is also caesium, for what that's worth. And etymologically speaking, the oxide is alumina, so the metal should be aluminum (just like ceria → cerium, but lanthana → lanthanum). :) Double sharp (talk) 13:42, 7 January 2023 (UTC)

Point. But we don't say *sodum. — kwami (talk) 20:21, 7 January 2023 (UTC)

Soda and potash are carbonates, not oxides (which is part of why they are not on Lavoisier's 1789 list of elements), so they are different cases. Or at least, that's what they meant around the time when Davy named them: our article calls K₂O potash too now. Anyway I feel like the point of Unified English spelling was to have some kind of informed reasoning for preferring one spelling over another, rather than to create spellings that never existed. Otherwise, I should like to borrow Russian magnij (don't have Cyrillic on my phone) as "magnium", which is what Davy named it, to avoid the Mn-Mg confusion. And fix the fact that H and O have the names that would make more sense for each other. And change the suffixes of helium, germanium, selenium, and tellurium to -on (as was done for Si). :) Double sharp (talk) 00:20, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

P.S. Incidentally, I believe the history of the Czech element names might interest you. There were attempts at mass calquing in the XIX century, but aside from the most common elements, they did not survive.

One day I'd like to expand chemical elements in East Asian languages with history as well, but can't find the sources I remember seeing for it. Okay, I only have seen much for Chinese and Japanese, but some expansion is better than none. Double sharp (talk) 00:40, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

It would be worth doing, I think. The Czech stuff too. I imageine there was quite a bit of calquing in the early days. — kwami (talk) 07:32, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

We do have an article on the Czech stuff (quite short though): Czech chemical nomenclature. Saving the link here so I know where to find it again. :) Double sharp (talk) 14:06, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

Anyway, there's not only variation in English for element names. The German de:Liste der chemischen Elemente always surprises me a little bit because it is closer to the Latin forms – I myself remember learning it with k and z for c often, e.g. Silizium, Kalzium, Zäsium, Aktinium, Wismut, Jod (but on de.wp it is given as Silicium, Calcium, Caesium, Actinium, Bismut, Iod). Personally I fail to see the point, as in Spanish one still writes escandio, in Italian afnio, in Polish ren and iryd, in Turkish tulyum, and it does not seem to cause undue confusion. And that's not even getting into reasonably common languages for chemical scholarship that use different scripts altogether (Russian, Chinese, Japanese spring to mind). But well, it is not my native language or even the language I write chemistry stuff in, and thus not really my business to give an opinion, just my business to describe. :)

Something interesting I found on the chemical elements in East Asian languages page is the recent reforms for Korean (e.g. using Koreanisations of sodium and potassium since 2014, rather than natrium and kalium). Like I said, when I have time, I'll do some research. :)

P.S. vi.wp has yterbi for ytterbium, but en.wikt has ytecbi. Probably another matter of how much to Vietnamise foreign names and words (e.g. Einstein vs Anhxtanh), but I guess the en.wikt list should be checked. Double sharp (talk) 08:17, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

Looking at variations in the articles of de, es, and it.wp, it appears that there's significant variation in many of the languages commonly used for chemical publications. Not all though: fr, pl, and ja are pretty standardised on this end. For ru, there are a few elements that may vary (iodine, flerovium, tennessine – though flerovium is a case of using yo or not), but most don't. For zh, it is rather a case of two separate standards. Much of it rests on how much to nativise (e.g. Italian kripton vs kripto vs cripto), so like that Vietnamese variation I pointed out above. A Wiktionary appendix, sort of like wikt:Appendix:Planets, would be a nice end goal, but with 118 elements I guess it would start looking incredibly wide. Double sharp (talk) 09:35, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

Danish also has variation in element names: Retskrivningsordbogen gives the spellings litium, karbon, fosfor, klor, krom, kobolt, zirkon(ium), molybdæn, jod, cæsium, tallium, bismut (formerly vismut), but Dansk kemisk nomenklaturudvalg gives lithium, carbon, phosphor, chlor, chrom, cobalt, zirconium, molybden, iod, caesium, thallium, bismuth. Burzuchius (talk) 09:50, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

Thanks very much for this, the Scandinavian languages are a major blank in my knowledge. :)

Turkish Wikipedia has tr:Lavrensiyum, but the Güncel Türkçe Sözlük only recognises lorentiyum. Double sharp (talk) 09:58, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

@Nanahuatl: maybe you could help us on this? :D Double sharp (talk) 10:00, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

Hi! To clarify, do you ask proper sources for the names in Turkish? Nanahuatl (talk) 18:56, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

Same sex marriage

Why did you revert my second edit which was NOT in the lede it was in the history section. The section mentions Nero and some others from early history the person to sign the first same sex marriage legalization merits inclusion. Rote1234 (talk) 19:28, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

You implied if Jim Obergefell was mentioned, we should mention Queen Beatrix as well. But we don't mention Jim Obergefell. Also, Beatrix's signature was a formality. If you're now going to compare her to Nero, she didn't actually do anything. We don't mention who wrote or sponsored the legislation, or even mention the first SSM twenty years earlier. So yes, Beatrix's involvement is trivia. — kwami (talk) 19:41, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

The LGBT community deserves to know the leaders that were involved in such a historical achievement. But if you allow mention of Nero, then other historical same sex marriages from centuries ago should merit mention as well.Rote1234 (talk) 19:46, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

Then why not mention the leaders involved? Did Beatrix initiate or champion this legislation, that she's one of the leaders?

You can take it to Talk. Two editors have judged this to be trivia. If the broader response agrees with you, it will be restored. — kwami (talk) 19:56, 8 January 2023 (UTC)