Talk:Chechnya

Ukrainian recognition

"melk" has reverted a good faith edit 3 times, despite the fact a legitimate source was added. Leetinkoy (talk) 21:02, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

I reverted your edit twice. And it does not mean you can write anything as long as you add a "legitimate source". The source states that Ukrainian parliament declared "Chechen Republic of Ichkeria" as "temporarily occupied" (the same euphemism as before). The source does not say it was recognized as the "legitimate ruler" by Ukraine, and it does not recognize "Chechen Republic of Ichkeria" as independent or sovereign[1]. So, I suggest to self-revert here and actually read the policy on WP:NOR instead of making such comments, and also to follow something like WP:BRD. Mellk (talk) 23:49, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

Have you read the source? It clearly states that: "Oleksiy Danilov, the Secretary of the National Security and Defense Council, tweeted that 'Free Ichkeria will start the process of decolonization of the Russian Federation and the destruction of the sub-empire.' ". This is a black and white statement proving that Ukraine has officially recognised the ChRI as a free and legitimate government, currently under russian occupation. Leetinkoy (talk) 08:41, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

The Reuters article says "A majority of Ukrainian lawmakers voted on Tuesday to back a resolution that "recognises the Chechen republic of Ichkeria as territory temporarily occupied by the Russian Federation as a result of armed aggression which contravened the UN's Statute". I think it's different from what is written in the article now. I'd suggest to use the same wording that the source uses. Alaexis_¿question? 17:27, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

@Leetinkoy It doesn't matter what some official tweets. This is not official recognition. The Meduza article I provided to you mentions this. Otherwise it looks like original research. Mellk (talk) 20:57, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

Also the wording suggests that this is some kind of polity that still exists. Mellk (talk) 21:01, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

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Leetinkoy, the Reuters article doesn't say what you've written here. If you took it from somewhere else please add the source. Alaexis_¿question? 17:48, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

I didn't directly quote the article, but I did make an entirely reasonable statement. If a nation recognises an area as being forcefully occupied, it must therefore recognise that there is a legitimate owner. In this case, it is the ChRI. I'm sorry if you don't like it, but anyone can see this. If you don't agree, take it up with the Ukrainian parliament and ask them what they really meant. Leetinkoy (talk) 17:56, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

@Leetinkoy There is page for this called WP:No original research. Mellk (talk) 18:05, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

Also the Meduza article I provided shows that this assumption is incorrect. There is a different bill regarding recognition of independence. Can you stop adding your own unsupported commentary? Mellk (talk) 18:09, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

It's not an unreasonable statement but as long as it's your own interpretation and not something reported by a reliable source, it's still considered original research. Alaexis_¿question? 12:47, 25 October 2022 (UTC)

Adding the ChRI flag to the infobox?

Considering the recent recognition by Ukraine, and the long history of the usage of the ChRI flag (which predates the current russian one), it would make sense to include the ChRI flag as the flag of Chechnya. The Wiki article for the ChRI already has a good image that could be used here. Leetinkoy (talk) 15:40, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

This article is about the Russian federal subject, and Ukraine has not yet recognized such an entity as independent. So no. Mellk (talk) 18:15, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

Also, even if Ukraine did recognize independence, every other country does not. Mellk (talk) 18:16, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

The label for that is "partially recognised state" and I will note that Abhazia, South Ossetia, (previously) the DNR/LNR and Transnistria all fell under that category. This is despite all of those states being recognised by russia and occasionally Syria or Belarus. If even one totally recognised state (such as Ukraine) recognises another, a state is partially recognised. Kosovo is partially recognised, for example. Leetinkoy (talk) 18:23, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

Again, no country actually recognizes Chechen independence (you are assuming Ukraine does) and this article is about the Russian federal subject which Russia controls, so there not even de facto independence. Mellk (talk) 18:33, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

1. Ukraine does recognise the independence, so your point there is moot.

2. This article claims to be about "Chechnya" as a people, state and region all together. If it is only about the supposed "Chechen Republic" then it is dishonestly portrayed, and the article should be first moved to "Chechen Republic" and the wider history of Chechnya section should be removed. Otherwise, this article should be treated as covering the entire concept of Chechnya as a state, region and the Chechen people; this would then make using the ChRI flag completely acceptable. Leetinkoy (talk) 11:17, 25 October 2022 (UTC)

I am having a lot of difficulty finding non-Ukrainian sources claiming that the Verkhovna Rada does recognize the independence of the Chechen Republic of Ichkeria. You are going to need to find a better source than one Reuters article. And as @Mellk said, this article is about the Russian federal subject. And on top of that, the Chechen Republic of Ichkeria has not existed in any meaningful form since. On the contrary, the Republic of Crimea is not recognized, but does have de facto control over the most of the Crimean Peninsula, with the exception of Sevastopol, which is organized as a separate federal subject. I called your edits POV pushing with merit. I mean, your userpage literally does say "Chechnya will be free". So that does imply a POV. Michael60634 (talk) 00:15, 26 October 2022 (UTC)

"Chichan" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Chichan has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 April 5 § Chichan until a consensus is reached. _signed, Rosguill ^talk 21:55, 5 April 2023 (UTC)

Flag of Israel overlay breaking the page

Someone clearly overlayed an image of the flag of Israel on mobile to break the functionality of the mobile page. I have no clue how to edit it out so I'm asking an experienced Wikipedia editor to fix it. Thanks! 96.224.19.11 (talk) 02:56, 16 September 2023 (UTC)

This is the result of vandalism, which has been reverted. I've purged the cache so it should be fixed now. Nardog (talk) 04:02, 16 September 2023 (UTC)

January 2024

@Mellk Regarding Akhmad Kadyrov, his description as "former Mufti" is factually correct and provides additional context about his background and influence in Chechnya. Taken directly from his page: "Akhmad-Khadzhi Abdulkhamidovich Kadyrov was a Russian politician and revolutionary who served as Chief Mufti of the Chechen Republic of Ichkeria in the 1990s". Secondly, there is a lack of concrete evidence proving Kadyrov's participation in armed conflict to classify him definitively as a rebel.

The term "restored" implies a continuity of Russian control over Chechnya following the USSR's dissolution. Therefore, using "restored" inaccurately suggests a return to a previous state of Russian control which it did not have post USSR, ignoring the de-facto independence Chechnya exercised in those years. A term like "achieved" or "established" would more accurately reflect the reality that Russian control was an establishment of authority rather than a reinstatement of an uninterrupted status quo. Ola Tønningsberg (talk) 14:37, 28 January 2024 (UTC)