Talk:Companion (Firefly)

Good start!

Created it! We've been discussing it for ages, it's an important concept/term/organization/cultural thing from Firefly (I managed to list eight episodes from memory alone that featured either Companion Guild rules, customs, or mentions thereof, etc., before I realized that the "See also" list was way too long and all of it was technically covered in the series template. Obviously, of big importance!) and Companion linked to this then-nonexistant page anyway; obviously, plenty of people expect an article on this topic. Furthermore, the "Firefly series" template linked only to Companion, which is actually a disambiguation page (I've also changed the template to reflect this article's new existance).

I've also categorized it as best I could, and made sure to place it in "Category:Unassessed Firefly articles" as well.

I know, however, that it definitely needs improving so go ahead. :)

On a side-note, the Companion (Firefly) link isn't really working in the series template yet. Any idea why? :\Runa27 21:50, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Since this article is so new, I'm not worried about it yet, but we need to work on making sure there's no WP:OR and we cite everything. Direct observations from shows can be made, but no inferences, etc. I can't wait until I can get my hands on that book that talks about Companions in the Firefly verse; that should give us some great sourcable material....plange 01:45, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Great start. :) (I've tried to reformat the talk page a little so it fits into a TOC, hope no-one minds.) Barnas 01:47, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

To Plange - that's why I listed episodes where I could remember which ones they were in (all I missed was the female client being from "War Stories" - not bad, eh? :D ). Now, I do think the fact that we've never seen a male Registered Companion (the boy whores in "Heart of Gold" don't count, seeing as they very definitely weren't Registered Companions) is in fact notable, however, in hindsight, I do see where you're coming from with "inferences", and see why it was deleted. How about, underneath the list of things we've been shown and told about them (not in the list, but rather in a bit of prose underneath, since its significance, if any, is never made clear, and thus should not be listed with the things that are more concrete):

Not once in the series, including the comics and feature film, has there been a male Registered Companion shown or mentioned. What this means or whether or not it even has any significance, however, has never been made clear in canon, and no statement has ever been made by Whedon or Minear in regards to it.

How's that? Absolutely clear that a pattern is there, but very explicit that it may have no meaning, or be a coincidence. :)

To Barnas - Thanks! :D And I don't mind the reformatting at all.

To whomever assessed the article - thank you. :D That was fast! I figured about the same for importance and assessment levels (what with it providing a decent "start", and even having a picture - hooray for me finally figuring out how to put a picture in! :D), but did not think it would be appropriate for the person who started the article to be the first to assess it. ;)

I'm glad I started this. Other than a lot of us agreeing it needed to be here and all, I learned some more about Wiki formats; other than the image insertion, I also inserted (and modified!) my first series template! Whoo-hoo! :D Here's to a.) My first article to be rated more than a stub class immediately after I began it!, b.) the 'verse being expanded on Wikipedia, and c.) me becoming slightly less of a newbie! :D

On a side note, though, I think whomever knows how to do it should format some of the references to specific episodes as references with footnotes. I think it would look more encylopedia-y, don't you?

Oh, and by the way, the SVC's official title is Serenity:The Official Visual Companion, not just Serenity:The Visual Companion. One person got it right, one missed it in the references section, but I fixed it. :) Runa27 21:02, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

I went ahead and added the less-ORish note about there not having been any male Companions shown. How's it look now? Runa27 00:45, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

Saffron

Is referring to her as a "femme fatale" really right? Surely a name would be better... but which one? Barnas 01:48, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

WARNING - for those who haven't seen "Our Mrs. Reynolds", there is a bit of a spoiler afoot below ;)

I referred to her as a femme fatale for several reasons, actually. 1.) EXACTLY. All we have are a handful of aliases, none of which is verifiably her real name. ;) 2.) Even calling her "YoSaffBridge" wouldn't work, because that's only a fan nickname that arose from a one-line joke, and not her official name. 3.) Naming her in such a reference provides a huge spoiler for "Our Mrs. Reynolds" (if you know she recieved Companion training, that's kind of a dead giveaway that she's not being entirely truthsome to Mal, isn't it?), and I wanted to avoid major spoilers (and thus, a need for spoiler tag on the section) if I could. In contrast, we know very early on in "Heart of Gold" that Nandi was a former Companion trainee, and it's only in casual conversation that she mentions the dulcimer - it's not a huge spoiler, I don't think. 4.) She does in fact fit the definition of a femme fatale ;) She's one of the most femme fatale-y femme fatales I've ever seen! 5.) all that's really needed, I think, is to note that a minor (female) character who appeared in those two episodes was thought by Inara to have had Companion training, which is the only reason she's mentioned on this particular page in the first place - and a description, which "the femme fatale who appeared in..." covers perfectly, since she was in fact the only femme fatale to appear in those two episodes. People who watch the episode will know exactly, by the end of "Our Mrs. Reynolds", who it is that is the "femme fatale". ;) And it's not entirely necessary to the page to know her exact name, actually - just that she's a femme fatale who is thought by a Companion character to have received Companion training. 6.) if people want to know more about the "femme fatale", checking out one of the pages for the episodes she appeared in would do just fine - which is why they're linked. Hope that helps? Runa27 20:36, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

I don't disagree on any particular point, it just... reads strangely without it being a name of some kind. As you say, though, what name would be used? Probably best to leave it as it is. Or try to find out what she's called on the scripts. Barnas 23:30, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Wouldn't it be hilarious if she was referred to as "femme fatale"? I doubt it, but it'd be funny. ;) Runa27 23:09, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

The list of minor characters in Firefly refers to her as "Saffron" (is one of [her] several known aliases). If someone can find out what the script says, use that; otherwise I think "Saffron" with quotes is good. --Pentasyllabic 23:49, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

The problem with that is again, it would require a (in my opinion, not really necessary) spoiler tag on the section - for ONE note, on a character that we're most likely not going to see again (even if Joss manages to convince Universal to make a sequel, I'm sure he'll spend more time on the mystery of Inara and so forth and River's psychological healing process, etc. Main character stuff). I was trying to avoid that; and I don't think anyone would argue that that wouldn't be a HUGE spoiler for the "Our Mrs. Reynolds", given "Saffron"'s initial behavior and claims and the mid-episode plot twist that comes of it all. It'd give half the plot away. Again - we know Nandi was a former Companion trainee right after she's introduced, and her business is introduced at the beginning as well; the trainees at the Companion training house in Serenity... well, obvious, of course, and not at all a spoiler since all it says is that in the film, Inara visits a Companion training house which has some trainees and a teacher. Again - I think it works OK as it is. I mean, it's not REALLY confusing, because upon reading the episode summaries (were one to choose to do so), you'd know exactly who it was referring to. It's a bit of a tetchy issue, though, idn't it? :P I mean, we can't cut the reference entirely - the fact that she was so firmly said by a registered Companion to have definitely received Companion training, that's significant in regards to this page. Runa27 15:21, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

I think that having a name would be nice, b/c when I read it, I instantly wanted to add a name. If you think that including Saffron etc would be too spoiler-y, perhaps by including the fact that her true name is unknown, so something like "The femme fatale (her true name is unknown, however she is known by several alias throughout the show) featured in the episodes "Our Mrs. Reynolds" and "Trash" was firmly thought by Inara to have received Companion training."

Or something like that. So at least people know that it's an intentional omission. But even over that, I'd rather have a spoiler tag and the names. Shirley Ku 00:30, 12 September 2006 (UTC)Shirley Ku 17:35, 11 September 2006.

Customs and practices...

OK, now, this is interesting - and somewhat well-researched - but I thought I'd bring it up:

While the Companion Guild is in many ways a working company of skilled artesans, it also would appear to be a kind of religious sect. Heads of Companion houses are called "priestesses", and Inara's house is called "Madrassa", a term for an Islamic religious school. There are heavy religious overtones to many Guild practices, such as the use of incense, a focus on contemplation, and a cloistered lifestyle.

Now, that's an interesting lead. However, I think it's also somewhat incomplete at the moment. For one thing, I'd like to note that geisha also lead a somewhat cloistered lifestyle during their training, and also use incense (as a timer for their sessions, mostly, but still). That's notable, given that they also use tea ceremonies - and when I say "they" I mean both Companions and geisha. The influence of geisha culture and known practices is quite strong - hardly surprising, given Joss' known affinity for anime and for Asian culture.

Further, the idea that it is an actual religious sect is a bit OR, though, don't you think? I mean, it's interesting - but there's nothing really to support it. I agree that there are religious overtones, and apparently Inara is religious (a Buddhist, apparently), but that does not mean the entire Companion Guild necessarily is as well. For instance:

• Incense could be used for asthetic reasons, as it commonly is today, or as aromatherapy.

• Other trades traditionally have their trainees lead cloistered or semi-cloistered lives - and, as noted, so do geisha, which are not part of a religious sect, and all-girls schools, which can and often are secular. :P

• We don't know why her house was called Madrassa. No one involved in the production has ever stated a reason for the name. Believe me, it could be intentional - or it could be completely accidental. Either is possible. I myself have multiple times "invented" a name, only to discover it's a real word or existing name (one time, it was embarrassingly inappropriate; another, however, it turned out to be absolutely perfect, as it turned out to be a Norse girl's name meaning "strength", and I was using it for a character who was a stoic female survivalist), so I am not about to make any assumption regarding whether or not it was intentional, especially given that most of the aesthetics of the Companion training house and Inara's shuttle decor appear to be more Orientally influenced than Middle-Eastern. I mean, yeah, a blending is possible - very posssible - but we can't assume that's what it was named after. That would be Original Research. ;) I do find it interesting, but if it hasn't been stated as being intentional by someone involved in the production who would know, we can't really imply that it definitely was intentional, just note that it's there and might be intentional, but give no opinion on it. To show you what I mean it currently says, and Inara's house is called "Madrassa", a term for an Islamic religious school. I think it would be better to phrase it as and Inara's house is called "Madrassa"; "Madrassa" is also a term for an Islamic religious school. or perhaps and Inara's house is called "Madrassa", which is also a term for an Islamic religious school. or and Inara's house is called "Madrassa", a word which can also refer to an Islamic religious school.

• Focus on contemplation? Cite please. I don't recall that.

HOWEVER, I do have a copy of Finding Serenity, and while some essays are better than others in it, the one on the historical counterparts/cultural allusions/influences on the Companions of the 'verse is very good, and worth citing. And that one outright states that they were based on several different ancient practices involving priestess prostitutes, the name of one group of which literally translates to "companions". THAT would be an excellent cite.

Basically, it just needs fleshing out and citation. Also, I'd argue that it could be made its own subsection (within its existing section, of course), since it already has a bit of a disconnect from the rest of the list-format section it's in due to being prose format (though I am glad of course that it is prose format, as prose is often preferable to lists when possible). Although, as it is, I was considering reorganizing and rewriting the list so that all of it is prose format, and maybe then it could have a couple of subsections to organize it even better. :) Runa27 15:57, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Geisha to Oiran

I changed the geisha references to link to the oiran, which is more accurate. Oiran were liscenced, high-class prostitutes skilled in music, dance, arts and companionship as well as the sexual arts. MightyAtom 09:41, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Black Marks

It was written that a customer earning themselves a black mark is then stopped from hiring a Companion; changed it to Companions not choosing them in the future to avoid misunderstandings. Mooyah 05:06, 17 April 2007 (UTC)