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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by 95.177.43.18 (talk) at 16:39, 24 April 2010 (→Urgent problem: someone thinks I'm you and is extremely mad at you). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Alien Nation FAC

Well, it looks like they closed the FAC for Alien Nation. I'm actually surprised. I didn't hear back on your comments relating to my changes. I think I made the necessary and appropriate corrections. Did you view the page recently? I thought after my most recent changes, the article would pass on its merits. I didn't really get any oppose recommendations from any reviewers, but apparently the article was still demoted. I'm disappointed. I'm not sure what to think. Theatrickal (talk) 13:21, 8 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Sometimes reviews just go stale and the delegate has to make a decision on whether it's likely to get through this time. For what it's worth, I found some time these last couple of days to do a few reviews, and was preparing to lodge a reluctant oppose at the article today, based largely on the prose. It really needs a top-to-bottom copyedit, with particular attention paid to redundant wording and lack of compliance with the manual of style. If you haven't already, I strongly recommend you take a look at Tony1's redundancy exercises and perhaps WP:FILMCOPY. Don't be discouraged; it wasn't "demoted"; it just stayed the same. :-) Also, would you mind sticking to the one account? Take a look at WP:SOCK to see why. All the best, Steve T • C 13:31, 8 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
What Steve said. It was mainly because of a lack of traction. Were you unable to get coverage from Laserbrain? I saw on his talk page that there was difficulty corresponding. Since Steve recommends copy-editing, it may help to launch a peer review for that article. For example, Meet the Parents has one here. Maybe if you provide some constructive criticism there and ask to have Alien Nation (film) reviewed in return, that would get another pair of eyes on the article. Erik (talk) 13:36, 8 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I also strongly recommend using edit summaries when you work on the article and elsewhere on Wikipedia. It's hard to know what's been accomplished without summaries; diffs are hard to read, especially when sections are shifted. Erik (talk) 13:38, 8 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Hi Erik. Well, apparently more negativity was surrounding this article than I was led to believe! I thought everything was going great. First off, with Mr. Laserbrain, there was indeed an issue. He was supposed to email me a copy of those reviews to insert because they are not available for free to the general public. I followed his instructions for email correspondence, but he later decided not to provide me with the content. He said there was something odd about my email. I inquired further, and he failed to describe what the problem was. So that was that. I inserted one reliable review from a film stub though, and I also inserted the aggregate Rotten Tomatoes reference as per your instructions. As far as the Peer Review is concerned, I'm actually discouraged from doing so. I noticed many times reviewers just write a comment here and there, but they don't always necessarily help out. The copy-edit issue is also a significant problem. I looked at the cop-editers page, and there's a list of people waiting for copy-edits as long as a roll of toilet paper. Meaning: if I put in a request now, maybe it'll get done by 2011. I wasn't aware of those manual of style, redundancy, film copy problems. I'll have to take a look at that later. But thanks for the insight. Theatrickal (talk) 14:37, 8 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Try following up again with Laserbrain. If there is still an issue, I can correspond with him and try to add the coverage. Also, I am not sure if Rotten Tomatoes is the best source to use for aggregate reaction; see WP:RTMC – Limitations for what I mean. It would be better to find a post-1989 source about the film that reviews in retrospect how it was received. Erik (talk) 14:57, 8 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, I will try to contact him again. If it doesn't work out, I will let you know and perhaps you can collaborate with him to help make those additions. I'll let you know what happens. As far as a post-1989 source for reviews, I'll have to look into that one. If a major source cannot be found, then maybe it would be best to just stick with individual reviews. Theatrickal (talk) 14:54, 8 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Erik, hi. I just wanted to give you an update on whats been happening with the article. I made a few cosmetic changes adding some re-usable images to further help and compliment the breakage of the text wall as you had earlier suggested. Now as far as Andy's links; I had missed an earlier email he sent me. It was archived and I wasn't thorough in checking through it. Anyhow, in that email from awhile back, Andy described that my email was identified as a "Spoof" email. I have no clue why. Sometimes I get messages that are important, and for some odd reason they get sent to my junk mail folder too. Email providers are not always perfect. But if you're interested, you can try to get the reviews from him. If your busy or not interested, you don't have to. But as far as the reviews in general are concerned, it looks fairly sufficient. Its pretty much an entire screen. Now as far as a rough copy-edit is concerned, would you like to enlist? .........(but only if your interested) Theatrickal (talk) 20:50, 15 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

low blow

That was a pretty low shot, Erik. Perhaps next time, you might consider actually reading the block log a LOT closer than you apparently have. I was blocked once for edit-warring in that article (the other two blocks were reversed immediately when it was uncovered that edit-warring wasn't occurring). It's okay, we all miss things - much like you missed that I haven't been blocked in almost two years. Pretty messed up way to try and win an argument. What the hell happened to you, man? - Arcayne (cast a spell) 18:33, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

You brushed off five other editors' viewpoints as invalid and even insinuated that we were colluding. You disagreed with Howcheng. A third opinion came in through Andrew c. You disagreed with that. A fourth opinion came in through Hammersoft. You disagreed with that too. A fifth opinion came in through me. You disagreed with that. A sixth opinion came in through Collectonian. You disagreed with that. You thought that the issue needed more viewpoints. You said you would not concede. This resistance, knowing your history of edit warring, made me worry that you would restore the image just because. Erik (talk) 18:47, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
You drastically misread the situation, Erik, and your response was reprehensibly inappropriate not to mention inaccurate. I had asked for Howcheng to widen the citcle on the discussion - an offer he firmly resisted, unless it was to go behind everyone's back and get an answer that served him by reframing the question. So now, Howcheng sacrificed a lot of good faith that way. After that, i simply wanted to know where he went to solicit input, to see if he had re-framed the question there as well. Let me be clear: I wanted more input, and was happy that it came (no matter the end result). All i wanted to know was where the input was requested. And hell yes, I wanted more input. I thought the issue belonged on a noticeboard, as the discussion was barely about the image and more about the exclusionist/inclusionist battle.
And I said that I did not concede Howcheng's point, not that I "would not concede". Two entirely different things. I did not find the arguments convincing; all i saw was yet another attempt by that merry little band of folk who want to delete all non-free imagery from articles. You know this, and yet you endangered your own film articles by giving this crew yet another level of precedent to take aim.
I see you redacted your comments, but that's a lot like closing the barn door after the horse is gone. You reverted the image, and even if I was inclined to revert (which I am not - at least not until a citation shows up) you made it seem as if I was some petty edit-warrior. It was a truly fucked up thing to do Erik, and I would not have imagined you being the sort of person to do it. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 19:10, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
You are right; Howcheng should have framed the notification better. He should be informed so he does not do that in the future. I hope my notification at WT:FILM was appropriate? You didn't get the agreement that you were looking for, I know. I've had to give up elements before, like a "See also" section of similar movies at Fight Club (film). I strongly encourage you not to look at people you disagree with as a "merry little band of folk who want to delete all non-free imagery from articles". Consider only the arguments at hand. I do not want to delete all non-free imagery; I want to add them where their presence can ring true. Obviously, the contextual significance can be debatable, and in this case, five editors agreed that the significance was not there. I'm actually advocating video samples, which are rarities in film articles. A couple of Star Trek films and American Beauty have them now. It is not so black and white. Erik (talk) 19:33, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
If you want to discuss my conduct, please do so here. Erik (talk) 19:52, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I hope you work out how to work together in future. And just to point out that they are not Erik's film articles ;-) Now we have a Java video player for Ogg video files, watching video is easier. In fact, I'm thinking of demonstrating some of the editing techniques with video examples, but am wondering about WP:OR and not using secondary sources for the examples. Stephen B Streater (talk) 20:19, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Have you seen the video samples at Category:Video samples of films? We also have WP:FILMCLIP for some guidance. Erik (talk) 20:23, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks - I hadn't seen either of those. I linked to a few of my videos a few years ago, but got my fingers burnt because I hadn't uploaded them to WP and used my own format rather than the Ogg format which approximately no one could play back in those days. Video wasn't as common then and no one who knew what was allowed was around at any of the relevant discussion places for six months. I also uploaded some videos in Ogg format, and these are still around :-) I'll make some edit to the WP:FILMCLIP page so I can find it again easily, unless it is perfect of course! Stephen B Streater (talk) 20:52, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
What edit do you have in mind? I attempted to create WP:FILMCLIP and WP:FILMSHOT as shortcuts, and the multimedia department is listed in the WikiProject Films sidebar. If you want to revise the "Video" section at that page, talk to User:Steve, who set up the video sample at American Beauty. I'm in the dark about video samples for now, though I hope to learn to upload a sample on my own. Erik (talk) 20:55, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Help with fair use of Image rationale

I added File:Ken Branagh on Thor.jpg to Thor (film) and would like additional help to make sure it use is justly reasoned. The biggest justification is that Thor is closed a set so any images depecting filming is sanctioned by the film makers and published as non-free content therefore no free alternative exists. However if this image does in fact violate wikipedia standards please let me know I will have image speedy deleted. Thank you. --TriiipleThreat (talk) 14:36, 10 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I looked at the image and reviewed the "Filming" section to see if there is any context. Unfortunately, I do not think there is a strong rationale for the image. Per WP:NFCC, the non-free image needs to be contextually significant, and I do not think that there is any available context that it signifies. For example, we already have free images of Kenneth Branagh, so we do not need a non-free image showing him. In addition, there is nothing unique happening in the shot. Even if there is technology to show off, it should be possible to get a free image of it. If the film article is to use any images, it would probably be related to makeup, costume design, or visual effects. I'm sure that kind of information will be forthcoming. For example, it's likely that the poster will show Thor, so we don't necessarily need to show him again in the article body. However, if there is context about the appearance of secondary characters or about a scene involving visual effects, that would be contextual significance to warrant including a non-free image. Let me know if you have any questions. Erik (talk) 18:43, 10 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the input I'll remove the image from the article and have it deleted. --TriiipleThreat (talk) 18:56, 10 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Hey I just came across this article [1] talking about technology in the photo. Would any info found there and added to the article rejustify the images use? --TriiipleThreat (talk) 19:23, 10 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Nevermind, article seems speculative at best. --TriiipleThreat (talk) 19:28, 10 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Ha

[2]Surprised you are ditching that, but still watching FlashForward, V and SGU... talk about disappointing series beginnings... Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs(talk) 20:13, 12 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

He's nuts. :-) I've only watched the first five episodes, but I must admit to being quite enamoured of Caprica. It's no BSG, but then it's not trying to be. FlashForward, V, SGU and Fringe however ... Steve T • C 20:28, 12 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
FlashForward was definitely weak when it first started out, but I think it is better in its returning episodes. V is not great; I kind of watch it in the hope that smart science fiction elements will surface. SGU definitely started slowly, but I really like the approach because I didn't follow the spinoffs and wanted to return to the franchise in a new way. And hey, Fringe and Walter have grown on me. :) Erik (talk | contribs) 20:52, 12 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, and Caprica goes nowhere. The best part of the show was the virtual world, New Caprica City. I'd love it if Caprica focused on holobands and not the painful robot/daughter scenes. The fictional universe is just too boringly grounded in future/retro Earth culture. Erik (talk | contribs) 20:54, 12 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I'm also onto V, but the long break cut down on my interest in the show. I'm trying to find a new interest as Lost comes to an end, and I don't know if V's ratings are going to keep it afloat. --Happy editing! Nehrams2020 (talk • contrib) 04:37, 13 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Have you checked out Justified? I've heard good things about it, and the first three episodes are on Hulu. I was planning to watch The Pacific, but I'm too busy to add an hour-long TV show to my queue. Erik (talk | contribs) 11:21, 13 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Justified seems pretty good, but I'm not sure I should be adding more shows to my Hulu queue when I've got finals coming up :P I was a huge fan of Stargate SG-1 (not so much Atlantis), so the change to "TEH DRAMAZ AND SLOW PACING" still irks me, but at least they seemed to have learned from their mistakes. I keep reminding myself that the first seasons of Star Trek series usually weren't that great either... :P Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs(talk) 20:35, 14 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I heard of Justified but I'm not that big an Olyphant fan. I really would like to see Pacific (Band of Brothers was great) but just don't have HBO right now, so have to wait till Blu-ray. --Happy editing! Nehrams2020 (talk • contrib) 02:04, 15 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The Wikipedia Signpost: 12 April 2010

RTMC

What do you think about adding something from this discussion to WP:RTMC about the subjective nature of the "Top Critics" section and the resulting score? Questions about appropriateness of RT seem to come up often enough that the essay made sense to be created when it was. Now I'm just thinking that we should keep it regularly updated when new issues arise and are resolved. For this, I was thinking something along the lines of:

Remember that the "Top Critics" section's overall score may differ depending on where in the world you're accessing Rotten Tomatoes. This is because your query may redirect you to a local site (such as uk.rottentomatoes.com in the United Kingdom and au.rottentomatoes.com in Australia) and the Rotten Tomatoes staff is given some subjective control in selecting "Top Critics", allowing for different make-up on different local sites.

It can probably be worded better but you get the idea. I'm thinking that it can be placed immediately after the sentence about sampling individual reviews from the "Top Critics" section. What do you think? Big Bird (talk • contribs) 12:53, 15 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The writeup sounds good, but I think it's better to place it as a limitation. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're referring to the "Index of usable sources" bullet point after the "ideal for sampling" sentence? Defining it as a limitation is more accurate, especially when we are telling the reader that "Top Critics" is not what it seems. Also, I'm not sure if it is a matter of "subjective control" that is problematic; my issue with "Top Critics" is that the sample size is sometimes insufficient when it's under 30 reviews. From what I recall in my stats class, and looking at Wikipedia's sample size article, "In general, if a population mean is estimated using the sample mean from n observations from a distribution with variance σ², then if n is large enough (typically >30) the central limit theorem can be applied to obtain an approximate 95% confidence interval..." Anyway, feel free to edit the essay and use its talk page. It's not the guidelines, after all! Erik (talk | contribs) 13:41, 15 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I was thinking of the "Index of usable sources" as a place for the statement but "Limitations" sounds like a logical place as well. The issue of sample size will definitely always be a factor whether it's the overall score or the "Top Critics" section. What I specifically meant by my statement is to explain why User:Belovedfreak and myself are able to agree that Avatar's overall score on RT is 82% but we're unable to agree about the current "Top Critics" score. I think both issues of sample size and regional difference should be resolved if my statement is placed below the existing statement on "Limited number of reviews" with a segue from one point to the next. I'll construct it and add it, feel free to adjust. Big Bird (talk • contribs) 14:01, 15 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

thanks for the invitation

I've started an account. No more am I just a number, a cog in the machine, a blip on the radar. Now I am Jack Sebastian. Still a blip on the radar, though. ;) - Jack Sebastian (talk) 23:15, 16 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Additional Lord of The Rings work; Blu Ray and 3D

hi erik. i started an article that im hoping you can help me on. it is about lord of the rings being released on blu ray, and the fact that new line cinema is considering putting lord of the rings back in theatres with 3D technology. if u have the time, please help me out with improving this article. thanks --Cman7792 (talk) 19:51, 18 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, Cman. I looked at your writeup, and I think you should move the article to your user space for now. The writeup is a reasonable start, but it needs to be structured and referenced. Would you be able to move it to User:Cman7792/Home video of Lord of the Rings film trilogy? In addition, The Lord of the Rings film trilogy has a lot of home video information already. I'm not sure if we need a whole new article about it; we may just be able to add a few paragraphs to that main trilogy article. Let me know if you have any questions! Erik (talk | contribs) 14:14, 19 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Film infoboxes

Do you intend to pursue Merging infobox templates? I hope so! Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 13:36, 19 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Argh, I forgot about that discussion... it did become stale. I'll try to follow up on it later today. Nudge me again if I don't! Erik (talk | contribs) 13:46, 19 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Nudge. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 13:56, 20 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks! :) I'll try to start on merging one smaller template into the main one. Erik (talk | contribs) 14:01, 20 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

filmographies rfc closed

fyi, the RfC is now closed and there's an implementation discussion at:

Cheers, Jack Merridew 00:48, 20 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The Wikipedia Signpost: 19 April 2010

Non-free images

Any time when you're available could you swing by and comment on the images at the cleanup listing? I've left comments for all of the FA images to begin with and hopefully with another comment or two we can have a better idea on what should be kept or removed. If anybody else is watching this page, I would welcome your comments there as well. --Happy editing! Nehrams2020 (talk • contrib) 04:15, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Cloverfield

Looking over some of our B-class articles, I stumbled on Cloverfield. The article is still in pretty good shape and I was just curious why you never took it on to GA. It obviously needs to be copyedited, the plot reduced, the lead expanded, and some sources replaced/added, but with a little work, you could probably get it to GA fairly easily. There are various articles like this one in the category that are nearly GAs that just need a little bit of work. Once the cleanup listing is finished, I'll probably do a search of all of the articles in the C & B class categories and point out potential candidates for members to pursue GAs. We can look to see how some of the GAs could reach FA as well. There are many potential cinema collaboration articles out there, which could greatly expand our current spotlight articles. Again, I'm waiting until after the cleanup, but since that is going to take forever at its current pace (I don't want to relive Sweeps again), it'll probably be a while before I compile the potential articles. --Happy editing! Nehrams2020 (talk • contrib) 06:09, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I think I tend to drop out of articles that get highly trafficked. Cloverfield was just busy with a lot of discussions that I did not find constructive. The article may need revision with retrospective publication, especially in regard to its viral marketing. Erik (talk | contribs) 14:54, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I usually try to pursue articles also that usually aren't constantly changed (I guess that was a bad idea to strive for the main page!). I couldn't image how crazy it was when you guys were working on The Dark Knight or those focused on Avatar. Just thought I'd point it out to you in case it got bypassed by more current projects. --Happy editing! Nehrams2020 (talk • contrib) 05:47, 23 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I guess that was a bad idea to strive for the main page! Sorry, I'm not sure what you mean here? I'm not sure how much I can help with Cloverfield, though. One of the major blows in losing my university account is that I can't check newspaper and magazine articles on a whim. I have to choose my projects more selectively now. Erik (talk | contribs) 11:53, 23 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I just had Oklahoma City bombing on the front page, and it had the joy of numerous edits. Unfortunately I was at work for the majority of the day so I couldn't help to maintain it. You likely had more revisions though with Fight Club. You should ask your university to consider letting you use the account for free or for a reduced rate as you would only be using it to improve articles that educate others for free. If worded well, there's always a possibility it could work. As always, if you need assistance with seeing an article, let me know. --Happy editing! Nehrams2020 (talk • contrib) 00:50, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Final Destination 5 at IMDB

Inre Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Final Destination 5: The Death Trip: While the article written by User:Masolipis111 is frought with problems, the topic itself is not a hoax, and so I believe the topic itself may merit a merit a redirect to Final Destination (film series), where speculation of a 5th in the series might best be covered. Not exactly RS, but Slashfilm, Screenrant, Shock Till You Drop, and others all make note of Warner Bros. head Alan Horn announcing at ShoWest that they're planning Final Destination 5. So while the current article itself is full of unsourced speculation, the chase for consumer dollars makes the project likely. If we set a redirect, Wikipedia can afford to be patient and revisit this topic when it receives more coverage and in reliable sources. Schmidt, MICHAEL Q. 20:11, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It's a hoax based on development talk. Even if there is talk about a fifth film, the subtitle "The Death Trip" is completely false. The same editor likely created Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Alvin and the Chipmunks 3: The Chipmunk Rampage (film). The information at the film series article is acceptable, but this article is not a realistic redirect in any sense. Erik (talk | contribs) 20:14, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
It looks like Final Destination 5 is deleted and salted. We should contact an admin to unsalt it and redirect to the proper section at the film series article. Erik (talk | contribs) 20:17, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, Steve! Erik (talk | contribs) 20:47, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Gerund zero

[3] It is a verb, but the verb's noun form; therefore it's treated as such (see gerund). Imagine it with a more obvious noun in its place ("the supporters' table"). I think we've had this discussion before; I couldn't convince you then, if I recall. :-) Steve T • C 20:24, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I had that suspicion... what about something like "showed that Chávez's supporters were shooting"? It's a couple more words, but it may iron out the gerund weirdness. Erik (talk | contribs) 20:27, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
That's the thing; if it sounds weird it sounds weird, even if it's technically correct. I reworked it accordingly. Steve T • C 20:29, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I'm just doing minor copy-editing here, but I'm making a few points in an open FAC page that I'll post soon. Just getting the nitpicks that I can personally address out of the way. Chavez picture looks good. Erik (talk | contribs) 20:31, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Legal_threat_regarding_image

I've re-opened the discussion on the grounds that the removal of the image doesn't seem to meet any criteria for removal. Woogee (talk) 20:47, 23 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

See Talk:Don Murphy#Photo. The licensing is appropriate, but editors did not feel it was necessary to include the image. Feel free to counter them. Erik (talk | contribs) 20:49, 23 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I hope that's not your real address that they pulled up on the website. :( SilverserenC 07:11, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, they're in the process of outing me. Hopefully they won't harass my fiancee... Erik (talk | contribs) 10:12, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Urgent problem: someone thinks I'm you and is extremely mad at you

Hello,

I've received two calls in the past hour from a person named Don. He is extremely upset with the wikipedia editor named Erik and has somehow googled his way to me. My name is Erik Kraft and he found my phone number and address. He won't tell me how he found my information. He refuses to believe I'm not the wikipedia editor Erik and is making weird threats. He won't even tell me what article he's so upset about; he is so convinced I'm the person he's mad at that he thinks I'm playing dumb. Can you help fill me in? My email address is krrraft@gmail.com and my phone number is 773 682 9254. Please get in touch ASAP. And anything you can do to cool off this Don guy would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Erik

It might be a bit late, but do you want me to frag the old revisions of your user page? Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs(talk) 16:29, 24 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hello--this is Erik Kraft writing again. Thank you for the offer, but I'm not sure what this means--I'm not the wikipedia user Erik and I don't have a user page. This is the whole problem. I'd appreciate the wikipedia editor Erik coming forward to clarify things. I've never been so confused about something in my life.

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