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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by 83.38.20.81 (talk) at 21:34, 16 November 2010 (→‎Arabic name: new section). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

One can say Many Roman Monuments

The mosque was a Roman Temple when mouslims arrived; the Roman bridge over Guadalquivir, the triumph door, the theater and many other monuments are in favour of this theory.

Name

Well, this could be a touchy issue, but after linking to this article on occasion from articles about the Moorish period, it strikes me that the name Córdoba, Spain is a poor choice of location. It's true that the city is currently in Spain, but its history includes Roman and Moorish periods, among others. Perhaps something more neutral like Córdoba (city)? --Delirium 01:19, Oct 1, 2004 (UTC)

It should be at Córdoba. Chameleon 09:39, 1 Oct 2004 (UTC)
Either way is okay by me; this is certainly the most famous Córdoba, and the content at the Córdoba could be moved to something like "Cordoba (disambiguation)" if there are no objections. -- Infrogmation 19:55, 1 Oct 2004 (UTC)
It's the most famous, but unlike in cases like Paris, where the other uses are minor, I'm not sure it's as clear-cut: Córdoba, Argentina has 1,350,000 people, and is that country's second-largest city. --Delirium 05:25, August 28, 2005 (UTC)
I think Córdoba, Spain is the best name for the article. As Delirium said, there's a Cordoba, Argentina that is very significant as well. And I think the modern location of the city is fine. The article is on the city, which is in Spain. If this were an article like History of Córdoba, Spain, it might be more problematic.--Bkwillwm 17:20, 5 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]
I´m Spanish and I think that "Córdoba, Spain" is -of course- the best name for the article. If We follow Delirium´s reasons, We can´t write an article called "London, England" or "NY, USA", because the history of these cities also includes differents periods of foreign domination or colonization. In any case, Corduba (Córdoba)was included in Hispania province in Roman Period. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.217.175.176 (talk) 03:03, 27 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Córdoba or Córdova?

CORDOVA IS CORDOVA IS CORDOVA!

Why; if the Wikipedia article in French on the same topic can use the French word, the Catalan language page using the Catalan word, the Italian page using the Italian word, etcetera; can not the English-language version use the English name which has existed for this city for hundreds of years? I know it's some sort of politically correct pedantery, from people with more money than sense deciding that because they've been there on holiday for a week that the only version to be used to describe things abroad is in their (usually only approximate) version of what one of the languages in that area use.

Cordova is Cordova. It's the name of the city in English. Why use another language to describe it within an English text? Just like Naples is Naples, not Napoli, which is an Italian word. Rome is Rome, not Roma. Geneva is Geneva, even if these pedants prefer to say "I've just been to visit Geneve again. How beau it is in the montagnes..." or whatever other silly foreign word they jam into their conversation to show how ever-so-clever they are to have forgotten how to say it in English. Nine times in ten you find they don't even speak the language the so eagerly want to pepper their English with.

'Just a thought.

Patrick O' Solsti.

I'm English, and I've always known it as 'Cordoba', without the accent. There are plenty of precedents for foreign placenames which have traditionally had an English language version reverting to the original name used by nationals of that country even when speaking in English. Peking/Beijing is a contemporary example. Atlases published in the early 20th Century refer to a town called 'Leghorn' in Tuscany, but this has fallen into disuse and the Italian 'Livorno' is used instead. Similarly, I would argue for 'Puglia' (Italy), rather than 'Apuglia', because that is how I have always known it, but there are those who would disagree. There are no hard-and-fast rules for which is authentic or correct as the usage is constantly changing. 88.14.200.129 (talk) 13:33, 27 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I'm American, and I've only heard "Cordoba" as well. I think it sounds nicer, too, but whatever.68.84.23.145 (talk) 22:40, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I've always heard it as Cordoba or Córdoba as well. Just because something has an English name doesn't mean that's the name that English speakers use. - Montréalais (talk) 23:44, 21 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
There are many cities of course where the English name differs from the one used by the locals. Moscow, Paris and just down from the road from Cordoba, Seville all spring to mind. The titles of the English language wikipedia articles rightly refer to them as such and indeed anyone who tried to pronounce them as the locals do in English would sound faintly ridiculous. However I'm not convinced Cordoba falls into that category. Sure I've seen Cordova but only in older texts and not from anything that was written in my lifetime. It sounds rather quaint like referring to "the Argentine" or something. Its not being overly PC or pretentious to call it in wikipedia by the name that most people seem to call it nowadays. The English wikipedia is rightly using the common English name in the same way as the French or Catalan wikis would, it just happens that that name has become the same as the Spanish name, whatever it was called historically. If anyone has any evidence that the Cordova form is sufficiently used in contemporary usage to take precedence fine. Reynardthefox (talk) 22:47, 10 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

ROMAN NAME?

Before Roman, there were not anything; Nothing; after that, the city knew all its richness.

Why does 'Jewish Quarter' link to 'Ghetto'? There is a sinagoga in midle of this quarter, I think Jews decide to live closed to their church; it is correct than Jews was prosecuted many time by muslims and after Catholic Kings were many time tortured or killed.

      • Why is Cordoba called Cordoba? Old Latin? Spanish? Arabic? What does Cordoba mean? Claudius named it Corduba. What does it mean?

Karduba (Kart-Iuba). Iuba, was a general who died fighting in the Region at 230 BC; before latins or Romans other people lived in the region; Romans began the construction of the city and the first constructions are Romans

The name of Corduba was the original of the Iberos city Roman found when they began to conquered Spain. Romans settle a militar location close to them. Due to they got on well, Roman decided created a real city, and the Iberian name for that area was taken by Romans to named the new city. Few time after, Augusto gave to Cordoba the status of Colonia, and the name became Colonia Patricia Corduba.
So, there were two cities, the Iberian and the Roman one. As time went by, Iberians moved to the Roman Cordoba until finally, the Iberian one disappeared. It´s not true to say "Before Roman, there were not anything, as someone said before.
For checking this information: Arqueocordoba, develop by the Archaeology department of University of Cordoba.


Córdoba

This article needs more work, it doesn't look good. -- ICE77 84.222.103.59 11:46, 14 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It needs more text. It also needs a representative photo of the typical whitewashed look of buildings in modern Cordoba, which is very distinctive from northern and eastern Spain. I have a few at http://dheera.net/photos/thumb.php?q=europe2005/andalucia I'd be willing to insert, but I'm hesitant to do so yet because the article already has too many photos and too little text.

Also perhaps one should write about the Flamenco events, and create a transportation section. Cordoba has a bus system, is part of a convenient bike rental system, and is serviced by high-speed train as well. 18.62.12.133 16:15, 13 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]


Flamenco events ?

Flamenco events in 2007?, even in Cordoba there are a few shows of Flamenco per year; but, you are right, the article is uncomplete and the article says the flamenco is very popular in Cordoba.

Largest in the World Aside from Constantinople?

I suspect Chang'an (modern day Xian) and Baghdad were both considerably larger than either Córdoba or Constantinople in the 10th century, contrary to what the opening paragraph states. Furthermore Kaifeng, Hangzhou, Zhongdu (modern day Beijing) and Kyoto may also have been larger than either city. It would seem unlikely that Europe, which at this time had less people and was far less advanced than either the Abbasid Caliphate or the Song Empire, would be home to the world's two-largest cities. I'm not going to alter anything yet because I don't have any totally reliable sources, but the 'Historical urban community sizes' article on this site suggests that Constantinople and Córdoba were smaller than Baghdad and Chang'an at very least. The link provided, admittedly does place Cordoba as the largest for a brief period, but that is in contradiction with what I have read elsewhere, so perhaps the article could be re-worded: 'It is believed by some that Córdoba was the largest city in the world from 935 to 1013'.

I believe Christopher Tyerman, in "God's War", claims that Baghdad was the largest city in the world in this period (1 million inhabitants). He lists Cairo and Constantinople as having 500,000 inhabitants. The claims that Cordoba is the largest city in the world seems spurious at best. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.111.228.240 (talk) 12:58, 5 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

at any case, very large

From Roman bridge to Medinat al Zahara are more than 10 kilometres.


Excellent bull teather

Bulls are prosecuted and killed for pleasure of female and male. The article does not talk anyting about this.

Please stick to editing in your native language. Your English isn't anywhere near as good as you think it is. Iantnm (talk) 13:35, 27 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Evidence

What on earth is the evidence for this statement?

In Roman times, the city had more culturals buildings than Rome.
    • I removed the statement and reworded it. It looks like this statement was stolen from answers.com or one of the numerous sites, mostly promotional, that seem to have copied each other. Ther is no strict agreed definition of a cultural building, so it's meaningless to say more. Furthermore, Roman times is extremely vague. Dheerav2 15:58, 29 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Gibberish

The article speaks of:

Monasteries and broods (some of them are desafected)

What on earth does this mean? even in Spanish? --Sir Myles na Gopaleen (the da) 16:56, 17 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

omg fix the wild sentence wrapping problem I created, thanks.

Hacked

the 1.000.000.000.000.000 or so inhabitants in the 10th century mention. the beginning of the history chapter. the page has been owned. didn't anybody notice? help, please. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Adrantomis (talk • contribs) 23:07, 7 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Utter, utter, utter twaddle. Stick to your mother tongue. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Iantnm (talk • contribs) 13:36, 27 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Patio festival

Why there is no info about Patio festival ? Kupsztal (talk) 21:50, 9 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Feria

Currently, the article says that most important festival in Cordoba is the 'Patios', but the 'Feria' have a lot more people (approximately 100% of the inhabitants, the second weekend people come from across the province, and along week people from all over Spain) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.168.59.62 (talk) 17:15, 9 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Fernando Tejero

Fernando Tejero is not a flamenco artist, but an actor. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.216.153.50 (talk) 11:52, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Cordoba as symbol of Islamic Conquest

To all the people who value political correctness over the facts of the existence in the Muslim world by some, that Cordoba is a symbol of Islamic conquest. (i.e. Bkwillwm, Steelersfan7roe - obviously not New Yorkers.)

Please consider this quote from the reference I provided:

http://www.elaph.com/Web/opinion/2010/5/562230.html :

...as is well known that the Mosque of Cordoba, the first was built in a Spanish cities by Muslims after the that have occupied the country Christian and killed men and insulted women and Ngulwhn to the Arab countries Kjuari and maids who provide sexual pleasure for them, and this colonial history is still the Arabs and Muslims boast about it and Imjdonh and consider it a symbol of strength and greatness and insensitive ashamed of pages filled with crimes shameful!

(Disclosure: this quote is not verbatim, because it was generated by Google Translate of the original Arabic, but it's a verbatim quote of that output.) Picador127 (talk) 02:47, 27 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Cordoba as symbol of Islamic Conquest

I dont know that opinions, or quotes of opinions (espically ones that are not in english) belong in this artical. You could just as easly say that Cordoba is a symbol of conquest to some people of roman heritage/beliefs, or that it represents a symbol of civilation and education to some muslims. To drive my point home you could say that some believe cordoba to be frequently visited by UFO's http://www.disclose.tv/forum/ufo-over-southern-spain-march-30th-2009-t3128.html 8/27/2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Alaska78 (talk • contribs) 10:39, 27 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"(espically [sic] ones that are not in english [sic]) belong in this artical. [sic]" - well said, Alaska78. So you don't think an opinion piece written in Arabic, for an Arabic audience is relevant to a reference regarding an Islamic-world sentiment? Ordinarily, I wouldn't waste my time with this wikinonsense, but since I live in New York City, where 19 Islamic Fundamentalists MURDERED 39 of my co-workers - I have an interest in pointing out certain non-trivial, political facets of the description of the city of Cordoba. I guess I'm done. You terrorist sympathizers win because I cannot waste any more of my time reversing the edits of communist, Dukakis-hugging moon maidens. Wait until it happens in your city you freakn' hippies. Picador127 (talk) 15:03, 27 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Removed minor detail from introduction

Although it is certainly true that some people claim Cordoba is a symbol of Islamic conquest, this piece of cultural trivia is not sufficiently important to be in the introduction. If you'd like to re-add it, you could for instance create a section near the end of the article called Cultural Allusions, or some such. Ordinary Person (talk) 13:37, 27 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

well, that's just your opinion, OP and it's certainly not authoritative - so I will just put it back; thanks anyway. Picador127 (talk) 15:23, 27 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]
There are many problems with your addition to the lead. First, Cordoba has been under Spanish control for centuries and there is a Christian church in the center of the mosque; It seems strange to just jam a sentence into the lead asserting that Cordoba is a symbol of Muslim dominance. Also, randomly inserting factoids into articles isn't very good editing. I ran the article through Google translate, and there doesn't seem to be much concerning Cordoba as a symbol of Muslim dominance. It references the Mezquita, but doesn't really say anything about the city. Albeit, that could be the machine translation. Really, when it comes down to it, randomly inserting sentences in articles based on the latest political meme doesn't make a good encyclopedia. Is there any source that refers indicates that Cordoba has served as symbol of Muslim dominance besides those written in the past few weeks regarding the Manhattan mosque?--Bkwillwm (talk) 03:58, 28 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • I didn't add it - I merely put it back. It appears to have been added with this edit: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=C%C3%B3rdoba,_Spain&oldid=373642198
  • I could just as easily claim that the motivations for people removing it are based on "the latest political meme", as you can claim it was the reason it was added.
  • the fact that Cordoba has been under Spanish control for centuries does not at all diminish the symbolism - are you saying that the older a historical event, the less relevant it is? Try telling that to the Sunnis and Shi'as about the Battle of Siffin
  • I think we both know that if you asked any radical Islamist if the Caliphate of Cordoba should be restored, they would definitely say yes.
  • Thanks for your comments.Picador127 (talk) 22:26, 29 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Generally in Cordoba we believe the city should simbolize tolerance between the three mayor religions of the time of the Caliphate (even though there was conflict between them and dominance of Islam over Cristianism and judaism). It was in Cordoba also where Averroes came up with the doctrine of the double truth and double use of science and religion,as different ways to reach truth, therefore simbolizing tolerance of religion with science (even though I believe that, like many scientists and philosophers, averroes was merely sucking up to the religious people in power to be able to continue teaching his "controversial" science).

I therefore believe it would be better to say Cordoba is a simbol of tolerance in an age of religious wars and superstition, than a simbol of Islamic Conquest. It was in the Caliphate of Cordoba where the Coran was most loosely and liberaly understood, where images of animals and persons where created, where wine was drunk and pork was eaten, where science and philosophy could try and challenge religious authority, and from whence came a spirit of relative "tolerance" towards scientific and philosophical thought that reintroduced Aristotle to europe (through Toledo), fed the european scholastic schools, and ultimately gave rise to the Renaisance. It isa a simbol of Islam, and Spain as it should have been, had only the tolerant doctrines created there taken root rather than been exported to other countries and cultures. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.216.136.123 (talk) 10:27, 14 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Twinning

I don't believe the info about Cordoba's twin towns is right. I checked http://www.ayuncordoba.es/hermanamientos.html and the info on this page (the Cordoba town hall web page) is different from the one to be found on this wikipedia page. Can someone check it as well and make the changes? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.216.136.123 (talk) 10:06, 14 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Arabic name

Many Spanish cities and toponyms have a name of Arabic origin. What's the reason to include the Arabic name of this city in the English article?

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