Talk:Solo: A Star Wars Story

Space western

I removed space Western from the lead. Not that I do not think the source or statement is unwarranted, but we need a third-party to suggest sources for the film, not a producer. Per WP:SUBJECTIVE, "Wikipedia articles about art and other creative topics (e.g., musicians, actors, books, etc.) have a tendency to become effusive. [...] it is appropriate to note how an artist or a work has been received by prominent experts and the general public. [...] Verifiable public and scholarly critiques provide useful context for works of art." In short, we need someone outside the production to place the film into categories, not someone who is trying to market the film in any specific way. Andrzejbanas (talk) 19:36, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

I get what you're coming from, though "space western" does not qualify as "effusive". I'm not seeing any other genre labels available (since everyone knows it's Star Wars). This third-party source does mention "space western" (and the reason for it, at least based on the trailer). Unless we want to just call it a Star Wars film, why not keep "space western" until there's something better? Erik (talk | contrib) ^{(ping me)} 12:55, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

I'm leaning towards that its mentioned by a producer, and being reported by a third-party source. It comes more off as marketing than any third-party thing. A person can spin a film in any way to make it unique, so I'd rather we keep it straight and just wait it out for a third party source to see a final product, opposed to some marketing type of spin on the film. Andrzejbanas (talk) 12:15, 5 April 2018 (UTC)

Including box office prediction

Box Office Pro is saying Solo could open to $150M in the 3-day opening weekend and it has a lengthy-well-written article on why it might be able to do those numbers: https://pro.boxoffice.com/long-range-tracking-solo-star-wars-story/. Hope we can add it into the wiki page for Solo. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.242.50.246 (talk) 01:41, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

When I previously reverted @Disneyisatale: adding it to the article, I cited WP:CRYSTALBALL. Why would we add information that is pure speculation? What is notable about this prediction, and why should it be included? The article doesn't collect every prediction and article about Solo. What is significant about the opening predictions for a movie that's going to open in two months that makes it worth including? ~Cheers, TenTonParasol 02:45, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

Well, you allowed it to happen with Avengers: Infinity War. To sy this can't be allowed, even though the same site's projection for Infinity War's opening weekend can be allowed on it's page is unfair. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.242.50.246 (talk) 13:52, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS: just because it exists elsewhere does not mean it's necessarily right to do on this page. My arguments apply to the Infinity War article, which I am not involved with: Why does this projection merit inclusion? How is it significant? Why should this article include speculation and predictions? ~Cheers, TenTonParasol 15:33, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

Agree with TenTonParasol. Such information is for news sites not encyclopaedias. Box office figures once the film is released are quite sufficient Robynthehode (talk) 21:24, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

To make another comment, the idea that this is done "for every movie", I haven't seen it until very recently, that box office predictions are added to articles. I do not understand why this doesn't violate WP:CRYSTALBALL and in as far as WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS arguments, additions of box office predictions has been removed from at least the Deadpool 2 film article on the grounds that it is speculation and subject to wild change, and that inclusion of box office numbers should be based in firm existing numbers rather than just predictions. I do not know what the merit of including predictions of box office numbers include without some significant context as to why we're going to he including speculation. We don't include any other kind of speculation, even those made by RS, so why does it change when it's box office projection? ~Cheers, TenTonParasol 16:25, 1 April 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, it also falls under WP:NOTNEWS, as this is purely the sort of overanalysis one finds in the trade press. It's not encyclopedia material and has no place in the article. oknazevad (talk) 17:26, 1 April 2018 (UTC) PS, I changed the breaded of this section to something more descriptive of the topic of discussion, not the misspelled copied headline.

@96.242.50.246: Stop adding the section back to the page. The edit is under discussion and under dispute, the page needs to stay in status quo. Please continue to discuss it here. ~Cheers, TenTonParasol 17:10, 1 April 2018 (UTC)

I'm not gonna stop. I want it in there. It should be allowed. It's not speculation. It's long-range forecasting the movie's box office based on audience awareness. It should be allowed. If Solo can't have it, Deadpool 2 shouldn't have it. So, unless u want me to continue getting into an edit war with you, I suggest u back offend let me add in the box office projections. So, TenTonParasol, let me have my way. Or I'll start deleting other box office predictions from other pages, since, u won't let me keep mine in there. You can't just prevent me from adding in from Box Office Pro like if ur the boss of me. That's censorship of freedom of speech. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.242.50.246 (talk) 01:03, 2 April 2018 (UTC)

So you state flatly you will not listen to consensus and will continue to edit war. You won't be around here very long if you do that, you know. You're heading for a block, all based on an WP:OTHERCRAPEXISTS argument. Here's a more productive idea: see what people say the the film wikiproject. Maybe they'll agree with you. Or maybe the other articles will have the predictions removed. But since consistency between articles seems to be the issue you have, asking in a broader forum is a better idea than edit warring in a way that will get you blocked. oknazevad (talk) 02:01, 2 April 2018 (UTC)

As I've stated: I don't feel that the fact that it exists in other articles is firm enough reasoning. And stating that "it's not speculation" just doesn't make sense. Even if it is extrapolating from data, it is still a prediction—which is the same exact thing as speculation in this context. The rest of your arguments (censorship?? WP:ILIKEIT) are tangential and don't address the content on its merits. I've opened up a discussion at WP:FILM: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Film#Box Office Predictions. ~Cheers, TenTonParasol 02:46, 2 April 2018 (UTC)

I suppose the inclusion of this content per WP:CRYSTAL, which says, "It is appropriate to report discussion and arguments about the prospects for success of future proposals and projects or whether some development will occur, if discussion is properly referenced. It is not appropriate for editors to insert their own opinions or analyses. Predictions, speculation, forecasts and theories stated by reliable, expert sources or recognized entities in a field may be included, though editors should be aware of creating undue bias to any specific point-of-view." So it is a false claim to cite WP:CRYSTAL in removing the content. Furthermore, whether other stuff exists or not is irrelevant. Maybe stuff has not quite existed in the past because of certain editors misapplying WP:CRYSTAL as has just happened here. Erik (talk | contrib) ^{(ping me)} 11:40, 2 April 2018 (UTC)

I concede the CRYSTAL argument, but my concern over whether or not the numbers are adding anything to the understanding of the topic at hand here in this specific article at this moment in time stand. The numbers don't really add anything to understanding without the context of actual box office numbers. Why is this projection important, in an industry where there will ultimately be a dozen projections—most of which will be promptly forgotten if the box office hits it? ~Cheers, TenTonParasol 15:28, 2 April 2018 (UTC)

Solo: A Star Wars Story runtime revealed

The official site for the 2018 Cannes Film Festival has revealed that the official runtime for Solo: A Star Wars Story has been revealed to be 2 hours and 15 minutes (135 minutes long): http://www.festival-cannes.com/en/infos-communiques/communique/articles/the-2018-official-selection'%20%20rel='noopener. Hope we can add this into the movie's wiki page, because I see this as the official runtime, especially since Ron Howard has finished the final edit on Solo.