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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by JackFloridian (talk | contribs) at 11:40, 22 May 2019. The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Sources and notability

A comment at WP Sociology raised the issue of whether "Male expendability" is sufficiently notable to have an article at Wikipedia. Let's have the discussion here.

I understand that we should always assume good faith, but it should be noted that there is a long history of subjects like this being swept under the rug as "not important" whenever they are brought up in the public square because they go against the common "Patriarchy Theory" narrative. On that basis alone, I think declaring it "not notable" would be premature, as in effect Wikipedia would be bowing to political pressure from a specific interest group even if the original raising of the issue was done in good faith.JackFloridian (talk) 11:40, 22 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I believe it is notable, based on numerous references at Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL, especially in books. Where I agree with the OP, is that none of them have an explicit definition. Per GNG: If a topic has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject, it is presumed to be suitable for a stand-alone article,[emphasis in original] and there's nothing further down that page that implies that locating a definition in a source is a requirement for notability. Neither does MOS:LEADSENTENCE require it, and bullet 3 implies that it isn't required. Finally, template {{Missing lead}} is available to tag the article, if needed. So, I believe that this topic is notable. Mathglot (talk) 12:09, 3 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

While your argument is convincing, I could make a similar argument for "male disposability" but when you read the sources, they don't clearly define either one. See Misandry#Male disposability. I'm of the mind that we should #redirect or merge to that section. Atsme📞📧 12:38, 3 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The "male disposability" material does seem to be about the same concept. But you could take that material and merge it here. Bondegezou (talk) 17:11, 3 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The customary procedure is to spin-off from the main article because there is no more room to expand. We don't necessarily create stand alone articles unless there is good cause, and I'm not seeing it here. Atsme📞📧 23:25, 3 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Here's some room to expand, from a few sources on the topic:
  1. ~ and roots of polygamy[1]
  2. ~ starts in the womb[2]
  3. masculinity as a moral code assoc. w ~[3]
  4. ~ biologically rooted[4]
  5. evolutionary and biol roots of ~[5]
  6. sense of ~ from slaughter in WWI[6]
  7. burakumin background as origin of ~[7]
  8. Wheeler's response to ~[8]
  9. (relevant snippet p.333 missing)[9]
  10. one- gender "marriages" increase with ~[10]
  11. in Japanese fiction[11]
  12. boxing, bruising, and ~[12]
  13. ~ and populist political protest[13]
  14. ~ and human warriors[14]
  15. feminist guerillas celebrating ~ [15]
Plenty to feast on, there. Mathglot (talk) 07:37, 4 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Go to Misandry and look in the right margin at the nav boxes (1) Series on Masculism and (2) Series on Discrimination and you'll see what I'm talking about regarding redundancy. Atsme📞📧 16:05, 4 February 2018 (UTC) [reply]

References

  1. ^ Roy F. Baumeister (12 August 2010). Is There Anything Good About Men?: How Cultures Flourish by Exploiting Men. Oxford University Press. p. 175. ISBN 978-0-19-970591-7. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  2. ^ Howard Bloom (1 November 2013). The Lucifer Principle: A Scientific Expedition into the Forces of History. Grove/Atlantic, Incorporated. pp. 103–. ISBN 978-0-8021-9218-9. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  3. ^ Danny Kaplan (30 November 2006). The Men We Loved: Male Friendship and Nationalism in Israeli Culture. Berghahn Books. p. 121. ISBN 978-1-78238-937-8. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  4. ^ James Giles (9 April 2006). The Spaces of Violence. University of Alabama Press. p. 94. ISBN 978-0-8173-1502-3. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  5. ^ Carlin A. Barton (2001). Roman Honor: The Fire in the Bones. University of California Press. p. 40. ISBN 978-0-520-92564-9. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  6. ^ Mark Spilka (1992). Renewing the normative D.H. Lawrence: a personal progress. University of Missouri Press. p. 16. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  7. ^ Eve Zimmerman (2007). Out of the alleyway: Nakagami Kenji and the poetics of outcaste fiction. Harvard University Asia Center. p. 75. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  8. ^ Susan Jeffords (1 January 1989). The Remasculinization of America: Gender and the Vietnam War. Indiana University Press. p. 108. ISBN 978-0-253-33188-5. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  9. ^ Sneja Marina Gunew (1991). A Reader in Feminist Knowledge. Routledge, Chapman & Hall, Incorporated. p. 333. ISBN 978-0-415-04698-5. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  10. ^ Fidelity. Wanderer Forum Foundation. 1989. p. 17. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  11. ^ Proceedings of the Association for Japanese Literary Studies: PAJLS. AJLS. 2000. p. 244. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  12. ^ Gerald Lyn Early (1994). The Culture of Bruising: Essays on Prizefighting, Literature, and Modern American Culture. Ecco Press. p. 20. ISBN 978-0-88001-310-9. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  13. ^ Ellen Peck (1975). A funny thing happened on the way to equality. Prentice-Hall. p. 55. ISBN 978-0-13-345512-0. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  14. ^ van der Dennen, J.M.G. "Why is the Human Primitive Warrior Virtually Always the Male of the Species?". U. of Groningen. Groningen, Netherlands. Retrieved 3 February 2018.
  15. ^ Carter, Mia (1993). "The Strange Case of Callie Khouri: Public and Private Responses to Thelma & Louise". Tex. J. Women & L. 2 (1 (Winter)): 126. Retrieved 3 February 2018 – via HeinOnline.
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