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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by 79.44.235.28 (talk) at 08:08, 27 May 2019 (→‎The Great Wall of China: Documentary). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

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Ways to improve Ran Wei

Hello, Nlu,

Thanks for creating Ran Wei! I edit here too, under the username Eagleash and it's nice to meet you :-)

I wanted to let you know that I have tagged the page as having some issues to fix, as a part of our page curation process and note that:-

Please see WP:NACTOR

The tags can be removed by you or another editor once the issues they mention are addressed. If you have questions, leave a comment here and prepend it with {{Re|Eagleash}}. And, don't forget to sign your reply with ~~~~ . For broader editing help, please visit the Teahouse.

Delivered via the Page Curation tool, on behalf of the reviewer.

Eagleash (talk) 23:58, 24 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

long time no chat

Hello, this is Ling.Nut. Can you translate this for me? Google translate is no help:

  • 六部口坦克追轧学生撤退队伍事件. Thanks ♦ Lingzhi2 (talk) 16:13, 17 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    @Lingzhi2: Can you give me a bit more context? (I can look myself later today, but giving me a bit of context would speed things up.) --Nlu (talk) 16:18, 17 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    One of many many posts by Wu Renhua on the June 4th 1989 event: ]https://blog.boxun.com/hero/201006/wurenhua/5_1.shtml here]. I am cleaning the references of that article in my sandbox. ♦ Lingzhi2 (talk) 16:21, 17 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    @Lingzhi2: In that context (as a reference article title) I would render it as "The Incident Where Tanks Ran Over Retreating Group of Students at Liubukou." If it were to become a separate article of its own, a less clumsy title should probably be considered. --Nlu (talk) 17:45, 17 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • Hey thanks... As for making it into a separate article, that might involve the ability to read Chinese. Regrettably I do not have that ability. :-( I guess nothing is impossible, but it's very highly unlikely... But thanks again for the helpful translation! If you ever need anything, drop me a line... PS, just as an aside, I'm somewhat surprised by the lack of activity on the June 4th page. For example, The Holocaust is a veritable beehive of editor activity, but Tienanmen is something of a backwater on Wikipedia, at least relatively speaking.... but... it is what it is. ♦ Lingzhi2 (talk) 04:55, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Categories

Hi Nlu, thanks a lot for your work categorizing Chinese biographical articles! However, I believe some of the categories you added are WP:OVERCAT, such as categorizing scientists as writers/science writers/educators. Practically all scientists publish and most also teach. Unless a scientist is a noted writer or educator, I don't think these categories need to be added. What do you think? -Zanhe (talk) 23:57, 1 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Zanhe: Possibly. I certainly think that's open to discussion. I think we may need to set up some standards thereof, but absent standards, I think think overinclusiveness may be better than uninclusiveness. I certainly had some reservations about including some entertainers as "writers" when the quality of their writing may be suspect, but I also didn't necessarily want to get into value judgments on that issue... --Nlu (talk) 00:00, 2 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Lawyers and law students' signatures needed for Supreme Court amicus brief in favor of publishing the law

Hello, given your userbox I thought you might be interested in helping Carl Malamud's case for the public domain, crucial also for Wikisource: https://boingboing.net/2019/04/25/happy-law-day.html . Best regards, Nemo 21:07, 25 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

ArbCom 2019 special circular

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The Arbitration Committee may require a new RfA if your account is compromised.

View additional information

This message was sent to all administrators following a recent motion. Thank you for your attention. For the Arbitration Committee, Cameron11598 02:28, 4 May 2019 (UTC) Template:Z152[reply]

Administrator account security (Correction to Arbcom 2019 special circular)

ArbCom would like to apologise and correct our previous mass message in light of the response from the community.

Since November 2018, six administrator accounts have been compromised and temporarily desysopped. In an effort to help improve account security, our intention was to remind administrators of existing policies on account security — that they are required to "have strong passwords and follow appropriate personal security practices." We have updated our procedures to ensure that we enforce these policies more strictly in the future. The policies themselves have not changed. In particular, two-factor authentication remains an optional means of adding extra security to your account. The choice not to enable 2FA will not be considered when deciding to restore sysop privileges to administrator accounts that were compromised.

We are sorry for the wording of our previous message, which did not accurately convey this, and deeply regret the tone in which it was delivered.

For the Arbitration Committee, -Cameron11598 21:04, 4 May 2019 (UTC) Template:Z83[reply]

Generals

Hi Nlu, thanks for your categorization work and sorry about the reverts. I don't think military generals should be categorized as politicians even if they are represented in the Central Committee. Regards, -Zanhe (talk) 01:48, 12 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Zanhe: I see your point. I respectfully disagree - but I'll respect your call on this. --Nlu (talk) 04:04, 12 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Virtually all Chinese generals hold seats in national or provincial Communist Party congresses. The politician categories are WP:OVERLAPCAT and WP:NONDEFINING, IMO. This also applies to the categorization of scientists as science writers, as practically all scientists publish. -Zanhe (talk) 19:26, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Zanhe: Possibly, but while most generals do hold political offices (and are Communist Party members), there are rare exceptions (as to both). But I don't quite agree that "practically all scientists publish." Some are in private businesses and/or are not in academia, in which case they may not publish. --Nlu (talk) 19:51, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Of course nothing is ever 100%. But when two categories overlap overwhelmingly, only the defining one should be included, see WP:Overcategorization. -Zanhe (talk) 20:06, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Zanhe: But are these truly nondefining characteristics? I am not convinced. I mean, this is not a situation where someone once appeared in a dorm play and is considered an "actor." That would truly be nondefining. I think that their political offices are nevertheless defining when not clearly honorary. --Nlu (talk) 20:13, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I believe the politician categories are nondefining because they merely reflect the generals' automatic congress seats, and they add no value to the article or the category. In fact, it obscures those generals who hold real political offices, such as the generals that took over local governments during the Cultural Revolution, or people like Liu Yuan (PRC general), who was a politician before joining the military. -Zanhe (talk) 23:06, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Zanhe: I see your point. I am still not sure that I agree with it. (For example, I'm set to looking at diffusing the Category:People from Yantai category this morning and immediately came across Ba Zhongtan - someone who appeared to had no substantial party/state political offices in his resume despite being a lieutenant general - or, if he had, not mentioned in the article.) It's a situation where I think political offices do matter in terms of a person's significance even if not the primary reason for his/her notability. --Nlu (talk) 13:48, 15 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry I missed your ping. Ba Zhongtan was a member of the 9th National People's Congress. And I can imagine that the author probably did not consider it an important part of his career to warrant a mention in the article. You'd be really hard pressed to find a general who does not hold a nominal political position at the national (for Lt. Gen. or higher) or provincial level (for Maj. Gen.). -Zanhe (talk) 00:40, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Removal of residence categories

Could you explain why you removed the from category of Taipei from Chan Hao-ching? Certainly she can have a new category of Taichung, since she was born there, but she resides in Taipei and that has also traditionally been allowed on Wikipedia. Why the removal? Thanks. Fyunck(click) (talk) 18:53, 17 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Fyunck(click): I think I had to make a judgment call there - which is certainly subject to differences in opinion. (I was reviewing the category because it is getting large enough for potential diffusion, but before actually diffusing (by different sports) I was reviewing the people in the category to make sure they actually all belong (because this would actually be the first Taiwan city sportspeople category that would be diffused by sport, and I want to make sure diffusion is needed.) I don't think she's "from Taipei" as such, but I'd have no problem if you want to add it back. --Nlu (talk) 02:42, 18 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The Great Wall of China: Documentary

TV Movie 2007, Discovery Channel, National Geographic. The protagonist is Qi Jiguang, an historical character. Geng Zhou, one of his soldiers, and Chang Ang, the Mongol military leader, are historical or fictional? If you don't know very well this documentary, you can see the full video (Part 1, Part 2). Their names can also be changed with other historical characters related with Qi Jiguang. Here Geng Zhou is renamed Zhou Li. Geng Zhou was probably a fictional character, but in this documentary he is the second main protagonist after Qi Jiguang, then he could have an own page. You could also create the page about that documentary Behind the Great Wall. Please, can you help me, because I'm too busy? Thank you very much. --80.181.64.26 08:17, 18 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think I can write these pages - out of my area of expertise. Sorry... (However, when I have time - maybe next week - I will try to see if I can figure out whether the two characters you mentioned were historical or not, but not this weekend.) --Nlu (talk) 13:22, 18 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. --87.4.239.210 08:13, 19 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I just checked. Chang Ang (probably more appropriately written as "Chang'ang" because I think the whole thing was a personal name, not that he had a surname of Chang and a personal name of Ang) was a real Mongolian chieftain. I cannot (quickly) find any historical references to an assistant of Qi's named Geng Zhou or Li Zhou or Zhou Li. --Nlu (talk) 13:20, 20 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. For Chang Ang, can you find an internet site with his biography? Geng Zhou is surely a fictional character, but in this documentary is the second main protagonist after Qi Jiguang, then can you create his own page with a detailed biography? --95.252.44.246 13:42, 21 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I am not sure that there is any kind of a detailed biography around for Chang'ang. The only reference I could find was within Qi Jiguang's biography in the History of Ming as well as a few references elsewhere in the History of Ming (although a lot of derivative works also discuss him, but only in terms of his acts as discussed therein). If you can read Chinese, Qi's biography is in volume 212 of the History of Ming. The other references to Chang'ang were in volume 228 in the biography of Li Hualong (李化龍), volume 238 in the biography of Li Chengliang (李成梁), volume 239 in the biographies of several more generals (Zhang Chen (張臣), Wang Bao (王保), Du Song (杜松), and You Jixian (尤繼先)), and volume 328 in the general history of the Three Garrisons of Wuliangha (兀良哈三衛) - i.e., three tribes of the Wuliangha region, one of which, Duoyan (朵顏) Chang'ang was the chieftain of.
What it comes down to is that Ming history - particularly Ming defense and ethnic history - is really quite a bit out of my expertise. (Just reading these references, I have some questions as to whether the Wuliangha tribes are actually properly characterizable as Mongol tribes, such that I am not completely sure that if I were in fact writing this article that I'd characterize Chang'ang as a Mongol chieftain, even, in light of these references that I'm reading.) I would not feel comfortable writing about it (even if I had the time and energy right now - and I really haven't had much time to do research and writing substantively ever since I got married about three years ago, although I do hope to get back to it eventually). But if you are interested in writing about Chang'ang, I would greatly encourage you to do so. If you do not read Chinese, I can (slowly) translate these passages for you, and you can digest them and figure out a cohesive timeline for Chang'ang's activities and family relations. As for Geng Zhou, while I know that there are plenty of articles about fictional characters around, I am not sure that I would be as encouraging, but certainly it wouldn't be a frivolous project to do. --Nlu (talk) 14:21, 21 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Unfortunately, I don't have time to do it, then can you help me with this three voices (Behind the Great Wall, Geng Zhou and Chang Ang)? Thank you very much. --95.252.44.246 14:3, 21 May 2019 (UTC)
I am not sure what you mean here by "three voices." In any case, I don't think I can. Sorry. --Nlu (talk) 14:52, 21 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Please, don't forget it, if you can. --79.44.235.28 08:08, 27 May 2019 (UTC)
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