Talk:RAS syndrome

PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds: Battlegrounds

PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds (PUBG) apparently rebranded itself PUBG: Battlegrounds. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2a01:cb00:8ed:3200:1d24:941e:5829:2b11 (talk) 14:56, 14 August 2021 (UTC)

Cited from this source: PUBG is now officially PUBG: Battlegrounds for some reason Blake Gripling (talk) 03:25, 14 January 2022 (UTC)

Additional example proposal: RAT test

Additional example proposal: •RAT test (rapid antigen test test)

citation: [1] 103.139.104.233 (talk) 09:16, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

Sounds like a good idea to me too. --184.63.205.119 (talk) 01:15, 30 January 2022 (UTC)

Jeb Bush

“Jeb” is an acronym for John Ellis Bush. Thus, “Jeb Bush” is short for John Ellis Bush Bush. 2600:1700:37A9:4000:2C15:BBD6:EF78:A78C (talk) 16:12, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

proposal for additional example: PDF format

Arguable one of the most frequent examples would be

• PDF format

(obviously expanding to Portable Document Format format). — MFH:Talk 10:25, 29 July 2022 (UTC)

DC Comics

'Detective Comics' is the company name, comic books is a product they sell. If the company Ford put out a car model called the Ford then it would be the Ford Ford, and not redundant as that would be make and model. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.112.217.211 (talk) 20:26, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

This has all been covered already in previous discussions, see Talk:RAS syndrome/Archive 4#DC Comics. - wolf 21:03, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

It wasn't covered, it was ignored. It's not a redundant acronym. There are tons of actual RASes that can be used as examples. This isn't one, at all.

'Detective Comics' = company

comic books = product they sell

Ergo 'DC comics' is not redundant. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 23:42, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

That's your opinion. We don't base content on personal opinions, we base it on sources. That was covrered in the previous discussion. I suggest you read it again, but also, I strongly suggest you read the guidelines that have been cited for you on your talk page, in response to your editing. Then, when your block expires, if you still wish to pursue the changes you were trying to make, here and elsewhere, you can discuss them collaboratively on their respectlive talk pages first. - wolf 23:58, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

No, it's not a matter of opinion. It's a fact by the definition of 'redundant'

((of words or data) able to be omitted without loss of meaning or function.

"our peculiar affection for redundant phrases")

If you omit 'comics' from 'DC comics' then all you have is the name of a company that puts out dozens of products. the 'comics' bit is necessary information.

Again, there are dozens of undisputed RASes, just use one of those.

If you need a source, here's my source for the definition of 'redundant'

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/redundant

So, it is definitively NOT an RAS 97.112.217.211 (talk) 03:34, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

Again, this is all your opinion, except the part where you claim Merriam-Webster as a source. But if you read the previous discussion, you'd see I also quoted M-W, along with several other actual sources. Look, I get it... you don't want DC Comics listed as an example, but it is, it has been for some time now, and it's supported by sourcing and consensus. Perhaps it's time to to let this go. - wolf 04:15, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

It was never a matter of opinion. It is not a redundant acronym, by definition of redundant. It's not supported by sourcing and support by consensus is a terrible way to build a library of knowledge.

Content not in anyway useful.
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
It's Not A Re Dun Dant A Cro Nym

I'll 'let it go' when right finally prevails instead of a bunch of petulant children who just want their way because "B-but that's just the way it's always been". 97.112.217.211 (talk) 05:02, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

Are you saying mistakes that have slipped by for years should get to stay, just because of legacy? That, again, is a horrible way to compend a library of knowledge. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 05:07, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

So which part of it not being a redundant acronym are you not understanding? 97.112.217.211 (talk) 12:25, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

Someone even got the point in non-examples

"Similarly, "OPEC countries" are two or more member states of the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries, whereas "OPEC" by itself denotes the overall organization." 97.112.217.211 (talk) 12:27, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

DC = the company

comics = a product they put out

DC comics = the company and a product they put out. It's not redundant because 'DC comics' differentiates from other products they put out. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 12:28, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

Ok well if you're just going to ignore my points, I'm going to go back to editing the page based on the fact that I'm correct. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 13:57, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

You know, even though you were blocked, C.Fred, permitted you access to talk pages so that you could discuss edits collaboratively, not so that you could badger and bludgeon threads, with a battleground mentality, posting more personal attacks, and complaining about how Wikipedia has been built over the last 20 years. This hostile, I didn't hear that and I don't like it approach will accomplish nothing. Simply repeating "It is not an example of RAS!! It is not an example of RAS!!" does not make it so. Refusing to recognize previous discussions of the same content does mean that they suddenly do not exist. Consensus plays a significant role in how Wikipedia is built, and you can't just pretend sources that don't support your position also do not exist. And, you can't just repeatedly try to remove sourced content, just because you don't agree with it. Threatening to resume your edit warring once your block expires, or actually doing so, will likely result in you facing a longer block. - wolf 17:05, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

I've explained in detail as to why it's not a redundant acronym, even citing the page itself and the 'non-examples' section which lists an example exactly like the one I'm referring to.

OPEC countries is not redundant because 'OPEC' is an organization, 'countries' are members of that organization

DC Comics is not redundant because 'DC' is the company, 'comics' is a product they sell.

Though you're right, I got a little agitated. I apologize, let's get back on track. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 17:51, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

Yes, you keep repeating the same point, over and over. This has already been covered, hence the reason I directed you to the most recent discussion on this entry, and made note of the both sourcing and consensus. All points you continually ignore, while repeating the same opinion. Wikipedia content isn't built on opinions, nor is it changed because of whoever was able to wear out their opponents with the most posts containing the same repetitive arguments, or with most number of reverts. - wolf 18:23, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

But it hasn't been covered, it's been ignored. It's not an opinion, it's a fact. It's quite literally a fact that DC is the company name, and comics are a product they sell. Where is the opinion exactly?

I'm not trying to change based on opinion. I've provided sound logic as to why it doesn't apply. I keep repeating it because you keep ignoring it, it's objectively correct every single time I post it though. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 18:41, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

It's often the case that people think they're right, they've "shown it", they've "proven it with their logic!". This is where verifiability, not truth may come in handy. - wolf 18:50, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

Ok where am I wrong, or employing opinion?

Detective Comics is the company

Comics are a product they sell 97.112.217.211 (talk) 18:52, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

Here's my source and verifiability: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/redundancy

"the part of a message that can be eliminated without loss of essential information"

You cannot eliminate 'comics' from DC comics when referring specifically to comic books because DC is the company and they have many products aside from comic books. When referring to their action figures, the company name does not change to 'Detective Action Figures'. When referring to their apparel, the company name does not change to 'Detective Apparel'. etc. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 19:07, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

You're again trying to use the same source, that was already used in the previous discussion, for an opposing purpose. Meanwhile, the entry has other sources attached, and if need be, additional sources can be added. - wolf 20:58, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

My sources are the dictionary and the wiki page itself. You haven't addressed any of that, at all.

>Similarly, "OPEC countries" are two or more member states of the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries, whereas "OPEC" by itself denotes the overall organization.

Same principle. The C in OPEC stands for countries, but it's still not considered redundant. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 23:54, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

There, I think that's a fair compromise. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 03:09, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

But it's not the same, and Wikipedia articles can't be used as sources (have you even read any of the relevant guidelines here?) We've already gone over the M-W "source"; you want to use it to support removal, but it's also been used to support inclusion. Along with that however, the entry has other sources attached, and if need be, even more can be added. But see, again you're just leading this discussion into circles... you keep repeating yourself, and now you've got me repeating myself. This isn't accomplishing anything. - wolf 01:53, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

It's not accomplishing anything because you're refusing to concede that you're wrong

It's not redundancy because you can't remove the 'comics' bit without removing meaning/information. 97.112.217.211 (talk) 01:58, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

You can add all the incorrect sources in the world, they're still incorrect

Content also not in anyway useful.
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
It Is Not A Redundancy.

97.112.217.211 (talk) 02:00, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

ANEW notice

Both editors involved in the discussion above should stop editing this page for the time being. Leave it to others to sort things out for now. You can return and discuss the matter further in the future if you think it warrants it. For now, stop edit warring. I am reporting this at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring. Cnilep (talk) 02:37, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

The other editor has self-reveted. They also wanted to add a note about the entry being disputed. I have changed that to the correct tag, linking this talk page thead. I'm satisfied with that for now and see no need for any further edits. - wolf 03:15, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

Post tag-removal

You reverted the disputed status because of no reply?
I was the last one to comment....
Lol. So by that reasoning, and due to no response from you, I deleted the DC entry again 97.112.206.67 (talk) 23:48, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

Hilarious. But that's not how it works. The tag was added to see if it would solicit comments from other contributors, to perhaps add additional sourcing or build a new consensus. That didn't happen, and there was therefore no basis for your edit. Despite being blocked twice in as many days, you still continue this disruptive and tendentious editing. Perhaps it's time for you to finally let this go. - wolf 01:59, 11 November 2022 (UTC)

I was the last one to reply to the discussion, so you were the one who would've needed to reply to dispute it.

You were also the one who edited the agreed upon reversion and entry 97.112.206.67 (talk) 02:52, 11 November 2022 (UTC)

As far as letting it go, I'm not the one that keeps reverting my valid edits. Try practicing what you preach maybe? 97.112.206.67 (talk) 06:02, 11 November 2022 (UTC)

I've made a solid case as to why DC Comics is not a redundant acronym. There are even non-examples listed on the page itself that are identical in principle, IE OPEC Countries

"Similarly, "OPEC countries" are two or more member states of the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries, whereas "OPEC" by itself denotes the overall organization."

>

Similarly, "DC Comics" are a product sold by Detective Comics, whereas "DC" by itself denotes the overall organization. 198.70.2.200 (talk) 12:58, 15 November 2022 (UTC)

You certainly seem to believe you have a solid opinion, but content isn't decided by opinions supported only by discrepant analogies, as opposed to sourcing and consensus, and certainly not decided by edit warring to force your opinion in, all the while evading a block. On one of your ip accounts, you are currently on your third consecutive full block for edit warring on this specific page, while on another account you have been partially blocked from editing this specific page. You need to either wait out those blocks, then pursue this matter the correct way, or you need to go back to each of those accounts, request to be unblocked, and if you are, then pursue this matter the correct way. You can't just continue to disrupt pages becuase you think you're right. - wolf 15:57, 15 November 2022 (UTC)

Few more examples

Since it seems that the main article does not need more examples, here is my collection for anyone interested:

• ATM machine (automated teller machine machine)
• DC Comics ("Detective Comics Comics")
• AC current / DC current (alternating current current / direct current current)
• HIV virus (human immunodeficiency virus virus)
• LCD display (liquid crystal display display)
• UPC code (universal product code code)
• PDF format (Portable Document Format format)
• DVD disc (Digital Versatile Disc disc)
• DLL library (digital linked library library)
• TSB Bank (Trustee Savings Bank bank)
• HDMI interface (High-Definition Multimedia Interface interface)
• LED diode (light-emitting diode diode)
• PMR radio (private mobile radio radio)
• LAN network (Local Area Network network)
• UHF frequency (ultra high frequency frequency) (also applicable to other frequency ranges)
• PIF film (public information film film)
• NTFS file system (New Technology File System file system) (also applicable to some other file systems)
• UDF format (Universal Disk Format format)
• UFS storage (Universal Flash Storage storage)
• BASH shell (Bourne-Again Shell shell)
• RAM memory (random access memory memory)

Hope I could help. 😁 K1703 (talk) 15:10, 11 November 2022 (UTC)

DC comics is not a redundant acronym. DC is the company, comics are a product. If Ford put out a car called Ford, it would be the Ford (make) Ford (model), and not redundant. 198.70.2.200 (talk) 21:27, 14 November 2022 (UTC)

Consensus is that it is: see Talk:RAS syndrome/Archive 4#DC Comics. —C.Fred (talk) 21:48, 14 November 2022 (UTC)

Separate page

Hi again, everyone! I am building a separate Draft:list of redundant acronyms. Enjoy!

Contributions would be appreciated. K1703 (talk) 01:05, 12 November 2022 (UTC)

When will the link work? Thanks. AndreasNV (talk) 14:45, 13 November 2022 (UTC)

There you go. - wolf 17:14, 13 November 2022 (UTC)

Nice one. AndreasNV (talk) 17:28, 13 November 2022 (UTC)

DC comics is STILL not a redundant acronym

No matter how many times you ignore it, it is not and never will be

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/redundancy

>the part of a message that can be eliminated without loss of essential information

There is no information in 'DC comics' that can be removed without losing meaning

You can't just say 'I bough some DC'.

DC what? They sell apparel, action figures, trading cards

comics is a product, and necessary for specificity 198.70.2.200 (talk) 16:54, 15 November 2022 (UTC)