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*'''Comment''': Non-free reduced version uploaded on 07:29, 26 November 2011.[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:OccupyUCD3.jpg#filehistory] [[User:Viriditas|Viriditas]] ([[User talk:Viriditas|talk]]) 07:32, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
*'''Comment''': Non-free reduced version uploaded on 07:29, 26 November 2011.[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:OccupyUCD3.jpg#filehistory] [[User:Viriditas|Viriditas]] ([[User talk:Viriditas|talk]]) 07:32, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. As much as I'd love to keep the image, there is just too much of an issue of infringing on the rights of the newspaper that owns it, and [[WP:LOWRES]] is unlikely to really fix that. And arguing [[WP:ITSHISTORIC]] for something that just happened is unconvincing. --[[User:Tryptofish|Tryptofish]] ([[User talk:Tryptofish|talk]]) 17:00, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. As much as I'd love to keep the image, there is just too much of an issue of infringing on the rights of the newspaper that owns it, and [[WP:LOWRES]] is unlikely to really fix that. And arguing [[WP:ITSHISTORIC]] for something that just happened is unconvincing. --[[User:Tryptofish|Tryptofish]] ([[User talk:Tryptofish|talk]]) 17:00, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', not according to Wikipedia editors, but according to the repeated assertions of historical importance made by reliable secondary sources like journalist Katharine Q. Seelye of the NYT and professor Robert Thompson at Syracuse University.[https://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/23/us/pepper-sprays-fallout-from-crowd-control-to-mocking-images.html] <small>([http://www.webcitation.org/63UTc9k3t web cite])</small> According to Seelye, the image led to a national debate, and is extremely powerful because the use of pepper spray on protestors is rarely captured on film. Robert Thompson considers the image to be of significant interest as it represents a ''distinct period of history with a particular feature'': "...the public rarely witnesses such scenes, and that was one of the reasons that the video from Davis was so powerful. It captured many elements — seated protesters being doused with a bright orange spray by campus officers, whose body language appeared surprisingly casual..."What makes this so oddly interesting is that those officers don’t look like the Chicago police in 1968,” said Robert Thompson, a professor of popular culture at Syracuse University. They are so casual, he said, "it's as if they were called because someone was sunbathing naked on the quad." All of these elements, Mr. Thompson said, added up to a riveting image. "All of these contradictions are jammed into that little video, where we have this casual disenfranchising of rights, but it is a new era, where pepper spray is used as opposed to batons and guns." The assertions made by Seelye and Thompson are supported by many additional sources. In other words, we have multiple, non-trivial mentions of the image in notable, mainstream sources and its inclusion in the article adds significantly to the article on [[Occupy UC Davis]] because the image and its historical significance are the object of discussion. [[User:Viriditas|Viriditas]] ([[User talk:Viriditas|talk]]) 20:17, 26 November 2011 (UTC)


====[[:File:Vac2 075 PR.jpg]]====
====[[:File:Vac2 075 PR.jpg]]====

Revision as of 20:17, 26 November 2011

< November 23 November 25 >

November 24

File:Public transport sialkot.jpg

File:Public transport sialkot.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Yaminjanjua (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

no source provided, uploader was prolific (c) violator; given the lack of source, suspect that this also is a copyright violation Skier Dude (talk) 01:47, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:SialkotAirport10.jpg

File:SialkotAirport10.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Yaminjanjua (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

no source provided, uploader was prolific (c) violator; given the lack of source, suspect that this also is a copyright violation Skier Dude (talk) 01:48, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Nasir Ali.jpg

File:Nasir Ali.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Yaminjanjua (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

no source provided, uploader was prolific (c) violator; given the lack of source, suspect that this also is a copyright violation Skier Dude (talk) 01:48, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Seerat Study Centre Sialkot.jpg

File:Seerat Study Centre Sialkot.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Yaminjanjua (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

no source provided, uploader was prolific (c) violator; given the lack of source, suspect that this also is a copyright violation Skier Dude (talk) 01:48, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Upper Chenab Canal.jpg

File:Upper Chenab Canal.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Yaminjanjua (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

no source provided, uploader was prolific (c) violator; given the lack of source, suspect that this also is a copyright violation Skier Dude (talk) 01:48, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:SLM1.jpg

File:SLM1.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Yaminjanjua (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

no source provided, uploader was prolific (c) violator; given the lack of source, suspect that this also is a copyright violation Skier Dude (talk) 01:51, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Adding File:SialkotRiksha.jpg File:Murray College Sialkot.jpg File:SMC Sialkot.jpg File:Sialkot MC Sialkot.jpg File:Slk Fort Ruines2.jpg File:Sialkot Golf Club.jpg File:PunjabAssemblyBuilding.jpg File:TownHallSialkot.jpg File:War Monument sialkot.jpg File:Saga Square.jpg File:Wazirabad Road.jpg File:Residential Area Sialkot.jpg File:WarMonument2.jpg for the same reason - note that exif data is aso very suspicious. Skier Dude (talk) 02:02, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Mohamed Haji (Ingiriis).jpg

File:Mohamed Haji (Ingiriis).jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Mohamedhaji (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto of inactive user. — Train2104 (talk • contribs • count) 04:39, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Claude Aikins.jpg

File:Claude Aikins.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Bender21435 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

On Commons, where deletion discussion is taking place (commons:Commons:Deletion requests/File:Claude Aikins.jpg); fair use doesn't appear to be likely. Magog the Ogre (talk) 04:59, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:PentUpSOHcover.gif

File:PentUpSOHcover.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Esotericeric (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, claims to be cover for some undefined something... Skier Dude (talk) 06:32, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:John and Liev.jpg

File:John and Liev.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Jstylesjr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned user's iamge; no other encyc use Skier Dude (talk) 06:48, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:StoryBW.JPG

File:StoryBW.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Limitlessness (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned, subject not ID'd Skier Dude (talk) 06:49, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Dr Gabe Veas.JPG

File:Dr Gabe Veas.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Gabeveas (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned user image; no other encyc use Skier Dude (talk) 07:23, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Userdrumpler.jpg

File:Userdrumpler.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Drumpler (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned user image; no other encyc use Skier Dude (talk) 07:26, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:L 71be07dcf61cf76b38ecb1586448c8a0.jpg

File:L 71be07dcf61cf76b38ecb1586448c8a0.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by NossySP (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned, subject not ID'd Skier Dude (talk) 07:37, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Ladyofthetown.gif

File:Ladyofthetown.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:41, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Planter.gif

File:Planter.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:42, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Livingroom.gif

File:Livingroom.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:43, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Heightenedscared.jpg

File:Heightenedscared.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:43, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Around.jpg

File:Around.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:43, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Incongruent.jpg

File:Incongruent.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:43, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Roaring.jpg

File:Roaring.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:43, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Mightbeupsidedown.gif

File:Mightbeupsidedown.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:43, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Statue, the.jpg

File:Statue, the.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:43, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Four d.jpg

File:Four d.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:44, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Clay, the.jpg

File:Clay, the.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:44, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Operlate.jpg

File:Operlate.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:45, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Writeonthepage.jpg

File:Writeonthepage.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:45, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Writeonthepage, the.jpg

File:Writeonthepage, the.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:45, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Parody.jpg

File:Parody.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Goodfunction.jpg

File:Goodfunction.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Figure, the.jpg

File:Figure, the.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Tictactoeonapillow.gif

File:Tictactoeonapillow.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Mstrpc.gif

File:Mstrpc.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Paris.gif

File:Paris.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Uranus, the.jpg

File:Uranus, the.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Virus, the.jpg

File:Virus, the.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Amytan.jpg

File:Amytan.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Bluedowntown.gif

File:Bluedowntown.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:46, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Drawing,the.jpg

File:Drawing,the.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:47, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Method.jpg

File:Method.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:47, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Now.gif

File:Now.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:47, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Speakerandlamp.gif

File:Speakerandlamp.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by QuAtyr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 07:47, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Lamm2.JPG

File:Lamm2.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Lamour013 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR drawing, no target article or encyc use stated Skier Dude (talk) 07:51, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Laura peace 200.jpg

File:Laura peace 200.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by PartySan CZ (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR drawing, no target article or encyc use Skier Dude (talk) 07:53, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Laureatezportrait.jpg

File:Laureatezportrait.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Laureatez (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned user pic; no other encyc use Skier Dude (talk) 07:54, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Laureen.jpg

File:Laureen.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by LaureenO (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned user image; no other encyc use Skier Dude (talk) 07:54, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Lecomicjo4.png

File:Lecomicjo4.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by DarknessLord (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, LQ, non-encyclopedic Skier Dude (talk) 08:00, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:LifeChurch block tag.jpg

File:LifeChurch block tag.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Tiggerjay (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned church logo, no other encyc use Skier Dude (talk) 08:07, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Lloyd Himself.JPG

File:Lloyd Himself.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Lloyd himself (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned user image; no other encyc use Skier Dude (talk) 08:09, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Logo preach-the-word-always.jpg

File:Logo preach-the-word-always.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Janet1983 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, apparently intended for user page, no other encyc use Skier Dude (talk) 08:14, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:N17210552 33495999 1469.jpg

File:N17210552 33495999 1469.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Typo420 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned, Low Quality, Unencyclopedic, no foreseeable use. FASTILYs (TALK) 10:33, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:N1910129 34515374 4554.jpg

File:N1910129 34515374 4554.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Guwherey (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned, Low Quality vanity photo, Unencyclopedic, no foreseeable use. FASTILYs (TALK) 10:33, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:N36902060 32519832 9237.jpg

File:N36902060 32519832 9237.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Boris Allen (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned, Low Quality, dim, no foreseeable use. FASTILYs (TALK) 10:33, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Gramicidins3d.png

File:Gramicidins3d.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Jeremiah (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Seems to be incorrect: Replaced by uploader by a new version. Leyo 13:21, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:OccupyUCD3.jpg

File:OccupyUCD3.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Viriditas (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Photo is taken directly from a newspaper website, violates WP:NFCC#2 by replacing the market role of a current events photo. I'm not really seeing any explanation of why this image is "historic". Kelly hi! 15:07, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep (at a reduced resolution). If properly reduced in size to say 200*300, hosting this image is acceptable under the NFCC policy. Regarding #2, nobody would buy this image at that thumb size to use in current events coverage. If people believe otherwise, please provide a plausible explanation of why you think so, perhaps an example of a news site actually using such an image as part of their journalistic output. We are not sourcing this from an image agency either so it is not in violation of WP:NFC#UUI point 7 - the declared source of Wayne Tilcock/Enterprise is indeed the stated owner of the copyright and the end user. They clearly intend to use it at the high resolution as part of that image gallery, whereas we will be using a single image at low resolution. That's not a competing interest, if anything it's complementary given backlinks. Regarding the claimed purpose of use, while not phrased particularly well currently, it's clear from the sourced statements in the article Occupy UC Davis where it's being used, why this image is already considered to be an important/historic event ("Bull Connor Moment" etc), and it also contains critical commentary of the incident which is not replaced by text alone ("pepper-hose" etc). If it's deleted, the ability for the reader to both interpret those statements and appreciate the event's significance is going to be severely undermined. The NFCC is there not only to specify what cannot be used, it also exists to stop deletions of valid uses which would have that detrimental effect, ie, the NFCC exists "To facilitate the judicious use of non-free content to support the development of a high-quality encyclopedia". All other NFCC conditions are also satisfied in a trivial manner, although as is being discussed, moving it further down to a more appropriate place in the article is probably warranted, but that's hardly a case for deletion. DCron (talk) 18:53, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • If a reader can see the image here, what reason would they have to visit the newspaper website? And I'm not seeing any sourced commentary on this particular image, only on the event it depicts. So perhaps the event is historic but the photo itself is not. Can we simply provide a link to the image's source? Kelly hi! 19:02, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Because it would larger over there (once this one is reduced), and they have a gallery too. That's because their purpose of use (providing timely news & images of the protest) is different to ours (providing justifiably illustrated encyclopedic content about the protests). I don't agree with your distinction between the image and the event - they are one and the same to me looking at the text & the image. If simply providing a link was OK, we wouldn't allow any non-free content would we? All of it can ultimately be replaced by links, can't it? DCron (talk) 19:52, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • WP:NFC#UUI clearly says that we do not take images from news agencies. I'm not understanding your point that stealing a lower-resolution version is OK. Kelly hi! 20:37, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • I already covered UUI - it's not an agency photo, it's been taken from the source, who is a staff photographer not a freelancer or re-distributor, and is properly described as such on the image page. If it was marked 'Getty Images' et al (and nobody reduces it in size), then yes there's a case we would then be undermining Getty's revenue stream (even though anyone who re-used it from here would be breaking the law anyway, because we are not advertising it for re-use but as justified nfcc). In this case, it's not an agency image, it's already being used in the place where it derives revenue. As for why it should be low resolution, it's because if that was done, there'd be no plausible conflict here regarding the remaining aspect of NFCC#2, namely attracting readership, because the newspaper's use of high res photos in a gallery to do that is not challenged or compromised by our use of a single low res photo. As a final point, please do not characterise other people's good faith uploads as an attempt at theft, that can easily be taken as disrespectful. We can politely disagree on the finer points of NFCC, without impugning people's motives. DCron (talk) 21:16, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Just to clarify - are you claiming that the photo was not taken by a commercial news organization? What is the essential difference between this news corp and any other? Kelly hi! 21:20, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • UUI7 refers to an "agency", not an "organisation" (AP & Getty etc are agencies). The reason for that is because an agency's primary purpose is to re-distribute images/copy for profit, and thus they can be undermined by people copying their work before its been sold to as many takers as possible. What we have here though is not an agency, but a photographer who is working on the staff of this paper, who took the photo for this paper, who are already using it. Thus we cannot undermine their revenue from distribution, only by diverting readers from their existing article/gallery, which we do not when we properly follow the other criteria laid down in the NFCC. DCron (talk) 21:37, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • This seems to be pretty fine legalistic hair-splitting. The terms of use of The Davis Enterprise make it clear they license their content to others (for instance, under "Intellectual Property", they refer to "licensors" more than once). Also, you're still conflating "historic image" with "historic event". We could use an image under fair use if the image itself were the subject of commentary, not the event it depicts. Otherwise WP:NFCC would allow to use non-free images for any historic event, which is clearly not the case. Can anyone provide any evidence that this particular photo by The Davis Enterprise has been the subject of widespread commentary in reliable sources? Kelly hi! 23:23, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • The difference between an agency and a newspaper is not exactly hair splitting, they're as different as well, the guy who trucks gas around the country, and the guy that pumps it. I would be amazed if it turned out that the reason that the UUI#7 clause focuses on agencies is just an oversight, and it was meant to cover all images sourced from newspapers. There's some fairly iconic images out there that are still the sole property of news organisations/staffers, how would we ever be able to use them given this blanket ban? And those T&C's just seem to be the standard waffle you get for any company's website, not just newspapers. I don't think they show anything germaine, it would be different if you had found a specific clause or section which instructs/directs people what to do if they want to buy their staff photos. Their "licensor" in this case is more than likely their staffer, not re-users. Permission can be obtained they say, but again, that's standard. And yes, I'm conflating the image with the event, because I really don't see the distinction here that you seem to. Sure, NFCC doesn't allow random photos to be used in any old historical article just because they're historical, but we are also not restricted to just using historic/iconic nfc in articles like the flag raising at Iwo Jima or the Napalm Girl. The relevant clause there is whether "its presence would significantly increase readers' understanding of the topic, and its omission would be detrimental to that understanding". The article very clearly has commentary on what is _precisely_ being depicted by the photo which cuts to the heart of that purpose. Just because nobody discusses this particular image out of the 10s or more that must have been taken of the exact same incident, is not important. DCron (talk) 00:41, 25 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - is there a reason this can't be replaced with a free image per WP:NFCC#1 instead of using a commercially-produced image from a news agency? I see people with cameras everywhere in this photo. Kelly hi! 19:02, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • NFCC#1 - "Non-free content is used only where no free equivalent is available, or could be created, that would serve the same encyclopedic purpose". That does not bar images that theoretically could be replaced, it only bars images where a "free equivalent is available" & obviously one cannot be "created" now, it has to come from an existing source. By all means, if someone makes one available that serves the same purpose, I'll vote delete, particularly because we could then use it at the highest resolution. DCron (talk) 19:52, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • It's my understanding that these protests are not supposed to have organizers. DCron (talk) 21:16, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Nonetheless we have scores of free images from these protests provided by the participants. Kelly hi! 21:20, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Images that "would serve the same encyclopedic purpose"? DCron (talk) 21:39, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Odd. That goes against what I'd heard about these things. Drop them a line then. DCron (talk) 21:39, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • So a free image could be obtained? Kelly hi! 23:23, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • No idea, it depends on who you can contact and whether they accept Wikipedia's image licensing, which includes commercial re-use. I really wouldn't want to speculate on where these protestors sit on that particular fence. But NFCC#1 is clear, this only comes to play if it "is" available. The "could" part only applies to theoretical situations like you 'could' go and get a photo of a building or a person etc, it does not apply to this sort of situation where you are reliant on finding a released image, or persuading someone to release one. DCron (talk) 00:41, 25 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Keep, historic-- one of a kind image that has achieved substantial notoriety after spreading worldwide. For example, see "John Pike" meme for several thousand examples of derivative images based on this one image. The fact that there are 60,000+ parody versions of the image should suggest that yes, this image and precisely this image is historic. While there might be other similar pictures, this picture is the one being used as the primary source for the meme. (It's easy to imagine that the meme could wind up becoming notable enough to merit an article at some point in the future... or maybe not). Tangledorange (talk) 13:34, 25 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete - I think trying to claim "historic" for a week-old event is a bit of a disconnect from reality. Also, this isn't an article on "the pepper-spray incident", it is an article on the Occupy UCDavis overall. Tarc (talk) 15:02, 25 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep at a reduced resolution. The photo has a much higher resolution than is required to document the event, but that's it. 1) There is not currently a free alternative, and it's far from obvious that there will be one. Of course everything that can be done to get one and has not been tried yet needs to be done. 2) As I said, the resolution must be reduced. But nothing needs to be cut off, as the entire surrounding scene is relevant for understanding the monstrosity of what is shown on the photo. 4)-7) Clear. 8) The photo is iconic for Occupy UC Davis and in particular for the police violence section. As it is also required to fully understand the third lead sentence, its placement in the lead is OK. 9) Clear. 10) Everything fine. And yes, it's a historic moment that will no doubt be remembered at UC Davis for decades to come unless it should get overshadowed by something even worse. Hans Adler 23:39, 25 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete. Per Tarc. However, if the consensus is to keep the image, I would favor (1) a lower resolution and (2) a different placement in the article. I understand Hans's comment about the lead mentioning it, but it still draws too much attention to one aspect of the occupation.--Bbb23 (talk) 02:09, 26 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: Non-free reduced version uploaded on 07:29, 26 November 2011.[1] Viriditas (talk) 07:32, 26 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete. As much as I'd love to keep the image, there is just too much of an issue of infringing on the rights of the newspaper that owns it, and WP:LOWRES is unlikely to really fix that. And arguing WP:ITSHISTORIC for something that just happened is unconvincing. --Tryptofish (talk) 17:00, 26 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep, not according to Wikipedia editors, but according to the repeated assertions of historical importance made by reliable secondary sources like journalist Katharine Q. Seelye of the NYT and professor Robert Thompson at Syracuse University.[2] (web cite) According to Seelye, the image led to a national debate, and is extremely powerful because the use of pepper spray on protestors is rarely captured on film. Robert Thompson considers the image to be of significant interest as it represents a distinct period of history with a particular feature: "...the public rarely witnesses such scenes, and that was one of the reasons that the video from Davis was so powerful. It captured many elements — seated protesters being doused with a bright orange spray by campus officers, whose body language appeared surprisingly casual..."What makes this so oddly interesting is that those officers don’t look like the Chicago police in 1968,” said Robert Thompson, a professor of popular culture at Syracuse University. They are so casual, he said, "it's as if they were called because someone was sunbathing naked on the quad." All of these elements, Mr. Thompson said, added up to a riveting image. "All of these contradictions are jammed into that little video, where we have this casual disenfranchising of rights, but it is a new era, where pepper spray is used as opposed to batons and guns." The assertions made by Seelye and Thompson are supported by many additional sources. In other words, we have multiple, non-trivial mentions of the image in notable, mainstream sources and its inclusion in the article adds significantly to the article on Occupy UC Davis because the image and its historical significance are the object of discussion. Viriditas (talk) 20:17, 26 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vac2 075 PR.jpg

File:Vac2 075 PR.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by THEchronicIRONIC (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 15:33, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vagner Zanatta.JPG

File:Vagner Zanatta.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Zanatta (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 15:41, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Valentinosavio.jpg

File:Valentinosavio.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by U4ORIC (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 15:47, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Valermos user image.jpg

File:Valermos user image.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Valermos (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 15:48, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Valleyman.jpg

File:Valleyman.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Ismoot (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 15:56, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vamp.JPG

File:Vamp.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by FOTEMEH (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphan, unencyclopedic. Kelly hi! 16:00, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vandalproofbugscreenshot.JPG

File:Vandalproofbugscreenshot.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Fetofs (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned screenshot. Kelly hi! 16:04, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:VANPIC.jpg

File:VANPIC.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Asharshavardhan (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 16:23, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Various table sauces.jpg

File:Various table sauces.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Petecarney (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned, possibly {{non-free product cover}}. Kelly hi! 16:32, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vaso.jpg

File:Vaso.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Lord vasillius (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 16:34, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vaughan.jpg

File:Vaughan.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Richtallent (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 16:36, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:VBlows.JPG

File:VBlows.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Jamesbaker1987 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned, unencyclopedic. Kelly hi! 17:03, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vc bio jim 01.jpg

File:Vc bio jim 01.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Vinylcandy (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 17:08, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vc promo 02.jpg

File:Vc promo 02.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Vinylcandy (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned band picture. Kelly hi! 17:09, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vday1 me.jpg

File:Vday1 me.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Sirkevinalot (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 17:10, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Veg Thali.jpg

File:Veg Thali.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Gauravejain (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned, low resolution, unidentified subject. Kelly hi! 17:16, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:VeganAdamLogo.png

File:VeganAdamLogo.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Ajkochanowicz (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 17:21, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vegapedia4.jpg

File:Vegapedia4.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Angie6913 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 17:24, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:VegEx.jpg

File:VegEx.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Garyworthing (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 17:27, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vegiac Logo.jpg

File:Vegiac Logo.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Mrsleep99 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 17:28, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vegitaiscool.jpeg

File:Vegitaiscool.jpeg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by El dood (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphan, unencyclopedic. Kelly hi! 17:29, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:VelureElevator1.jpg

File:VelureElevator1.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Richardturnbow (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned band picture. Kelly hi! 17:43, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Velvet cacoon logo.png

File:Velvet cacoon logo.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Authrom (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 17:50, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Velvetine.jpg

File:Velvetine.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Black-Velvet (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned user image. Kelly hi! 17:51, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Venetian Snares London Electrowerx.jpg

File:Venetian Snares London Electrowerx.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by St.vitus066 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 17:55, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Venspire.jpg

File:Venspire.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Savani1987 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 18:04, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Verajewel.jpg

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Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 18:08, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Vernon mckinney king of oceanside.jpg

File:Vernon mckinney king of oceanside.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Blastocystosis (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 18:19, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:VERO BEACH POWER SQUADRON BRIDGE 2008.JPG

File:VERO BEACH POWER SQUADRON BRIDGE 2008.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Scullybob (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphan, possibly non-free. Kelly hi! 18:21, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Aaron on boat in FL.JPG

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Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 19:23, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:ABC-PaxtonBro.Resolution.jpg

File:ABC-PaxtonBro.Resolution.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Paxtonbro (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphan, possibly non-free. Kelly hi! 19:25, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:AboutPic3.jpg

File:AboutPic3.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Sfumisa (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 19:26, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:AboutPic1.jpg

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Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 19:26, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:AboutPic2.jpg

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Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 19:27, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Addressbook-mapping.png

File:Addressbook-mapping.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Anisotropic inversion (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned screenshot. Kelly hi! 19:30, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:AIM-artists in mind Collage1.jpg

File:AIM-artists in mind Collage1.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by AIM-Artists in Mind (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphan, possibly non-free. Kelly hi! 19:35, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Alegreen.jpg

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Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 19:47, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Alexis.gif

File:Alexis.gif (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Dumartian (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userimage. Kelly hi! 19:51, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:All RA Monuments.jpg

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Orphan, possibly non-free. Kelly hi! 19:53, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:AlphasiteForum.png

File:AlphasiteForum.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Andorian15 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 19:55, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Amarillo Ozymandias.jpg

File:Amarillo Ozymandias.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Existentist (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphan, possibly non-free. Kelly hi! 19:59, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:AndrewJMigliore.jpg

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Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 20:02, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:G4 - Copy.JPG

File:G4 - Copy.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by XDecemberFlower (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned file, poor quality - dark moon on black  Ronhjones  (Talk) 20:11, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Anime wallpapers-1141739044 i 1090 full.jpg

File:Anime wallpapers-1141739044 i 1090 full.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Jerezjhon (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphan, unencyclopedic. Kelly hi! 20:12, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Animeexpo badges 2003.jpg

File:Animeexpo badges 2003.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Colin Keigher (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphan, possibly nonfree. Kelly hi! 20:13, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:G42006(2).jpg

File:G42006(2).jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Hweiming (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned File, Unknown Subject, no use to keep  Ronhjones  (Talk) 20:14, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:AraxisKeturaProjectManagementScreenshots.jpg

File:AraxisKeturaProjectManagementScreenshots.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Dneades (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned screenshot. Kelly hi! 20:30, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Area Wide.jpg

File:Area Wide.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Popplewell (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned screenshot. Kelly hi! 20:32, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Ark-Mobile-Orig.png

File:Ark-Mobile-Orig.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Johnrpenner (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 20:34, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Arturo subercaseaux.jpg

File:Arturo subercaseaux.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Arturo 7 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userimage. Kelly hi! 20:48, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Asquirm.JPG

File:Asquirm.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by SquirmsComics (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, UE. Kelly hi! 21:17, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:At The Surface Records Logo.png

File:At The Surface Records Logo.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by JamesWilson2007 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 21:28, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Gabrietom.jpg

File:Gabrietom.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Codecold (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned File, Unknown Subject, no use to keep  Ronhjones  (Talk) 23:36, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:GAC.png

File:GAC.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Nickersonl (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned File, Unencyclopaedic, no use to keep  Ronhjones  (Talk) 23:38, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Avalummer06.jpg

File:Avalummer06.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Fairness And Accuracy For All (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 23:43, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Axe3 Logo-(2007-).png

File:Axe3 Logo-(2007-).png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Aaron J Nicoli (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned logo. Kelly hi! 23:44, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Gadem6du.jpg

File:Gadem6du.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Ralphus629 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

Orphaned File, Unencyclopaedic, no use to keep  Ronhjones  (Talk) 23:47, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Balinor.JPG

File:Balinor.JPG (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Ringwall (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

OR, UE. Kelly hi! 23:49, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

File:Baruch.jpg

File:Baruch.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Darkbaruch (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).

orphaned userphoto. Kelly hi! 23:59, 24 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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