Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Ralphellis

Tatelyle

Tatelyle (talk⁺ · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · spi block · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)

Please note that a case was originally opened under Ralphellis (talk · contribs) but has been moved to Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Tatelyle. Future cases should be placed under Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Tatelyle.

23 September 2017

– A user has requested CheckUser. An SPI clerk will shortly look at the case and endorse or decline the request.

Suspected sockpuppets

• Ralfellis (talk⁺ · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · spi block · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)
• Ralphellis (talk⁺ · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · spi block · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)

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Summary

Tatelyle and Ralfellis both claim to be the author of a 2016 paleoclimatology paper. Both are involved, on the same side, in a long-running dispute at Talk: The Exodus. Tatelyle's account, explicitly and implicitly, has a long-running pattern of primarily existing to support the works of WP:FRINGE author Ralph Ellis, including but not limited to the climateology paper in question. I'll begin with the paleoclimatology paper. I will follow this with places where Tatelyle has added explicit references to Ralph Ellis to Wikipedia pages. I will end with a long list of places where Tatelyle adds material similar to the books of Ralph Ellis to Wikipedia pages, but without mentioning Ellis by name.

The climateology paper

Here is Tatelyle's self-description from User:Tatelyle: "Tatelyle is a British polymath researcher and writer with interests in science, history, aviation and climatology. His science paper on paleoclimatology was published in 2016." Diff: [1].

Here is User:Ralfellis identifying as the author of the 2016 paleoclimatology paper by Ralph Ellis: [2]. Here's Ralph Ellis identifying himself as "a polymath and independent researcher, interested in science, technology and history." [3]

Explicit References to Ralph Ellis by Tatelyle

The following diffs show Tatelyle adding references to the self-published works of Ralph Ellis to various Wikipedia pages: 100,000-year problem, Carolina bay, Younger Dryas impact hypothesis, Talk: Christ myth theory, Christ myth theory.

Implicit References to the works of Ralph Ellis

The following references show a behavioral pattern by Tatelyle of inserting material similar to material already in books by Ralph Ellis, without citing Ellis directly. These edits are primarily concerned with connecting the Pharaohs to Jesus to the Jewish War of AD 70 to King Arthur, in a variety of ways. The links are in pairs: each pair starts with a diff by Tatelyle and is followed by a link to the works of Ralph Ellis showing coverage of the same specific information: Antonine Wall -- [4] and [5]. Talk:Paul the Apostle -- [6] and [7]. Ferris Wheel - [8] and [9], connecting Ferris Wheels to the legend of king Arthur. Naassenes -- [10] and [11]. Sarras, to connect king Arthur with Jerusalem: [12] and [13]. Tatelyle claims that Ramesses was "ginger haired" at Ancient Egyptian Race controversy [14] and Black Egyptian hypothesis [15]. Similar material by Ralph Ellis: [16]. Deva Victrix -- [17] and [18].

Tatelyle asserts that algebra comes not really from al-Khwarizmi but from an Indian philosopher, Brahmagupta: [19]. Ralph Ellis claims the same: [20] (page 10).

Conclusion

That's a lot of similarity: same claims about paleoclimatology research, same esoteric interests in Ancient Near Eastern history, promotion of a variety of obscure claims from Ralph Ellis on Wikipedia. Alephb (talk) 06:53, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Doug Weller. Beans? Alephb (talk) 11:09, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Alephb, beans means don't spell out the tells because that might assist future socks in avoiding them, as per WP:BEANS. Bishonen | talk 15:04, 23 September 2017 (UTC).

Bishonen, for what it's worth, the books are identified under the names "Ralph Ellis" as well as "Ralf Ellis," as google books searches for the two will show. This parallels the two user names. It's probably irrelevant, but it's one of the many very unusual features of this odd situation. Alephb (talk) 16:46, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Comments by other users

Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

• Like Tatylyle, Ellis is also interested in aviation.[21] This is pretty much a slam dunk and the illegitimate use of a sock for self-promotion. On that basis I suggest blocking the Tatelyle account indefinitely so that it if Ellis wishes to edit it's obvious who he is. Doug Weller talk 07:29, 23 September 2017 (UTC)
• I have been an editor on the Exodus article. I was puzzled as to why Tatelyle seemed so focused on having the name of Josephus included - not Josephus's ideas, but Josephus himself. Ralph Ellis is an extremely prolific self-published author, and it's clear from his web-page (link) that Josephus occupies an important position in the intricate and highly idiosyncratic version of history he promotes. To my mind Tatelyle appears clearly to be Ellis, and is clearly using Wikipedia to advance a personal agenda (not, however, to sell his books, which he rarely mentions). PiCo (talk) 07:47, 23 September 2017 (UTC)
• Tatelyle now claims Ellis is his brother and that I've banned him twice. I've never banned Ellis and unless there are undisclosed accounts have never blocked him. I've also got some beans that show that Tatelyle is Ellis. Doug Weller talk 10:56, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

• Alephb, see Ebenezer Cobham Brewer (2001). Wordsworth Dictionary of Phrase and Fable. Wordsworth Editions. p. 107. ISBN 978-1-84022-310-1. Tgeorgescu (talk) 13:20, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Hello Bishonen, point of Wikilaw. If Ralfellis continues to use that new account, would he immediately be subject to blocking or banning as a sock of the old 2006 account? Or is there some sort of statute of limitations?

And would Tatelyle be eligible to start a new anonymous account under WP:FRESHSTART, or would any such attempt be viewed as abusive sock-puppeting?

I am not sure whether Tatelyle actually is Ellis, or not. As has been mentioned in the thread at The Exodus talk, I've been in contact with him off-wiki. Ralph has neither confirmed nor denied being Tatelyle, and it is possible that Tatelyle is one of Ellis's 2500 Facebook friends, fans and followers. But like the other users, I suspect that Tatelyle and Ellis are one and the same. Could you offer any advice as to how Tatelyle and/or Ellis can continue to participate in the discussion at The Exodus without being subject to immediate blockage? Thank you. JerryRussell (talk) 16:17, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

@JerryRussell:, Tatelyle claimed to be Ellis's brother, a standard excuse for socks and sockmasters. Ellis can continue to participate on the talk page but clearly has a conflict of interest about his works. And we've been lied to it seems. Doug Weller talk 17:34, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

@Bishonen: thanks for the clarifications, I'm also learning from this. —PaleoNeonate – 19:20, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

This is Ralph Ellis, and I have just been notified of this action. I would like to complain about the censorship by Dougweller, who has deleted my Wiki profile on two occasions, and is now deleting my brother too. Dougweller appeared to follow me around Wiki many years ago, and delete any update I made - all of which were very reasonable. So I have had to rely on freinds and supporters to make any revisions on my behalf.

The issue here is typical of the censorship of myself here on Wiki. I asked for an update to be made on the The Exodus page, because after ten years it still did not mention that Josephus Flavius, Judaism's greatest historian, said the Israelites were the Hyksos. What I asked for, was a two-word quotation from Judaism's greatest historian, which is not unreasonable. But this was deleted again and again, for a multitude of spurious reasons. My supporters have then engaged in some 100 pages of debate on the 'talk' page, where it was agreed that quotes from Josephus should be allowed on Wiki. There are many quotes from Josephus on Wiki, as are there are many quotes on Wiki from Gildas and Bede - two similar ancient chroniclers. And yet still the two-word quote from Josephus gets deleted and censored. Why??

And now, because the The Exodus editors still want to delete the two-word quote from Josephus, they have started attacking the contributors rather than looking at the content. And yet again Dougweller has got himself involved in this censorship action. Wiki should not be operating a censorship program, where it excludes quotes from Judaism's greatest historian, and bans any editor who wishes to post those quotes into a Wiki page.

Perhaps the editors who brought this action, should explain why they are so determined to delete a two-word quote, that they would indulge in two months and 100 pages of debate, to do so. Ralfellis (talk) 21:30, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments

• This SPI should might be at Ralphellis rather than Tatelyle, since Ralphellis is the oldest account. (Ralfellis, which edited only on 17 Sept 2017, is the youngest.) I don't know how to arrange that, and never mind the red tape for now; I'm convinced by all the above, and will block Tatelyle indefinitely per Doug Weller's suggestion. Very strong report, Alephb, thank you for your work with it. The chances are the user has forgotten the password to Ralphellis, which was used only in 2006, and I'm leaving both the "ellis" accounts alone. Unless another admin wants to tidy up further or place more sanctions, I think this can be closed. Bishonen | talk 15:25, 23 September 2017 (UTC).

• @JerryRussell: I regard the old 2006 account, Ralphellis, as abandoned and defunct; no account should be blocked as a sock of that, eleven years later. I'd encourage the user to continue using the account Ralfellis. But he may alternatively make a fresh start, provided he complies with WP:COI and is open about his connection with the author Ralph Ellis. So there are two principles that he needs to follow: having one account, not several; and being open about his COI. That's it. As for whether some or all of the accounts are the author Ralph Ellis, or are actually his friends or relatives, nobody cares. They still have the same COI, and will be blocked as socks if more than one of them is used. Compare WP:MEAT. Bishonen | talk 19:16, 23 September 2017 (UTC).

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