Talk:À rebours

Translations and editions

I hope that someone familiar with A Rebours will add information about translations and editions. I've seen remarks that the John Howard translation is unreliable (possibly because homoerotic implications have been removed). So what is the best translation, and when were different translations published?

Another issue, painfully evident on Amazon, is the proliferation of bogus "editions" that are just the cheapest kind of reprintings. Some of these are based on scanned images of old books. Others are based on OCR scans, and the "publishers" don't even bother to proofread the result to correct OCR errors. Pretty sad for the state of book publishing. Look for real publishers and solid information about the edition and translation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 136.162.34.1 (talk) 16:11, 20 November 2012 (UTC)

An interesting translation of the title

"...a Rebours, became one of the most famous novels of its time. The title is almost untranslatable. Against the Grain sounds oddly anonymous; Against Nature is closer to the spirit of the book. But since Huysmans explains that his hero, Des Esseintes, occasionally takes his nourishment ‘a rebours’ - through the rear end - when eating bores him, it could equally be translated as Up the Arsehole - a version that would have undoubtedly pleased the author..." from Colin Wilson on Huysmans: The Word-Painter of Paris

This is a very vulgar translation of the title, which is simply translated as The Wrong Way.Lestrade (talk) 01:52, 22 November 2008 (UTC)Lestrade

The vulgarity was the point. "The Wrong Way" isn't in my opinion satisfactory as a title, either. It's too polarizing. Judgemental. I like "The Way Not Taken" or something like that, if I was naming the book. 76.115.59.36 (talk) 15:27, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

The wrong way was taken by Des Esseintes , and its effects were described in Huysmans's book. Even though you reject it for being "too polarizing ," and "judgemental," The Wrong Way is a clear, simple title that is not crude or vulgar. Huysman might have wanted to be judgmental. His later life as a Schopenhauerian ascetic showed that he abhorred low, coarse behavior. Lestrade (talk) 17:47, 26 May 2009 (UTC)Lestrade

How about 'against the flow'? (RJPe (talk) 14:36, 3 July 2009 (UTC))

Against nature is translated as Contre la nature. Against the [wood] grain is Contre la fibre. À rebours is Wrong Way, which Huysmans described in his novel. His description was not a model to be emulated or celebrated. It was an exhibition of a mistaken way of life. Colin Wilson's suggestion may merely tell us more about Colin Wilson than what would "have undoubtedly pleased" Huysmans.Lestrade (talk) 19:25, 31 January 2010 (UTC)Lestrade

If you will notice, the subtitle of the book is "Au tournant d'à rebours." This means "turning the wrong way (in the road)." This is what Huysmans depicts. But, as with much art, the mere depiction results in readers or spectators imitating what they read or see. Humans have an inborn simian propensity to imitate.Lestrade (talk) 12:13, 18 March 2010 (UTC)Lestrade

Someone's earlier remark that the title, À Rebours, is nearly untranslatable, is correct. There is no phrase, at least in English, that resonates with the same range of reference, concrete and conceptual, vulgar and abstract. I agree with the following person's judgment that a hint of vulgarity was implied by the title. The title of H's next book, Là-Bas, likewise benefits for being deliberately vague and polyvalent. Perversity in its many forms may be the prevailing theme in À Rebours, so I suggest Perverse (or Perversity) as alternative titles in the sense of "against nature"—to hint further at the ambit of meanings that the original title evokes—not for a moment expecting it to be adopted since it abstracts too much from the gamy associations that À Rebours definitely brings in its train. Some third person said it: best leave the title(s) untranslated. (P.S., I don't like The Wrong Way as a rendering because Huysmans clearly did not want it to be judmental.)helio 00:23, 2 June 2012 (UTC)

How does this clause make sense?

"especially because it successfully transcended the definition of Romanticism into Decadence."

How do you transcend the defintion of something, into something?

I've revising, see what y'all think. --Andersonblog 17:27, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Des Esseintes at study Zaidenberg illustration.JPG

Image:Des Esseintes at study Zaidenberg illustration.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot 23:24, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Doyle

Huysman's book had an influence on Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's novel The Sign of the Four. The character Thaddeus Sholto was patterned on Oscar Wilde, who was seen as a variation of Des Esseintes. Samuel Rosenberg, in his Naked is the Best Disguise, first discussed this influence.Lestrade (talk) 16:09, 6 June 2009 (UTC)Lestrade

Ironic effect

The irony of this novel's effect is that Huysman's wanted to show that the protagonist's life and behavior were "the wrong way." However, people who shared the style of life that Huysman described were fascinated by its presentation in the book and they made the book very popular, for the wrong reason. This is a common occurrence. Today, when unhealthy behavior (à rebours) is depicted on TV or film, many people imitate what they see. The very presentation in art leads to imitation, glamorization, or glorification. This is confirmed by the old ironic saying that "life imitates art." That is why Plato wanted to eliminate art from the Republic: people would imitate undesirable behavior if it were to be presented to them in art.Lestrade (talk) 16:02, 17 July 2009 (UTC)Lestrade

Introduction is Plagiarized

Or copied word for word, from the dusk jacket or a product description such as the one that can be found here:

http://www.amazon.com/Against-Nature-Joris-Karl-Huysmans/dp/1604596716/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1264831772&sr=8-2

Furthermore, the citation No. 1 has little to do with what is being cited in the introduction. Please fix, interested contributor or author responsible.

173.21.106.137 (talk) 06:16, 30 January 2010 (UTC)

Actuallly, it's probably the other way round and that book jacket is copied from Wikipedia, judging by the publication date. I've removed that citation. --Folantin (talk) 09:15, 30 January 2010 (UTC)

In memoriam

This is to commemorate the untimely demise of the following passage regarding a reference to the depiction of Des Esseintes's inner life:Schopenhauer, who was a great influence on Huysmans, wrote: "A novel will be of loftier and nobler nature, the more of inner and the less of outer life it portrays … . Art consists in our bringing the inner life into the most intense action with the least possible expenditure of the outer; for the inner is really the object of our interest." (Parerga and Paralipomena, vol. 2, § 228.). This reference was considered to be a reference "of doubtful relevance" by Folantin. It is altogether possible, however, that, to a person who has read both Schopenhauer's Parerga and Paralipomena and Huysmans's novel, the reference may not only be relevant, but also insightful and helpful in appreciating Huysmans's work, which may be something other than it has been taken to be. Schopenhauer's doctrines regarding aesthetics, morality, and ascetic Christian sainthood had a great influence on Huysmans's writing and on his life. Huysmans prominently referred to Schopenhauer in À rebours. See the "Apostles of Naturalism" section of Colin Wilson's The Word-Painter of Paris in which he asserted that Huysmans "was convinced that the nihilistic Schopenhauer is one of the few philosophers who has seen life clearly and without distortion."Lestrade (talk) 20:49, 30 January 2010 (UTC)Lestrade