Talk:Death Rides a Horse

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Character names are not indicated in on-screen cast credits

It should be noted that, since there is no cast list in the closing credits and character names are not specified in the opening credits, their form in the article's cast list is taken from various resources, primarily AllMovie, Fandango (company), TCMDb and IMDb, as well as from personal viewing of the film by editors. For the record, below is a reproduction of the cast listing in the opening credits:

Metro Goldwyn Mayer

UNITED ARTISTS PRESENTS

LEE VAN CLEEF

JOHN PHILLIP LAW in

DEATH RIDES A HORSE

Produced by AL & HENRY SANSONE CHROSCICKI © Copyright MCMLXVII by P.E.C. S.p.A. All rights reserved

with MARIO BREGA LUIGI PISTILLI ANTHONY DAWSON JOSE TORRES (actor)

FRANCO BALDUCCI BRUNO CORAZZARI FELICITA FANNY IGNAZIO LEONE CARLO PISACANE (actor) ANGELO SUSANI GUGLIELMO SPOLETINI

VIVIENNE BOCCA WALTER GIULANGELI ELENA HALL MARIO MANDALARI NATALE NAZARENO (c.s.c.) ENNIO PAGLIANI GIOVANNI PETRUCCI (actor) ROMANO PUPPO RICHARD WATSON (actor) ARCHIE SAVAGE

Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 06:05, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Elucidation of recent edits

1) On April 6, 2020, in order to improve the article's accuracy regarding the names listed in the credits, I provided the information immediately above, under section header "Character names are not indicated in on-screen cast credits", indicating the order of names as depicted on-screen. Before I made the revisions, the article's cast list consisted of 31 names, presented in no discernible order, although the on-screen cast only lists 23 names.

2) Among those uncredited eight names in the 31-name list, Carla Cassola has been inexplicably listed 7th and seven others — Giuseppe Castellano (actor), Nerina Montagnani, Nino Vingelli, Remo Capitani, Giovanni Scarciofolo, José Terrón (actor) and Claudio Ruffini have been likewise unaccountably listed 12th, 21st, 22nd, 23rd, 24th, 25th and 31st, respectively.

3) Among those who do have on-screen billing, 3rd-billed Mario Brega is downgraded to 9th, 7th-billed Franco Balducci is lowered to 13th, 8th-billed Bruno Corazzari is pushed down to 17th, 9th-billed Felicita Fanny is dropped to 19th, 10th-billed Ignazio Leone is brought down to 20th, 14th-billed Vivienne Bocca is submerged to 29th place, 17th-billed Mario Mandalari is plunged to 26th place, etc. On the other hand, 11th-billed Carlo Pisacane (actor) might be some editor's favorite, since he is raised to 3rd place, immediately behind the two stars,

4) Billed last (23rd) on-screen, Archie Savage is raised to 8th place and named "Negro Soldier". There is no reason to use such a description when his character's name appears to be "Vigro". I also clarified and /or revised a number of the other character names.

5) After publishing the above "Character names..." posting, I arranged the article's cast list in on-screen credits order. In addition to the 23 names depicted on-screen, I added a separate list of the six uncredited cast members who have Wikipedia entries, for a total of 29 names. The list before I made the edits consisted of 31 names, but I deleted the two uncredited names that did not have Wikipedia entries.

6) I also edited the infobox information, changing the names of the producers from "Alfonso Sansone" and "Enrico Chroscicki" to "Al Sansone" & "Henry Chroscicki" since that is how the names appear on-screen. There is an inline cite referencing the names to a 2004 book by film historian Howard Hughes, but no explanation as to why the names provided by this author should supersede the on-screen credits. Surely the producers would have provided their own names in their own preferred form.

7) I also limited the infobox cast to the two above-the-title stars. There is no reason to list four members of the supporting cast — 4th-billed Luigi Pistilli, 5th-billed Anthony Dawson, 6th-billed Jose Torres (actor) and 3rd-billed Mario Brega in the infobox.

8) Additionally, I appended the on-screen credits for production / distribution companies Metro Goldwyn Mayer and United Artists. as well as three files from Wikimedia Commons: File:John Phillip Law (Death Rides a Horse).jpg, File:Anthony Dawson (Death Rides a Horse).jpg and File:Luigi Pistilli (Death Ridess a Horse).jpg.

9) Less than eight hours later, all my changes were reverted {via WP:Twinkle}, with this edit summary: "names should refer to full names, not title credits. we aim for accuracy, not duplication". Immediately thereafter, a second edit, with this edit summary: "agree on removing excessive cast listing though", deleted the bottom eight of the 31 names in the restored cast list. Five of those deleted names were among the on-screen cast names and three names were among those uncredited.

10) However, the cast continues to remain in the same random order as before (for example, uncredited Carla Cassola is still listed in 7th place). Furthermore, I never contended that the cast list was overlong and had deleted only the two uncredited names which had no Wikipedia entries, thus reducing the original list from 31 to 29 names.

11) Having stated the preceding, I will stop at this juncture and restore my edit to the article. Hopefully, this matter can be resolved point by point, as listed above and I stand ready to discuss each point to everyone's satisfaction. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 19:45, 8 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]