Talk:Fedor Emelianenko/Archive 2

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Pic

Can we get a better pic of Fedor he looks awful in this one. —Preceding unsigned comment added by GEMx21 (talk • contribs) 04:02, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

Zuffa and UFC

Must be Noted that Zuffa did not buy Pride FC a completly new organization was created by Fertitta brothers "Pride FC Worldwide Holdings LLC." in order to run UFC and PRIDE as two different entities. This is the reason Dana White is not part owner of the new PRIDE organization and his interest is rather to bring all the best PRIDE fighters to the UFC —Preceding unsigned comment added by Soundtech04 (talk • contribs)

MMA Record Section

I updated this section so remove the use of the term "punches" and instead use "strikes". This seems to be the convention in the MMA world. I also am considering updating the formatting so that submissions, tko's, and Ko's (outright victories) continue to be "Type_of_win (reason)". Then change the decisions and stoppages to something like "Decision/Stoppage: unanimous/split/reason_for_stoppage". As it is, it makes it look like the reason for the decision is unanimous. Floodo1 (talk) 18:07, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Olympic Torch Bearer

There isn't any mention of Fedor carrying the Olympic torch in his biography, this is a huge achievement and should be added as soon as possible in my opinion. Stevenronaldson (talk) 11:06, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

free agent

http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles.asp?n_id=11698 according to this fedor is a free agent now after m1 was purchased. is this worth noting anyone? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.247.69.78 (talk) 07:49, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Chuck's Statements

Chuck Liddell did not specifically claim Fedor was signed, his words were too vauge for any conclusions like that. His statement could have easily mean that he is currently in contract negotiations, shown interest, or simply just heard small talk from the big guns at the UFC —Preceding unsigned comment added by Soundtech04 (talk • contribs)

Those both are accurate, nice catch. Also, please remember in the future to sign your posts with ~~~~. east.718 00:55, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

No problemo boss- Soundtech04 01:08, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Mostly in order to experiment with actually editing something, I made a minor change to the sentence about Liddell's speculation on Fedor and the UFC. The original version started with "In a recent interview with Chuck Liddell, Liddell stated that," which made it sound like Fedor was part of the interview. I think it's clearer now.Aptninjajefferson 20:17, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

BoDog

Personally, I'm in favor of deleting the entire second paragraph. Original research, NPOV, etc.

Comments? Tuckdogg 01:37, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

It would be nice if it was sourced, but I haven't found anything reliable. Go for it, and burn the picture too. east.718 05:29, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

...done and done. Tuckdogg 12:53, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

I think the new Bodog stuff is an improvement on the previous paragraphs, but not mentioning the supposed rope grab isn't really NPOV. I think it was enough of a controversy that it merits mentioning; what else about the Lindland fight is notable? 70.18.21.206 20:36, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

I finally found something on it from the Houston Chronicle. east.718 11:24, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

After reading the Houston Chronicle article (and becoming briefly distracted by the spectacularly dumb comments below it) I propose the following sentences regarding the "rope grab" contoversy:

Early in the fight, Lindland opened a cut above Emelianenko's left eye and clinched with him, pushing him into the corner and working for a takedown. At this point, the referee warned Emelianenko against grabbing the ropes and Emelianenko corrected. After a few seconds working in the clinch, Lindland attempted a bodylock takedown. When Lindland lifted Emelianenko from his feet, Emelianenko reached for and made contact with the top rope; whether he grabbed it or only touched it remains a subject of disagreement. Emelianenko reversed Lindland's takedown and landed in his half guard. The fight remained on the ground and Emelianenko won by submission via armbar at 2:58 of the first round.

I think it's closer to NPOV; leaving the rope grab out essentially takes the position that he didn't do it. I'm a big Fedor fan, myself, so it's possible my edit remains biased. I think the combination of this narrative and the link to the Chronicle article -- which takes the position that he used the rope to reverse, and ignores video evidence suggesting that Fedor's foot is at least briefly planted before they both go down -- would present a balanced perspective.Aptninjajefferson 15:25, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

That looks like it passes WP:NPOV with flying colors to me. east.718 21:46, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

I'll second that. It's certainly better than anything else we've had in the article before. Tuckdogg 02:12, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm going to reveal my depthless ignorance, here, but if you boys want to go with that edit I think someone else should implement it. I haven't done this before; apparently Fedor is one of very few subjects I care enough about to get off my ass. I'll check out the tutorial, but it seems like you guys have invested a lot of time and attention in this article, so I'm inclined to let you do the actual carpentry. Let me know what you think.Aptninjajefferson 17:20, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Done, thanks. east.718 21:57, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Style changes

I've made the following changes to the article:

• Added {{persondata}} along with the required parameters—see WP:PERSON for more information.
• Per WP:MSH, removed special characters from headings.
• Removed all contractions outside of quotes.
• Removed "s" from units of measurement that demarked plurality.
• Per WP:FN and the CMS, moved footnotes right after a punctuation mark with no space in between.
• Per WP:UNITS, when doing conversions, used standard abbreviations.

east.718 02:48, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Box containing record breakdown

The list of fights does not contain the Semmy Schilt fight, even though that fight is mentioned earlier in the page - it's mentioned on Semmy's fight list. 71.188.131.185 (talk) 04:58, 25 January 2009 (UTC) some dude 1-24-09

I really don't see the need for this; it takes up a lot of space and is made redundant by one line of text directly above it. Additionally, succint prose is always preferred over large lists or tables.

Boy, aren't you guys ANAL! This is exactly why noone takes this site seriously anymore. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.108.181.98 (talk) 02:54, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

The chart was factually incorrect to boot. east.718 10:53, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

---

Disagree, the table can be improved. Personally, I prefer table instead of one line text, for fighters with different wins, losses and no contents or draw, that line looks bad, example:

28 wins (6 (T)knockouts, 13 submissions, 7 decisions, 1 other), 20 losses (5 (T)knockout, 10 submissions, 4 decisions, 1 other), 2 no contest, 2 draw

Two tables that I made:

	18 Wins	4 Losses
(T)Knockout	10	0
Submission	3	2
Decision	5	1
Others	0	1
Draw	0
No Contest	0
Total	22 matches

or

22 matches	18 Wins	4 Losses
(T)Knockout	10	0
Submission	3	2
Decision	5	1
Others	0	1
Draw	0
No Contest	0

As there is no consensus about it. I moved these record to Infobox table. Carlosguitar 14:09, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

---

The second table looks better to me, and I agree that it would be more suitable than text in cases of fighters with records that would be convoluted as text. However, I also think this should be decided on a case-by-case basis, and 27-1-0-1 is not hard to write out. east.718 11:04, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Ok, I did another thing. What do you think? The small table can still be improved. Carlosguitar 09:17, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

That's a great solution! I made some tweaks, what do you think? east.718 15:30, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Cool, I liked. I hope we reach consensus now. Carlosguitar 01:54, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Regarding the loss of Fedor

I find it humorous and even cute that the people that edit Wiki, who have so much knowledge and time to do this for all of us would not know that TK hit Fedor with an elbow! NO, Fedor didn't allege that it was an elbow, it WAS an elbow, there is nothing to allege. You can see the elbow strike on the video. TK has said in plain Japanese that it was an elbow! This is too funny. Every single human being that has seen the fight knows it was an elbow. Why give TK the possible credit and discredit Fedor when everyone knows it was an illegal strike? The ref said it was an elbow too.

question, first of all i want to say im a fan of fedor and i dont want to take anything away from him, but shouldnt the article mention that tk was not trying to hit fedor with an elbow, i mean if anyone watches that fight, isnt it obvious that tk threw a looping punch and fedor used head movement to get out of the way and by coincidence (or irony) tk's elbow came in contact with fedors head? (either way it shouldnt have been a loss, but in one case tk losses for cheating, and in the other its a nc due to unforseen circumstances, right?) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.27.62.219 (talk) 04:34, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Wouldn't it be considered a stoppage rather than a TKO since the fight was indeed stopped due to a cut re-opening? MMAfan2007 19:09, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Stoppages are TKOs. Or do you mean that the reason should be "doctor stoppage" instead of "cut?" east.718 19:38, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

But normally TKOs in the MMA world are considered as stoppage by ref due to inability to defend yourself. The loss should be considered "Doctor stoppage(cut)" rather than TKO. MMAfan2007 21:20, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

That's incorrect. According to the NJSACB's rules, "if an injury sustained during competition... is severe enough to terminate a bout, the injured contestant loses by technical knockout." The NSAC states that "if a contest or exhibition is terminated because an unarmed combatant is injured, it may be adjudged a technical knockout to the credit of the winner." In RINGS, a TKO is recorded in the case of a referee/doctor stoppage, or five knockdowns (two rope breaks also count as a knockdown). east.718 21:34, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Was this fight in New Jersey? I don't think so. MMAfan2007 18:57, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

I just stated RINGS' rules next to that. Also, I mentioned Jersey's rules because they are the de facto rule set for sanctioned mixed martial arts. I've been trying to locate RINGS' rules online but can't find them, so I'm just going off what one of my old RINGS tapes says. It's really difficult to find info on RINGS because they went defunct five years ago and a lot of matches before 1997 were worked or had kayfabe elements. east.718 19:42, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

East is correct, TKO encompasses referee, corner, and doctor stoppages. Also chokes that render a fighter unconscious are TKO (when he does not tap). So when you asked "Wouldn't it be considered a stoppage rather than a TKO since the fight was indeed stopped due to a cut re-opening?" it is actually kind of redundant since in MMA a TKO and a stoppage are the same thing. Thesaddestday 22:16, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

The problem with the Fedor "loss" is that TK hit Fedor with an illegal blow, an elbow strike. Whether accidental or not (it was almost surely accidental) the blow was delivered illegally. In any other match in RINGS, the fight would have been given to Fedor. But owing to the tournament rules (Fedor was prohibited from fighting again in the tourny) he was not allowed to go on and thus had to be given a loss, as no one who has suffered a loss can go on (TK), who was the only replacement possible (there were no alternates). Accordingly, the loss should be ascribed an asterisk for explanation, as almost everyone is willing to claim that Fedor is undefeated.24.239.162.198 (talk) 06:41, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

As a ref and a fighter myself the fact that he recieved no previous warning for any illegal strikes pretty much deems it as an accident there was nothing illegal about it. Also fedor had a previous cut on his forehead from his last fight and having anything touch it would of reopend it. I think its cute your such a fanboy you cant accept that fedor lost. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.176.55.27 (talk) 02:53, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

It's cute that a "ref and a fighter" doesn't have the balls to sign his posts.. Just like when he fought Nog, it's a no-contest, plain and simple. The Muss (talk) 14:29, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

I dont have a wikipedia profile nor do i particuarly want one, And its not a no contest it hasnt been officialy ruled as such so your "opinon" quite frankly doesnt mean anything. How did I know some "expert" gave their opion in here? because some idiot marked his one loss as both a ko and a no contest and one can safely assume it was you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.169.12.125 (talk) 12:08, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

Are you talking to me? I haven't edited anything like you said on the main page. One can safely assume that since you are both a "ref and a fighter" you failed at fighting, but would like to cling to some authority. Tell me mr ref/fighter, why wasn't the 2nd fight against Nog a loss as well?? Fedor was cut and could not continue, why is it not a loss?? I like how you cowardly give your opinion but are too tough to make an account.. Or maybe it's too hard for you to work out.. Sorry if I am too harsh, I don't want to upset a self proclaimed "ref and fighter".. The Muss (talk) 12:59, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

And im sure you can back this up?

Well your not very safe in your assumption all considering im currently doing both, Its somthing I took up because its about about the only thing related to amature fighting I found that pays so I took it up and it got me payed to go to nearly every fight around most of QLD that I wasnt already partaking in. Because the ref ruled it diffrently they had a diffrent set up and governing body then rings did that lines like saying why didnt white do it if black did it? Expecting chalk and cheese to be the same thing will often lead to dissapointment Also rember as the ref you are the acting rep for the company that makes the rules what you say has alot of impact and unless they view it as REALLY wrong they will(often needing amdission on your part) not overturn it. And look at that adlib did I ever say I was too tough to have an account? did I even imply it? One thing that can be said my "opinon" is backed up by the fact that its the offical ruling and its a rich thing from a guy who has a non existant profile on here (click on it and it offer for me to make a page for it....mayby I should take it up on this offer and use some of my own adlib on that) or is that one too hard for you to work out? I never once knew that childish insults,reading into things that arnt there and being a hypocrite where in fact being harsh, prehaps next time you should mark with ^^ the sections you are being harsh so I can actually see where you are being(trying?)"harsh"? Is this the best you got? you have had 2 months to think of somthing better to be honest and if you really wanted to upset me one would of though youd actually say somthing upsetting rather then underlining your own ignorence you have done a better job of offending yourself —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.176.49.126 (talk) 15:25, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

Wow that was painful to read. You write like a 6 year old, perhaps taking a short course in English may improve your sentence structure and spelling?(My personal favourite was you spelling 'Ignorance' wrong, can you spell 'Irony'? )The only insult you have achieved is towards your parents retarded ability to educate their child. I am glad I have not created a profile due to people like yourself wishing to find personal information about other males on here. You act in suspicious ways, you enjoy the anonymity of no account while at the same time peering through members profiles, then complaining when they don't have one for your sly eyes. I guess we should follow everything you say, since you are a self-proclaimed 'ref and a fighter' hailing from QLD(because we all know that QLD(And Australia for that matter)is an MMA hot spot). Are you another sad and lonely MMA fan that has something against Fedor being the best and having no legit defeats? The Muss (talk) 13:01, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

i agree that the loss should have an asterisk. fedor is virtually undefeated and someone that doesnt know any better may think otherwise. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.247.69.78 (talk) 06:55, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Well there is a lot of discussion here about the elbow. Here's my take on it : The elbow was illegal. So the match should be a No Contest. Not a Loss. It is a loss because Fedor could not continue. WHAT!? So by that logic it is perfectly OK to use an illegal strike as long as you render your opponent unable to continue to compete as a result. So using this logic it would be perfectly OK [hypothetically speaking] for me to grab the ropes and elbow a guy in the back of the head as long as I render him unable to continue to compete in doing so. That's basically what your saying. Your saying an illegal stike becomes legal as long as it cuts your opponents eye. How does that make any sense? Could somebody please explain to me how that works. Why can't it be recorded as a No Contest for Fedor? It has every detail of a No Contest type situation verbatim. I understand that it counts as a loss because in order to not get the loss you have to win the tournament which Fedor was unable to but that does not turn a No Contest into a Loss. It just doesn't and shouldn't work that way. It should be a No Contest and EVERYBODY KNOWS IT! So just do the right thing and come to you senses and change the entry to match the reality of the situation and not some B.S. techninality.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.132.0.255 (talk) 21:54, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

The bottom line, however we feel about the judgement, It's recorded as a loss on his official record and sources all list him as having one loss. If we were to start adjusting results because of what we thought should have happened where would we stop? Should we start giving wins to fighters that lost on controversial split decisions? Can I change the Patriots 1976 playoff loss [1] to a win because the referee made a bad call costing them the victory?--Cube lurker (talk) 18:30, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Blogs

In response to this edit [2], I received this message on my talk page:

I recently restored a source you removed from Fedor Emelianenko, which you rationalized by saying "blogs are not reliable sources." Normally this is the case, but WP:V#SELF says that self-published material is permissible when it is by a "professional researcher in a relevant field." Ivan Trembow is one of the lead writers for MMA Weekly, an editor-in-chief for IGN, and a respected journalist in the field. Additionally, most of the articles on his blog are copies of articles written at MMA Weekly, since their articles expire from public view after a while.

Some community discussion took place a while back here and a consensus was reached that Trembow's blog does qualify as a reliable source.

Please reply on my talk page if you have any concerns. Thanks! east.718 19:00, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

The removed text reads:

This impressive victory against a perennial contender catapulted him into the upper echelon of the sport.

My main reason for wanting to remove this is not exactly that it is sourced only by a blog, although that is reason enough. I am trying to cut down on the peacocking in Wikipedia articles, especially related to MMA fighters. These articles are usually edited almost exclusively by fans, and so this kind of unencyclopedic, adulatory language slips in. In my opinion, the article is not improved by this statement, which only serves to sell the greatness of the article subject to the reader, and not contribute much factual information. The fact that it is cited by a blog makes it even more tenuous, although I did not remove blog citations elsewhere in the article. --causa sui ^talk 21:18, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

I cited that paragraph to Trembow's blog because it's the only source I found—I agree that ideally there shouldn't be any blogs cited at all. It's quite difficult to find sources for older events in MMA because of the lack of reliable sources covering it at the time, and it doesn't help that Sherdog's pre-2004 archives are broken, MaxFighting went offline, and The Wrestling Observer is not really searchable. east.718 21:42, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

Okay, sure. Can you respond to my point about the lack of encyclopedic value in this statement, sourced or not? --causa sui ^talk 21:50, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

How's it look now? east.718 22:32, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

Much better! Thank you. --causa sui ^talk 23:49, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

External Links

What is the rationale for removing external links? I came here to add a link to his official site but I found that the External Links section has been deleted before. Why? if you look at other MMA fighters' pages, pretty much all have External Links. 129.97.29.13 04:36, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

It's already linked to several times in the references, the same goes for his Sherdog profile. The PRIDE profile isn't that helpful because the promotion doesn't exist anymore, and the last link was an online petition. I welcome more outside input on this.  east.718 at 07:19, August 31, 2007 

I don't think it matters that it's in the references, a lot of people jump directly to External Links without going through the 64 references or the entire article looking for the links. The fact that almost every other fighter has External Links should say something. 74.103.163.40 16:44, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

That makes sense.  east.718 at 16:48, August 31, 2007 

Fedor pic

i'm a fan of fedor and all but we really should get rid of that one pic. hes in such a bad position. seeing this just makes my stomache turn. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.247.68.66 (talk)

Do you own a better image? We need of a image licensed under a free license. Carlosguitar 02:06, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree.. we need a new picture. he looks like elmer fudd in that one. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.89.66.95 (talk) 23:39, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Next opponents after the new contract

I guess Fedor's next destination must be the UFC. Tanigawa Sadaharu, the president of Fighting Entertainment Group (FEG) which hold regular K-1 events including Hero's, Dynamite! and Grand Prix, already mentioned the negotiation between his organization and Fedor Emelinanenko was not going well. Moreover, Dana White already confirmed (not 100%, though) the negotiation with Fedor is almost done while the only reason of detained official release is just because Fedor's participation of other sambo events in his own country, Russia.

Therefore, now I really am curious about which fighter is going to be Emelianenko's next opponent and the after. Surely, his next bout is almost confirmed against the current UFC heavyweight champion Randy Couture. It might be the reason why Randy's next bout schdule is not released yet. Originally, since Randy had a match against Gabriel Gonzaga in August, and against Tim Sylvia in last April, maybe December is the appropriate time for Randy also. Plus, Randy is the powerfully attractive for drawing TV viewers into Spike TV, which had the broadcast right of UFC, so UFC doesn't have any reason not to make Randy's appearance in December. I guess UFC might be waiting for Fedor's final confirmation, and just after that, they may release the match between PRIDE heavyweight champ and UFC champ.

I am also curious about, if Fedor wins the match, who is going to be the first challenger for him. Lots of changes happen in the UFC heavyweight division with joining former PRIDE heavyweight fighters, so it is going to be really exciting to expect Fedor's contenders. Nogueira, who was the eternal No.2 in PRIDE following Fedor, again? Or Tim Sylvia? Or winners against Mirko Cro Cop, who has been toughest challenger in the career of Emelianenko, Cheick Kongo and Gonzaga? Oh, I cannot wait matches after Fedor's arrival in UFC. Meganext 02:41, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

Given that he isn't signing with the UFC, I'd say this whole discussion would be moot.Tuckdogg 03:13, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

Gee, you are right. If the information is definitely correct, the match-up cannot be realized. But, considering power balance among MMA organizations which is the essential to balanced development of MMA market, Fedor's decision could be right. Now, hopefully want M-1's success, without following IFL or WFA, even bodog's a helluva lot of failure. Meganext 07:46, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

finally, it is decided that Hong-Man Choi will be Fedor's next opponent. Many Korean media are worry about the bold challenge Hong-Man just made. Meganext (talk) 10:30, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

On another note, shouldn't Fedor's upcoming bout Vs Andrei Arlovski be mentioned? I would edit this myself, but the article is semi-protected... ~Tae (talk) 23:26, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Nickname

i heard fedor being called Cyborg ever since they were talking about a superfight between him and coutore (i.e. captian america vs the russain cyborg), anyways i think the name stuck even though the fight may never happen, because ive heard him being called that now without referring to the superfight —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.27.62.219 (talk) 04:18, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

maybe, in my opinion, Fedor is seldom called 'Cyborg'. (Perhaps it's more appropriate Evangelista Santos who just call himself Cyborg). His well-known nickname is 'Last Emperor' because he is from Russia which was monarch country a century ago, and in my memory some of the Russian emperor's name was Fedor. Anywayz, 'emperor' is much better than 'cyborg', considering he is now at the top of MMA. Meganext (talk) 10:28, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

-for nicknames i added the russian experiment. i've heard them call him this in pride —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.86.179.34 (talk) 15:56, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

I've removed it, since no reference citation was provided for that being an actual nickname. Keep in mind that an offhand remark by an announcer is not a nickname, but if you can actually cite to a reliable source that he had that as a nickname at some point it could go back in. Gromlakh (talk) 16:32, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

-do a google search for like fedor russian experiment. its common knowledge, although i think he is not called this often anymore. i think it was more during the rings time. suppose i'll find some sources to make the wikinazis happy. brb —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.86.179.34 (talk) 21:56, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

-heres are some but there are many more out there. i dont have time because i need to get back to work before i get yelled at. http://www.leechvideo.com/video/view2213629.html http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xjyc7_the-russian-experiment http://bigdaddyving.multiply.com/video/item/3 http://www.mmaweekly.com/absolutenm/templates/dailynews.asp?articleid=3785&zoneid=13 http://www.themmaboards.com/showthread.php?t=632 http://www.sherdog.net/forums/archive/index.php/t-365736.html http://www.mmaworld.org/showthread.php?t=1889 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.86.179.34 (talk) 22:14, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

-can someone either unlock this page or add russian experiment to the nicknames. i have provided many legit sources. there was no need to remove it or even lock this page. i realize that no one calls him the russian experiment anymore but the fact is was a nickname for him weather anyone likes it or not. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.188.195.13 (talk) 21:19, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

Middle name

The Spanish version of this article has his middle name written as "Vladimirovich". I would add it to his page but I don't know how it is spelled in Russian. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.9.73.219 (talk) 00:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

The German page also has this as his middle name. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.9.73.219 (talk) 00:21, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

I checked the Spanish page. Problem: there's no citation for it. I wouldn't have a problem with it being added (even without an accompanying Russian spelling for it) as long as it's properly referenced. If not...then it's original research. Would be great if we could find a reference for it, though. Gromlakh (talk) 00:26, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

His patronymic is Vladimirovich, since his father's name is Vladimir. This information comes from a biography on his official Web site. I've added this into the article. --Life is like a box of chocolates (talk) 23:48, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Fedor's nationality

The facts is:

1. He born in Ukraine.

2. His surname is 100% Ukrainian.

3. In his early fights he even fought under the Ukrainian flag (checkout the last seconds of this vid: youtube.com/watch?v=pp4o1vzQvik ).

So, I think that it is better to say that Fedor is Russian/Ukrainian, but not just Russian. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.223.25.133 (talk) 18:48, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

The facts are:

1.He was born in USSR and Russia is the only legal successor of USSR nowadays;Luhansk,where he was born into,never constituted part of Ukraine in ethnic sense and was added to Ukrainian SSR by bolsheviks in order to boost support for the Soviet regime in 1918;Luhansk is a predominantly Russian city;

2.His surname is both Russian and Ukrainian since both peoples ascend from the same progenitor;moreover,surname says little about nationality,for example-G.Bush has a German surname but everybody thinks he is American;

3.Fedor's mother's pre-marriage surname is typically Russian

3.He moved to Russian SFR at the age of 3.

87.226.123.130 (talk) 14:49, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Great, the Ukrainian nationalists again. go back to your filthy hole, UPA dog! Fedor grew up in Russia, he only was in Ukraine for 2 yrs, he has a Russian passport. end of story. stop claiming what doesn't belong to you! now you bastards say that ancient RUS dukes were Ukrainian! You say that ancient Rus itself was Ukraine! oh, yeah, the whole world is Ukraine! keep telling yourself that, fucking Orange asshole! I am half-Ukrainian myself, people like you just piss me off! oh, and no, his surname is NOT "100% Ukrainian"! You know how many people in Krasnodar, Stavropolie, and other areas of RUSSIA, have last names that end with "-enko"? millions! myself included (Levchenko). fucking uneducated banderovitz nazi, you have no place here, go, save your antisemitic, supremacist theories for others (hint, maybe your brothers in Poltava will listen to your preachings). You people are the reason for all the hatred between Russians and Ukrainians these days! its people like you that should have perished in the Holodomor, seriously!--SergeiXXX (talk) 04:02, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Please stay civil or go away, thank you. - PietervHuis (talk) 17:16, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

Not up to you to tell me to go away, banderlog pig! You get out of my country, filth! Ukraina belongs to Ukrainians, not banderlog nazis!--SergeiXXX (talk) 03:56, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Sergei, you say "You people are the reason for all the hatred between Russians and Ukrainians" and then add "its people like you that should have perished in the Holodomor, seriously!" ... right... very convincing... not. P.S. Good luck with your application to be an Admin!! --David from Downunder (talk) 04:46, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

FEDOR NO UKAINIAN ! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Fedor_Emelianenko/Archive_1#Fedor.27s_Nationality_and_country_of_birth This issue has already been discussed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.96.196.85 (talk) 05:51, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

He's a Ukrainian-Russian. Ethnic Ukrainian living in Russia. - PietervHuis (talk) 16:16, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

Negative. This was already discussed as a part of an edit war last year. Fedor identifies solely as Russian, not Ukrainian. Unless you have a source more reliable than his own word for him being Ukrainian, go with the consensus reached here. Gromlakh (talk) 17:20, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

He considers himself Russian because he's a Russian national. He hasn't _denied_ his herritage anywhere so that's completely irrelevant. Fact is he's Ukrainian-born and an ethnic Ukrainian. Just like how for example Adolf Hitler is Austrian-born (even though he violently considered himself German). Here are sources that dub him as a Ukrainian-born Russian too: [3][4][5][6] so I'll change it to that instead of "ukrainian-russian" - - PietervHuis (talk) 18:14, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

That's fine; I'm not disputing the fact that he was born in the Ukraine. I believe that has been pretty conclusively established. I just haven't seen anything arise since the last consensus that established that he's ethnically Ukrainian. Gromlakh (talk) 21:02, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

Good, let's keep it this way then. You can tell he's an ethnic Ukrainian by his surname. His grandparents are also from Ukraine (he said so in an interview).- PietervHuis (talk) 21:27, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

Your arguments are not convincing. Klitschko brothers were born in Kyrgyzstan and Kazakhstan, they are regarded as Asians? We correct facts. FEDOR NEVER UKRAINIAN YOURSELF! IT IS 150% FACT! He was born in the region with a predominantly Russian population.

You Ukrainians, and you want to make of the Russian champion, a Ukrainian champion.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Fedor_Emelianenko/Archive_1#Fedor.27s_Nationality_and_country_of_birth

Actually the region he was born in is predominantly Ukrainian, although most speak Russian. His family name is also Ukrainian. And no I'm not Ukrainian and I do consider him a Russian champ since he's a Russian national. - PietervHuis (talk) 20:02, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

PietervHuis,you are posting blatant lies.What is your source of information about Luhansk being predominantly ukrainian?Luhansk is part of former Little Russia area,the region that was colonised quite recently,in 17-19 centuries,after Russia had succeded in defeating nomad tartar tribes that prevented settled peoples from living there.The colonists went mainly from Russia.Luhansk,where Fedor was born,had been part of Great Russia before 1918,after which this area was added to Ukrainian SSR by bolsheviks in order to boost support for the Soviet regime;Luhansk has always been nearly 100% Russian city,and this posture of things continues on.Anyone interested can easily check my information.

2.Fedor was born in Soviet Union, not Ukraine,if we want to be precise.He might be as ukrainian as I am,despite the fact that I was born in "Latvia" in 1980.

3.I doubt if the info about Fedor's father being "ukrainian" has any grounds.

Today's Ukraine contains very large portions of previously Russian territries such as Crimea and Luhansk,Donetzk and other.So my claim is that Fedor may be as ukrainian as 30 millions of other Russians living in nowaday's Ukraine.Frank Russian (talk) 14:50, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

He never considered himself Ukrainian !!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.96.196.85 (talk) 20:10, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

You have assumed the right to determine the nationality of Rights? Fedor always considered themselves Russian ! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.96.196.85 (talk) 20:16, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

Take it easy man. It doesn't say he's Ukrainian, it says he's Ukrainian-born. Has he ever denied that? No. So yes he's 1) Russian, but also 2) Ukrainian-born. - PietervHuis (talk) 20:26, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

To me, there is no dispute that Emelianenko was born in the Ukrainian SSR (it's the first sentence of the main article - "Fedor Emelianenko was born in 1976 in Rubizhne, Luhansk, part of the Luhansk Oblast region, presently a part of Ukraine..."), but how much weight is afforded by placing it in the lede and as a category. As Emelianenko self-identifies as Russian ("I want to stay on top and show people that Russian fighters are very good... I want to represent myself and to be honored by the Russian people."), I believe that undue prominence is afforded to his place of birth by a mention in the lede, an ethnicity which he doesn't even claim. east.718 at 02:13, April 9, 2008

He considers himself a Russian NATIONAL, that has absolutely nothing to do with ethnicity. And even if he would deny his heritage (which he hasn't), so? If he considers himself Chinese that doesn't make him Chinese does it? Ukrainian-Russians are well documented people (See: Ukrainians in Russia) and it may be noticed that he's one in my opinion. - PietervHuis (talk) 02:38, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm not going to take sides in the issue about "Ukrainian-born". I don't care whether that's there or not. The issue with the category is that it appears to suggest that Fedor is of Ukrainian ethnicity. I realize that is your opinion, and in fact you may well be correct. What I have still yet to see from anyone, though, is a citation to any reliable, third-party source that says he's of Ukrainian ethnicity. Your attempts to explain his statements of being Russian as that of being a "national" only are not a source, nor are your (or the various anon IPs) explanations of his allegedly Ukrainian name sources. The standard for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth. He cannot be identified as ethnically Ukrainian without a verifiable source. If there is no such source, he cannot be included in that category, period. Gromlakh (talk) 03:32, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

-enko is by defenition a Ukrainian name, there's many sources for that."The most typical Ukrainian surname ending is -enko, which is not found in any other ethnic group, and is commonly found in central and eastern Ukraine."[7] His parents were from Ukraine, his grandparents were from Ukraine (so he said himself), what should be more interesting is a source that claims he does _not_ have Ukrainian ethnicy. - PietervHuis (talk) 04:09, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

"The most typical Ukrainian surname ending is -enko, which is not found in any other ethnic group, and is commonly found in central and eastern Ukraine." Yeah, and also in Krasnodar, Stavropolie, and many parts of Russia. C'mon, give it up already. My neighbour's last name is Melniachenko, he is from Irkutsk. There goes that theory. --SergeiXXX (talk) 03:51, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

"Source A says Emelianenko ends in -enko, source B says -enko is a common Ukrainian suffix, so Emelianenko must be Ukrainian" is original synthesis and doesn't fly. And the absence of evidence of a source that claims otherwise isn't evidence of absence. east.718 at 04:35, April 9, 2008

Uhm it sounds more like WP:SENSE, Claiming that an Emelian-enko from Ukraine isn't Ukrainian is the the same as claiming Eisenhower wasn't a German-American. - PietervHuis (talk) 04:52, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

You're still completely missing the point. There is no source that says he's Ukrainian at all. You can talk until you're blue in the face about suffixes, who's born where, etc., but that doesn't change the fact that the article contains exactly zero sources identifying Emelianenko as ethnically Ukrainian. However, Fedor gives many interviews (properly sourced in the article and here!) in which he identifies as "Russian", with no mention of being "Ukrainian", despite being born in and hailing from what is now a foreign country to Russia. So, according to what's in the article and properly sourced at this point in time, Fedor is Russian. Period.

You are the one making the claim about his ethnicity that is currently not supported by reliable sources. Instead of citing sources, such as interviews or anything else where someone says conclusively "Fedor Emelianenko is of Ukrainian ethnicity", you're instead attempting to use original synthesis to draw your own conclusions from the evidence that you see and requesting that we prove a negative that he isn't Ukrainian (which isn't logically possible). Your analysis may be correct. It also may be correct that Fedor is purely Russian, but his family lives in the Ukraine. Perhaps also his mother (or another relative) could have married a Ukrainian and his family name was changed early in life. There are a million possible explanations for that; yours does not win out simply because it makes sense to you.

This does not mean that I'm advancing one of the above theories over yours in the article. Far from it, because that would be as much original synthesis as what you've done. I'm simply telling you that we have to follow Wikipedia policy and go with whatever the sources say. The sources in the article say he's Russian and say nothing about him being Ukrainian. The sources win. Fedor's Russian, until such time as you can produce a better source that clearly states his ethnicity as "Ukrainian" and does not require guesswork on the part of the reader. Gromlakh (talk) 13:14, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Look, he's a Ukranian nationalist a UPA/UNSO Neo-Nazi. They say Tsar Vladimir of Rus was Ukrainian. They say all ancient Rus Dukes and Archdukes were Ukrainian. To them, the whole freaging world is Ukrainian! Not much to do about that. Just ignore them.--SergeiXXX (talk) 03:55, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Ok look the thing is this.Fedor's father is an ethnic Ukrainian.The proof is in his last name,but how about Fedor's mother. Whats Fedor's mother's maiden name.It could be ethnic Russian.So until we find out Fedor is half ethnic Ukranian half something else.Maybe Belorrussian,maybe Russian,maybe Ukrainian.:) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.66.88.246 (talk) 18:36, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

His obviously Russian Ukranians really have to get a life. How funny would it be if we said Fedor was Ukrainian and we said Alek was Russian? wouldnt make sense would it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.160.168.50 (talk) 15:16, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

PietervHuis,you are posting blatant lies.What is your source of information about Luhansk being predominantly ukrainian?Luhansk is part of former Little Russia area,the region that was colonised quite recently,in 17-19 centuries,after Russia had succeded in defeating nomad tartar tribes that prevented settled peoples from living there.The colonists went mainly from Russia.Luhansk,where Fedor was born,had been part of Great Russia before 1918,after which this area was added to Ukrainian SSR by bolsheviks in order to boost support for the Soviet regime;Luhansk has always been nearly 100% Russian city,and this posture of things continues on.Anyone interested can easily check my information. 2.Fedor was born in Soviet Union, not Ukraine,if we want to be precise.He might be as ukrainian as I am,despite the fact that I was born in "Latvia" in 1980.

3.I doubt if the info about Fedor's father being "ukrainian" has any grounds.

Today's Ukraine contains very large portions of previously Russian territries such as Crimea and Luhansk,Donetzk and other.So my claim is that Fedor may be as ukrainian as 30 millions of other Russians living in nowaday's Ukraine Frank Russian (talk) 10:02, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

It's funny, I had this very same argument with my wife. She was born in Kyrgyzstan, but both of here parents are Russian. I call her a Kyrgyz all the time to mess with her. But she gets pissed off, and corrects me she's Russian. She was only born Kyrgyzstan! Trust me when I say this your fighting up hill on a no win battle. --EHDI5YS (talk) 22:11, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

Pics

I found this japanese site, there's a lot of Fedor's pics under Creative Commons good enough to upload here. take a look guys [8] (Marty Rockatansky (talk) 10:00, 12 March 2008 (UTC))

Non-commercial and non-derivative work are not allowed on Wikipedia. See WP:SD#I3. Carlosguitar ^{(Yes Executor?)} 19:25, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

I don't want to sound like some guy just walking by and suggesting something, I just really wanted to say this for some time now - My personal opinion is that it would be much better if somebody would put some other picture of fedor, I don't have nothing against this particular one but in my opinion there are many more pictures that portray him and his work better. Thank you for listening :)--VEGETA_DTX (talk) 23:51, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

Fedor's father

Fedor's father is not a steel worker, instead according to his official website, his father is gas-electric welder. So you could do that minor change. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.162.148.51 (talk) 23:31, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

Fedor and TKD?

http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200601/200601180031.html

Do you think we should add a little footnote about that in the training part? I was thinking just something small like "In 2006, Fedor blah blah blah..."

Final Justice (talk) 04:25, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

I believe he only said he did TKD to please the korean media at the time, I haven't heard of any concrete sources that he does and he does not use kicks in his fighting. -- MMAJunkie250 (talk) 06:37, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

It totally makes sense he would say that in Korea to be polite. It would endear him a great deal, Koreans love people to acknowledge and show interests in their culture. 121.44.67.25 (talk) 14:19, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Fedor's first fight

Fedor's first fight against Martin Lazarev took place on May 20, 2000 in a RINGS Russia event. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.193.186.204 (talk) 16:27, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

locked wtf? stop ruining wikipedia

why is this locked now? i check fedors wikipedia almost everyday and not once have i seen it vandalized. and why did someone remove russian experiment as one of his nick names? i provided 7 different sources proving this was one of his names and i can provide many more. we have enough wikinazis ruining wikipedia, we dont need one guarding fedors page. hes a tough guy, the best fighter in the world, the page can defend itself.

Mother fucking exactly. Unlock this article now. This is getting ridiculous.24.239.162.198 (talk) 06:27, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

---

Goddamn, that was worth staying up for (again). - Pieter_v (talk) 04:34, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

fujita fight

found an error about the fujita fight. referring to the infamous punch that threw fedor off balance. "Emelianenko has claimed this is the only time he has ever been knocked down." this is false, the punch did not knock down fedor, it stunned him and after fujita was able to take him down. i'd be happy to change it to what happen but some idiot decided to lock this page. http://youtube.com/watch?v=5eVLXVnuEgI 57 seconds into the video. source for anyone whos asking. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.188.195.13 (talk) 23:24, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

i forgot to add, fedor did say in an interview that this is the closest he had been to being ko'd —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.247.69.78 (talk) 03:34, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

Yes and if I recall correctly he also described it as a knockdown. Don't forget after that he fell on his back. - Pieter_v (talk) 19:49, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

i checked the sources and 35 mentions nothing of it and its a blog. i could be wrong but i thought blogs cant be used as sources on wikipedia. and on 36 after translating it the only thing i found was "A knock-down on sensations. At an exchange of blows my contender, densely having covered, has struck me backhand, has got a fist to a temple, and I "have floated". Fortunately, he has not noticed it and has not rushed to finish, having taken advantage of a situation. I have soon departed from a knock-down and have gained a preschedule victory."

maybe its a mistranslation but it seems more proper to say fedor got taken down, not knocked down. watch the link to the video above. at 57 seconds fujita hit fedor good but fedor does not get knocked down. he does clearly lose his balance but does not fall. fedor quickly engages in a clinch to prevent himself from falling. at 1:08 in the video while still clinched, fujita secures a takedown. this is not the only time fedor has been taken down(i can provide sources if anyone is asking). it was fujitas takedown while clinched that caused fedor to fall on his back. i'm sure that punch helped but it was fujitas takedown that brought fedor to his back. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.188.195.13 (talk) 21:49, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

The "knock down" reference is from Fedor's official site. It was a misnunderstanding of English on either Fedor or his translator's behalf, and the webmaster makes note of this if you visit the site. EazyBreezy (talk) 06:30, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

update or unlock please

fedor was scheduled to face arlovski for affliction on oct 11th. but he once again has a hand injury so was replaced by barnett. there are sources on sherdog and this is old news. whoever locked this page should take the responsibility of keeping it updated. speed is very critical on new information on the internet. i think this article should be unlocked so we can update it in a more timely manner. i never once seen fedor's page vandalized and if it happens there are enough fedor supports to change it back. 68.188.195.13 (talk) 20:28, 7 August 2008 (UTC)ski can someone please unlock this article so we can update it in a more timely manner.

correct this

why is it written that Fedor has 2 losses in professional MMA? In reality, there is just 1,and that one was just a technicality. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Frank Russian (talk • contribs) 07:38, 5 October 2008 (UTC)