Talk:Jon Gibson (Christian musician)

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I do most of Hammer's article and did a large part of Gibson's awhile back (extremely familiar with both artists), and may continue to expand it eventually. It was the concensus that Hammer has periods in M.C. per album covers, etc. I have been going to related articles changing them. There is a talk page discussion about it on his page. We have also discussed merging or changing the article title and search/link to M.C. which is correct, not MC. Thanks, but you didn't give me the benefit of the doubt with my good faith edit nor did you discuss it as I'm doing now. Good day! P.S. M.C. works too. It goes to his page without affecting the "link". I wasn't trying to correct it, I'm more concerned about being accurate/factual, not right. (talk) 08:49, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

Take it up with Wikipedia. The article doesn't contain the periods. The one with the periods is a redirect to the one without. If you want it to have periods, pipe it. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 08:54, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

CD Baby bio is the same as the Soul Tracks bio[edit]

Bold are the differences. They are otherwise identical and as far as WP:V and WP:R go, are the same document.

  • CD Baby's starts "For the last two decades" while Soul Tracks starts "For nearly three decades".
  • CD baby "moved him to the head of Contemporary Christian artists" Soul Track "moved him to the A-List of Contemporary Christian artists"
  • CD baby "urban-sounding disc made with master producer Tommy Sims. The album didn't fare well" Soul Tracks "urban-sounding album made with master producer Tommy Sims. It didn't fare well".

Unless there is text in the profile that is not displayed to all users. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 02:36, 3 January 2011 (UTC)


Would be a good idea to get a publicity photo posted on the article eventually. (talk) 11:49, 7 July 2012 (UTC)

A photo, yes. Publicity photos are copyrighted and so are not permissible on Wikipedia. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 14:22, 7 July 2012 (UTC)

Of course, but in general, a publicity photo meaning a public domain photo. Or simply, a/any photo available to post on Wiki (without being so "micro"). For instance, a current one from his new album or from a prior release. Thanks! (talk) 05:18, 8 July 2012 (UTC)

Many photos (past and present) on his website that might be "available" for use? (talk) 11:22, 8 July 2012 (UTC)
Publicity photos do not enter the public domain. Their ownership is retained by the original copyright holder whether that is the photographer, record company or publicist.
Published online, by American copyright law, means that they are copyrighted. Sorry. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 19:59, 8 July 2012 (UTC)

This [1] and other articles (ie. one used to be posted on an actor's article from Welcome Back, Kotter for awhile) claim to be "publicity" photos (perhaps as a generic term) which is the point. However other editors acquire photos for articles, some from artist's websites, would work I'm sure (without being too technical and in hopes you won't be too literal with the words I'm using). You or I can get the wheels in motion so that one can be posted. If you've checked and nothing is approved by Wiki, please disregard. (I realize there are older and newer photos of Gibson on various sites, but that doesn't mean they can be used for the article.) Thanks! (talk) 01:52, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

Consider context first[edit]

Please don't be "revert happy". Consider the context of all changes and by all means READ sources and sections before just undoing good edits. It's wrong and unproductive! It's lazy to undo quick fixes and appropriate updates/changes... FYI. (talk) 12:43, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

FYI only[edit]

"Ebony & Ivory" + "The Wall" + "She Told Me So" videos all on Youtube and/or social media sites of artists involved. 2602:304:CEED:E550:EC6B:4B7F:25C9:67C4 (talk) 11:37, 28 January 2018 (UTC)

Unproductive/unnecessary/unwarranted reverts by Walter Gorlitz[edit]

(cur | prev) 16:00, 31 January 2018‎ Walter Görlitz (talk | contribs)‎ . . (14,908 bytes) (-1,256)‎ . . (Reverted to revision 804571074 by NihlusBOT (talk): Revert to last stable version. (TW)) (undo) (Tag: Undo)

All of the edits made to the article were legitimate and sourced. The new information is appropriate as is the revised additions. In fact, if you took time to view them all and not use "twinkle" then you'd see that the current way the article is has errors (such as "Love Comes Down" is "Love Come Down" and "This Wall" is actually "The Wall", fixed/updated links to other articles, etc.)! Adding information such as his first interaction with Wonder makes sense instead of a paragraph that claims they reunited when it's never even mentioned they collaborated before until the edits made that you undid. I don't want to get in an edit war so I didn't "undo" it but you're absolutely wrong and do not own the article. The personal life info is cited and allowed within the article. The only thing that can stick is No. 1 not #/Number 1 (most likely done in error). Please check all the edits carefully (don't be lazy and ignore/discredit edits without doing verification first) and see that they comply with Wiki and therefore should remain. I see you have a history of doing this and it's not appreciated. Thanks and good day! P.S. I may not be back on to reply or defend myself. You just need to do the right thing and accept the changes/updates not revert them all (without explanation) to a "stable status" which is not correct such as punctuation errors within the listing of the songs/albums at the end of the article. Please pay attention and don't sabotage/suppress "good faith" contributions! [1][2] 2602:304:CEED:E550:2142:3FC8:DC76:4D71 (talk) 10:04, 1 February 2018 (UTC)

(cur | prev) 03:55, 29 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:d0be:dbf8:119a:f31f (talk)‎ . . (16,171 bytes) (+229)‎ . . (expanded the intro with text from article) (undo)

(cur | prev) 03:47, 29 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:d0be:dbf8:119a:f31f (talk)‎ . . (15,942 bytes) (-3)‎ . . (→‎Music career: year moved) (undo)

(cur | prev) 03:45, 29 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:d0be:dbf8:119a:f31f (talk)‎ . . (15,945 bytes) (+15)‎ . . (→‎Music career: minor wording changes) (undo)

(cur | prev) 02:10, 29 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:d0be:dbf8:119a:f31f (talk)‎ . . (15,930 bytes) (+20)‎ . . (no 's' + added spaces) (undo)

(cur | prev) 01:37, 29 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:d0be:dbf8:119a:f31f (talk)‎ . . (15,910 bytes) (+25)‎ . . (→‎Music career: J.G.) (undo)

(cur | prev) 01:29, 29 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:d0be:dbf8:119a:f31f (talk)‎ . . (15,885 bytes) (+4)‎ . . (→‎Music career: album format) (undo)

(cur | prev) 13:33, 28 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:4ce3:2424:18b:51fb (talk)‎ . . (15,881 bytes) (+139)‎ . . (→‎Discography: "The Wall" track listing not "This Wall") (undo)

(cur | prev) 12:17, 28 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:ec6b:4b7f:25c9:67c4 (talk)‎ . . (15,742 bytes) (-109)‎ . . (outdated/old notices) (undo)

(cur | prev) 12:11, 28 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:ec6b:4b7f:25c9:67c4 (talk)‎ . . (15,851 bytes) (+29)‎ . . (→‎Music career: Elektra Records per video) (undo)

(cur | prev) 11:57, 28 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:ec6b:4b7f:25c9:67c4 (talk)‎ . . (15,822 bytes) (+231)‎ . . (→‎Personal life: current status) (undo)

(cur | prev) 11:37, 28 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:ec6b:4b7f:25c9:67c4 (talk)‎ . . (15,591 bytes) (+2)‎ . . (→‎Music career: fixed song) (undo)

(cur | prev) 11:20, 28 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:ec6b:4b7f:25c9:67c4 (talk)‎ . . (15,589 bytes) (+75)‎ . . (→‎Music career: The Wall + Ebony & Ivory per JG sources) (undo)

(cur | prev) 11:05, 28 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:ec6b:4b7f:25c9:67c4 (talk)‎ . . (15,514 bytes) (-1)‎ . . (→‎Discography: technically The Wall with This Wall lyrics) (undo)

(cur | prev) 11:02, 28 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:ec6b:4b7f:25c9:67c4 (talk)‎ . . (15,515 bytes) (+573)‎ . . (→‎Music career: expanded and corrected with source) (undo)

(cur | prev) 08:50, 25 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:211c:332:f8cf:567 (talk)‎ . . (14,942 bytes) (+16)‎ . . (→‎Music career: fixed format) (undo)

(cur | prev) 01:59, 9 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:cc06:851b:de94:6f78 (talk)‎ . . (14,926 bytes) (0)‎ . . (fixed format) (undo)

(cur | prev) 01:27, 9 January 2018‎ 2602:304:ceed:e550:cc06:851b:de94:6f78 (talk)‎ . . (14,926 bytes) (+18)‎ . . (→‎Music career: fixed link) (undo)

Notices are 5 years old (hence updates/improvements made):

This article has multiple issues. Please help improve it or discuss these issues on the talk page. (Learn how and when to remove these template messages)

This article may be written from a fan's point of view, rather than a neutral point of view. (December 2013)

This article may contain an excessive amount of intricate detail that may only interest a specific audience. (December 2013)

This biography of a living person needs additional citations for verification. (December 2013)

There are multiple issues. No, not all of the edits are legitimate. Many are primary sources. Most are not reliable. For instance you source the title for his song to That is not a reliable source for songs. You also have the primary source,, for that. That's already a problem for a claim like this, but then when I read it, it doesn't mention the song and while it mentions Hammer, it's not in relation to that song.
The next sentence makes the claim that it was featured in Time-Life's CCM Presents The 100 Greatest Albums in Christian Music. First, that's not referenced. Second, you're saying a song appeared in a book about albums. Do you understand how illogical that is from the outset? Third, The album on which it appeared, Change of Heart, does not appear in that book, but Jesus Loves Ya appears at No. 90. Finally, the book was published by CCM Magazine and not Time Life. The magazine published a subsequent article (or was it a book?) in 2006 on the 100 best songs, and no work of Gibson's appears in that. Granted, those claims are made later in the article, but you've had a lot to do with this article over time (and over multiple anonymous accounts) so a thorough cleaning of the article is due.
I do not have the time to respond to all of the other problems but how about you start by explaining your edits using edit summaries, and without making massive changes. And it would be best if you did not remove the maintenance templates at the top of the article.


No mention of pre-Christian career[edit]

added to Music career section:

After Gibson got out of the army at age 20, he signed with Dick Griffey's Constellation label as a rhythm and blues artist. Jon's debut as a singer/songwriter came as a guest vocalist and songwriter on three songs for The Jacksons' keyboardist, Bill Wolfer's solo project entitled "Wolf" on the Constellation label. The album included Michael Jackson singing background vocals on the Gibson/Wolfer collaboration "So Shy". Griffey had fun circulating Gibson's demo tape, with people believing they were listening to Stevie Wonder (who Gibson sang "Ebony and Ivory" with while on tour in 1983). Gibson released his debut album Standing on the One with Constellation and produced the 1983 single "She Told Me So" via Elektra Records (including a music video that premiered on MTV).[2] Gibson, however, being torn between his desire for pop stardom and his need to give testimony to his faith, entered the Christian music industry when he signed with Frontline Records in 1986.[5] 2602:304:CEED:E550:2142:3FC8:DC76:4D71 (talk) 00:57, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

Good point. The source for being signed to Constellation is primary but should be OK. This content needs to be rewritten because it's a copyright violation, or at least very closely matches the word order from that page though. Walter Görlitz (talk) 03:46, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

per Walter Gorlitz's disruptive reverts — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:304:CEED:E550:2142:3FC8:DC76:4D71 (talk) 01:00, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

And I have requested that the article be locked to new and unregistered editors based on the comments I left above. The problems are all yours. Walter Görlitz (talk) 01:13, 2 February 2018 (UTC)
Page protection already applied, no further admin action needed here. Yunshui  08:39, 2 February 2018 (UTC)
Admin action needed was not for a temp block on this page it was because WG violated revert rules again and was not even warned. He recently conducted an edit war on Billy Graham as well even after given a reason for the content being removed. This is an ongoing problem with him over the years because he's too busy (as he mentions above) or lazy to do any work but delete good faith edits by anon users. I'll be back years from now when he's long gone until the truth is included on this article. P.S. I will not directly communicate with him, view his messages on my talk page or reply to any messages he leaves here. He can not be cooperated with. He's difficult and I've been over it for years. 2600:1702:1690:E10:8938:94E:77FE:6FF1 (talk) 16:43, 1 March 2018 (UTC)
Actually, it was you, anon, who were adding unreliable sources. This is an ongoing problem with you over the course of this article because you have no clue what a reliable source is. If you're not willing to communicate, that could get you blocked as well.
That you're pretending to be a different editor than the earlier anon is laughable. Walter Görlitz (talk) 17:50, 1 March 2018 (UTC)
Reports of edit warring should be made to the appropriate noticeboard, rather than by using the help template. Yunshui  08:41, 2 March 2018 (UTC)
And read WP:BOOMERANG before you do. It seems that the addition of sources that fail WP:RS and the WP:OVERREFs have stopped. The prose are, more or less, the way the anon would like them (even though it completely misses the point that "This Wall" was also the name of the song "The Wall") and the refs are sufficient, albeit not of the highest quality. I don't see the need for page protection, but do have the article on my watchlist and should notice any inappropriate changes. Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:56, 2 March 2018 (UTC)
I just fixed another case of using poor sources and OVERREF, although a read of MOS:LEAD wouldn't hurt. For the record, online sources are not required. Sources are. Read WP:V. Walter Görlitz (talk) 16:20, 2 March 2018 (UTC)

Note to self[edit]

This article has come a long way over time since the original creation of it but I would still like to eventually include additional notable collaborations/influences contained within this early contribution (ie. John P. Kee, etc.): [2] as well as more recent ones (ie. Gibson serving as the house band for Prince, etc.) when I have more acceptable sources. For now, i'm taking a long break from this article and hope in time the notices/headers/templates can be removed (at least some of them). I may not return until his new album is released. I also think adding jazz, funk, pop and/or rap genres is acceptable based on album content and some sources I've read categorizing them as such (ie. urban). Not important. No response needed for this. Just a reminder for myself in the future. 2600:1702:1690:E10:1CC6:9EDD:42E:91BF (talk) 06:18, 6 March 2018 (UTC)

These issues no longer apply and are outdated since the recent changes were made so they should be removed:

  • This article may be written from a fan's point of view, rather than a neutral point of view. (December 2013)
  • This article may contain an excessive amount of intricate detail that may only interest a specific audience. (December 2013)
  • This biography of a living person needs additional citations for verification. (December 2013) (talk) 06:16, 13 March 2018 (UTC)

For the record, the song was always "The Wall" but was typed wrong by mistake. As with allot of other contributions i made in the past, meddling editors came to this article on purpose bent to ruin it by deleting/changing content and adding false templates resulting in poor quality, misspellings, missing sources and info being out of context/order. It made it sloppy due to their arrogance and ignorance. It's why people get upset on here when they have to redo things and prove themselves yet other articles have NO sources at all. This type of double-standards is epic on Wikipedia but tell anyone and they just dismiss complaints as being disruptive. The only common factor is humans making errors but not accepting blame. It is what it is but doesn't make it right. Moving forward... 2600:1702:1690:E10:5800:576:9EC4:80DC (talk) 19:49, 13 March 2018 (UTC)