Talk:Jota Aviation

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Including detail about Jota Aviation owner and Chairman and his publicly stated campaigning in position to policy and practice adopted by Jota Aviation

I'm looking to rebalance this article, but be gentle please as I'm new!

The article is tagged as 'This article contains content that is written like an advertisement. Please help improve it by removing promotional content and inappropriate external links, and by adding encyclopedic content written from a neutral point of view. (August 2019) (Learn how and when to remove this template message)'.

I am adding detail about Jota's owner Simon Dolan. It appears to be relevant to me, as the owner is an anti-facemask campaigner, whereas Jota has a facemask policy and has taken a contract to transport PPE. Similarly Jota has an active Twitter account but Dolan is anti-Twitter. When I add this detail, another poster undoes this, saying that Dolan is not the CEO, which is true, but not the point being made. How do I resolve this other poster undoing my edits, which is only reverting the article to its "advertisement" state? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Itcontractor (talk • contribs) 17:52, 29 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe I answered my own question. Previous editor referenced that Dolan is not CEO. I have added detail and reference to Dolan's role as Chairman as well as owner. Hopefully that is satisfactory. Itcontractor — Preceding undated comment added 21:01, 29 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This article is about Jota Aviation, not Simon Dolan. If you want to attempt to point out hypocrisy, this is not the place. There is no source stating that Dolan specifically is involved in the airline's mask policy or their contract to carry PPE. I'd further point that PPE does not inherently mean masks.

Further, attempting to add Dolan information to an article that is not about Dolan is not attempting to alleviate the "advertising" issue with the article. This includes attempting, repeatedly, to add to the article that Dolan is an anti-masker. Wikipedia policy on Biographies of Living People clearly states that information should remain neutral, meaning Dolan's political history has absolutely nothing to do with an article on the airline. Finally, you cannot own an article and control who can and cannot remove or alter your edits.

As someone proclaiming to be new, you should probably start with relevant policies regarding libel and neutrality, especially since your sole editing on Wikipedia has been to Simon Dolan. This appears to be a single-purpose account. The³5₉ (Talk) 23:53, 29 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for responding on the Talk page. Hopefully this is a more constructive way of managing this disagreement that undoing my edits. Thanks also for the reminder if wiki rules of engagement. One of those is to assume good faith on both parts, so let's aim for that as well. A couple of points I would make. Where the publicly stated views of the Chairman and owner of Jota Aviation directly opposed the policies of Jota Aviation, that is relevant to Jota Aviation. It's not about hypocrisy, but it is still relevant, and I struggle to see why anyone neutral would disagree. It's factual, referenced, and relevant. And while I do agree with your point about PPE not necessarily meaning facemasks and I will construct my sentence in my next edit to make this clear. Thanks again for engaging on the Talk page. Itcontractor — Preceding undated comment added 11:43, 30 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Taking on board comments about neutrality, and also in the interests of moving towards consensus, I've removed some content in the first paragraph about Dolan involvement with Keep Britain Free, which isn't relevant to the article. Itcontractor — Preceding undated comment added 12:09, 30 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

One additional thought for the other poster. Do you think it would help if we added some detail about Dolan as the founder of KBF (and perhaps we could agree some neutral language about this) to show that Dolan's vies on facemask is not just a personal political view, but a publicly stated campaigning position within the context of a campaign group founded by Dolan? And that this position is in opposition to the policies and practices of a company that Dolan has significant control over (as defined by Companies House) and is Chairman of? Thanks in advance for engaging constructively. Itcontractor — Preceding undated comment added 13:41, 30 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Re latest edit comment: "Again, this article is not about Simon Dolan, it is about Jota. Dolan's personal feelings have no relevance to the company's actions" I agree that Dolan's personal feelings are of limited relevance (although clearly they are of some relevance). But the the company owner and Chairman's publicly stated views within the context of a political campaign that he has founded are relevant, particularly when they relate to safety. Rather than being locked in a cycle of one poster nuancing the wording to get it right, and another poster removing the edit, I am proposing this wording (obviously with refences to be added as per before!): 'Jota Aviation has been delivering personal protective equipment (PPE) to the NHS. While it is a requirement for passengers to wear face masks on board Jota Aviation aircraft, Jota Aviation owner and Chairman Simon Dolan his the founder of the Keep Britain Free movement which campaigns against the UK government response to COVID-19, including the mandating of face masks; Dolan has claimed that requiring people to wear masks is a step toward authoritarianism, tweeting, 'Unless you make a stand, you will be wearing a mask for the rest of your life.'

It would be great to get a constructive conversation around this to move towards a consensus. Itcontractor

I left the previous version for over 3 months and have now updated as per my proposal above. Very happy to discuss further on Talk page. Itcontractor — Preceding undated comment added 08:12, 10 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]