Talk:Norwegian and Swedish Travellers

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Tschiwi?[edit]

There seems to be some debate about the term "Tschiwi" or "Tchiwi" in Sweden. Some attempts have been made to apply this term to Resande/Travellers as an ethnonym (e.g. at various times by Romsk kulturcentrum in Stockholm and even the Swedish Parliament), although this caused an outcry from some leading members of the Resande community, who flatly reject the term (cf. La Romané Nevimata, no.1/2008, p.7). Other sources seem to suggest 'tschiwi' means 'to speak' in Scandoromany, e.g. [1]. I suspect this latter usage would be related to 'chib/čib' (=tongue, language) in other Romani languages/dialects? Does anyone have a definitive answer to this, or can explain how and why "Tschiwi" came to be suggested as an ethnonym in recent years? Thanks! —Zalktis (talk) 16:13, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

  • Please compare with Dzhiwiek (Dziwijek) in Poland and Ukraine, means also Dzhiddi (Jew). If these two words are comparable then it might show from which direction the first Romani population arrived to Sweden.88.115.115.177 (talk) 10:35, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Swedes also use the term tattare[edit]

However it is sometimes considered derogatory.

http://www.svenskaakademien.se/svenska_spraket/svenska_akademiens_ordlista/saol_pa_natet/ordlista — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.101.207.226 (talk) 17:02, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

Mix-up of "tatere" and Roma/Gypsies in Norway[edit]

The claim that a large proportion of Norwegian travellers are/were Roma is false, and I propose that this part of the article is removed.

The overwhelming majority of travellers in Norway have been of either completely ethnic Norwegian origin, or of ethnic Scandianvian origin. The terms "tater", "fant" and "skøyer" were reserved for the Norwegian/Scandinavian travellers, whereas the Romer were always termed "sigøynere".

Small groups of Romer/Gypsies ("sigøynere") entered Norway from 1860 onwards, but they were always distinct groups from the former, and never exceeding a few hundred people. The number of Roma with Norwegian passports, or who mainly resided in Norway, were less than 100 until WW2 (between 30 and 40 persons in 1924, and 68 in 1934). Sourcces: The city archive for Oslo council, The Norwegian institute of local history, and

http://www.historieblogg.no/?cat=89

Scandinavian travellers developed a Scandinavian "lingua franca", or "Pidgin Scandinavian". The claims of common language origins with Roma languages are not plausible, for a variety of reasons, amongst them that the grammar is fully Scaninavian. However, the "Pidgin Scandinavian" also included a handful of words of Roma origin. --Ronja R (talk) 08:40, 6 May 2013 (UTC)