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"Involuntary Seizure"[edit]

The phrase "involuntary seizure" is really awkward. The phrase is intended to say that it is against the will of the person acted on, but it's more common to speak of the actor as doing so involuntarily. When you say an action is involuntary, you mean that the actor did not intend it. The current phrase is awkward because a seizure is involuntary; if it weren't, you'd say the person went willingly. For similar reasons, "involuntary murder" (where it is meant that the murder is against the wishes of the murdered) would be nonsensical

I'd suggest come other phrasing. If the author means that the seizure is against the wishes of the seized person, I'd say that "involuntary" is otiose. If the intention is to emphasize that it is an outcome of a contract, I'd say "contractual seizure." Or something else: the original author can clarify his meaning. Hughdbrown (talk) 15:41, 16 November 2012 (UTC)

Forcible? Arbitrary? The idea is to distinguish panyarring from pawnship which was the "contractual seizure" of individuals (done without force by the debt collector). There needs to be some modifier to distinguish the seizure of individuals in pawnship (which was based on mutual consent) from panyarring (which was based on decision only by the creditor). Lovejoy uses Arbitrary as the key modifier. Other suggestions welcomed. AbstractIllusions (talk) 16:03, 16 November 2012 (UTC)
Went with arbitrary as a placeholder. It makes sense, I think, but another sentence needs to be added I think for clarity. AbstractIllusions (talk) 16:46, 16 November 2012 (UTC)