Talk:Shin splints

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...shin splints is the most common form of shin splints...[edit]

Really? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.212.29.88 (talk) 09:43, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Periostitis disambiguation PLEASE!!![edit]

A search for "Periostitis" (that is, inflammation of the "periosteum") links direct to this specific disorder page. Periostitis can occur in any bone with a periosteum, not just the tibia (e.g. periostitis of the jaw, of the eye orbit, periostitis through bone and joint lesions of yaws, syphilis, etc!!!)

I agree. Periostitis of alveolar process is also not so uncommon. - Dr P

Orthopedic conditions template suggestion[edit]

I have been going through the list of orthopaedic conditions listed as stubs and suggesting this template for Orthopaedic Conditions (see Talk:Orthopedic surgery)
Name
Definition
Synonyms
Incidence
Pathogenesis and predisposing factors
Pathology
Stages
Classification
Natural History/Untreated Prognosis
Clinical Features
Investigation
Non-Operative Treatment
Risks of Non-Operative Treatment
Prognosis following Non-Operative Treatment
Operative Treatment (Note that each operations should have its own wiki entry)
Risks of Operative Treatment
Prognosis Post Operation
Complications
Management
Prevention
History
--Mylesclough 06:27, 8 October 2005 (UTC) Please add DDX to help better needed readers. thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jryni (talkcontribs) 14:32, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

Adding a section for the added resistance to shin splints in the strong[edit]

There is a link along these lines, the last one, I intend to read up on it. Like any soreness in connective tissue, this should in theory be something that we can improve over time, yes? Exert ourselves until we feel the soreness/pain, rest with nutrition to recover, and it will be stronger? It should also be mentioned how this increases, such as pounding the ground more intensely, a harder surface (like pavement), the weight of the runner (fatness, weighted vest) and the gradual buildup of such tensions during the length of sleep deprivations. In time friends! Tyciol 09:35, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

  • When I started running seriously, the above was in fact my approach toward shin splints. I understood what was causing the pain and so I simply worked harder to strengthen the area. I just kept pounding away at the shins until they became stronger. I ran hard down hills, I stretched the muscles after exercise to increase flexibility, I used ice and so forth. The shin muscles grew in size. Raising my toe to flex the shin raised a huge, rock-hard slab on the front of my leg. The shins no longer hurt. No matter what kind of running I did, I simply did not "hear" from that area of the body any longer. But eventually, I ended up with an inflammed tendon in the top of the foot! It hurt to run or walk. Every time I placed the heel down on the ground, followed by the toe, there was pain. If I tried to raise my toe, there was pain (and also a creaking sensation). I went to the running track to pound on the injured area a little bit and discovered that it did not hurt whatsoever during a fast 400 meter repetition! Obviously, that was due to the different running form. So immediately returned to a regular intensity and volume of training, using a different posture and footstrike. I felt no discomfort from the injury, which rapidly recovered. The point is that increased strength and flexibility in the shins might not be the right answer, at least not by itself, because it doesn't eliminate the source of the tension. It's been a few years and I haven't had any problems with those tendons, nor with the shin. The tibialis anterior muscle is still quite large and strong, but not quite like before.--KazKylheku 23:34, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
  • By the way, the last link in our article's External Links section ([[1]) is very good. It identifies the true causes of muscle pain in the shin and recommends an interesting exercise that seems like a good alternatives to beating up the shins by downhill running. Check out the Heel Stepdown. --KazKylheku 23:34, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

Diagram is poor[edit]

Zero sharp 06:57, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Could someone make a better diagram of posture rather than the text-based one on this page. It is hard to understand.

Seriously I agree that diagram is so bad that maybe it should just be taken out.

I agree. The ASCII art is amusing, but nearly useless.
Somebody took out the diagrams at some point, but the article still talks about the "following grossly exaggerated diagrams". (Could anyone here please point to an version of the article just before the ASCII diagrams were removed? Thanks.) Lumpish Scholar 00:11, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Annoyed[edit]

Not only runners get shin splints. While the basic information is good, I think it should be rewritten to include other forms of activity that can promote shin splints such as dancing, figure skating, gymnastics, ect. Right now it only discusses from the running point of view.

Please clarify the "There may even be immediate discomfort in the muscles from a build-up of lactic acid." Other pages in Wikipedia dispute "Lactic Acid" formation regarding muscles.

Please add other treatments for shin splints if cessation of excercise isn't possible- icing the affected area before and after running, or up to 4 times a day, taking ibuprofen before running to decrease swelling and inflamation, stretching the calves and shins, and swimming or flutter kick in the water (it stretches out the shin).

Also, extreme amounts of whip kick in the water and pole vaulting can cause shin splints on both shins and the planting foot, respectively.

- Why should anyone credit what you say? What are you annoyed about? Perhaps the other cases you discuss are not actually shin splnts. If you check my site http://www.questforendorphins.com you'll see that I have an interest in these questions. You're free to post what you like of course, but if you don't demonstrate credibility - why? YAC (talk) 02:50, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

- I credit what he/she says. I completely agree with it. The hostile response is what was annoying, though. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.249.47.11 (talk) 15:47, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Dubious assertion[edit]

This one:

Runners who strike heavily with the heel should look for shoes which provide ample rearfoot cushioning.

I wouldn't say this is not true; I'd say it doesn't make sense. Runners who strike heavily with the heel should stop doing it. Anything else is a palliative measure that ultimately does not work. The so-called motion control shoes give you a degree of protection from your bad technique, but at a price: they are heavier and less flexible, which - ironically - makes it even harder to run in a correct way. So, in short, I don't think this is a good advice. (Though it's very popular - I know that.)

This assertation is true; a powerful downward strike can put a lot of pressure on the entire area of the leg, and thereby exacerbate the pain of shin splints. Running in shoes with a lot of cusion and on softer surfaces with some give, like dirt or grass, helps out better than running in worn out shoes or on asphalt. However, just wearing better cusioned shoes could cure the symptom- shin splints- and not the cause, poor running form.


The "upper part" of the article gets it right:

The long-term remedy for muscle-related pain in the shin is a change in the running style to eliminate the overstriding and heavy heel strike.

Still, there is one more crucial point that is perhaps not explained entirely correctly in the article. Running is not properly done on your toes: it's not your toes that strike the ground first, it's the ball of your foot. I've seen the "running on your toes" story dozens of times; of course, when people who hit the ground with their heels first read this, they try it, conclude that it "doesn't work" (of course it doesn't) or is not "right for them", and go back to their old style. Also, the point which some people miss is that you're still allowed to touch the ground with your heels: it's just that they have to come into contact with the ground last, not first.

"Finally, arguably the most important dietary aspect preventing shin splints is cutting out highly carbonated "soft drinks". These types of beverages will literally take calcium away from your bones, leaving you with weak and calcium deprived bones.[citation needed]" - Let's add this when there is a citation, not before!


A warning: IANAD (<-- dumb acronym, stands for "I am not a doctor"). Of course, this can only mean one thing: I've learned it the hard way.

Finally, a good explanation can be found here. The entire posetech.com site is worth taking a look at. GregorB 22:57, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

Name for the opposite fallacy?[edit]

Does anyone know why this condition is called this? The standard definition of "splint" is probably not related. Boris B 11:10, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Can the references to "poop", "Pee" and "Fire" please be removed? I don't believe they have any place in this subject.

confusing text[edit]

Each of these sentences seem to make little sense:

In a foot pushes off almost entirely from the big toe, causing excessive strain on the big toe and the outside of the shin.
In contrast, under pronation, occurs when the foot does not roll enough.

Also "CCS" is never defined, I think...

Lastly, under "form", it says

Correcting the footstrike begins with posture. A hunched forward posture leads to a heel strike. In both postures, ...

but only one posture was mentioned at that point... I suppose the opposite would be "tilted back"?

I would also like to know what CCS stands for. Does anyone know? Jason Smith 01:10, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Compartment syndrome is the cause[edit]

A somewhat informative article...but it completely fails to mention one of the main reasons for the pain of shin splints. When muscles are overused, bruised, or torn swelling occurs. The muscles of the anterior leg compartment are contained in a fascial sheath that does not stretch. Hence when the muscles swell pressure builds up and pain results. A link to (chronic) compartment syndrome is must have addition to this article.

Sorry, I'm not a user so I can't sign.

64.17.194.175 03:53, 18 April 2007

In both postures, the center of gravity is directly over the foot. Physics requires this, because it is the condition which prevents a body from falling over.[edit]

"In both postures, the centre of gravity is directly over the foot. Physics requires this, because it is the condition which prevents a body from falling over." - I'm pretty sure this isn't right. Walking (and by extension running) has been described as 'controlled falling' - each step you take, you lean forward and fall slightly, then extend a foot to catch yourself. It might be the preferable technique to keep an even centre of gravity - I'm far from an expert - but physics certainly doesn't require it. --irrevenant [ talk ] 10:45, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

It probably needs to make a distinction between dynamic and static equilibrium. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.235.19.132 (talk) 19:54, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Article needs work[edit]

This article is in pretty bad condition. I don't have the time now, but if someone is able, can you look over the organization and flow of this article. It is confusing at best. 128.211.251.187 00:46, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Doesn't make sense[edit]

There's no such thing as "the foot joint", and the sciatic nerve does not lie near the foot. Someone screwed up their anatomy in the pain referral section.

little blue borrower[edit]

What the hell does this mean: "This cannot be left until tommorrow, as said person may turn into a little blue borrower"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Srostami (talkcontribs) 03:05, August 25, 2007 (UTC)

Soft Drinks??? Really???[edit]

I found this section interesting: "Finally, arguably the most important dietary aspect preventing shin splints is cutting out highly carbonated "soft drinks". These types of beverages will literally take calcium away from your bones, leaving you with weak and calcium deprived bones"

Another entry seems to contradict this: [2] —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sceptic69 (talkcontribs) 20:47, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

"Bikers"[edit]

"Bikers who have to use their feet to change gears or apply brakes can suffer from shin splints after long rides."

This is a non-sequitur. I've at least changed it to clarify what the contributor presumably meant (motorcyclists). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.64.138.40 (talk) 23:08, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

Ummmm....[edit]

This article so full of dogma and half-truths and lies, it's ridiculous. Would someone please just start a new article? Start with this... "Shin Splints" also known as tibial stress syndrome...

Tibial stress syndrome is not mentioned in this article for some reason. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.60.135.28 (talk) 18:25, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Jump Rope[edit]

On my site http://www.questforendorphins.com, I promote physical activity and a form of jump rope I call JumpRock. I rarely touch my heel to the ground and jump much higher on my toes now than when I started. Any opinions on whether this would be helpful in preventing shin splints.

I said I wouldn't put the link to my site anywhere but my profile, but it seems relevant here. YetAnotherCommenter (talk) 04:17, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Dr. Chad Hadersbeck?[edit]

The "Diagnosis" section seems to suddenly lapse into an excerpt from a book or website that is not previously referenced: "For centuries the lingering pain of shin splints has plagued athletes from around the globe. But however powerful the machine (or herbal remedy), the underlying model remained the same. To find the pain, Dr. Chad Hadersbeck first had to look for the symptom." It's not very coherently laid out. --Irrevenant [ talk ] 11:12, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Poorly written in places[edit]

Language such as "good shoes- not that piece of crap payless", found in the last section, does not belong in an encyclopedia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by PaulPrice (talkcontribs) 21:30, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Is rest really the ideal treatment??[edit]

My sister was diagnosed with shin splints 15 years ago and was told to rest. It did nothing. She then got a second opinion and they told her to keep exercising (just don't overdo it), combined with massage and physio treatment should work it out. A few months later she was back to normal. I was then diagnosed with shin splints 6 years after her, was told the same as her second opinion, and then after no improvement was referred to a bone scan which revealed a minor case of compartment syndrome. This article is atrocious and not factual. I'm not a medical practitioner but I could write a better article! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.184.2.1 (talk) 07:28, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia's model is fundamentally ill-suited to articles about medical conditions; not so much because the topic is impossible to write about (there are ample sources, and shin splints in particular is a known and common condition), but because people will rely on Wikipedia for medical advice, no matter how many disclaimers there are in the article, no matter how frequently it is re-iterated that the contributors are anonymous nobodies who may or may not be lying about the qualifications they claim to have. It doesn't matter if someone gets the wrong information from Wikipedia about nuclear fusion or the lesser spotted dust mite, because the consequences are nil (unless the dust mite is poisonous); the impression I get is that there is an attitude amongst Wikipedia editors whereby if people rely on Wikipedia for their medical information, they deserve to die for being so stupid. I disagree with this attitude. -Ashley Pomeroy (talk) 11:19, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Cushioning & Support[edit]

There is controversy over whether cushioning and support in shoes is effective to prevent injury in the long term. By strengthening the foot and lower leg, and allowing a more natural stride, barefoot running or more minimal shoes can improve a runner's ability to resist injury, by reducing the cause rather than buffering against it and allowing it to grow. I think this section of the article is biased toward established convention to the benefit of running shoe manufacturers (intentionally or incidentally). It is presented as if fact, and should be modified to reflect the varying opinions in the running and medical communities.

Also, the sentence about heel-striking providing the most cushioning goes against most research I have seen into running form. Someone should look into this--the source may not be reliable.

198.82.21.1 (talk) 20:05, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Poor circulation[edit]

After repeated trials (unknowingly) wearing tight shoes will cause painful shin pain - even while walking for a moderate distance. Loosening the shoes will prevent the pain in the shins.

-G —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.48.170.129 (talk) 00:37, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

Contradiction: heel strike[edit]

"Cause" section indicates heel strike contributes to the condition, whereas "Long-term treatment" section recommends heel strike to help prevent the condition.  ??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.136.185.157 (talk) 20:02, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

I noticed that contradiction, too. A pity that WP has no policy for for making use of experts who actually know the subject of an article. David Spector (talk) 00:03, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Overstride link[edit]

The article links to the Running article for overstride, but that article never mentions overstriding. I don't know what overstriding is, so can't correct this mistake. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.185.148.200 (talk) 19:57, 8 July 2010 (UTC)

Landing on balls of your feet[edit]

Cited from article: "Having poor form, such as leaning forward or backward too much, as well as landing on the balls of your feet and running with toes pointing outwards all contribute to the causation of shin splints."

Everything I have read in preparation for race training indicates that landing on the balls of your feet (not toes) IS the proper running form. See: http://running.about.com/od/faqsforbeginners/f/landingfoot.htm

Therefore the article is incorrect and misleading. 71.237.240.207 (talk) 03:40, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

It's gone now. David Spector (talk) 00:05, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Needlessly unexplained technical language[edit]

"Shin splint pain is described as a recurring dull ache along the posteromedial aspect of the distal two-thirds of the tibia" by someone who has had their brain replaced by a medical dictionary. How does the average joe describe it? --75.173.1.59 (talk) 02:42, 8 August 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, most of the people who write articles here are actually trying to direct traffic toward other articles--in this case, the articles on "posteromedial" and "distal" and maybe a few other vocabulary words... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.190.81.197 (talk) 22:56, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

"Shin splint pain is a dull ache felt along the very front of the lower two-thirds of the lower leg" might work well when the description first appears, then the more accurate description could appear later. Providing both types of language (common and anatomical) would make the article easily accessible to all readers, no matter what their reason for reading the article, at the cost of some small redundancy. This comment also applies to many other articles in WP. This suggestion might even be offered as a new policy. David Spector (talk) 00:14, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Contradictory opening[edit]

The opening sections states: "Medial tibial stress syndrome (MTSS) is commonly referred to as shin splints but they are distinctly different."

If this is true, then why does the next paragraph state:

"Medial tibial stress syndrome is the most prevalent form of shin splints..."

I don't know medicine, but I do know English. Either MTSS is distinctly different, or it is a subset of a broader class. It cannot be both simultaneously. Can someone who knows better make the appropriate correction? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.79.3.56 (talk) 02:20, 11 March 2014 (UTC)

I completely agree with this. In addition, this is the first Wikipedia article I have ever read, and I have read tens of thousands, that states in the first sentence that it is not about the topic in the title! What is with that? Unless I hear from some interested party in the next twenty-four hours, I am goint to take the Wikipedia editing guidline "be bold" to heart and fix this by moving the contents of this article to a page named Medial tibial stress syndrome and creating here an article about shin splints. Nick Beeson (talk) 12:11, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
In doing research on the web, to prepare for moving the article as I promised in the above paragraph, I found that the contradiction in the first sentence was entirely wrong. The American College of Orthopaedic Surgeons (and who should know better?), says, on their web site, that "shin splints" and "medial tibial stress syndrome" are the same thing. I corrected for that, with a reference. In addition, since this is an article about "shin splints", I changed all "MTSS" to "shin splints". Nick Beeson (talk) 15:56, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

Treatments - ESWT[edit]

I have removed this sentence "ESWT currently is used to treat various tendonopathies by sending low low levels of energy pain areas." from 'treatments' because it makes no sense whatsoever. Low levels of what? Sent at what? Even the article for ESWT on wikipedia doesn't say what ESWT actually is. If somebody can provide some clarity feel free to put it back in (if that person could see to improving the ESWT article, that would be good too). Tomdeath1990 (talk) 16:39, 18 April 2014 (UTC)