Talk:John F. Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts
|WikiProject United States / District of Columbia||(Rated B-class, High-importance)|
|WikiProject Opera||(Rated Start-class)|
- 1 Photo
- 2 Numerology
- 3 Incomplete sentence in intro material - can someone fix this?
- 4 Changing the Names of Places that shouldn't be Changed
- 5 Peer review
- 6 National Park Service
- 7 Hall of States et al needs its own article???? Then why Wikify?
- 8 Grand Foyer is 63 feet high, not 60 feet high.
- 9 Arbitary removal of "Management" section by 2 editors
Sadly, John F. Kennedy was assasinated on November 22, 1963.
The title of this page should be The John F. Kennedy Memorial Center for the Performing Arts, as is the text on the front of the building. But I can't change it.
I want to add that I measured the hieght of the grand foyer at 63 feet, not 60 as stated both here and by Britannica. Here's how I measured it: The exterior of the structure is faced large square stone tile. I measured three of them, and divided by three. I measured singles, including grout spaces. The average dimension is between 58 and 58.25 inches. If the height was truly 60 feet, these tiles would measure closer to 55 inches. I plan to take a more accurate measure and report it here.
The distance between cloumns is 360 inches.
There are 23 exterior columns along the longer side of the building, there are 12 columns along the shorter side. Therefore, there are 22 spaces and 11 spaces between these columns, repectively; and measures of the total length and width of the building along lines coincident with these columns, are 660 feet by 330 feet, respectively.--Charlesrkiss 21:47, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
- Re thge unsigned comments above. The name, as described in many places and many times by the Center itself on its web site, does NOT INCLUDE the word "Memorial". In its history section, it does say that "From its very beginnings, the Kennedy Center has represented a unique public/private partnership. As the nation's living memorial to President Kennedy, the Center receives federal funding each year to pay for maintenance and operation of the building, a federal facility."
- It would appear to me that the present name of the article is correct, and I have reverted the inclusion of the world "Memorial" in the text. Viva-Verdi 19:29, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
Maybe you bozos should go there once and find out for yourself!--Charlesrkiss 21:47, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, but where do you live, who are YOU, Viva-Verdi, how many times have you visited the KC? Why don't you just call it the Kennedy Center, then? Nobody calls it, or speaks of it as, The Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts, anyway! They just say, "the Kennedy Center," or "the KC". Although it is/isn't written that way! Although it is explicitly named, in text, in front, as if chiseled in stone, or cast in bronze, by the ARCHITECT, by the ORIGINAL designers, decision makers, tile setters, bronze casters, builders: "The John F. Kennedy Memorial Center for the Performing Arts". You figure that out, o.k.? What I'm saying is, "my comment is the point" and if you read and understand the inscriptions on the exterior of the KC, if you've ever seen them, otherwise known as the KFC (Kennedy Frickin' Center), you'll understand the importance in the meaning of the word memorial as you would understand the importance of the word living, or the words long after and the sentiment to which the Kennedy Memorial regards the importance of the living arts! --Charlesrkiss 04:28, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
- Oh dear, you are a little over the top here... FYI: I lived in Rockville Maryland for 20 years, had a subscription to the Washington Opera and regularly attended concerts at the KC. Viva-Verdi 16:19, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
- Yeah, maybe that's true. But we're not dead, so what do we know.--Charlesrkiss 18:31, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
Incomplete sentence in intro material - can someone fix this?
Hi -- I changed a bogus period to a comma to make my attached comment "stick", then found this "talk" mechanism. A small error, but why mess up a nice page with a missing sentence fragment? "...it is BOTH a public memorial to Kennedy" or some such, but no "AND, a major venue for the arts" or some such. Busy life here, but hate to see this -- someone kindly fix??
184.108.40.206 06:38, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
- Fixed it. Viva-Verdi 13:53, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
Changing the Names of Places that shouldn't be Changed
I don't think it's appropriate for anonomously or secretly authored "encyclopedia's" to be changing, subtracting words, from the names of historic buildings, and preventing others from naming them as they have been titled on their fronts when they were built. Part of the mystique of the "Kennedy Center" (which is a colloquialism), is that's it's a memorial, unlike any other.
- No one subtracted anything. The article was named by someone (not I) based on what the institution calls intself on its web site and elsewhere. I told you that I didn't think anyone would object - certainly, not I - if you added the full name of the building as part of the article. Since you didn't, I'll go ahead and add it in. Viva-Verdi 15:09, 7 April 2007 (UTC)
I'm sorry I wrote like a big jerk, I was being a pompous-ass having fun at your expense, I hope you understand it's me and the internet and not you; I'm sure you're a very nice person. People always delete my stuff, and I just got personal and stupid about it. I regret it; but I'd feel dishonest if I just went back and just edited my post, and suddenly pretended I was a nice guy, and not a jerk.--Charlesrkiss 21:30, 11 April 2007 (UTC)
- I don't think changing the name of the article is necessary. The website and official communications (see page 50 of this GAO report, which includes a letter from Mr. Kaiser, President) use a name consistent with how this article is named. (despite the signage on the building and in your photo -- hope you don't mind, I've sized it here) Not sure why the inconsistency. --Aude (talk) 21:43, 11 April 2007 (UTC)
I'm sorry, but I totally disagree; "Not sure why the inconsistency"? Why should you have to be sure about it? The name of the site is very clear by the face of the building itself, which predates their stupid "website;" and who are the members of "GAO" to be an authority on the naming of this site, I'm sure they have their own shortcuts and corner cutting. Part of the very importance of the building is it's proper name; and I have brought to you here concrete proof!! It's a superset of what is contained elsewhere.
- The page of the GAO report I refer to is an official letter (it's page 53, not 50 as mentioned) from the President of the Kennedy Center to the GAO, which provides oversight for the Kennedy Center. Their official letterhead says "John F. Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts" and Mr. Kaiser refers to the Center that way. --Aude (talk) 03:46, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
- The GAO conveniently refers to the place as "The Kennedy Center;" just look at the title page. The GAO is not the authority on the naming of historic buildings. Instead, historic buildings are their own authority on their names; especially when huge titles have been deliberately bolted into the front of the building at the time of construction so as to be made visible from many angles and from very far away. See photo above. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Charlesrkiss (talk • contribs) 21:33, 12 April 2007 (UTC).
The governing legislation for the Kennedy Center (20 USC 76h) refers to the "John F. Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts". The building does say "Memorial", but the official documentation omits that word. Roserita 18:58, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
- This is the whole point. The article was renamed against my easrlier objections, given what it calls itself and, now, a reference to this legislation.
- No harm in noting in the opening para. that the name on the outside is "Memorial", but it should NOT be the name of the article. Viva-Verdi 03:38, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
- And, I omitted to say, it NEEDS TO BE CHANGED BACK to "JFK Center for the Perf Arts"
I've made numerous edits in the past couple days, as well as a number of edits in January. It would be nice to see this article become a featured article. I'm making use of material in the "Records of the Columbia Historical Society", as well as Becker's book which I found at a used book shop, and other materials. Sometime when the weather isn't gloomy, I'll go over there with my camera and get more pictures for the article. The article isn't quite ready for peer review, but maybe by next week. I know the "Events" needs more work, and "Venues" and "Management" need more references. Please feel free to help, fill in gaps, copyedit, make suggestions, etc. My "expertise" is more with architecture and local history aspects of the article, and not as much detailed knowledge of opera and theater. --Aude (talk) 22:03, 11 April 2007 (UTC)
- I'll come back to working on the article later, and get it ready for peer review. --Aude (talk) 21:35, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
National Park Service
I've removed the reference to current Park Service involvement with KC maintencnce, as they contract between the Kennedy Center and NPS was dissolved in 1997.
This history portions of this article are amazing. Roserita 21:19, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
- Sounds like you are correct (I believe you), but the article should say something about the contract being dissolved. We need to cite sources when adding to the article, so if you know of some article or reference we can use, that would be helpful. Otherwise, I might be able to find something. --Aude (talk) 21:35, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
Hall of States et al needs its own article???? Then why Wikify?
They're called "corridors" in the article and are bland 1960s architecture of the worst type, tarted up a bit by the present head of the Center, but still, just hallways.
Do they need their own articles? I think not. Viva-Verdi 00:30, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Grand Foyer is 63 feet high, not 60 feet high.
I used a Stanley (registered Trademark) brand, "Tru-Laser," "TLM-100", distance measuring laser device to measure the height of the grand foyer. The product is marketed claiming to be accurate within 0.25 inches per 100 feet: "[plus or minus] 1/4 inch up to 100 feet". I measured the ceiling height of the structure at the front steps to the entrance to the Concert Hall, at the front steps to the entrance to the Opera House, in the Hall of States, and also outside the building between columns (canopy height). All locations measured 63 feet 02 inches, plus or minus two inches. Here is how I carried out the measurements.
My assistant and I checked the calibration of the device using a 100 foot measuring tape. From the front (north-east side) of the building, we extended the tape 63 feet eastward across the plaza floor. By coincidence, there had been constructed there a bench-height retaining wall, enclosing plants and landscaping, parallel to the structure under examination.
I placed the laser atop the retaining wall and pointed toward the building and carried out eight separate measurements (turning on and off the laser as per it's instruction manual); each time measuring the distance from the front of the retaining wall to the front of the building, but at different locations parallel to the structure. All eight measurements where the same within one inch error: 63 feet, 02 inches.
I then walked to the northeast corner of the structure and measured the elevation of the bottom surface of the exterior canopy (the cantilever); I measured it eight separate times. I pin-pointed a location on the ground surface between two columns and did my best to point the laser straight up, plumb, to the bottom surface of the canopy above. Each time, the laser read the same: 63 feet, 02 inches (plus or minus one inch error, since I did not care, as before, to note fractions of the inch).
I then went inside the structure and made three quick ceiling height measurements. In the Hall of States, at the front of the steps to the entrance of the Opera House, and at the front of the steps to the Concert Hall; each measured: 63 feet, 02 inches, 63 feet 02 inches, and 63 feet 04, respectively.
I don't doubt there could be greater error in my tool, since a bit of earlier sloppier work with the machine gave, at one measure, an obviously false reading. But out of approximately twenty measurements, not one was less than 63 feet.
Finally, climbing the several steps to the entrance of the Concert Hall, I managed to get a reading of 60 feet 01 inch. But this is hardly what could be considered the Grand Foyer.
It is now very clear to me that the height of the Grand Foyer, both inside and out, of the John F. Kennedy Memorial Center for the Performing Arts, is no less than 63 feet.--Charlesrkiss 06:12, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
Arbitary removal of "Management" section by 2 editors
With no discussion as to its merits, one unregistered editor removed the section. After replacement, it was again removed by a registered editor,Corvus cornix, who complained that it was unsourced.
I have added a link to the full Michael Kaiser article which is full of links to articles, interviews, etc. which justify including Kaiser's management of the KC in the KC article. Viva-Verdi (talk) 03:12, 24 February 2008 (UTC)