Talk:Len Bias

Jay Bias was nominated for deletion. The discussion was closed on 28 June 2015 with a consensus to merge. Its contents were merged into Len Bias. The original page is now a redirect to this page. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected article, please see its history; for its talk page, see here.

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Basketball

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A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on June 19, 2020.

Explain the context

Whoever put in the last sentence of the first paragraph about a District Court and Court of Appeals ruling that Bias was a drug user needs to explain the context. By way of illustration, was this as a result of a coroners inquest; or was this the finding of a judge or jury in some civil suit related to this matter; or was someone charged with a crime related to Lenny's death and this was the ruling of a criminal court. Please explain why a court took up the matter.--205.188.116.69 18:41, 8 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

---context--- when it comes to the context, the case where it was cited he was a drug user was Bias v. Advantage International, Inc. which was the company that he hired to represent him and his career (agents). They were supposed to get a life insurance policy before the draft for him at his and his families request, then Advantage represented they did, although they did not and the Bias family sued on Len's estate's behalf, but lost in a summary judgment by the District Court and affirmed by the Court of appeals, because they proved that he had been a known drug user, and no insurance company would have insured him regardless. i just read the case in law school civil procedure class. i hope you get this, and it sheds some light. ---summary--- Len Bias, a basketball player, consumed cocaine and died of a heart attack. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.4.206.4 (talk) 22:19, 10 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Supreme Court

Deleted misleading mention of supreme court. The Supreme Court did not say it agreed with the lower courts, it denied the appeal without comment, as it does in nearly all cases. This is because the legal issues are not interesting enough for the Supreme Court, not because they take any view on the merits of the case. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.95.26.125 (talk) 02:33, 19 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Trial/ "ruled a drug user"

I don't know specific citations, but the drug dealer, Brian Tribble, was acquited, in a large part due to Len Bias's teammates testifying that he had used the drug previously on numerous occasions. basically the court found that he was not a "first time user" as was played up ( partly as drug war propaganda). His coach and family don't believe he had ever used cocaine because he was polite and church-going...

Neutrality?

"...defending champion Boston Celtics aka the greatest basketball franchise of all time..." This statement, along with a couple of other opinionated statements, should be removed or altered. 216.180.75.58 14:28, 19 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Jay Bias

"On December 11, 1990, Bias's younger brother Jay, a promising high school basketball player, was shot to death in a dispute in the parking lot of Prince George's Plaza," actually Jay was a 20 year old mail room clerk at the time of his death.

WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 08:16, 10 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

really poor understanding of cocaine psychokinetics

"Bias took a lethal dose of cocaine through inhalation (snorting), which, because of its location and method of ingestion (the nasal cavity), the dose went immediately to the autonomic nerve center of the brain. There, it shut down the nerve signals that tell the diaphragm to expand/contract (allowing a person to breathe).[citation needed] In other words, as the dosage in his blood stream rose (through inhalation), he promptly stopped breathing. In addition, other secondary effects of the overdosage were convulsive vomiting and an irregular heartbeat."

this is trash. first of all, "autonomic nerve center of the brain" doesn't mean anything. the autonomic nervous system is peripheral, as opposed to the central nervous system. secondly, cocaine is not a respiratory depressant (nor any other kind of depressant). it is a tropane alkaloid stimulant. He likely died of either a massive cardiac arrest, arrhythmia, or stroke. I don't know the details of this particular case, but I know that the above is incorrect based on basic facts about cocaine and human anatomy. and to boot, it's poorly written.

Scapermoya 09:18, 15 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Quote really worth mentioning?

" Mike Krzyzewski stated that Michael Jordan and Bias were two of the best players ever to come through the ranks of the ACC"

"Two of the best..." Way to go out on a limb, there Krzyzewski. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.225.179.246 (talk) 23:57, 25 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Exaggeration

"a potential backup for both the aging Bird and Kevin McHale who were getting on and were near the end of their careers."

This statement makes no sense. Both Bird and McHale were only at the halfway points in their careers. Bird would play for 6 more seasons and McHale for 7 more. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.253.186.24 (talk) 13:22, 25 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The Possibility?

I went ahead and just removed that section. Besides being completely speculous, it's nowhere near accurate. Bird and McHale were 29 and 28, respectively, when Bias died, so they were definitely not near the "end of their careers". Bird would have two HOF quality seasons before his first major injury, and McHale would have four more high quality seasons before his production dropped off. MagicSpork (talk) 16:42, 25 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Pro Career

His pro career is listed as 1986-present. This should be edited.

ElectricSeed (talk) 05:43, 19 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Famous last words

It is well documented that Bias' last words were "I'm a bad m'rf'er! I can handle anything!" right before taking the drugs that killed him.

This has become a part of popular culture as an example of arrogance, irony and foolishly taking "fun" too far. It should be included, possibly in a legacy or culture section.

I've tried to add it but it gets deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.247.64.182 (talk) 04:30, 26 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No heart condition?

What's funny is I remember a lot of discussion for years after about Bias having an underlying heart condition. The article says nothing about that. Has that been disproven? I can understand why people took that and ran with it to make it less scary that this healthy young man could die of a cocaine overdose, which I understand is fairly rare.

According to the Washington Post[1], Bias showed no sign of a heart ailment in yearly team physicals, including a special study to look for hidden heart disease.It was rumored that he had the genetic disorder Marfan's syndrome, however this was not true. There was an article in Time Magazine that discussed how cocaine caused the heart attack.[2]--Yankees76 ^Talk 18:20, 21 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Proposed merge with Jay Bias

Jay Bias is not independently notable, all the sources reflect that he was Len's brother. Most of the content there is already here anyway.--CutOffTies (talk) 07:19, 17 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Merge The only reason he made the news was for having died; there wasn't anything about his death that would have made it notable aside from his being Len Bias's brother. —Largo Plazo (talk) 11:11, 17 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

oppose This conversation is going on at the AFD of Jay Bias. Rationale is listed there. NegroLeagueHistorian (talk) 11:52, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Merge - Jay Bias's college career and death are only notable because of his brother. If Len Bias wasn't found notable than his brother would never be mentioned to any extent. It only makes sense to merge because any notability Jay Bias actually has is dependent on his brother's.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 15:28, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Move this to the AFD The same conversation going on in multiple places. TheGracefulSlick, you voted delete in the AFD but merge here. Which one is it? NegroLeagueHistorian (talk) 17:51, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

This conversation came first. —Largo Plazo (talk) 17:54, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

At Afd, you voted "Keep or Merge to Len Bias". Here you opposed the merger. Which one is it? —Largo Plazo (talk) 17:56, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose Merge, Keep Article. NegroLeagueHistorian (talk) 18:18, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I know that's what you're saying here. I said it's not what you said in the AFD discussion, and I think I'm justified in pointing this out to you after you challenged TheGracefulSlick on his inconsistency. —Largo Plazo (talk) 19:37, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

NegroLeagueHistorian if you read the whole AFD you would realize I commented saying I would recommend you accept a merger. Clearly, Jay Bias, to me, and everyone else involved, doesn't have enough notability to have a stand-alone article, but perhaps a small mention in Len Bias's article.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 19:05, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I will let it play out. I am happy with whatever happens. NegroLeagueHistorian (talk) 21:59, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

NegroLeagueHistorian if you are happy with any outcome than why waste everyone's time when consensus is clearly toward a merger? Consensus is not just going to dramatically change in the short span that AFD should still last.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 22:17, 23 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Unsure of your logic, or your desire to continue conversation with me but continue on with your journey. NegroLeagueHistorian (talk) 08:08, 24 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

You don't understand the logic behind asking you which of two inconsistent positions you've taken is your actual position, right after you've done exactly the same thing to someone else? Whatever. —Largo Plazo (talk) 09:57, 24 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Largoplazo I was speaking to TheGraceSlick. Not to you. NegroLeagueHistorian (talk) 04:56, 25 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Merge completed

Text and/or other creative content from Jay Bias was copied or moved into Len Bias with this edit. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists.

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Len Bias/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

According to the article, Dean Smith has been quoted as naming Len Bias one of the two best NBA players from the ACC (with Michael Jordan). The article does offer that opinion from other basketball insiders, including North Carolina players, but does not actually refer to Dean Smith. The Smith reference should be removed. Hollisbrown 04:23, 7 July 2007 (UTC)Brian Anderson (hollisbrown)[reply]

Last edited at 04:23, 7 July 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 21:51, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

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Keith Gatlin

For those editors who are more experienced than I am: I noticed that although there's no English WP page for Keith Gatlin, there is one in the German WP: <https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Gatlin>.

By convention, does one link to an article in another language? Link to a translation? e.g. <https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Gatlin> Gprobins (talk) 01:10, 12 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

We do not link to other language Wikipedia using Google translate. The best way to link there is this way – [[de:Keith Gatlin|Keith Gatlin]], which will show up as Keith Gatlin in the English Wikipedia. – Sabbatino (talk) 16:44, 13 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Book on Bias?

Anybody want to make reference to the 2019 book by Walt Williams and Tony Massenburg? "Lessons from Lenny The Journey Beyond a Shooting Star?" Gprobins (talk) 14:58, 9 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

"The law provided a mandatory minimum prison term of 20 years and a maximum life sentence, along with a fine of up to $2 million,...." What is the offense? Is it possession, use, or distribution?Kdammers (talk) 05:28, 1 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]