Talk:Lot Smith

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Neutrality of Utah War section[edit]

Much of the second paragraph is plainly not neutral and should be rephrased with citation support for claims such as the relative troop strength and (lack of) wounds inflicted. The disputed language was added in http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Lot_Smith&diff=201670271&oldid=190463002 Vttale (talk) 15:45, 31 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I rescinded my own neutrality challenge because the offending text had been removed in a later edit. Vttale (talk) 16:54, 25 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Significance of Utah War[edit]

I disagree that his actions against the military were insignificant. The 2500 US troops were forced to spend the winter in Wyoming. Epachamo 23:53, 24 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Original Research[edit]

Is it just me, or is the section at the bottom talking about Hoke Denetsosie under the References heading original research? Seems like they discourage that around here. I think what they want is for you to put that in a real book, and then cite the book. 67.161.220.103 (talk) 05:36, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The following removed for sourcing and discussion. WBardwin (talk) 06:11, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I talked with an 89 year old Navajo man, Hoke Denetsosie, from Tuba City and he told me some stories about Red Beard, a Mormon man named Lot Smith around Tuba City, Arizona. rs by Hoke Denetsosie

Great-Grandma’s first husband killed Red Beard and soon after that his in-law wanted to take the blame for the murder of Lot Smith. When Washingdon found out about it, they instead purchased the land south of the Colorado River and turn it into a reservation for the Navajos and as a result, the Mormons were forced to leave the land. Most of the Mormons ended up moving to places like St. John, Farmington, Kanab, Snow Flakes, and other places in 1904. The trading post owners were the only ones left behind. One of them was an old white man with white or blond eyelashes and they called him Na’dizi. He managed the trading post near the place where Van’s Trading Post is at now. Other trading posts left behind were Tuba City Trading Post and Red Lake Trading Post. Wagon trails were seen every where and corn fields were plentiful as well, especially down in Kurley area

Question: Where is this discussion about Hoke Denetsosie come from? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.162.195.192 (talk) 03:39, 28 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Under the United States Military official reports and Arizona court proceedings of the time, very little credence is given to the accounts of Hoke Denetsosie and several other individuals who claim to have killed Lot Smith. Only one individual is named as the main perpetrator and is held accountable for shooting Lot Smith. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.113.68.26 (talk) 15:52, 29 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Lot's Death[edit]

This anecdote comes from Georgia Buss (8/20/06, private email): "Now the other shock of the day. It happened as Dave and I were walking to the cabana at the pool. My name tag said Lot Smith as well as the cabana had a sign. A clean-cut Navajo young man with his little baby and Caucasian wife stepped up and asked if we were with the Lot Smith family and I said, " Yes, he was my grandfather." The man whose name was Corey Smallcanyon said, " Well my great grandfather shot Lot Smith." What an opener. We talked a while. He lives in Provo and is in graduate school. The incident of Lot Smith has sent him to all the history papers. There was nothing written he has not read. Dave told him, "You are lucky you didn't run into the less liberal of our family members--they would have drown you." We let Corey tell his story. He told of the agreement that was given by Mr. Furgeson in the beginning of the development of that land. The water holes and springs were to be open to the Navajos. When Mr. Furgeson sold to Lot that information was not passed on and regrettably that June afternoon there was shooting of animals on both sides. When Lot fired in the direction of Smallcanyon's family is when Smallcanyon shot Lot. Smallcanyon's grandfather was not a local, he was visiting a brother. He took his family into hiding in a canyon for two weeks then turned himself in. The other Indians called him " Killer of White Man" and "Killer of Red Mustache." Smallcanyon was in jail waiting trial for two months. At the trial it was confirmed Smith shot first. Self defense. Smallcanyon served no prison time. Georgia"--(Mark Crane, a great-great grandson)

another source about Lot Smith[edit]

Jeannette Walls, in her 2009 book Half Broke Horses, cites another source, not mentioned here, that she used, Major Lot Smith, Mormon Raider by Ivan Barrett. Her grandfather, Jim Smith, was one of the 52 children of Lot Smith. --AJim (talk) 15:31, 21 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Final rank[edit]

There seams to be some disagree of the final rank of Lot Smith before he retired. From the sources I have found, he was a general in the Utah territorial Milita [1][2]. I have also seen a source for him being a colonel, [3] then a source saying he was a major[4][5] and then captain. It is reasonable to believe that he was just promoted captain-major-colonel-general, he was a good and effective calvary commander. LuxembourgLover (talk) 16:07, 27 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Also I did an edit to reorganize the article, but I wanted others option before I completed the edit and change the article organization. LuxembourgLover (talk) 01:28, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding the final rank: please keep in mind that people often got promoted just before retiring. So he might have been a retired general, his actual rank would have been a step lower (colonel). The Banner talk 02:11, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Orgnzation[edit]

I did a test edit to fix or change orgnazaiton. I wanted to know others opinion, does it make the article look better? LuxembourgLover (talk) 00:57, 26 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]