Talk:Welfare in New Zealand

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This article is written in British English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, travelled, centre, defence, artefact, analyse) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

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Welfare in New Zealand was the New Zealand collaboration from 24 November, to 6 December 2006. For details on how the article improved, see the NZC history

Image

You need some images (especially graphs). I have asked Tony Milne to release a graph he did into the public domain at http://tonymilne.blogs.com/i_see_red/2007/01/minimum_wage_ye.html . Can someone upload it if he does release it? Cheers,

Yes - some other suggestions are minimum wage protests, a WINZ building, a state house. If anyone feels an article needs a picture just use the request template as I have above.

Social Policy divided into Social Welfare, Fiscal Welfare, and Occupational Welfare

I have introduced this idea to this page in the second sentence. The implications are larger than I expected. Clearly Social Welfare article written from American perspective does not make this distinction. Much of the material in this article would be separated into those domains.

The catagories from social policy perspective are important because according to Titmuss they draw attention to the way the service is distributed. Social policy is concerned with the distribution of resources and life opportunities. Withit 09:33, 23 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Proposal to move working for families to fiscal welfare

This "financial benefit" is administered through IRD. Citizens do not receive this benefit unless they are earning, and therefore paying tax. It is in relation to employment and family situation that this benefit is paid. This is clearly a samll distinction, I realsie, but I think it is important. There is a trend to link a benefit more directly to an economic benefit to society. Social welfare is not paid with this expectation. I will delete after three days. The wiki member who added the catagory is not wanting to participate in editing any longer. Withit 00:29, 26 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I'm confused about what you are proposing.

Do you mean you want to move the article Working for Families? I strongly oppose this. The article title is the name of the package, whereas fiscal welfare is a generic term not unique to New Zealand and not well known in this country. This is the wrong place to propose renaming it anyway.

If you mean you want to rename the section Social welfare in New Zealand#Working for Families, then I have no opinion. Since it's an empty heading at the moment, I suggest you be bold and just go ahead.

If you were thinking of adding a section to the fiscal welfare article about New Zealand's Working for Families package, I'm slightly opposed. Adding any substantial content about a single country will unbalance that article; you'd need to add paragraphs about the fiscal welfare policies of several countries at least.-gadfium 01:47, 26 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the feedback. I propose to adding a section to fiscal welfare called working for families, and other sections that wefare policy relates to. I take your point that this would unbalanced from a single countries perspective. Such information would be very difficult to research. Perhaps another user will contribute if this is incomplete. Withit 08:02, 26 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Seeing that the category was still there I have added a brief summary of the package. I think this is appropriate as it appears this article will also include a brief summary of any major package or changes to social welfare in New Zealand (the 1991 benefit cuts are already included).wikicharlie23 08:33, 25 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Proposal to change name of Superannuation section to Pensions

Should we change the name of this section from Superannuation to pensions?

I have been told by Nurg that this section is for pensions rather than just for New Zealand Superannuation. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Nurg#Social_welfare_in_New_Zealand

I think that the name Pension will be better understood by people outside of New Zealand. It will also avoid confusion where people might think that this section is only about New Zealand Superannuation and not other pensions - as I originally did.

Potential COI - I work for the Ministry of Social Development Dooglefeedback (talk) 00:18, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Proposal to correct incorrect qualification for New Zealand Superannuation

This sentence is not correct:

Currently superannuation is paid to all aged 65 and over – provided they have lived in New Zealand for at least 5 years after age 50 – and is taxable.

Work and Income wording

The plain English version of the qualifications are (taken from the Work and Income website)

You may be able to get New Zealand Superannuation if you:

are aged 65 or over
are a New Zealand citizen or permanent resident
normally live in New Zealand at the time you apply.

You must also have lived in New Zealand for at least 10 years since you turned 20. Five of those years must be since you turned 50.

Time spent overseas in certain countries and for certain reasons may be counted for New Zealand Superannuation.

Proposal for new text

I like the Work and Income version but we could just say - To get New Zealand Superannuation a person must be aged 65 and over and meet residency requirements.

We can't say that they will get NZ Super because some people on ACC and people who opt get to Veteran's Pension instead won't get it.

Possible citations

While Work and Income provides a plain English version of the qualifications and I think should be cited, http://www.workandincome.govt.nz/individuals/65-years-or-older/superannuation/superanuation-overview.html, the legislation should also be cited. The legislation is on the Work and Income site, http://www.workandincome.govt.nz/manuals-and-procedures/legislation/index.htm, but a more neutral source would be from the Government Legislation site.

http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/2001/0084/latest/DLM113924.html

7 Age qualification for New Zealand superannuation
8 Residential qualification for New Zealand superannuation
9 Periods of absence that are not counted
10 Periods of absence as missionary also not counted
11 Commencement of New Zealand superannuation
12 Standard rates of New Zealand superannuation

Possible COI

I work for the Ministry of Social Development. Let me know how I can help. Dooglefeedback (talk) 01:01, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Proposal to add content about Vetetran's Pension and War Diablement Pension

I'd like to add something about these pensions to the Superannuation (pensions) section.

War Disablement Pension: http://www.workandincome.govt.nz/individuals/65-years-or-older/war-veteran/war-disablement-pension.html

Veteran's Pension: http://www.workandincome.govt.nz/individuals/65-years-or-older/war-veteran/veterans-pension.html

If people are ok with this I'll come up with some wording and cite the legislation behind them and add it to this proposal.

Potential COI: I work for the Ministry of Social Development. Dooglefeedback (talk) 01:22, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I'm very happy with all your proposals - to rename the superannuation section, change wording and add refs, and to add the veteran's pensions to it. I don't see your potential COI as a problem, but thank you for declaring it up front.-gadfium 02:08, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I've renamed the section and added some content about war pensions Dooglefeedback (talk) 22:55, 15 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Possible further reading

These may be useful to editors of this page. I don't endorse them - I haven't read them.

Histories of Social Welfare in New Zealand

‘Social Welfare’, chapter 7 in Department of Statistics (1990) New Zealand official 1990 yearbook, 94th edition, Wellington : Department of Statistics, pp. 203-219

Kunowski, Myra (1988) The first hundred years : social welfare in New Zealand from 1891, Auckland, N.Z. : Heinemann Education

Dalley, Bronwyn (1998) Family matters : child welfare in twentieth century New Zealand, Auckland, N.Z. : Auckland University Press in association with the Historical Branch, Department of Internal Affairs. Traces the changes in government child welfare services from 1902 until 1992 when the New Zealand Children and Young Persons Service began

McClure, Margaret A (1998) A civilised community : a history of social security in New Zealand 1898-1998, Auckland, N.Z. : Auckland University Press. Traces the history of social security policy in New Zealand from the introduction of the old-age pension in 1898 through to the passing of the Social Security Act 1938 and up to the benefit cuts and the superannuation referendum of the1990s.

Rewarding service : a history of the Government Superannuation Fund / Atkinson, Neill (2002) Dunedin: University of Otago Press, 2002 Abstract: This book traces the history of public service superannuation. It began in colonial times when it was seen as a way of rewarding government employees for their service, of guarding against corruption as well as enabling the state to retire elderly staff without undue hardship. The modern Government Superannuation Fund dates from 1948, when three separate state schemes where brought together. The book also discusses the changing political climate of the 1980s and 1990s and subsequent policy and institutional reform. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.27.54.3 (talk) 01:52, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Possible COI: I work for the Ministry of Social Development Dooglefeedback (talk) 01:48, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Welfare in New Zealand/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

An important topic, referenced fairly well though still a little stubby - good enough for a B though, quality is most important.

Substituted at 04:50, 24 July 2016 (UTC)