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The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Fair use rationale for Image:Electricalstormscreen.png

Thanks for uploading or contributing to Image:Electricalstormscreen.png. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use. Suggestions on how to do so can be found here.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If you have uploaded other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on those pages too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Rettetast 21:21, 27 June 2007 (UTC)


Possibly unfree Image:Aofwtemplate3.jpg

An image that you uploaded or altered, Image:Aofwtemplate3.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree images because its copyright status is disputed. If the image's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the image description page. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree images if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. Nv8200p talk 18:45, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Please Help ME!!!!!!!

Hey, can you help me at the U2's 12th Album? I really would like your help. Thanks!!!!!!!!CRBR 20:17, 8 July 2007 (UTC)


Work on The Animals of Farthing Wood

I have to thank you for all of the work you have put into the Character pages. Several months ago I began work on them, but have been too busy ever since to do much with them except for reverting the occassional vandalism. The pages are beginning to look really good, especially with the new screenshots! MelicansMatkin 17:13, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Timata1705 17:19, 13 July 2007 (UTC)Your very welcome, its given me a great opportunity to re-watch the entire three series' again. I've just reached the end of the A Joke Backfires in the second season and paused for a break, but I should be resuming them soon. May also have to get my magazines out :D
As I said, they look fantastic. I only have a slight issue with them though, and that is that they seem to be based solely on the Television series. Since the books take precedence, I think that the main part of the articles should be taken from the books with additonal details from the television series following (so if I add information before the text that you've written, please don't be offended! ;) By the way, just a quick fact that I found interesting but did you know that The Shrews were never in the books, but were created solely for the TV series? MelicansMatkin 17:27, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
Of course. I have most of the books too, so I can always reread them and check anything you add :) I expect there is quite a difference, with a lot of the characters changing genders and so on. I honestly can't remember the books that much, particularly how their characterisation differed, if at all, from the TV Series. I think I'll reread them anyway, out of interest. I didn't know the Shrews weren't in the books until I read it in the article, makes me wonder why they were created, since they ended up playing such a minor role. Timata1705 18:12, 13 July 2007 (UTC)


Are You On Dissendium

Did you sign up for Dissendium? CRBR 20:15, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Its a Harry Potter fan website for fans, I'm on their because if you could believe it, I'm a fan.


Songwriting In Morocco PT 3...

I've got two questions:

  • Do you got the actual link to the article on u2.com
  • Is it relevent to the album?

Let me know. Thanks.CRBR 16:06, 31 July 2007 (UTC)


WikiProject U2 July 2007 Newsletter

The U2 WikiProject Newsletter
Issue II - 31st July 2007
If you would like to help out with future newsletters, please contact the Outreach Department.
“I want to run, I want to hide.
I want to tear down the walls,
that hold me inside.”
U2 News
Project News
Member News
From the Editors

Welcome to the July edition of the U2 WikiProject Newsletter. We hope you enjoy reading it!

New Members

Our team is growing! We now have 34 members! The new members since 25th June are: SteinAlive, Sittingonfence, Jutras Antonio_ssv, Folksong, Epf, malcolmedge, Dmolavi, Morphyoss, Amccaf1, kb9wte, jmccrohan, Joelster, Escobillo and Chupper. Remember, if you or someone you know is interested in joining the project, you can sign up at the Project Page.


Contributors to this issue

smithcool and joelster

by smithcool and joelster.


You are receiving this newsletter because you have signed up for WikiProject U2. If you wish to stop receiving this newsletter, please contact Smithcool. This newsletter was delivered by the automated R Delivery Bot 01:34, 1 August 2007 (UTC) .


Wikiproject U2

Hello, I just wanted to let you know about a new department of the U2 Wikiproject. It is called the Collaboration of the Fortnight department, and we would like your help! This week's collaboration is U2. You can find out more here. If you want to receive a notice whenever a new collaboration begins, contact me here. Thanks! Sincerely, Neranei

Orphaned non-free image (Image:U2thefly.png)

Thanks for uploading Image:U2thefly.png. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. BetacommandBot 06:31, 11 August 2007 (UTC)


WikiProject U2 August 2007 Newsletter

The U2 WikiProject Newsletter

Issue III - 12th August 2007
If you would like to help out with future newsletters, please contact the Outreach Department.

“Can you, hear, me, when I, sing
You're the reason I sing
You're the reason why the opera's in me”
U2 News
Project News

The Collaboration of the Fortnight Department has just been set up and is run by smithcool and neranei. If you have any questions or suggestions, or if you would like to nominate an article, go to the Collaboration of the Fortnight Talk Page.

Member News
  • A Portal still needs to be set up. People are also needed to help out in the Outreach Department.
  • If you or someone you know is interested in joining the project, you can sign up on the Project Page.
  • Join in the Collaboration! For the fortnight of August 3-17 the goal is to promote the U2 article to FA status. Remember, we need as much help as possible so don't hesitate!
  • If you have any ideas, tasks or concerns to put forward, or if you just have something to say, visit the Talk Page.
From the Editors

Welcome to the August edition of the U2 WikiProject Newsletter. As you may have noticed, we are now doing themed newsletters. This one (if you haven't already guessed) is How To Dismantle An Atomic Bomb. Every month the newsletter will have a different theme. There will also be a special edition when the new album is released. Also thanks to Neranei for some of the U2 news.

New Members

We have two new members since the start of the month! They are Vero444 and MC. We now have 38 members!

The Album

More info from the album page here.

Corrections

Last month's newsletter incorrectly stated that there were 34 members. This should've been 36. Also, under the "U2 News" section, line 3, instead of saying most recent single it should've said most recent song (this has since been corrected). The editors sincerely apologize for any misunderstandings this may have caused. The correct version of the July newsletter can be found here.

IMPORTANT NOTICE

All members of the U2 Wikiproject please note that voting for the next collaboration of the fortnight starts on THE 12TH OF AUGUST. Please visit the collaboration department for more details.

Written by Smithcool and Joelster with contributions from Neranei.


You are receiving this newsletter because you have signed up for WikiProject U2. If you wish to stop receiving this newsletter, please contact Smithcool. This newsletter was delivered by the automated R Delivery Bot 14:59, 12 August 2007 (UTC) .


What?!

What do you mean REMOVE??? CRBR 18:02, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

As part of the names of band members you had Adam Clayton and Larry Mullen Jr. I assumed that you had just copied the U2 infobox and edited it for your own band, but forgot to remove those two names. I apologize if that was not the case. MelicansMatkin 13:56, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Oh, I just didn't get it! Thanks! CRBR 18:29, 20 August 2007 (UTC)


WikiProject U2 September 2007

The U2 WikiProject Newsletter

Issue IV - 1st September 2007
If you would like to help out with future newsletters, please contact the Outreach Department.
“I am not afraid
Of anything in this world
There's nothing you can throw at me
That I haven't already heard”
U2 News
Project News

Don't forget that the Collaboration of the Fortnight Department is up-and-running. The collaboration this fortnight is The Edge. If you would like to nominate an article, go to the Collaboration of the Fortnight Talk Page. If you have any questions contact Smithcool or Neranei.

Member News

Also Neranei has recently started the U2 Portal. Don't forget to visit it when you can.

Did You Know?

On front cover of All That You Can't Leave Behind is a very subtle Biblical reference. In the background J 33-3 can be seen. This is a reference to verse 33 of chapter 3 of the book of Jeremiah: "Call to me and I will answer you and tell you great and hidden things which you have not known."

From the Editors

Welcome to the September Edition of the U2 WikiProject Newsletter. The theme for this newletter is "All That You Can't Leave Behind". We hope you enjoy reading it!

New Members

Our new members this month are Keeper76 and Jort227. We have now reached 40 members.

The Album

Take a look at the All That You Can't Leave Behind article for more info.

Written by Joelster and Smithcool


You are receiving this newsletter because you have signed up for WikiProject U2. If you wish to stop receiving this newsletter, please contact Smithcool. This newsletter was delivered by the automated R Delivery Bot 00:47, 2 September 2007 (UTC) .


New Password

I can't remember my password (embarrasing I know). I can log in alright on this computer because it's saved on my cookies, but not on any other computer. Can I change to a new password without needing to provide my old one? MelicansMatkin 19:31, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Try this: Go to the other computer and when you log into Wikipedia, click on E-mail New Password. This will send a new password to your e-mail address in Wikipedia. You would use that to log in and change your password. Hope this helps, --Willy No1lakersfan (Talk - Contribs) 19:35, 14 September 2007 (UTC)


WikiProject U2 Membership update

The WikiProject U2 team is currently running a membership to check for active or idle members.

Because you are on the members list, we kindly ask you to visit this page and put your name under the appropriate section, using the code #~~~~, in order to renew or cancel your membership.

If you do not post on the list at all, at the end of 1 month after this message was posted, your membership will be canceled and your name removed from the list. If you wish to regain your membership, just add your name to the members list again. Thank you! If you have any questions, please do not hesitate to contact Neranei or Smithcool.

The WikiProject U2 team – 18:31, 5 November 2024 UTC [refresh]


Pokémon: Diamond and Pearl (anime)

Please stop adding that the series will soon be airing in the UK. It is inconsequential to the article, and it's placement in the opening is not necessary. Wikipedia is not a TV Guide.

Why not, I just need to inform viewers, no need to delete it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Yinyanglightningthrash (talk • contribs) 19:59, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
For several reasons. As I've already said, Wikipedia is not a TV Guide - readers don't need to know when the dub will air in Britain, that's what the infobox is for. It has no relevence anywhere in the article either. If you check, not even the original airdate for the first Japanese broadcast is mentioned. If it goes anywhere in the article it should be put in the infobox, but only when an actual airdate has been released. MelicansMatkin 00:29, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Ok then I wont add it, just please dont delete the part where it says "TBA- late 2007" in the infobox —Preceding unsigned comment added by Yinyanglightningthrash (talk • contribs) 08:34, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Don't worry, I won't - that's what the infobox is for after all. ;-) MelicansMatkin 11:21, 26 September 2007 (UTC)


U2/EotF

Were you ever a member of a U2 fansite called "Eye of the Fly"? MelicansMatkin 10:52, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Hi there - yes, you're quite right, I used to be active on Eye of the Fly. Goodness, that was a long time ago; I'd completely forgotten about it, to be honest! I take it you are/were (does it still exist?) a member? These days, I confine my activities to only a few websites; Interference is my site of choice for U2 discussion. - Axver 11:17, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
I was on there under the name "Napkin". I thought your name sounded familiar (although I couldn't remember if it was from EotF or U2-vertigo-tour). I was actually hoping that you knew what had happened to it. One day I went on with no problems, and then the next I couldn't access it. It's been like that to this day, so I guess it got shut down because of all of the uploadings. You're actually the first old member I've been lucky enough to get in touch with. MelicansMatkin 15:49, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
Ah right, I think I remember you - though it's certainly been a while. I'd stopped being active before EotF went down, so I'm honestly not sure what happened. I've a sneaking suspicion that the owner just got tired of running it/paying for webspace. One of my friends may know for sure; Daniel, bono_man2002 on Interference, no idea what he went by on EotF but I think he was around until the end and knew the webmaster. I'll have to ask him next time we catch up. I don't think the downloads would really be a factor, given how successful places like U2Torrents and U2Start are. And I was wondering if anybody had noticed I was the U2VT guy, heh. I like setlists; what can I say? - Axver 09:45, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
All I can say is that it's amazing that you've been able to find out so many of those setlists. It must have taken you absolute ages. You wouldn't believe how much of a help it's been though. MelicansMatkin 21:59, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
It's not easy, believe me! The early stuff is absolute hell. Even when you can find a newspaper review of a gig, you're lucky if half the song titles are remotely accurate. I think I finally managed to clear up what demos were recorded when, though! I know they're not strictly setlists, but I put it on U2VT anyway just to try to counter the misinformation floating around online. Setlists nowadays are dead easy though, with being able to listen to virtually every concert via someone's mobile phone streamed online. - Axver 12:37, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
You've done a fantastic job with it. I imagine that Popmart must have been pretty easy to find though, seeing how they only switched songs four or five times the whole tour, =P. MelicansMatkin 15:48, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
Thank you. And ha, good call on Popmart. What keeps that tour interesting for me are the snippets, especially during Discotheque. I've actually found Elevation's third leg to easily be the most boring, closely followed by parts of Zoo TV. Lovetown, on the other hand ... not a dull show, and only a few predictable ones. - Axver 13:54, 3 October 2007 (UTC)


U2

cheers - he he. --Merbabu 16:46, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Doesn't it just annoy you when people complete disregard what you say? =P MelicansMatkin 21:20, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Disagreement on content we can all accept - it's part of the wikipedia process. But what is unacceptable is completely ignoring any attempts to get the editor to engage or discuss - he doesn't even leave edit summaries. groan - what to do? I'll ask around. thanks. --Merbabu 23:59, 5 October 2007 (UTC)


May's Age

There is alots of websites that said that she was 14 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.112.23.57 (talk) 20:58, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

What websites are they? You need to provide sources to back up your statement. In any case, in the first episode in which she appears, she clearly states that she is ten years old. Since Pokemon is a timeless anime, she remains ten years of age. MelicansMatkin 21:19, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't remeber their names

Then they can't be used. Just saying that you've seen a source doesn't make it a reliable fact for the article. They were likely just fansites, or an opinion on a Pokemon forum. MelicansMatkin 21:36, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

No it wasn't no forum they put age 14 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.112.23.57 (talk) 21:38, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

It still can't be used because she clearly stated herself that she is ten. MelicansMatkin 03:47, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Just to tell you no 10 year old girl has a body like she does so i don't believe that she is 10 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.112.23.57 (talk) 03:54, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Well it doesn't matter what you believe, because Wikipedia is about verifiability, not opinion. MelicansMatkin 04:05, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Like i said no 10 year old girl has a body like she does —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.112.23.57 (talk) 05:20, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

And like I said, Wikipedia does not go by opinion, but by fact. May says that she is ten years old, and therefore she is ten years old. MelicansMatkin 05:25, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

That website also said that she was born in 1989 76.112.23.57 01:45, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

That website has no source. No birthdates of any characters are known, and in any case it is completely irrelevent. If May says she is ten, she is ten. End of story. MelicansMatkin 01:50, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Whatever you say that makes you happy you believe what you want and i'll believe what i want

you say May was 10 when she first stared whatever and i say she was 14 when she first started 76.112.23.57

Wikipedia is about fact, not opinion. You can believe what you want but opinions have no place in Wikipedia. Only sourced facts are included. And I will thank you not to mess around with a Talk Page after it is has posted. You can edit your own comments for grammar, but please do not remove them later on. MelicansMatkin 01:58, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Like i said believe want you want 76.112.23.57 01:59, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


Pokemon Advanced Episodes

That was sneak peak the real airdate was November 2003 i know because i watched and the first episode aired in November of 2003 76.112.23.57 04:20, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

It may have been a "sneak peak" of the Advanced Generation, but both episodes were shown in full. Therefore, that is their original airdate. MelicansMatkin 04:33, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Get the Show on the Road 11/1/2003 i got this from http://www.tv.com/pokémon/show/467/episode_listings.html?season=6&tag=nav_bar;6 76.112.23.57 04:36, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Your source is incorrect. I clearly remember seeing both episodes in full in March of 2003. They were later redubbed and then rebroadcast in November as a regular part of Pokemon Advanced. Stop bringing all of this to my Talk Page. It's the reason why article's have talk pages, so that every editor can discuss changes to the article, not just two editors. If you want to comment on it, post it here. MelicansMatkin 04:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

No I am not because all the other websites say Novemeber 2003 76.112.23.57 04:47, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Look, I've already said I'm not discussing it any more here. Take it to the talk page. MelicansMatkin 04:49, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Listen don't touch it because every websites say November 2003 and you keep on doing this i will report you 76.112.23.57


Dawn age

Dawn is 10 years old Following A Maiden's Voyage! 4/20/2007 i got from http://www.tv.com/pokémon/show/467/episode_listings.html?season=10&tag=nav_bar;10 76.112.23.57 04:39, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

That is not a reliable source. The only sources we can use for Dawn's age are the official Pokemon website(s), or an episode. In both cases, a source is needed. Stop posting all of this on my talk page, put it on the talk page for the actual article. MelicansMatkin 04:44, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


Advanced Airdates

Get the Show on the Road: Listed here, here and here as originally airing on March 15th, 2003. The first link clearly specifies that the broadcast on March 15, 2003, was a sneak peek before airing in syndication on November 1st, 2003.

A Ruin with a View: Listed here, here. and here as originally airing on March 15th, 2003. The second link clearly specifies that the broadcast on March 15, 2003, was a sneak peek before airing in syndication on November 8th, 2003. MelicansMatkin 00:15, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Believe what you want because like i said i know in my heart 76.112.23.57 06:41, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Disputed fair use rationale for Image:DiscotequeU2.png

Thanks for uploading Image:DiscotequeU2.png. However, there is a concern that the rationale you have provided for using this image under "fair use" may be invalid. Please read the instructions at Wikipedia:Non-free content carefully, then go to the image description page and clarify why you think the image qualifies for fair use. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If it is determined that the image does not qualify under fair use, it will be deleted within a couple of days according to our criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 15:34, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Disputed Images (to Timata 1705)

I noticed that one of the screenshots you created for the Shrews was tagged as disputed. I'm glad to see that you resolved it straight away, but I know that you've also created more screenshots than just that one image. I had a similar dispute the other day, and I noticed that it was because no article was mentioned in the rationale box. I went through and saw that all of my pictures had the same problem. If you haven't already done so, I just wanted to recommend to you that you add the articles to all of the rationale boxes of your images. Hopefully then they won't be tagged. MelicansMatkin 19:56, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (Image:TeamRocketJessie.gif)

Thanks for uploading Image:TeamRocketJessie.gif. The media description page currently specifies that it is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, it is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the media was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that media for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that all non-free media not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. BetacommandBot 13:29, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Chobits images

I don't think adding rationale boxes will fix our problem. Betacommand or whatever his name is a very strict constructionist when it comes to Wiki policy. To him, there is no room for interpretation or exception. He has already removed the images from many character articles. We might as well just label the images for deletion.PiccoloNamek 20:24, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

I think that part of the problem is that the rationale is not up to date. They are being used in the articles because there are no free-use images in the domain. Under Wikipedia policy, doesn't that qualify the images as Fair Use? If it doesn't work and Betacommand removes them again, well then it's my time that's been wasted. But at the very least we can try by updating the rationale. And since Betacommand has not clarified what he means by "abuse", if they are removed from the articles again we could always ask for clarification from another administrator. I figure that we might as well try it and see what happens. MelicansMatkin 20:30, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
He has specifically stated in the talk pages of other character articles that such images are unacceptable use under WP:NFC#8 and WP:NFC#Unacceptable images. I disagree, but he is so utterly strict in his interpretation that arguing with him is useless. I don't think Beta is an admin himself, but he has admins do his dirty work if people try to revert his edits.PiccoloNamek 20:36, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
I can slightly see his reasoning under WP:NFC#8, although I personally feel that it does add to the article. I can't see his rationale under WP:NFC#Unacceptable images at all though; I mean, we aren't using baseball cards are we? These images are the only way to portray the characters. I suppose this is just a matter of interpretation of Wikipedia policies. However, there is still a matter of WP:Consensus. I feel that Betacommand's rationale on these images is shaky at best. MelicansMatkin 20:54, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Just remember that he threatened to have people who reverted his edits blocked. He also directly stated that image rationale was irrelevant. See the characters page for Camp Lazlo. "They were not removed because of their rationales.", "NFC is not allowed in lists.", and in the edit history "YOU WILL BE BLOCKED". Apparently there is no possible defense. He also did the same thing over at the Avatar the Airbender character page and many others, with impunity. I think we're fighting a losing battle, personally.PiccoloNamek 21:13, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

A user can't be banned for having a different interpretation than he does, and he is in no position to make such a threat. Wikipedia is built on reasoned discussion and consensus, not the opinion of one member. The removal of those images would be detrimental to the article/list. WP:NFC#Unacceptable images is only relevant if it fails WP:NFC#8. Whether they do or not can only be decided through discussion. MelicansMatkin 21:18, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
"Whether they do or not can only be decided through discussion." I wish that were still true, but in today's Wikipedia we have reached a point where single individuals (and their bots) are capable of wielding an extraordinary amount of power on their own without regard to such things as consensus and discussion. They won't take no for an answer and will punish you for resisting. Betacommand has even left vandalism warnings on people's talk pages for reverting his edits! I've been looking through some of the talk pages he has been posting on, and all of his answers to people's complains are short and curt, and always with references to non-free image criteria. He refuses to discuss anything, and all of the other editors seem to give up without a fight each time. Perhaps they just knew when they were beat. I can't see him making an exception for our article, regardless of how well thought-out our arguments are. Perhaps I'm just getting cynical, but I've really had it with Wikipedia lately.PiccoloNamek 22:45, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
I feel the same way about today's Wikipedia, but this is one editor who will not give in without a fight. We have both made many respectable contributions to Wikipedia, and no administrator would ban either of us for disagreeing with another member over interpretation of Wikipedia policy. If Betacommand refuses to discuss, then that is his own issue as the floor has been opened for a discussion on the matter. Betacommand will be mistaken if he places a vandalism warning template; those are only to be used when vandalism occurs, not a difference of opinion. There is a big difference between adding "hugfrtyjtfyqwhu Diiiigiiiimooon rats" and a content dispute. No vandalism template covers the latter, which is what appears to be happening now. If Betacommand chooses to place such a template on my talk page then it is nothing more than a misunderstanding of the template's purpose, and an abuse of power. MelicansMatkin 22:52, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
Edit: By the way, that was an excellent comment and rationale you made on Talk:List of Chobits characters. MelicansMatkin 23:03, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Well, it looks like the world is over! Or perhaps not. I still plan on doing everything I can to make the article a good article within the new restrictions that have been placed upon us. Primarily, I am still interested in adding those references and citations. The only reason I haven't done it already is because I simply could not get the citations to work when used within a body of text. Nothing I tried would fix it, so I had to write out the citation manually within the reference tag. Of course, using citation tags is completely optional, but still. Check out User:PiccoloNamek/Test to see what I've done so far and tell me what you think. If you agree that it's OK we can start moving the references into the main article.PiccoloNamek 15:55, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

I think that those two references look very good. I certainly don't see a reason for them to not be added. As time passes and more references are made, the article will start looking better.
I had a thought though; this issue occurred because the article is list. So why not create actual articles for some of the major characters in the series? The pictures could still be incorporated that way (none have been removed from pages such as Bart Simpson, Charlie Pace, or Fox (Farthing Wood)). I don't think that there would be any length or content issues for either Chi or Hideki. Jima and Dita could be incorporated into one article (much like Team Rocket (anime) contains Jessie, James, and Meowth). Freya could go under Chi, and Sumomo and Shimbo could also be put into one page. MelicansMatkin 16:00, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

The problem with this is that many, if not most of the sub-articles would be very lacking in content. I'm not sure we could justify separating the main article into separate character articles. There is only so much plot information you can add before it becomes too much, and such articles are strong attractants for fancruft and superfluous information; two things I have been trying hard to avoid and reduce. In order for such articles to work, we would need a great deal of legitimate out of universe information and critical commentary, which I am not sure exists in sufficient quantities. I fear that such an action would reduce the overall quality of the content.

And I've been thinking: if somebody really wanted to know what these people look like, couldn't they just open a new tab and do a quick google image search? When you think about it, the actual informative quality of the article hasn't been harmed that much.PiccoloNamek 16:27, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Very true. Still, would you mind very much if I were to make a test page for Chi, or Jima and Zeta, to see how well it could possibly translate? It may be better to test the idea before creating an actual article, or decide not to create one at all. It's true that the actual quality of the article hasn't degraded much, but I would still like to test this out to see how well it can work. I think that it may be difficult to do, but also very possible that a detailed and informative article could be created without being too fancrufty. MelicansMatkin 17:10, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

What treachery is this?

Vandalism to V-Dash's talk page? I AM V-DASH. How can I be marked for editing MY own talk page? —Preceding unsigned comment added by V-Dash (talk • contribs) 22:25, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

You were marked for removing a cautionary warning regarding WP:3RR from your talk page; removing/editing comments made by other users is frowned upon on Wikipedia, especially when it comes to removing warnings that serve only to let you know when Wikipedia policy is being broken, and encouraging you to express yourself in a constructive manner. MelicansMatkin 22:56, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Serebii.net Reference

Instead of arguing in another edit war, I thought I would bring the issue to your awareness here. The problem with using Serebii.net is that it is a fansite, and fansites are not considered to be a reliable source for an article. The problem with Pokemon is that most of the information is not cited by reliable sources. This is one reason why it is so hard to reference the Pokemon articles. It is the same with all of the major Pokemon fansites; Bulbapedia, Poke Beach, and Serebii are only a few of the fansites that are frequently cited, by new editors. Unfortunately, because of their fansite status, their references all have to be removed where possible. MelicansMatkin 03:15, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


Understood, but why is Bulbapedia on the reference list? —Preceding unsigned comment added by V-Dash (talk • contribs) 03:54, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

On the article itself, or on the references that can't be used? If it is used in the article itself, it shouldn't be. It's likely that it was added as a temporary measure until a more useable source could be found. If you're asking why it can't be used as a reference it's because no matter how professional it is (and no matter how much I wish it could be used as a reference), it is still a fansite. It's very difficult to find any useable references for the Pokemon articles, exclusing Pokemon.com (which often doesn't contain the needed information anyways). For information on individual Pokemon, it's the games and handbooks that have to be used. For the characters we have to use the games and the episodes. It's a very tedious process! MelicansMatkin 04:02, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


Well I see. Oh well, alls well ends well. —Preceding unsigned comment added by V-Dash (talk • contribs) 04:16, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Subpage Edit

Thanks for warning me that pictures are not allowed in subpages and removing it. I certainly don't want to get into trouble with a madmin over a policy that I wasn't aware of. Lets see if I can get this test page done before the image becomes orphaned. Thank you again for letting me know about that policy! MelicansMatkin 20:23, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Chii Test Page

Thank you so much for helping me to create this test page. It's looking a lot more professional because of it. How do you think it's coming on so far? Is it looking too fancrufty, or about right?

P.S. Heh, do you remember that huge argument we had right after I joined Wikipedia, about Ueda's "persocom wife." MelicansMatkin 00:39, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I do remember that argument, heh. It actually popped into my mind the other day when all of the nonsense about the images started... I'm not sure if I mentioned this at the time, but "persocom and wife" also signifies the dual roles she plays in his life. That of a persocom he has purchased to perform tasks in his store, and that of a wife whom he loves.

Hehe... ;)

About the Chi page, I think it has great potential as long as unverifiable statements and speculation are kept out. Soon, I will start adding some real references with citations into the text. Be sure to tell me if you feel that I'm stepping on your toes at all during the process. Some things I'd like to mention at least in passing are Chi's special abilities, such as the ability to levitate, move objects without touching them, and of course, her concussive blasts. Perhaps some kind of abilities section... or perhaps a section would be too much. I will find some way to integrate the information into the article.PiccoloNamek 00:58, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Oh, I don't think you're stepping on my toes at all! In fact, I was actually hoping that you would be able to help me with this page. I know that it's generally frowned on for one user to edit another's User Pages and User subpages, but I'd hoped that you would do this project with me. I totally agree with the the unverifiable information and speculation; here's hoping that I've avoided it so far! I think that creating a section for the specific purpose of listing her abilities would probably seem too trivial to a passing editor (and even more so to a madmin ;}), but it would be fine if it was integrated in a different manner (such as her ability to freeze other persocoms put into the "Relationship with persocoms" section).
I've actually been trying to think of a way to incorporate A City With No People into the test page, or at least Chi's and Freya's respective (roles? portrayals? representations?) in the book. I'm just not quite sure how to put it in. Chi's part could go under "Relationship with Hideki", or "Relationship with Chitose Hibiya", while Freya's part could go under "Relationship with Chi"; heck, the whole thing could even have it's own section!
On our argument before, the reason that I was thinking about it was because of how big the dispute was (or seemed to be) at the time, and we were both pretty... obnoxious to each other, for lack of a better term. But now, we're collaborating on a test page together; gotta say that's an improvement! MelicansMatkin 01:59, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

I like your latest addition to the Chii test page. Almost nothing was wrong with it. I find your writing style to be very agreeable overall.PiccoloNamek —Preceding comment was added at 01:54, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

I'm glad that you think "Employment" turned out alright; I was hoping that it didn't contain too many errors, or too much unnecessary information. MelicansMatkin 02:02, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

U2 - Vertigo

Why do you insist on reverting the "Vertigo" article back after I have fixed it? Do you know Spanish? If you do/did, you would know that "unos/dos/tres/catorce" means "some/two/three/fourteen" not "one/two/three/fourteen." There is most definitely an 's' in the word... I'm just pretty confused about the whole thing - the least you could do is take initiative and message me like I am to you now.

/gradster(1)/

I have to apologize to you. I do know some elementary Spanish, but very little, and it's been several years since I last learned/used it. I thought that unos did mean one, but a quick Google Translate check just now proved me wrong. I apologize for the hassle. MelicansMatkin 02:05, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Infobox Dispute?

Eh? Whatever happened to that little infobox dispute? Oh, and I think that if Gardenia's Victreebell has been mentioned in the anime, then it should be added into the article. -- Altiris Helios Exeunt 00:35, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

That infobox dispute is on Pokémon Diamond and Pearl; my query on Victreebell was on the DP page for the anime. Thanks for letting me know though; I've re-added Victreebell to the page as consensus is against me.
Gosh, I must seem much easier to deal with than V-Dash! MelicansMatkin 00:40, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

...oh wait, I've mixed up the game with the anime. Oops... -- Altiris Helios Exeunt 00:41, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

=P MelicansMatkin 00:43, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Whoa, that's a lot of Wikipedia rules you threw at him. I want to do that someday. -- Altiris Helios Exeunt 00:44, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

I just think it's important that he learns how to treat fellow editors. We've all certainly treated him cordially enough, and yet he continues to throw abuse to all of us. He needs to learn the boundaries; have you seen what his actual user page says? MelicansMatkin 00:53, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

...that's a bit extreme, isn't it? I mean...you can say that rules are meant to be broken, but there is usually a reason to every rule. -- Altiris Helios Exeunt 05:33, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Exactly. He's already been warned about attacking fellow editors, which he actually did on his User Page (he claimed that it was put on by vandals, even though you can see that isn't the case in the edit history). MelicansMatkin 12:21, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Stop attacking other editors

V-Dash, did you even read what A. Exeunt posted? It applies to you too. Just accept that consensus is against you. Stop attacking other editors. If you want to contribute to Wikipedia, the first step is in treating other editors politely. I suggest that you read WP:Etiquette, WP:POINT, WP:Civility, WP:Consensus, WP:NPA, and WP:DR. You have gone against every single one of these policies, and if you expect anyone to respect your opinions you need to follow them first. MelicansMatkin 20:27, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

You're the last to talk as the lot of you have contradicted your supposed ideas. I suggest you to read up on who owns Pokemon and who doesn't.V-Dash 01:28, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

We have all tried to treat you politely and with courtesy, and yet you have done nothing but attack and insult everyone who tries to discuss the matter with you. I honestly have no real opinion on whether to keep it as "Console RPG" or change it to "RPG". My concern is with your conduct towards other editors. MelicansMatkin 01:47, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

I haven't attacked anyone. I merely responded with an aggressive voice. V-Dash 01:48, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

If you were to read the pages that I linked to above, you would see that an "agressive voice" is frowned upon on Wikipedia. MelicansMatkin 02:02, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Then perhaps you lot need to stop contradicting your words. V-Dash 02:03, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Please explain what "we lot" have contradicted. In any case, "contradiction" (if it has happened) does not justify a violation of Wikipedia policy. MelicansMatkin 02:04, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject U2 November Newsletter

The U2 WikiProject Newsletter

Issue VI - 1st November 2007

If you would like to help out with future newsletters, please contact the Outreach Department.

U2 News
  • U23D, U2's upcoming movie, will not be released until early next year.
  • U2's recent biography, U2 By U2, is now available in paperback in the U.S.
  • The 20th anniversary edition of The Joshua Tree will be released soon; the bonus content includes the Red Hill Mining Town video, often sought by fans.
Project News
Member News
  • There were no new members this month.
Did You Know?

Bono is the only person to have been nominated for an Oscar, Grammy, Golden Globe, and Nobel Peace Prize.

From the Editors

Welcome to the November edition of the WikiProject U2 Newsletter. This month's theme is Zooropa, one of U2's most experimental albums. We hope you enjoy reading it!

New Members
The Album
  • Zooropa was released on July 6, 1993.
  • This album, along with Pop, is considered one of U2's most experimental.
  • It was originally slated to be an EP, but expanded into an LP.
  • It was recorded in between legs on the Zoo TV Tour.
  • Zooropa features a rare lead singing performance by The Edge, on the song Numb.
  • The names of three unfinished songs from the recording sessions -"Hold Me, Thrill Me, Kiss Me, Kill Me", "If You Wear That Velvet Dress", and "Wake Up Dead Man"- appear superimposed on the cover; "Hold Me Thrill Me Kiss Me Kill Me" was used in the Batman Forever soundtrack, and "If You Wear That Velvet Dress" and "Wake Up Dead Man" were included on 1997's "Pop".
  • "Numb" was released in an unlikely format as the first "video single"; the "Numb" video is thought of as one of U2's best.
  • "Some Days are Better Than Others" is the only track to have never been played live.
  • The singles from Zooropa are "Numb", "Lemon", and "Stay (Faraway, So Close!)"

Written by Smithcool, Joelster, and Neranei.

Atheism

Is your whole family atheist? That's kinda sad, as more and more atheists appear to be popping up. I still respect your decision though, as long as you are still a moral and decent person. Some other atheists I've known have no regard for human lives or the happiness of others. 216.166.78.9 18:34, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

Atheism, isnt to uncommon in the United States, I myself, am atheist, and i find it best to simply not discuss my religion (or lack there of) with other religious people, les I offend them. Athiests arent monsters, those are the Satanists. Atomic Religione 19:31, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

It would be a little better if you guys were agnostic instead, but anything's better than being a Satanist or a hypocritical terrorist Muslim. 216.166.78.9 20:14, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
I can not speak for the rest of my family but yes, I am an atheist. I personally do not see how God can exist, but that is my belief and neither intended to reflect anyone else or aggravate them. Freedom of religion is a beautiful thing; people can choose to be Christian, Catholic, Islamic, Hindu, Buddhist, Atheist, Agnostic, Lutheran, Protestant, Pagan, Wiccan, or any of themillions of other religions that exist, without fear of persecution because of it.
I am aware of the difference between an athiest and an agnostic, and yes I am the former; that is my choice. While I do not believe in God/Allah/Yahweh/etc, I do respect the comfort it gives to others. I do not blame religion for any troubles in the world (such as the terrorism that you have mentioned above). I blame an inability to co-operate with others, or see past one religion to address deeper problems. In other words, I blame intolerance.
I am not religious, but I do respect religion. People are free to be in whatever religion they choose, whether it be Catholicism or Satanism, Atheism or Islam, and I really don't care what religion a person is so long as they treat me with the same respect that I treat them. Please do not post derogatory comments such as anything's better than being a Satanist or a hypocritical terrorist Muslim on my talk page. MelicansMatkin 20:32, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, I didn't mean to put down just the Muslims; actually when it comes to any religion, being a hypocrite is probably the worst thing you can be as you are intentionally deceiving others to further your own interests. At least you are being honest by admitting you are an atheist. And Satanism is generally always associated with evil acts and malicious intent, so I give them no quarter. Have you ever seen a charitable Satanist? 216.166.78.9 20:41, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
I have neither seen nor met a Satanist. I have no opinion on Satanism, or on any other individual religion. My only opinion is that people should be free to choose what religion fits them best, and they should not act intolerantly to others just because they have different opinions. MelicansMatkin 20:45, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
The problem is, Satanism actually promotes the attacking and ridicule of one's enemies, and the satisfying of one's own carnal desires. Here's a description from the article on Satanism: "small religious group that is unrelated to any other faith, and whose members feel free to satisfy their urges responsibly, exhibit kindness to their friends, and attack their enemies". It's a very self-centered, self-serving philosophy so most moral people would likely have a strong distaste for it, atheist or not. 216.166.78.9 20:52, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
This is not a debate on the merits of one religion over another; my talk page is not the place if that is what you are looking for. As for the quote you provided, it could be applied to everyday life. Lets look over it. ...Members feel free to satisfy their urges responsibly: what if you're trying to quite smoking? You keep getting the urge to light one up, but you cut back slowly until the cravings are gone. Is that Satanistic? ...Exhibit kindness to their friends: who isn't kind to their friends? Isn't that one of the foundations of friendship, kindness? ...and attack their enemies: Have you ever been bullied? If so, haven't you just wanted, just wished that you could get back at your tormentor? Is that not revenge? Does that make you a Satanist?
I'm not debating the merits of one religion over another, and I really don't care to continue with this discussion. A person's religion is their personal choice. Each one has merits and demerits. I really have nothing more to say on this. MelicansMatkin 21:03, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
My apologies, I won't bug you again, unless I need help making edits or something. 216.166.78.9 21:13, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
I'm always happy to help a user out if it is related to editing Wikipedia. :) MelicansMatkin 21:17, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

Thanks~

Thank you for removing that nonsense from my talk page. I appreciate it, buku! -Sukecchi 23:35, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

It's no problem. I guessed that you wouldn't have wanted it on there. :) MelicansMatkin 12:24, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Your userbox

Hello! I have recieved your request for your usebox, and was wondering if this was okay?

'But...'This user always has to have the last word!
If youwant me to change the colours etc. I will! you could then store it in your userspace.
Reply here (on your talk page) or on this page: Wikipedia_talk:Userboxes/Ideas or on my talkpage I will get it whatever PhilB ~ T/C 14:39, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
That looks absolutely fantastic! Thank you very much! MelicansMatkin 16:09, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
You can find it at User:MelicansMatkin/userbox/Last word so you include it by typing: {{User:MelicansMatkin/userbox/Last word}}
Added it to your profile, I also cleared up the code, the easiest way to get a user box table is to type {{userboxtop}} and {{userboxbottom}} and it puts them all in a table
Hope I helped! PhilB ~ T/C 15:16, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
Thanks so much! I'd thought that it seemed cluttered, but I wasn't sure how to make it less cluttered. Thanks again! MelicansMatkin 16:22, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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