User talk:Flyer22 Frozen

This user may sometimes share an IP address with Halo Jerk1.

Welcome to my talk page. I have been editing Wikipedia since 2007. If you want to know more about me, see my user page. My work, like a lot of others, has been complimented and criticized. And in March 2012, I was even blocked. See the block cases. Having WP:GA articles and honors, and the trust of many Wikipedians, does not matter if some of the site's editors believe you have abused Wikipedia. Your and others' insistence that you have not abused Wikipedia hardly matters. And it's during that first block case that I learned a lot about WP:Assume good faith and who you can count on to be there for you; that experience has made me more acrimonious towards Wikipedia, and this feeling was intensified with my second block case (again, refer to the block cases link). Still, I believe that it's best that I help this site, seeing as many people come here for information (it's almost always ranking highest in search engines, and that type of thing is always going to bring in a lot of readers) and a lot of those people trust what they read here. So it's my job to make sure that any topic I am heavily editing is as accurate as possible.

Any questions, compliments or criticism of my work, feel free to leave me a message here on my talk page or email me. If you leave me a message here, I will usually reply here.

Archive

• Archive 1 (from May 8, 2007 - June 20, 2007)
• Archive 2 (from June 24, 2007 - November 3, 2007
• Archive 3 (from December 20, 2007 - November 4, 2008)
• Archive 4 (from November 10, 2008 - June 6, 2009)
• Archive 5 (from June 10, 2009 - October 9, 2009)
• Archive 6 (from October 9, 2009 - March/April 2010)
• Archive 7 (from April 2, 2010 - January 20, 2011)
• Archive 8 (from January 21, 2011 - July 27, 2011)
• Archive 9 (from July 27, 2011 - March 20, 2012 )
• Archive 10/block cases (from March 21, 2012 - July 24, 2012, for block case 1; December 12, 2012 - December 19, 2012, and to December 24 concerning extra comments, for block case 2)
• Archive 10 in general (April 25, 2012- August 31, 2012)
• Archive 11 (September 4, 2012 - April 3, 2013)

Re: Your welcome message to me

Hi Flyer 22, I am in fact working on the Sexual Orientation page as part of a project for a university seminar class. I was supposed to put all of my information in my Sandbox before editing the actual Wikipedia page. For that reason, I have removed all of the information I have added and placed it in my Sandbox. After it is marked, I will re-launch it onto the Wikipedia page. Sorry about that. Thank you. 8sjg2 (talk) 14:09, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Make sure that when you add back the text you removed,[1][2] that you add it back in its appropriate format (the WP:Manual of Style formats I explained to you). The same goes for any new text you add to the Sexual orientation article or any other Wikipedia article. Flyer22 (talk) 14:47, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Kim Leine

Why did you change De gyldene Laurbaer - it is right!!! Have a look at the german page f.e. I´ll fix it again. Is it english: "For romanen"??? --46.244.205.100 (talk) 22:39, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

My mistake. Flyer22 (talk) 22:40, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes. --46.244.205.100 (talk) 22:41, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

User:Star767

I noticed you have had some issues with Star767. He/she has now been permanently blocked as a sockpuppet see User_talk:Star767#Blocked.--Penbat (talk) 09:54, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes, because I was watching Star767's talk page (but will cease to do so when it looks like no further comments related to the block will be posted there), I'd seen your posts there and the block that resulted from that. I'd also seen your post in the Blocked section before I stopped editing Wikipedia for several hours. Very soon after the Blocked section was started, I considered posting in that section about the editor not seeming like MathewTownsend, who, like Star767, was confirmed as a sockpuppet of Mattisse, but I decided not to. Mattisse was referred to by female pronouns, and MathewTownsend (given the name "Matthew" and maybe because the editor also identified as male) was referred to by male pronouns, and MathewTownsend edited psychology articles every now and then. So that matter is confusing, like one can't be completely sure of anything regarding it. Flyer22 (talk) 13:15, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks

Thank you for removing the vandalism from the article about Harrison, Arkansas.

I went in today to fix it, and noticed you had already been there.

I tried to send you an email, but the "send this user an email" option wasn't available. You seem pretty good with Wikipedia, and it would be nice to have a Wiki friend who can answer some of my questions.

Take care,

Richard. Richard apple (talk) 20:20, 11 April 2013‎ (UTC)

Hello, Richard apple. You're welcome. When I reverted this, I initially didn't know what was going on with that edit. But the kkk addition to the URL was a dead-giveaway that it was vandalism.

Earlier this year, due to limited email abuse, I disabled the option that allows others to email me. I won't be re-enabling it any time soon for longer than a few minutes; if asked, and if the request is valid, I will re-enable it for a few minutes in order to give an editor a chance to email me. But the editor can just as easily allow me to email him or her, and then email me back that way.

As for experience with Wikipedia and help, I see that you are still relatively new (having registered for a Wikipedia account on December 22, 2012). I (as the top of my user page currently states) have been editing Wikipedia since 2007 (maybe tried to edit it as an IP address at one point before then) and I understand what you mean about it being good to have a Wikipedia friend/someone willing to help you on Wikipedia. There aren't many, or even several, Wikipedia editors I'd call my friends, however, on or off Wikipedia. Still, you may ask me for help about anything concerning Wikipedia whenever you feel like it.

I signed your user name for you above. Judging by your user page, it doesn't seem that you need to be told that all you have to do to sign your user name is simply type four tildes (~), like this: ~~~~. But your signature should provide a link to your account. If you have your signature formatted so that it doesn't do that, you should fix it so that it does. Flyer22 (talk) 21:27, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

Feel free to send me an email. I'm very curious about you. Richard Apple 04:31, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Flyer22 Frozen. You have new messages at Jackson Peebles's talk page.
Message added 03:17, 12 April 2013 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Jackson Peebles (talk) 03:17, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Michael Jackson appearance

Dear Flyer, I agree with you it did not fit. But thing is and there's also another source I can give you that this person also gave other statements about MJ and later under oath she admitted she did not see anything. So how do you know the comment that is posted here is correct? I don't know who had the idea for this page and why. But the health of an individual ist sth. very private and people should be very careful with what they write. As far as health is concerned tabloids are not a reliable source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Quaffel (talk • contribs) 17:54, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia has policies and guidelines for its editors to follow. Yes, this clearly does not belong there. And I clarified that a bit more in this edit summary. As long as what you add to the Michael Jackson's health and appearance article is reliably sourced and is about Jackson's health and/or physical appearance, I likely won't have much of or any problem with what you add to that article. Like I stated earlier the previous hour on that article's talk page: "When I cleaned up [that] article on January 10, 2013‎, I returned and added neutrality to [it] and removed crap." This edit by an IP undid that. That article is of WP:GA status and should stay that way. But I wouldn't be surprised if it loses that status at some point, given the IPs and registered users who continue to add or re-aad junk to it every now and then in order to bias it. Like Bookkeeperoftheoccult stated on its talk page, because it's no longer a WP:BLP article, concerning Michael Jackson at least, it is no longer afforded the high degree of protection against the type of junk that the aforementioned IP added back. Flyer22 (talk) 19:05, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Flyer22 Frozen. You have new messages at Stefan2's talk page.
Message added 15:44, 14 April 2013 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Stefan2 (talk) 15:44, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

As you know by now, I'd already replied, Stefan2. Flyer22 (talk) 15:47, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

IP 76.97.240.220

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Young_adult_(psychology)&diff=next&oldid=550197519

I think you warned him enough :) JDHuff185 (talk) 18:07, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I'd seen the IP's edit and was about to report him or her just before you left me this message. I have reported the IP at Wikipedia:Administrator intervention against vandalism. The reason that I warned the IP at least twice is because I did not want my report to be turned away with some annoying "IP was insufficiently warned" comment. Flyer22 (talk) 17:40, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

Good :) forgot to sign first time JDHuff185 (talk) 18:07, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

* A barnstar for you! *

		The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
		For being here, for working so hard and so well, for your help, support and encouragement. ♥ Lova Falk talk 15:51, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

Aw, thank you, Lova Falk!! It's very much appreciated coming from you, with how hard you work at this site and how kind and assisting you are. Thank you. I'm here a little too much these days, with barely any sleep because of my off-Wikipedia Internet work and because I'm battling my insomnia more than I have in the past, but knowing that my work here is appreciated by some people and that they believe I'm making a great difference is one way that I know it's not necessarily a waste of time editing Wikipedia. Flyer22 (talk) 16:02, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

You're very welcome, you deserve it. And from the sound of it, you still need lots of hard work in case you ever feel like becoming a wikisloth. Lova Falk talk 16:42, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

Child abuse article

Dear Flyer 22, Well, you stated that my adding abortion is not valid due to no links with it, now, in the first 2 paragraphs in the child abuse writings in Wikipedia, there also has not been any source added except only in a few circumstances, now, in the line "There are four major categories of child abuse: neglect, physical abuse, including abortion, psychological or emotional abuse, and sexual abuse.", none of these forms of abuse words have any relaible source to validate them, now I am getting the feeling that even if I would provide reliable source (despite the other forms of abuse are not linked in any sources) you would still be removing them as unreliable sources, to be honest, it this because you are personally pro abortion? Nayan Mipun, — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nayanmipun (talk • contribs) 19:37, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

Excuse me for butting in, but if you check the two sentences below the heading Types, you'll see that there is a source for the four major categories of child abuse. Also the subsections have lots of sources. When there are sources in the article, the sources don't always need to be repeated in the lead. Also, the lead should be a summary of the article, and there is no text on abortion in the article. With friendly regards, Lova Falk talk 19:56, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

[ WP:EDIT CONFLICT ]: Nayanmipun, you are not the first to suggest that I have, or accuse me of, some sort of bias (regarding a topic in question) for following Wikipedia policies and/or guidelines, and you won't be the last. Most of what I have to state to you about the Child abuse article is what I stated on your talk page about it. The forms of child abuse that you claim have no sources to validate them are sourced lower in the article, in the sections about them. Per WP:LEAD, they do not have to be sourced in the lead if they are sourced lower in the article. It remains that your text is not sourced at all, and should not be in the article unless added in the way that I described to you.

Also, never again post at the top of my talk page, or at the top of any Wikipedia talk page unless replying to a discussion post. New posts go at the bottom. And you can start a new section by clicking "New section" at the top of any Wikipedia talk page (unless the option to post to that talk page has been disabled). And remember to sign your username at the end of the comments you make on Wikipedia talk pages. All you have to do to sign your username is simply type four tildes (~), like this: ~~~~. A bot signed your username for you above. Flyer22 (talk) 20:03, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

Re: Biology and sexual orientation

It's biology and sexual orientation. Shouldn't it include biology-related statements specifically? --Scientiom (talk) 13:29, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

You've been reading the talk page, I'm sure. You know what the current consensus is about what that article should mention. Of course the Biology and sexual orientation article should not give the false impression that scientists generally think that sexual orientation is only caused by biology, which is why I reverted you. Should that article mostly be about biology? Sure. But when it comes to reporting what scientists generally think on the matter, we should report accurately. Flyer22 (talk) 13:51, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Gangadhar Nehru

The IP is still quite active there. It hasn't responded to the warnings from a bot and doesn't appear to respond to our efforts, so I'm going to go ahead and report it for what I think is vandalism. Since you were also reverting, I think it's apt to let you know. MezzoMezzo (talk) 06:25, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Ah, I realize now the IP has been warned only twice with my warning now. I reverted it for the third time though since it seems like vandalism I believe I have a 3RR exemption, though I won't push it. We'll have to see what happens after this second warning now (if you're still interested). MezzoMezzo (talk) 06:26, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Hello, MezzoMezzo. Yes, I reverted that IP three times.[3][4][5] I didn't bother reverting after that because I concluded that the IP would be reverted and blocked soon (or the other way around), and, like you, I didn't want to risk a WP:3RR violation...knowing that WP:VANDALISM may not define the IP's actions as vandalism. If the IP continues to edit in the style that we've objected to, and the IP likely will, then, if Wikipedia:Administrator intervention against vandalism doesn't do something about that, the Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring will. Despite risk of breaching WP:3RR, I had checked back in on that article and decided that I would revert again if the IP's edits stayed for longer than a few hours. Good to know that you reverted again. Flyer22 (talk) 08:52, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Jay Stamper

Hello Flyer22. The unregistered user is continuing to vandalise the lead section of the article. Since you reverted his vandalism, I've reverted him three times in two days. He is ignoring all attempts to communicate and I even warned him on his talk page. Could you possibly revert his vandalism and try asking him to stop as well? I think he might if a second editor does so too. Thanks, Tiller54 (talk) 17:18, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

I reverted. There's nothing left for me to warn the IP about, however, since you have warned him or her three times, unless you want me to try to discuss the matter with the IP. But I would prefer you try to start such a discussion first. Like I stated in the section before this one to a different editor, if the IP continues to edit in the style that we've objected to, and the IP likely will, then, if Wikipedia:Administrator intervention against vandalism doesn't do something about that, the Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring will. Flyer22 (talk) 17:36, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the help. I've left a message on his talk page explaining why we're reverting and asking him to discuss before removing the information again. Tiller54 (talk) 18:07, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

You're welcome. And, remember, you can report the IP at either of the pages I noted above. Flyer22 (talk) 18:12, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Orgasm

Hi, You said we don't determine what is appropriate by citing examples from similar pages. It seems to be a fairly reasonable method of showing a Wikipedia consensus on a certain matter. I just wanted to demonstrate that the Wikipedia community seems to have decided that sexual photos are OK.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 00:31, 23 April 2013 (UTC)

Okay, thanks for responding regarding the statements made about your image additions. You might want to explain yourself on this matter in that section about this on the article talk page, in case others want to reply to you and so that it's there when that section is archived. Or I could leave a note there stating that you replied about this on my talk page. I hope that you understand what we meant about WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS, WP:NOTCENSORED and WP:Offensive material, though. Flyer22 (talk) 00:41, 23 April 2013 (UTC)

Anti-Flirt Club

Hi Flyer, nothing exigent. I wanted to make sure you're checked out on the Anti-Flirt Club. it is a very remarkable article.--Wlmg (talk) 01:28, 23 April 2013 (UTC)

Interesting. Thanks for pointing me to it. Flyer22 (talk) 01:59, 23 April 2013 (UTC)

;-) --Wlmg (talk) 11:08, 23 April 2013 (UTC)

Fianna Fáil Liberalism

I was going through the Fianna Fáil page as an exercise is editing another page when I noted that you reverted an update which highlighted their shift towards European Liberalism. I was wondering why you removed that edit as the previous edit would appear to have reliable referenced sources?sittingonthefence (talk) 08:40, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

Hello, sittingonthefence. Look at this; it shows that I reverted the IP, then very soon afterward reverted myself. I can sometimes make mistakes when prowling to revert vandalism, and I was not sure about that edit; that's why I reverted myself, though reverting myself restored a cite error. Flyer22 (talk) 09:31, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Sexology closed

An arbitration case regarding sexology has now closed and the final decision is viewable at the link above. The following remedies have been enacted:

1. Standard discretionary sanctions are authorized for all articles dealing with transgender issues and paraphilia classification (e.g., hebephilia).
2. User:Jokestress and User:James Cantor are banned from interacting with each other, commenting on and/or commenting about each other including their professional lives, works and on-wiki activities. This applies to all namespaces, but excludes dispute resolution that explicitly relates to both parties.
3. User:Jokestress is indefinitely banned from the topic of human sexuality, including biographical articles.

For the Arbitration Committee, Ks0stm ^{(T•C•G•E)} 12:59, 25 April 2013 (UTC)

Discuss this

Hi, there. List of technical terms for nonparaphilic sexual interests.

Hi, Flyer. Did you want to talk more about List of technical terms for nonparaphilic sexual interests?— James Cantor (talk) 20:43, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Not really, James. We covered the bases in our discussion about it. Why do you ask? You want to revisit that discussion?

Also, as you can see, I expanded the heading of this section with the List of technical terms for nonparaphilic sexual interests mention/link, so that I or others know what this section is about from looking at the archives when it's finally archived. Flyer22 (talk) 21:01, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Nope, all good. It's just that that discussion happened in such a whirlwind, that it wasn't clear to me if it was done.— James Cantor (talk) 21:03, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

I see that analloerotic, gerontophilia and object sexuality are on the list. But the Analloerotic article includes Template:Paraphilia and is listed in Category:Paraphilias, the Gerontophilia article includes Template:Paraphilia and is listed on it, and the Object sexuality article is listed in Category:Paraphilias. So those three listings are a bit contradictory. We know that "sexual interest" is not the same as "sexual preference." So if sexual interest in an elderly person can be normal, but a sexual preference for elderly people is not, that needs to be clarified. Flyer22 (talk) 21:34, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

You're absolutely correct. When just cut-and-pasted the existing list when I moved it over. I didn't actually check the entries on the list, so I carried the error over. My bad. Gerontophilia and object sexuality should both be on the List of paraphilias and not the List of nonparaphilic sexual interests. I reflexively avoid the word "normal," but in the upcoming DSM, they will be be considered paraphilias but not considered disorders (unless they cause harm to someone). I'll move them back. Good catch.— James Cantor (talk) 22:03, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes, using the term normative over normal is preferred by sexologists, correct? Flyer22 (talk) 22:06, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

P.S.: I just created the List of nonparaphilic sexual interests link by redirecting it to the List of technical terms for nonparaphilic sexual interests article. Flyer22 (talk) 22:11, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

I don't think there's a consensus; it's one of the most politically laden idea there is for us. I just put my own opinion atop my userpage.

And: Done, I took the words out of the list. I didn't change List of paraphilias, however. Gerontophilia was already there, and "Objectophilia" pipes to Object sexuality.— James Cantor (talk) 22:16, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

I had seen (and read) your take on stigmatization of paraphilias on your user page before; thanks for reminding me that it's there. You used "the norm" at one point there, and I have seen some researchers prefer that wording (or "norms") as well. Flyer22 (talk) 22:29, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Re: The word social, Virginity article edit

Yes, legality is a social construct and a consequence of it. But laws, legal opinions, etc., do not necessarily reflect the social, moral, ethical attitudes of the place and time they're active. They may, and often do, reflect past attitudes no longer held by the society in question. Legal and social attitudes may even conflict with each other, particularly when social attitudes are changing and there's no consensus about which one should be held. Nor are laws necessarily amended to reflect the social attitudes of the time in question, they may simply be ignored.

The implied causality of the original wording is therefore too strict - removing the words "the resulting" allows for a looser relationship between the two. In my opinion, of course. Ngebendi (talk) 11:50, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for replying to my statements. I didn't think of the wording the way you did/do, obviously, so also thanks for giving me a wider perspective on that. Flyer22 (talk) 11:58, 28 April 2013 (UTC)