Talk:Spygate (conspiracy theory): Difference between revisions
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:::It has not "been proven true". Not at all. – [[User:Muboshgu|Muboshgu]] ([[User talk:Muboshgu#top|talk]]) 18:22, 14 February 2024 (UTC) |
:::It has not "been proven true". Not at all. – [[User:Muboshgu|Muboshgu]] ([[User talk:Muboshgu#top|talk]]) 18:22, 14 February 2024 (UTC) |
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::::It absolutely has been proven true, the Steele Dossier was proven to be false, by it's own author (https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-donald-trump-presidential-elections-campaign-2016-41116202428688e1088829852505e144), there is now a missing binder filled with formerly classified material that was ordered declassified as part of the declassifaction of the "Crossfire Hurricane" investigation into Donald Trump by former President Barack Obama's justice bureau (https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/dec/15/classified-russia-documents-missing-trump). [[Special:Contributions/8.10.181.17|8.10.181.17]] ([[User talk:8.10.181.17|talk]]) 01:56, 15 February 2024 (UTC) |
::::It absolutely has been proven true, the Steele Dossier was proven to be false, by it's own author (https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-donald-trump-presidential-elections-campaign-2016-41116202428688e1088829852505e144), there is now a missing binder filled with formerly classified material that was ordered declassified as part of the declassifaction of the "Crossfire Hurricane" investigation into Donald Trump by former President Barack Obama's justice bureau (https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/dec/15/classified-russia-documents-missing-trump). [[Special:Contributions/8.10.181.17|8.10.181.17]] ([[User talk:8.10.181.17|talk]]) 01:56, 15 February 2024 (UTC) |
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::::'''Done:''' This should be voted on. The Wall-street Journal and other sources - along with a primary source from the Durham report - confirmed that Trump's 2016 campaign was illegally spied on. |
Revision as of 01:58, 15 February 2024
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Roundup of more recent descriptions of the term "spygate"
This article was created in 2018 with the edit comment "spygate" refers to trumps claims that his campaign was spied on.
Since then it has become specifically about an embedded campaign informant and specifically about the Obama administration. I think limiting the scope to that is unsupported by the way "spygate" is referred to in the reliable sources. Below are some examples of the way the term spygate is described:
- “Spygate” — a labyrinthine conspiracy theory involving unproven allegations about a clandestine Democratic plot to spy on Mr. Trump’s 2016 campaign.[1]
- “Spygate,” the term it used to describe a sweeping conspiracy to undermine Trump through investigations into Russian election meddling.[2]
- The claim that his 2016 campaign was illegally spied on — either “spygate” or “Obamagate”[3]
- “Spygate: The Attempted Sabotage of Donald J. Trump,” which posits connections between the Hillary Clinton campaign and foreign entities to undermine Trump’s 2016 election chances.[4]
And finally here is an MSNBC opinion columnist implying that spygate has morphed into many things over time, sort of illustrating my point here:
Over the course of his presidency’s first year, Donald Trump came up with a conspiracy theory he seemed quite excited about. The Republican called it “Spygate.”
If you’re struggling to remember the details of the manufactured controversy, don’t feel too bad about it: Trump also had a hard time explaining exactly what he thought the story was all about. In 2017, for example, Trump invested a fair amount of energy pretending that Barack Obama had wiretapped Trump Tower. (There was no such wiretapping.) A year later, “Spygate” involved an imagined scheme in which the FBI put a spy in his 2016 political operation. (That didn’t happen, either.)
...
Four years later, the now-former president has apparently decided to tweak his conspiracy theory, swapping out one central detail for another. In the new iteration, Barack Obama didn’t spy on him, but Hillary Clinton did.[5]
There are many aspects to this and it involves international people and non-government people. The way things are now, it's confusing where the scope of one related page ends and another begins. I think this is the place to really tie it all together since this is the term most commonly used to refer to all of it. Nweil (talk) 16:37, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
References
- ^ Roose, Kevin (October 20, 2020). "How 'Spygate' Attacks Fizzled". The New York Times. Retrieved July 7, 2022.
- ^ Markay, Lachlan (January 11, 2021). "Epoch Times revenue soared on Trump conspiracies". Axios. Retrieved July 7, 2022.
- ^ Brown, Hayes (April 16, 2021). "The GOP is still telling Trump's 'spygate' lies. They have nothing on the reality of COINTELPRO". MSNBC. Retrieved July 7, 2022.
- ^ Roig-Franzia, Manuel (April 20, 2021). "Dan Bongino isn't just taking over where Rush Limbaugh left off — he's building a conservative media universe". The Washington Post. Archived from the original on April 21, 2021. Retrieved July 7, 2022.
- ^ Benen, Steve (February 15, 2022). "The new 'spying' story is clearly not what Trump thinks it is". MSNBC. Retrieved July 7, 2022.
There was a mole in the Trump Administration that Hillary and Obama hired
Why isn't this mentioned? 205.149.37.229 (talk) 23:54, 4 February 2023 (UTC)
- Spygate is a conspiracy theory promulgated by President Donald Trump in May 2018 that the Obama administration had put a spy in his 2016 presidential campaign soibangla (talk) 00:02, 5 February 2023 (UTC)
Spygate (Conspiracy Theory) and the Durham Report
The Durham Report (https://www.justice.gov/storage/durhamreport.pdf) confirms much of what is currently labeled as "conspiracy theory" in this article, including that all of the major players at the FBI, CIA, and Obama White House knew there was no substance to the "Russia/Trump collusion" theory, yet opened the Crossfire Hurricane investigation anyway. WikiJohnS (talk) 21:18, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
- That is not what the Durham Report says. I suggest you read a description of its conclusions from a reputable source, like this one, rather than Newsmax or 4chan. – Muboshgu (talk) 21:29, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
- I suggest you read the actual report, not summaries by third parties. No substance to the to the Trump/Russia collusion theory, I refer to page 8 of the report:
- "As set forth in greater detail in Section IV.A.3 .b, before the initial receipt by FBI Headquarters of information from Australia on July 28, 2016 concerning comments reportedly made in a tavern on May 6, 2016 by George Papadopoulos, an unpaid foreign policy advisor to the Trump campaign, the government possessed no verified intelligence reflecting that Trump or the Trump campaign was involved in a conspiracy or collaborative relationship with officials of the Russian government.21 Indeed, based on the evidence gathered in the multiple exhaustive and costly federal investigations of these matters, including the instant investigation, neither U.S. law enforcement nor the Intelligence Community appears to have possessed any actual evidence of collusion in their holdings at the commencement of the Crossfire Hurricane investigation."
- WikiJohnS (talk) 04:09, 17 May 2023 (UTC)
- "before" Downer's alert. And what does this have to do with Spygate? Are you asserting Durham proved Trump was spied on? I'm seeing a lot of "Durham proved everything Trump said was right all along" making the rounds. soibangla (talk) 04:22, 17 May 2023 (UTC)
- I agree that the bolded words are the ones Durham used in his report, which is a primary source. We prefer secondary sources that discuss primary sources over our editors' interpretation of those primary sources. Those analyses are still coming in. We have no deadline for that. – Muboshgu (talk) 04:28, 17 May 2023 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 14 February 2024
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To make the article more accurate-\ Spygate was a disproven[1] conspiracy theory peddled by 45th U.S. President Donald Trump
Spygate is a proven[1] conspiracy theory peddled by 45th U.S. President Donald Trump RomaBoy (talk) 16:35, 14 February 2024 (UTC)
- Not done: That would make the article inaccurate. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:43, 14 February 2024 (UTC)
- It was a conspiracy theory, now it's been proven true. So it's more accurate to describe it as a proven conspiracy theory rather than a historical disproven conspiracy theory. 38.96.169.131 (talk) 18:19, 14 February 2024 (UTC)
- It has not "been proven true". Not at all. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:22, 14 February 2024 (UTC)
- It absolutely has been proven true, the Steele Dossier was proven to be false, by it's own author (https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-donald-trump-presidential-elections-campaign-2016-41116202428688e1088829852505e144), there is now a missing binder filled with formerly classified material that was ordered declassified as part of the declassifaction of the "Crossfire Hurricane" investigation into Donald Trump by former President Barack Obama's justice bureau (https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/dec/15/classified-russia-documents-missing-trump). 8.10.181.17 (talk) 01:56, 15 February 2024 (UTC)
- Done: This should be voted on. The Wall-street Journal and other sources - along with a primary source from the Durham report - confirmed that Trump's 2016 campaign was illegally spied on.
- It has not "been proven true". Not at all. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:22, 14 February 2024 (UTC)
- It was a conspiracy theory, now it's been proven true. So it's more accurate to describe it as a proven conspiracy theory rather than a historical disproven conspiracy theory. 38.96.169.131 (talk) 18:19, 14 February 2024 (UTC)
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