Talk:Ice road: Difference between revisions

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Merge

I don't agree at all with this merge suggestion because a Winter Road is not the same as an Ice Road at all... People think and talk about a Winter Road in subtropical regions of the world such as southern Brazil or in Wintery locations such as Utah or southern Chile - and yet that is not the same thing as a true Ice Road in the Arctic or even in Antarctica. Bepp 09:09, 22 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

To my understanding ice road and winter road are not the same. At least here in Finland the ice road is opened on the ice covering lake/sea, while a winter road is a road opened in the forest. It seems to be the same in Canada as well: many remote communities for example in Manitoba are linked only by a winter road, that leads through the snow-covered forests (but not over the lakes). --213.216.199.6 07:47, 27 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

For what it's worth, I don't see a meaningful distinction between the two. A forest "winter road" invariably has to cross water bodies, and a lake or river "ice road" invariably has to cross lands and forests too. So unless a road's status actually changes from "ice road" to "winter road" every single time the landform it's crossing at that particular spot changes type, almost every road of either type is simultaneously both an ice road and a winter road even if those phrases are actually intended to convey different meanings. Bearcat (talk) 02:19, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've changed my mind three times now and I finally have to agree with Bearcat. There is a distinction, especially for sea roads (Estonia, Finland) where the road is entirely over ice and the Lake Ladoga WWII example, but these can be successfully integrated into the Winter road article, with a redirect from Ice road. (Who will be doing that BTW?) I note Canadian Geographic Nov/Dec07 -Diamond highway- describing "The world's longest ice road" which is named the Tibbitt to Contwoyto Winter Road which begs the question. The "Ice bridge" section of this article is problematic and needs to go somewhere else, any ideas? Franamax (talk) 03:11, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

There is some difference, winter roads can be made with frozen water, but also pressed snow, or cut directly in frozen dirt. Winter roads are indeed ice roads at creek crossings, when bridges are made from frozen water, but they can also use regular bridges or wooden mats to cross creeks. Winter rods don't cross lakes, they generally go around them. Ice roads go mostly across lakes (see Tibbitt to Contwoyto Winter Road, sometimes along rivers, such as on Mackenzie River north of Inuvik. --Qyd (talk) 15:55, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

An ice road does not have to cross the land. For example the ice road from Yellowknife to Dettah, Northwest Territories is on Great Slave Lake. When it meets the land it uses the regular road system. However, having said that I see no reason why the two articles could not be merged. CambridgeBayWeather Have a gorilla 21:35, 21 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Itobo (talk) 15:52, 16 March 2008 (UTC)There are some similarities between winter roads and ice roads, but the difference between them is significant. An ice road is in the main constructed anew annually, and its path can change from year to year. A winter road is generally surveyed and cut, and the route remains the same from year to year, and there can even be permanent bridges built along the route to bridge waterways. A winter road is generally just a seasonal road that is impassable except in winter. I've therefore referred back to the Winter road page where the content discusses issues that are in common, but otherwise I support having ice roads as a separate page.[reply]

I find this article a bit confusing in scope in that it is called ice road and yet contains a section on ice roads and winter roads. While it is common for winter roads to have sections across rivers (e.g. the Albany River), most of the time winter roads are on land. I think ice roads should be reserved for roads that travel for most of their length across lakes or other large bodies of water.

split

this article really should be split. Ice bridge needs a separate article, since it is an academic concept explaining migration of many prehistoric peoples. Ice road is a trivial concept of roads icing. Anlace 17:37, 16 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Agree that Ice bridge should be split but Ice road is certainly non-trivial, it is a serious matter of waiting for freeze-up until ice can support vehicles and judicious flooding of the ice to get the desired thickness. Perhaps you are thinking of "icy roads"? Franamax (talk) 03:15, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've split that off to ice bridge, and added a disambiguating note to this article. Mindmatrix 16:04, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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 [[User:Itobo|Itobo]] ([[User talk:Itobo|talk]]) 15:52, 16 March 2008 (UTC)There are some similarities between winter roads and ice roads, but the difference between them is significant. An ice road is in the main constructed anew annually, and its path can change from year to year. A winter road is generally surveyed and cut, and the route remains the same from year to year, and there can even be permanent bridges built along the route to bridge waterways. A winter road is generally just a seasonal road that is impassable except in winter.  I've therefore referred back to the Winter road page where the content discusses issues that are in common, but otherwise I support having ice roads as a separate page.
+I find this article a bit confusing in scope in that it is called ice road and yet contains a section on ice roads and winter roads. While it is common for winter roads to have sections across rivers (e.g. the Albany River), most of the time winter roads are on land. I think ice roads should be reserved for roads that travel for most of their length across lakes or other large bodies of water.
 ==split==