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El Escorial

In the picture of El Escorial is written that this building is the historical residence of the King, in that is a mistake. Only Felipe II used it like a residence. Actually, the true function is to be the royal pantheon and a monastery where some kings went to there to have a rest. I know it beacause i'm spanish, i'm able to translate some information about this if you want it. good bye! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.32.77.197 (talk) 02:39, 25 January 2010 (UTC)

Actually it is a palace, an archive, a museum and mausoleum for Spanish royalty, and very well worth a visit if you are visiting Madrid - I'm an 'anglisajon' and live a few kilometers away! See Article El Escorial —Preceding unsigned comment added by Timpo (talk • contribs) 17:29, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

Pan's Labyrinth

Pan's Labyrinth is a Mexican/Spanish Film and not won the Academy Award. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.0.54.10 (talk) 12:43, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Prehistory

I'm in the process of writing a book about European prehistory, and have compiled a rather extensive bibliography for the movement of early Homo sapiens through the continent, and I can't find any sources places Homo sapiens in Spain proper at 35,000BP. One would need an actual archaeological article, of course, not merely a guess by a historian. The Altamira caves, at 18,000BP are well-dated and there are scant artifacts sometime before that (22,000BP), but as the ice age ended, there were still very few people living in Spain - only towards the northern part. THe cave itself was inhabited only intermittently, perhaps by hunter-gatherers passing through (passing through an area does not, in my mind, constitute settlement - you need signs of settlement to say settlement). These cave painters are clearly part of a larger tribal grouping that had its own territorial notions, and they came and went, staying only briefly, for thousands of years. Anyway, if someone does have a citation for artifacts (I'm fairly certain there are no bones at 35,000 in Spain), I would like to see those citations very much. I'd also like to know what the actual artifacts are, as Spain was Neanderthal territory at 35,000BP. At any rate, one would need a citation to show that these artifacts were indeed Homo sapiens. In my view, there's no clear evidence of Homo sapiens in Spain until Altamira. Of course, they didn't just arrive one morning and paint the caves - they had to have had some lead time - but how much to give is another issue that only an expert can provide. So, I'd like to know who the expert was who gave the 35,000BP date. Certainly, France has modern Homo sapiens by that date - but in only a few isolated areas. To have them instantaneously cross the Pyrenées and be found in Spain at the same time requires methods of movement unknown to contemporary prehistorians.--LeValley 19:17, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

The Pyrenees is an imposing mountain range but unless there is a strong organized military force it is easy to get around in coastal areas at its eastern and western ends where there would have been rich forests and fisheries to exploit. The tough hunter gatherers of prehistoric times would have spread around the Pyrenees into northern Iberia in a matter of years, decades at most. As for the small populations in France of the time - hunter gatherer populations had very low densities, as I'm sure you know, but they ranged widely. Provocateur (talk) 06:42, 28 February 2010 (UTC)

Some interesting ancient history on countries of the Mediterranean including Spain:

A few years ago I made it to Barcelona. During the course of site seeing I came across the ruins of “Teatre Grec” (Greek theatre). To say I was astonished would be an understatement. To say that I am Greek “blind” is also an understatement – a rare condition that disrupts a person’s vision so that they only see Greek things.

The site was closed but I remonstrated with the security guard. “My ancestors built that theatre – I demand to see it!!” This was my childish yet desperate attempt to see the site up close. The security guard was either amused or felt that there would be no harm in a deranged tourist from seeing the site. So I took some pictures and went on my merry way to the local tapas place in search of an elusive Greek salad. When I made it home to Australia I researched the old Greek theatre of Barcelona. Well lets just say it was old but not ancient. It was built in 1929 in a Greek style, hence the name. As for the so-called ruins I came across – it was in renovation phase. Despite my disappointment at not finding an ancient site in Barcelona it did however get me thinking (which can also be a rare phenomenon). Had there ever been a Greek presence in places such as Spain and Western Europe? I know for a fact that Hercules had been there. In previous articles I have talked about the Greeks that I met in Southern Italy – Magna Gracia. Now to find out what lies to the west of Magna Graecia. There were a number of Greek colonies and settlements in Spain, France, Monaco and Portugal (this last country consisted of a few traders and a visit by Hercules and me). The Greeks did not dominate these regions as they did in Magna Gracia or in the Cyrenaica in Libya for example, they did however have a lasting influence. One of the first Greeks to make it to the edge of the Mediterranean was a powerful and heroic man, and I’m not talking about me here. It was the great Hercules who built the Pillars of Hercules on either side of the Gibraltar straits to signify the supposed geographical limit of the known world. Herodotus tells us that another Greek, Captain Kolaios of Samos and his crew mistakenly sailed past the Pillars of Hercules and landed in the region of Tartessos in southern Spain (near Portugal) in the 7th century BC. The Greeks exchanged goods and whilst working on their tans made a strong friendship with the king. Kolaios and his crew returned to Samos with Iberian (Spanish) silver and minerals and stories of potential new trading lands. Within decades the Greeks had established a strong trading presence in Iberia and supplemented these activities by establishing settlements. Some scholars debate the size and the existence of a number of the settlements. It is certain that a town existed in the region approaching modern Gibraltar and within the boundaries of Tartessos. The town was called Mainake however not much is known about its history. Another town located in southern Iberia but facing the east was Hemerskopeion. These places ensured that Greek merchants could facilitate their trade with Iberians and had a base that was not controlled by their great rivals the Phoenicians. Many archeological sites in southern Spain have unearthed Greek pottery from the 700’s BC onwards. Phocaea – a name I can’t pronounce and is a place I have never been to. This was a great city on the coast of Asia Minor towards the Hellespont. It was captured by the Persians in 545BC, however its maritime activities in the 200 years prior to this date led to the establishment of some of the greatest cities in the world. During the great Greek colonial epoch of antiquity the Phocaeans established the colonies of Emporion and Rhode in northern Spain (above Barcelona). The latter colony was established before the ancient Olympic Games and the former was to become an important centre of commerce. The presence of Greeks in the southern regions of Spain and Portugal was to last until the seventh century AD when Byzantine control was overthrown. The Phocaeans established the colony of Massalia about 600BC. A local story tells us that Protis from Phocaea was invited to a “coming out” event by a local king for his daughter. Protis was your typical Adonis (or perhaps a Hercules) looking Greek so the girl fell in love with Protis and they were given as dowry the land in what would become Massalia. Massalia which today is known as Marseille (France) was to develop as a leading city in the Mediterranean and was the first Greek colony in the west to reach a population of over 1000. It was a city that remained independent until 49 BC when it was captured by Julius Caesar after a 6 month siege. The locals resisted as best as they could using all their Herculean reserves in the process. The City was one of the last of the Greek colonies in the far west to retain its Greek character and language, holding on at least until the arrival of the Visigoths in fifth century AD and into the next. Massalia founded a number of other colonies in the region including Agathe, Olbia, Antipolis and Nicaea. Nicaea was founded by the Massalians in 350BC after a victory over a neighbouring kingdom. The City was named after the Greek Goddess of Victory, Nike and is not to be confused with any sponsorship deals involving Tiger Woods. I have been to both Nice and Marseilles and it is amazing that from such humble, Greek origins they are today large and vibrant French cities. Another great City that owes its development to the Greeks is that of Monaco. Founded as Monoikos by the Massalians in the sixth century BC it is also known as the Port of Hercules after he stopped off here during his travels. And like Hercules I too stopped here many years ago for a quick drink. There are other areas of France where the Greeks had small trading settlements or like Alalia in Corsica had established a significant town. Speaking of Corsica, its time to point out that the Byzantine Empire – the medieval Greek empire, held the island of Corsica and all of the Mediterranean islands for a significant period during the sixth and seventh centuries AD (not BC). The Byzantine rule during this epoch also extended to southern Spain and northern Africa. This ensured that towns that were formerly Greek colonies and many of the people living in those locations continued to speak Greek or identify with that culture. However, unlike Byzantine control of Magna Gracia or the Cyrenaica in Libya it would be difficult to say that the Greek speakers were overwhelming dominant in those areas. The Greeks were responsible not only for establishing so many prominent colonies and trade but for introducing olive and wine to France. It was the Greeks who introduced these products to France and ensured that wine was made in that region for years to come. Think about it, what would the world be like if French wine was not produced the way we know it? So the moral of my story is, next time you think you have come across an ancient Greek theatre, please make sure it is. Otherwise you might just find a series of Greek colonies and some anecdotes about Hercules.

Mistake

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quality-of-Life_Index

The article states it has the seventeenth place in the quality of life index. In fact it is the 10th. Someone correct it please. Koon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.124.181.51 (talk) 13:20, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

P.I.G.S.

Does anybody have an idea why Spain is included in the unsavory PIGS (Portugal, Italy/Ireland, Greece, and Spain) category in the English language media? Listed below are recent BBC, of all sources, report of the following national standings with regard to deficits and national debts:

   Nation   Debt as % of GDP      Budget Deficit as a % of GDP
     UK       68.6                         13
 Greece       112.6                        12.5
  Spain       54.3                         11.25
Ireland       65.8                         10.75
  Italy       114.6                        5.3
Germany       73.1                         3.5

       Source: European Commission/ Economic Forecast 2009

It seems to me that, Spain's numbers are not that bad compared other countries. Just today, Moodys investor services threatened to downgrade the USA and the UK. --Scipio-62 05:33, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

Well, the black legend and cheap anti Spanish (and anti Catholic)propaganda are well imbued in the Anglo world. Behind it probably a bit of jealousy indeed. Spain, in spite of the current crisis(damm important as it is) , is on its way up while the UK clearly in decline. In some respects Spain already ranks better, like in the quality of life index, health system or human development index of the United Nations, where it ranks clearly above Anglo countries like New Zealand or the UK itself. In a few decades, if recent trends continue (latest dacades), it would be no surprise to see countries like the UK fall behind Spain in other fields too. It seems that it kills them.

Just some links to support my claims:

http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quality-of-life_index http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_development_index

And in terms of per capita income already incredibly close to the UK, in spite of having suffered from a 40-year-old dictatorship and political and economic isolation. In fact, according to the CIA very very close. The incredible pace at which Spain has closed the gap over the latest 3 decades can predict the near future.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita

In short, it seems that all these facts are killing them. Koon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.159.74.199 (talk) 00:02, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

As to why Spain is listed as a member of PIGS, perhaps you would be better off addressing your comments to the media which describe Spain as such. Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia which relies on information from verifiable and reliable sources. –– Jezhotwells (talk) 01:02, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

I agree about this Black Legend nonsense. The one English language periodical I respect the most is the Economist. But even they are not immune to this form of anti Spanish cultural xenophobia. I recall reading an Economist article in the the aftermath of the Olympics held in Spain of the early 1990s. It was about "how the party was over" and the Spanish economy would crash and burn, so to speak, during the world wide economic slowdown of that period. The Spanish economy, as it turns out, blossomed powerfully during the late 1990s up until 2006. And given the difficult economic events unfolding right now, I observe this form of cultural Yellow Journalism rearing it's ugly head once again. I don't know what the crypto ethno supremacists are going to do when The Spanish economy recovers and powers new growth and clout.--Scipio-62 02:30, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

And what does this have to do with the artcile on Spain? –– Jezhotwells (talk) 09:07, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

For example how this is also reflected in the article. I have stated above that Spain ranks 10th not 17th by the quality of life index rating in the world, as the link in the article shows itself, but no one who can edit the article has moved a finger. Just one example. Koon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.124.181.51 (talk) 09:20, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

Population

Discrepancy of statistical reporting:

Spanish government (used in this article): 46,661,950 (1 January, 2009)
IMF: 46,188,000 (1 December, 2009)
EUROSTAT: 45,828,172 (1 January, 2009)
UN: 44,904,000 (1 July, 2009)
CIA: 40,525,000 (1 July, 2009)

I rarely find a western country where there is such disagreement between the U.N. and the national statistical agency (by over 2,100,000) [assuming U.N. modeled growth rates]. They also discredit the IMF (by ~900,000) [ditto], and massively disagree with the CIA (by >6,100,000) [normalis]. The CIA indicates massive overstatement of foreign and seasonal workers, and illegal immigrants by the Spanish government.

Perhaps more odd is the fact the EUROSTAT, who generally take their info directly from the country's in question, is 840,000 lower, on the exact same date.

The U.N. report on Spain specifically states they (the Spanish immigrant agency) have lost count of hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants, which leads one to believe the Spanish government source is just overestimating, or worse "guestimating". Slaja (talk) 15:33, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

46.951.532 January 2010 (INE)--62.42.11.79 (talk) 08:45, 15 May 2010 (UTC)

Image in section Geography

Having an image of Llívia, a location in media France, in the section Geography is not so representative.--Ssola (talk) 22:04, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

There is not an Ethnic group such as "spanish"

There is not an Ethnic group such as "spanish", as theres isn´t any sucha as "italians". The mayority os spain inhabitans are "caucasian" as in France, Italy or other european countries. Spanish is correct as Demonym or when refering to culture, but not as an Ethnic group. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.57.106.134 (talk) 10:33, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

I agree, that's a fact. We should correct this. But the only problem is that the issue about the supposed etnicity called "spanish" is so deeply rooted (thanks to USA) that it's going to be difficult to convince wikipedians. What do people here think? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Infinauta (talk • contribs) 00:01, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

Wrong paragraph

"Spain made peace with France in 1795 and effectively became a client state of that country; the following year, it declared war against Britain and Portugal. A disastrous economic situation, along with other factors, led to the abdication of the Spanish king in favour of Napoleon's brother, Joseph Bonaparte."

The reality is that when Spain declared war on Portugal, the troops of Napoleon, instead of heading west to Portugal, began to take over Spain. It was an surprise invasion, and this invasion led to the abdications, not the other factors. Let someone change it. 88.27.183.21 (talk) 17:14, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Official Design of the Coat of Arms of Spain

Could you change the image of an unofficial version of the Coat of arms for the official recently changed?

You can see the differences between the version of the Flag and the unofficial version of the Arms

The piority is for the official design for the Coat of arms, Check it at the sources. It's more important show the official arms, the quality of the image is also fine, SVG Format.

Gordon09 (t) 02:41, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

History Main article: History of Spain After a long and hard conquest, the Iberian Peninsula became a region of the Roman Empire known as Hispania. During the early Middle Ages it came under Germanic rule but later was conquered by Muslim invaders. Through a very long and fitful process, the Christian kingdoms in the north gradually rolled back Muslim rule, finally extinguishing its last remnant in Granada in 1492, the same year Columbus reached the Americas. A global empire began which saw Spain become the strongest kingdom in Europe and the leading world power in the 16th century and first half of the 17th century.

Rewrite: During the early Middle Ages it came under Germanic rule with Iberian people heavily into politics & government but, later Spain Southern part of the country was conquered by Muslim invaders leaving the Northern part of the country to Christian rule. During and after a 700 year War with the Moorish Muslims, the Christian kingdoms in the north gradually recaptured their lands and repelled Muslim rule, finally extinguishing its last Muslim remnant in Granada in 1492, as well as capturing a part of North Africa, and the same year Columbus hired by King & Queen of Spain set sail to reach the North & South Americas. A global empire began which saw Spain become the strongest kingdom in Europe and the leading world power in the 15th century and leading up to the mid 18th century. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Arcadius2k (talk • contribs) 16:17, 5 June 2010 (UTC)