Talk:Control of cities during the Syrian civil war

Map with Roads and Highways Ready

Following the news about civil war in Irak and Syria, we hear about important roads and Highwys. But we don't see them on the maps to get better oriented. Please someone add roads and highways also to the maps. Thanks! -> In Persian:

با دنبال کردن خبر ها در باره ی جنگ درونمرزی در عراق و سوریه و .. ما همواره چیزهایی در باره ی راه ها و شاهراه های مهم میخوانیم ولی آنهارا در نقشه پیدا نمیکنیم و نمیتوانیم جا های یاد شده را بهتر بیابیم. پس خواهشمندم که راه ها و شاهراه هارا هم به این نقشه ها بیفزایید. سپاس.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.75.52.4 (talk) 11:57, 28 October 2015 (UTC) 

Good idea, I was thinking of the same, especially knowing situation near Ithriya. We can add them just the same as other background maps, but these should be simpler, with just lines. --Hogg 22 (talk) 12:01, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

Who can do this? Who manages the background map? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.75.52.4 (talk) 15:38, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

Wouldn't the addition of roads and major highways require a changing of the background image for the template? I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to this, but I don't know of any way to add the roads without a changing of the .png image used in the background, besides, what colour would we make them? Black would be too close to IS's dot colour, similarly, grey would be too close to al-Nusra's. DaJesuZ (talk) 14:06, 29 October 2015 (UTC)

I dont know if a new layer can provide the roads or rather changing the backgroud map. But what concerns the color of highways, it is often yellow-orange with thin red borders on each side like here : Damascus Road Map . The roads colors must be kept neutral to civil war parties. we can see then from rectangle-dots ( f.e. IS presence on Ithariya road ) , who controls the road part at any time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.75.52.4 (talk) 08:32, 30 October 2015 (UTC)

I made a Map with Roads and Highways on base of the existent map. Here it is in png format:SyriaRoadsMap Can somebody who has the autority, replace the old one with this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.75.52.4 (talk) 13:04, 30 October 2015 (UTC)

That looks absolutely awesome! 84.212.61.74 (talk) 13:08, 30 October 2015 (UTC)

Great efforet thatnk you. I don't know how to replace the original one with th is though :( Helmy1453 (talk) 14:08, 30 October 2015 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your work! I have a question for you. The original file (Syria location map3.svg) is in .SVG format. Can you save your file in .SVG format? What will happen is that your file will have to be uploaded in Wikimedia Commons (https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Syria_location_map3.svg) as "a new version of file" Syria location map3.svg Then everything should work automatically. By the way, User:Spesh531 is the one who has updated this file the most lately. Also, there is another thing. The Highways need to be much thinner. They are now too intrusive. The red border can be removed and the orange line made a lot thinner. It should be thick enough to distinguish them from other roads, but not more. Maybe just double the thickness of the other road lines. Tradedia^talk 11:05, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

I will modify the map as requested as soon as possible. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:6A:6740:5E82:5138:4B24:66B0:26C3 (talk) 18:07, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

I made the Highways much thinner now, but I have no possibility to chenge my PNG file to Vector file SVG . But As I see, there is no obligation to use a SVG file, because the dimentions don't change in all browsers. But if anyone can make a SVG -format file out of this, please go ahead. Here is the new map in PNG -format.Syria Road Map With Thinner Highways — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:6A:6740:5E82:651B:C436:1C10:7C82 (talk) 20:41, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

Ok, so I went ahead and uploaded your PNG file as a new file (File:Syria location map4.png) to be used as a template for Syria maps. If someone has a problem with it being a new PNG file instead of the previous SVG file then they can do what they need to do... By the way, I have personally claimed copyright of the file & allowed it to be freely distributed. If this is a problem for you then please let me know (I am not sure if the copyright can be attributed to an anonymous IP as opposed to a user name account...) The new Highways look great. However, there seems to be a mistake in the al-Ithriyah-Khanasir road. According to wikimapia, the road goes through Khanasir. However, on our map, the road does not go through Khanasir, but rather to the east of it. I verified the coordinates of Khanasir on our map, and found it is correct (lat = "35.782", long = "37.499"). By the way, I make a call to all viewers (& editors) of the map to look for mistakes in the highways & roads (and post them in this section) so that we can find them & iron them out once and for all. Again, thank you very much user IP 212/2003 for your contribution. This was long overdue. Tradedia^talk 05:12, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Thank you very much applying my map. I know , there can be some minor deviations ( so I hope) from real road locations. But now we have a background-Basis-road-map and everybody who can work with a Paint-application, can correct those devations which are in important front lines.

I modified tha map to correct the road near Khanasir and added some road-numbers for better orientation with the news. here it is:correction #1 and some road numbers — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.75.52.4 (talk) 11:15, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Actually we do not need the road-numbers. They are too intrusive and the media do not mention road numbers much. For example, I don't recall the media mentioning that the Salamiyah-Ithriyah road is number 42. Tradedia^talk 11:55, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

OK, This one is without road numbers :roads without numbers — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.75.52.4 (talk) 12:25, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Thank you very much. Correction uploaded! Tradedia^talk 14:43, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Hey i noticed that the road between manbij to raqqah via tishrin dam was missing, its a pretty important road, as its the shortest route between manbij and raqqah for IS. if you guys could find the time to add it, it would be a great addition, i dont know how to add the roads, else i would attempt it myself. Midgetman433 (talk) 15:45, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for your participation. I will wait maybe 2 days for some other change requests and then I will fulfill them all together. 2003:6A:6740:5E82:5138:4B24:66B0:26C3 (talk) 18:37, 2 November 2015 (UTC) MapMaker

This was really good work! thanks to all that contributed!Rhocagil (talk) 17:30, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

I reverted the change of the global Syria map definition from SVG to PNG. Either add the roads to an SVG version of the map (preferably), or specify the PNG as an AlternativeMap in the module. Re the IP, if you use Inkscape instead of MS Paint (or whatever it is you're using), it'll let you edit and save SVGs. Jackmcbarn (talk) 19:02, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Fair enough. I figured out a different way that does not use the global module. There was already a map in use as an AlternativeMap in the global module and it is in use on many articles. Tradedia^talk 03:19, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

@Tradedia: You actually had AlternativeMap and image1 mixed up. In any case, it's sorted out now, and it's now using just the original definition (not the Syriawar one) but still using the right map. Jackmcbarn (talk) 22:35, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

@Jackmcbarn: Ok, I see what you mean now. Thanks. Tradedia^talk 23:17, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for your work. But the roads near Ghamam in Latakia are not in the correct position. See [1]. Schluppo (talk) 10:57, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Same holds for the Jisr-al-Shugour area; streets are quite bugged there: e.g. Bishlaymun [2] sits a few kilometers north of the highway. On the new map with roads, it is directly on the highway. etc. I fear it is going to take some serious effort to add all these minor corrections to the position of roads in all the places where it is necessary. Cheers, Schluppo (talk) 11:17, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

OK, I modified the roadmap : 1- Added Road Manjib to Al-Raqqa via Tishrin dam + 2- Highway Lakatia-Jisr al Shoghur corrected (Ghammam) . Here the modified file : Syria Roads Correction 2 . 212.75.52.4 (talk) 11:52, 3 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

Thanks. New version uploaded! Tradedia^talk 23:17, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Hello, thanks for the great work with the roads, it is extremely helpful. But, could you correct the one road that goes throgh Southern Aleppo? It actually extends from Tall Daman through Burida, Kafr Abid and Blas to Sheik Said and doesnt go through al-Manatir. Thanks in advance. Oberschlesien1990 (talk) 14:28, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for your participation. I will wait maybe 2 days for some other change requests and then I will fulfill them all together. --212.75.52.4 (talk) 15:46, 4 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

New modified roads map: Here is the Road Map Syria Correction 3. I corrected the road from Tall Daman to Aleppo (Sheikh Sa'id) + the Highway from Jisr-Al-Shoghur to Ariha. --212.75.52.4 (talk) 12:03, 5 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

Thanks. New version uploaded! Tradedia^talk 12:48, 5 November 2015 (UTC)

Hey could you add the al hawl road that connects the syria/iraq road to al hawl and road that connects al hawl to hasakah, it is a very important road b/c this the pathway IS uses to push further into cizire canton and the hasakah countryside, it would do a better job as to explaining the strategic importance of al-hawl and why the ypg has launched a huge offensive to capture al-hawl. b/c without the road al hawl just looks like a town in the middle of a desert, and the observer cannot understand its strategic importance. here is the road displayed on wikimapia for reference: http://wikimapia.org/#lang=en&lat=36.387018&lon=41.060715&z=11&m=b Midgetman433 (talk) 14:54, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Here is the modified Syria roads map (Road Map Syria Correction 4) with:
1- Al-Hawl road to Hasaka and to border
2- ICRADA at the right side of Highway
3- Road from Uqayribat to Tadmur via al-Mushayrifah
4- Ain_Issa to Al-Qantari Road --212.75.52.4 (talk) 10:13, 13 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

Hasakah Front

What source(s) were used to edit villages in the Haskah Province surrounding Al-Hawl? I say this as a reliable pro-Kurdish map maker, Cizire Canton has released a [[3]] for the 10 Nov which contradicts our map.Prohibited Area (talk) 13:54, 10 November 2015 (UTC)

Prohibited Area unreliable facebook and pro-kurdish sources were used to edit this villages especially the oil fields.Another map realeasd about this issue agathocledesyracuse.Lists129 (talk) 21:20, 10 November 2015 (UTC)

The villages marked as YPG-held south of Al-Hawl are a particularly strange edits.Rhocagil (talk) 22:28, 10 November 2015 (UTC)

Lists129 (talk)Rhocagil (talk) Tradedia^talk Ok so the villages south of Hawl have been edited back to IS held; do you think this scenario is appropriate to use the Cizire Canton map to edit towns otherwise our portrayal of the situation is almost certainly flawed. Given CC is a pro-Kurdish source and is very reliable I would consider it reliable for editing however it would violate rule 2 of editing. However given that rule 2 states that maps are approximate and therefore unreliable, CC is generally very specific and therefore I would argue contradicts this. Opinions?Prohibited Area (talk) 20:07, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

I think the source is good enough to make a reverse-edit. Also ARA-news (pro-kurd) has not written anything about YPG/SDF presence south of Al-Hawl and in this interview (from today 11/11) SDF spokes-person says that they are to besiege Al-Hawl, not that it´s already under siege. A big problemm is that Al-masdar and SOHR are not writing to much about it, and when SOHR writes about it they hardly ever mention places only that there were progress.Rhocagil (talk) 22:13, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

I was just about to complain about the same thing, when I saw this thread. user:LightandDark2000 stubbornly makes pro-yellow edits based on unreliable sources (random tweets, biased sources) or even change the map based on his interpretation of the source. For example, here he changed Khuytlh Khan and Sawi to yellow based on this source. I tried to translate it and from what I see, none of these villages is mentioned. The source does mention they are 3 km from "November field" (I guess it is former "November east station", but that information is far from enough to make any nearby village yellow. If someone here speaks Arabic, please read this article and check is there any mention of these villages or even some mountain where those villages are positioned.

user:LightandDark2000 proved very stubborn in his pro-yellow edits and doesn't respond well to criticism. So, if You wandered why is our map so yellow-optimistic, I believe this user's edits might be the reason. Someone should talk to him. I tried, but with no success.

Another thing, I'm not sure if this is part of the same problem, but it's at least geographically close: In Iraq, just opposite of Hasakah, NW from Sinjar mountain, there are villages marked yellow for months now. I just discovered that they are under Kurd control, but only since a few days ago. Thisa pro-yellow tweet says: 5 villages in Şengal #Sinjar liberated from #ISIS today - Faw, Zeko, Mujuli, Siheil, Bir Qasim - in ongoing ops (v @Rojnewsku) #Kurdistan. You can find some of these villages on Template:Syrian, Iraqi, and Lebanese insurgencies detailed map, just next to Syrian border, with names Al Faw, Zaku, Ber Qasim ... --Hogg 22 (talk) 08:43, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

He did it again. I asked for explanation. If I don't get proper one, I will have to revert it, again. --Hogg 22 (talk) 10:26, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Hogg 22 I reverted the edit by LightandDark2000 you referred to this time. Hopefully he can learn to start a discussion around biased sources before using them as edit-sources.Rhocagil (talk) 17:08, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

I have edited the map to change falsely proclaimed YPG-held towns back to ISIS held towns until they are changed per reliable sources, since it is hard to accurately interpret the map I am now looking for reliable sources to edit this area as well. Al-Hawl has also been captured by YPG as of a few hours ago.Prohibited Area (talk) 16:38, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Tel Othman, Hama

Recently, rebels took Tell Othman near Kafr Nabudah. The hill was then changed back to red because Al-Masdar (as only source) reported that the SAA had retaken the hill. And what do we see today? An Al-Masdar article, showing a map in which Tell Otman is several kilometers behind rebel lines in Al-Bani. So the hill should be green, as was pointed out a week ago.

Source: http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/understanding-the-syrian-armys-strategic-loss-at-morek-where-do-they-go-from-here/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 10:06, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

Also, somebody changed Mugahyr, the grain silos and Tell Sakhr to red. The Al-Masdar map also shows those locations as rebel-held. Change it back. There have been no sources given on this page that justify the change! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 11:20, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

After publishing the map that you refer to, al-Masdar reported in another article that Mugahyr, the grain silos and Tell Sakhr were taken by SAA. This report was given as a source for the edit, so the edit is perfectly fine. 109.43.2.191 (talk) 12:00, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

See [4] Schluppo (talk) 13:26, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

Then it should be contested? If one source reports on the same day that a village is rebel held and loyalist held, something is amiss. Since no other sources are reporting anything about a SAA counterattack, we should be cautious. Also, the hill is still not edited? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 16:56, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

The latest reliable source wins. Also we cannot rely on maps. 109.43.0.239 (talk) 22:33, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

The latest reliable source is the map from al-Masdar? The article doesn't mention tell Otman as retaken. so, edit the hill! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.31.204.195 (talk) 13:56, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Regarding Mugahyr, the grain silos and Tell Sakhr, the latest reliable source appears to be [5], stating that these places are under SAA control. Regarding Tell Othman, we cannot rely on maps, so we have to rely on the latest reliable source with text about Tell Othman. This appears to be [6] which was used to color Tell Othman red about one week ago. Since then, there was apparantly no reliable source stating that rebels retook Tell Othman. However, if you have a newer RELIABLE source that is NOT A MAP and states that the rebels retook Tell Othman, Mugahyr, the grain silos or Tell Sakhr, please provide it. Schluppo (talk) 16:04, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Fajdan

Fajdan, south of Safira, has had a green half circle for months, if not years, but I have absolutely never seen any reporting about this whatsoever. Could anybody provide a source, or remove the half circle. MesmerMe (talk) 11:30, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Is there an admin familiar with rules for editing this map?

It seams we have a problem with one stubborn user: User:LightandDark2000. Multiple users complained about his editing of the map, but he ignored everything and even deletes all complaints from his talk page. Which admin should I contact to discipline him? --Hogg 22 (talk) 12:24, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Indeed, this user is repeatedly breaking the rules, e.g. using partisan tweets as source and re-reverting anyone that reverts such edits. User:LightandDark2000: Please, adhere to the rules or stop editing! Schluppo (talk) 16:08, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

I raised this issue on Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents. --Hogg 22 (talk) 11:45, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Al-Hadhir

Please change the status for the Al-Hadir town from contested (red+green) to red. --212.75.52.4 (talk) 13:18, 12 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker iranian source

Confirmed by Reuters: http://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/Middle-East/2015/Nov-12/322778-pro-syrian-govt-forces-seize-aleppo-province-town-of-al-hader-near-kweires-airbase-from-isis.ashx MesmerMe (talk) 13:32, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

DoneAriskar (talk) 13:43, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Pro-opposition sources also reported SAA captured Al Hadhir.hereherehere 37.52.25.102 (talk) 14:31, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Icarda is placed on the wrong side of the road .86.135.154.78 (talk) 17:27, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Probably the road is placed wrong side of Icarda. Rhocagil (talk) 19:37, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Al-Eis with SAA confirmed by SOHR - http://www.syriahr.com/2015/11/%D8%AD%D8%B2%D8%A8-%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%84%D9%87-%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%84%D8%A8%D9%86%D8%A7%D9%86%D9%8A-%D9%88%D9%82%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%AA-%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%86%D8%B8%D8%A7%D9%85-%D9%8A%D8%B3%D9%8A%D8%B7%D8%B1%D8%A7/ Pro-SAA sources claiming that even Tall-Bajir (SW of Hadher) taken by the army. But wait for some confirmation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.240.103.242 (talk) 20:16, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

SOHR said that the AA/Hezbollah and NDF regain control of the town of Al Eis and the surrounding countryside, after heavy fighting in the town, with Al-Nusra and rebels.SOHR So this means that town Al Eis and Al Eis mountain and Army Fuelling Base under SAA. 46.201.74.27 (talk) 21:18, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

I will correct the map as soon as I can. --2003:6A:6740:5E82:D108:FF7:F61D:4E72 (talk) 21:40, 12 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

Hey, what do you think you are doing? There are already reports that the SAA did NOT, I repeat NOT, capture al-Eis and al-Hadir has already been captured back by the rebels. You are way to quick to change the map, even though the operations are still going on. Kolya60, 08:44 GMT, 12.November 2015 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kolya60 (talk • contribs) 07:45, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Not even the "5000 hero reinforcement from Hama" is true, but they captured everything back right :D "reports" Actually there are pictured reports that Tel eiz(not Eis),Banes and Rasm al-Sahreej got captured. http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/islamist-rebel-defenses-collapsing-in-southern-aleppo-two-more-villages-captuted-by-the-syrian-army-and-hezbollah/Totholio (talk) 10:02, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

See [7], [8]. Schluppo (talk) 10:08, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Could somebody add Tell Hadiya to the map as rebel held? It just south of the ICARDA base here. MesmerMe (talk) 10:47, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

And it is already in the hands of SAA :D (waiting for sohr/masdar to translate)Totholio (talk) 12:47, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Confirmed: http://news.yahoo.com/syrian-army-captures-village-aleppo-province-monitor-state-113912327.html Can somebody add it? MesmerMe (talk) 12:49, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Al-Eis is not even close to contested, SAA/Hezb/allies are attacking Zaytan and Barqun(just norteast of ICARDA), Birnah is red according to logic. http://www.syriahr.com/en/2015/11/intense-shelling-on-the-southern-countryside-of-aleppo-while-violent-clashes-erupt-in-the-area/Totholio (talk) 17:30, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Marj as-Sultan

Earlier reliable source said that the SAA captured Army base to west of town Deir Salman and entered to the Strategic Marj Al-Sultan Airbase.here

Later pro opposition source said that the Assad-forces & Hezbollah take over most of Marj as-Sultan & Marj as-Sultan helicopter base.source 37.52.25.102 (talk) 14:44, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

They probably refer to southern hellicopter base, not the northern one. --Hogg 22 (talk) 08:11, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Can we turn the southern helicopter base red? Paolowalter (talk) 14:54, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

I did, but it was reverted quite quick. MesmerMe (talk) 16:33, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Mistake at drawing the roads

The road linking Al-Qantari to Ayn Issa in north is not accurate. It should pass through both towns, not north of them. Look for example at google maps. Roboskiye (talk) 11:07, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for your mention. I correct the map as soon as possible . --212.75.52.4 (talk) 12:09, 13 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

Southern Aleppo

I think some towns in villages in Southern Aleppo are displayed quite larger on the map than they are in reality. Could someone have a look on this? Oberschlesien1990 (talk) 11:44, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Talaylat

SAA captured Talaylat 4-5 days ago per: http://southfront.org/international-military-rewiev-syria-iraq-battlespace-nov-9-2015/ and http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/syrian-army-and-hezbollah-capture-talaylat-in-southern-aleppo-moroccan-field-commander-killed/Ariskar (talk) 12:41, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

It was lost shortly afterwards. Probably it has been retaken in the mean time because of the SAA push to west, but it was not mentioned anymore. t can be turned red in a couple of days if no additional info comes out.Paolowalter (talk) 14:52, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Rif Damash

This battle map so out of date and should be updated...2.180.124.105 (talk) 14:28, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Situation is getting worse day by day. If things does not change we can consider removing it and going back to the old map. Advances to the Marj sultan base are not included and the control of all or most of the M1 highway from SAA is not included as well.Paolowalter (talk) 22:31, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

To continue, the Aleppo one needs significant tweaking as well, they're vastly outdated. Who is the one editing them? MesmerMe (talk) 16:27, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Naming ISIS/ISIL/IS

I think we should come up with a name that we all agree on for the Islamic State, as I don't think the names ISIL (Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant) or ISIS [Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham (Also called the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria, but the group never referred to itself as this)] work, as the group controls area in Libya, Afghanistan, and has fighters spread everywhere from Algeria to northern Pakistan, far outside the Levant. For the entirety of the time I've been here on this Talk page, and doing my best to help with whatever is going on on the ground, I've referred to this group as IS (Islamic State), and, regardless of anyone's views towards the group, whether their actions and views are representative of Islam or not, I believe that is the best name for them, as they refer to themselves as this, and the name does not imply that they are restricted to a small, specific area of the globe. What are everyone else's views on this?DaJesuZ (talk) 17:29, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Well, because Obama, as well as the US government in general, has been pretty hesitant to send weapons to any opposition groups, but have started doing so in the past year or so, McCain is only a senator, thus not having the authority to send anything, by himself, the CIA is under the authority of, basically, the president, and thus can't do anything on their own, and Netanyahu isn't in favor of the opposition groups taking over, as it would mean Israel would have to change its foreign policy towards Syria, something it's not willing to do any time soon, as they are far more used to a Ba'athist Syria, calling them any of these things doesn't fit particularly well.

Nice b8 m8, I r8 8/8.DaJesuZ (talk) 04:31, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Al Eis controlled by the Army or contested ?

Peto Map from November 13 showing this place under Army control https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTs_4ZXWIAACVzf.jpg:large — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.84.36.197 (talk) 17:52, 13 November 2015 (UTC) http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/breaking-syrian-army-and-hezbollah-officially-capture-the-strategic-town-of-jabal-al-eiss-in-southern-aleppo/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.84.36.197 (talk) 17:59, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Controlled: http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/syrian-army-and-hezbollah-capture-several-villages-in-southern-aleppo-en-route-to-cutting-off-the-m-5-highway/MesmerMe (talk) 18:02, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Prohibited Area is editing continuosly based on twitter or maps ofetn biased. I cannot revert all of them without breaking the 1RR rule. Please somebody should stop him.Paolowalter (talk) 18:04, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Al Eis under SAA.SOHRSOHRsourcesource Also all sources confirmed that th rebels also lost more territory to west, north and south from Al Eis they retreated to border with Idlib province.SOHRsourceSOHR 46.200.38.188 (talk) 21:23, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

al-Eis is not the question,Icarda/Barqoum is the front now it should be contested.(looking at both sides reports)Totholio (talk) 21:45, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

SOHR said that the SAA captured Barqoum.SOHR and SAA catured Icarda.SOHR. So this objects held-SAA but not contested. 46.200.38.188 (talk) 06:16, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

I know but the front is at Barqoum now the orcs are trying to attack.Totholio (talk) 08:23, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Paolowalter (talk)I used a map to revert unreliable edits based in East Hasakah Governorate as approved by during a thread on the talks page. I have not used maps for any of other edits, as all others were reliable and detailed sourcesProhibited Area (talk) 12:22, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Prohibited Area but you have broken a rule of editing when you noted the town Al Eis as contested on based clear anti-SAA(pro FSA) source .here Despite the fact that more reliable sources including the SOHR confirm that the town controlled army. 46.200.38.188 (talk) 13:04, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

The only sources saying Al-Eis was contested are twitter cause the frontline is far from Eis since days.Totholio (talk) 14:19, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Using any outside map as a source for edits, whether or not the edits are based on reliable sources or not, is against the rules for editing, Prohibited Area. You know this. If any edits are made that are not accurate, revert them, and provide a source justifying your edits. Using a map for your edits creates bias.DaJesuZ (talk) 00:07, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

I only used a map after it was approved by other editors on the talk page. It was used as a reliable source to revert earlier unreliable edits; since this edit most of these villages have since been changed back to YPG-held in light of reliable sources detailing their control under the YPG. My edit on Al-Eis however, was inaccurate as it was a pro-rebel source and hence I apologise.Prohibited Area (talk) 10:37, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

Jubb al-Jarrah

Jubb al-Jarrah in the eastern countryside of Homs under SAA but not ISIS.SOHR 46.200.38.188 (talk) 21:26, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 14 November 2015

Jisr Al Shughur is under the control of government forces, just wondering why you haven't shown this on the map ?

96.49.28.6 (talk) 10:14, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Its not, I take it you are quoting international military review which published several videos over the last few weeks saying Jisr Al Shughur was captured but there is a media blackout in this area also, but as far as I am aware the Syrian Arab Army are around 15-20 km south of this position.

Shaykh Miskin

SOHR also reported that the SAA advancement in the town Sheikh Meskin and seizing some parts of it.SOHR So that means that town Sheikh Meskin contested. 46.200.38.188 (talk) 11:32, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Al-Hawl is under YPG control

Who changed back village of Nazila, between Hasaka and al-Hawl to black? This village and its surrounding has captured by YPG since a week ago. since for example this ANHA (of course pro-YPg) cameraman interviewing the local villagers: http://www.hawarnews.com/%D8%A3%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%8A-%D9%82%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9-%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%86%D8%B2%D9%8A%D9%84%D8%A7-%D9%8A%D8%B4%D9%83%D8%B1%D9%88%D9%86-%D9%82%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%AA-%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A7-%D8%A7/ Same is true for Masudiyah and Um Hujra north of al Hawl. These villages were among the first ones which fell to YPG. Roboskiye (talk) 14:54, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

The village of Um Hujaira (wrongly labelled as Abu Hujaira on this map) captured today by YPG. It is 5 km northwest of Al Hawl and 12 km west of Khatuniyah. See ANHA report and the visual evidence provided in the link: http://www.hawarnews.com/%D9%82%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9-%D8%A3%D9%85-%D8%AD%D8%AC%D9%8A%D8%B1%D8%A9-%D9%85%D8%AD%D8%B1%D8%B1%D8%A9%D8%8C-%D9%88%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%85%D8%B1%D8%AA%D8%B2%D9%82%D8%A9-%D9%81%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%A7-%D9%85%D9%86/#prettyPhoto See even the road sign: http://hawarnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/2015-11-16.HSK_.DIMENEN.GUNDE_.UM-_72075262_-__.jpg Roboskiye (talk) 21:12, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

And here is visual evidence for Al-Hawl Grain Silos: http://hawarnews.com/%D9%85%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B2-%D8%AD%D8%A8%D9%88%D8%A8-%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%87%D9%88%D9%84-%D8%A8%D8%B9%D8%AF-%D8%AA%D8%AD%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%B1%D9%87/#prettyPhoto So we change village of Um Hujaira and al-Hawl Grain Silos according to the evidence. Roboskiye (talk) 10:30, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

M1 road in Damascus map

I think the Army controlled all or mosts sectors from M1 Road near Douma in Damascus map

These are lasted maps from that November 4 and 5 2015 https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CS_ZexIWEAA-5P1.jpg https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTEV4RIWwAA8h-0.jpg

The first source is very credible. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.84.36.197 (talk) 16:06, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

I agreed that this is very likely, but we need better sources. MesmerMe (talk) 16:13, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Peto map proved his credibility are very good his map always are 99,99% rights . — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.84.36.197 (talk) 18:57, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

That's not the point, we cannot use his maps a source MesmerMe (talk) 21:03, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

The source is good common... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.84.36.197 (talk) 23:20, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Maps cannot be used as sources. Provide something better to use for an edit.DaJesuZ (talk) 00:12, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

Now, however, we can edit. Source.MesmerMe (talk) 09:02, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia Syrian Civil War map

This map should really be deleted. It was reliable and stable 4 months ago but now became a place for 15 year old trolls and a place for shitposts. I don't have to mention that the map has 200 mistakes. Admin left this article months ago, they basically gave up, so I'm not sure why does this still exist. 109.175.58.213 (talk) 19:25, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

You should be deleted from here. This is the best map, 10x better than any big media outlet's map or professional analysts. You are 99% a nusra supporter.Totholio (talk) 11:39, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

And what 200 mistakes would that be?MesmerMe (talk) 21:04, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Yes, I would like to know it too. This map is my primary source of information and is always in line with other reliable sources. What I see is a lot of people carefully sifting through the news every day and updating the map. The only troll I see is the person who started this thread. --109.60.42.98 (talk) 21:22, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

If somebody is not happy with this map, he can use an alternative map and just leave this map to whom trust this map. In addition, I believe that this map is the best and most reliable and most lucid and most up-to-date map im whole internet. --2003:6A:6740:5E82:581C:8E48:8BBF:FF54 (talk) 20:20, 15 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

Syrian Arab Army control Handarat Town in Northern Aleppo.

This was reported on with a source a few months back, however it was decided that the source was not reliable at the time: but here in a pro government source it states ."......Syrian Government held town of Handarat and east of the rebel stronghold of Haritan;......" Source: [9] http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/breaking-syrian-army-and-hezbollah-launch-fresh-offensive-in-northern-aleppo/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.94.232.159 (talk) 23:07, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

I remember this coming up sometime ago, but because there is a city named Handarat as well, as well as a Handarat camp, we assumed they were referring to the camp. al-Masdar, by that time, was being used as a reliable source, but the claim that city of Handarat was controlled by regime forces was made by SyrianObserver2015. We haven't seen anything explicitly stating that the city is under government control.DaJesuZ (talk) 00:11, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

Handarat it is a village which under control of SAA and located to south of also SAA-held village Sayfat. This villages marked as under SAA on this map Rif Aleppo2 So don't need add this village on our map. 178.95.150.71 (talk) 12:07, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

Dayr Hanna

Dayr Hanna seems to be contested. http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/breaking-syrian-army-enters-deir-hanna-in-northern-latakia/ MesmerMe (talk) 09:06, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

SOHR reported that the SAA advance around the village of Ghamam and captured hill.SOHR So need removed green semicircle near Ghamam. 95.135.205.133 (talk) 11:21, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

SAA captured Deir Hanna village / Latakia (2 hours ago ?) --212.75.52.4 (talk) 13:05, 16 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

Seems like it, but needs confirmation. MesmerMe (talk) 13:09, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Latest from Al Masdar is more towns taken i can not find them on map .86.135.155.101 (talk) 19:40, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Al Mutilla is Daghmashllay according to wikimapia .86.135.155.101 (talk) 20:01, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Karkiz

SAA captures Karkiz southern Kuwaires --212.75.52.4 (talk) 10:43, 16 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

Source: http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/kuweires-military-airport-officially-secure-as-the-syrian-army-captures-kaskays-village/MesmerMe (talk) 11:02, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

SOHR also reported that the SAA captured village Karkiz to south of Kweiris Airbase.SOHR 95.135.205.133 (talk) 11:15, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Tall Syria Tel

Breaking :SAA imposed fire control on SyriaTel hill ( just westside of Tadmur) (?) --212.75.52.4 (talk) 12:43, 16 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

Fire control means they can target it by thier fire, not that they control it. Helmy1453 (talk) 16:45, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Regarding the Palmyra front, why were a lot of SAA held positions reverted about a months ago? MesmerMe (talk) 12:52, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Several Pro-SAA sources (including Al-Masdar) reported, that SAA was not closer than 10km to Palmyra. Schluppo (talk) 13:30, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Thank you, I didn't notice the reporting. MesmerMe (talk) 14:32, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

SAA/allies captured the Tal Syriatel and Jabal Ma’ar, Al-Bayarat the Ancient Palmyra Quarries, Al-Kassarat and Al-Dawa outside the city of Palmyra after a series of intense firefights with ISIS.source 95.134.186.238 (talk) 14:40, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

ICARDA base, south of Aleppo

This place was turned red some days ago by Prohibited Area using [10] as source. However, tweets and maps are in general not reliable sources and indeed, there are reports that the rebels still control ICARDA base, that (Russian) Airforce is bombing the base and that SAA is currently preparing to attack it. I found no reliable source claiming that SAA/shiite militias already took ICARDA base. Summing up, I think Prohibited Area's edit should be reverted unless there is a reliable source supporting it. Schluppo (talk) 17:47, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

If you have a pro-gov source claiming ICARDA based is under SAA or Russian attack that would be satisfactory to revert edit. I do not have a source as such however.Prohibited Area (talk) 18:13, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

The edit was based on a map from twitter, i.e. strongly violating the rules in the first place. Why would we need a source to revert it? Anyway, I found a reliable source (SOHR, yesterday) stating that SAA etc. took control of "ICARDA project near Kweires airbase" [11], which presumably refers to [12]. So it should stay red anyway. Schluppo (talk) 19:27, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Don't lie, Al masdar and pro opposition reported ICARDA taken, even SOHR, read back. Also this is not that ICARDA you are talking about. By the way pro SAA sources are arguing that SAA only got fire control on ICARDA cause after taking it they might retreated, it is in the open field so it would be understandable.Totholio (talk) 20:48, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

There are 2 ICARDAs. One north Kuwairas, One on M5 road south-west Aleppo. The one in north in full SAA control and the one in west, only partly under SAA, while they 'clean' this vast area.2003:6A:6740:5E82:581C:8E48:8BBF:FF54 (talk) 20:39, 16 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker

A map was not used to edit the source therefore the rule on not copying from maps was not violated. Upon reviewing the source the neutrality is questionable.Prohibited Area (talk) 20:40, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Alright, sorry. So there are two ICARDAs. Here is a reliable source (SOHR, 2015-11-13) stating "amid advancement for the regime forces and seizing al- Ikarda area which is adjacent to Aleppo – Damascus international highway" [13]. Also, please don't accuse me of lying, I was merely critizing the edit that was based on a Peto-Lucem tweet and asking for a reliable source on the matter. Schluppo (talk) 22:25, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Hey guys SOHR clear said that the regime forces(SAA) advanced and seized al- Ikarda area which is adjacent to Aleppo – Damascus international highway.SOHRSOHR 37.52.29.111 (talk) 08:50, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

I'm sorry Schluppo, you sounded like a troll. There's heavy fighting, like I said Icarda on the highway is most likely contested now.Both sides are gathering forces.Totholio (talk) 11:03, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Totholio ICARDA area near the highway but not on highway and we marked as under control SAA only ICARDA Army base which is located at a distance of over a kilometer from the highway. 95.134.186.238 (talk) 14:34, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

I know a military base won't be on a highway... I was trying to distinguish it from the one near Kweiris. I know it was fully captured by SAA, I'm just saying SAA sources are arguing that it's only under fire control cause they might withdrew from it,it's in the middle of an open field, easy target, not like the hills east of it.Totholio (talk) 15:35, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Totholio Near Kweiris it was not a army base it was the ICARDA Farms. But to south of Aleppo it is a army base. 95.134.186.238 (talk) 18:07, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

And? Someone just changed both ICARDA and Tel Hadiya to the orcs.Totholio (talk) 21:18, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Totholio But SOHR not said that ICARDA and Tall Hadiya under rebels and Al-Barqoum contested. SOHR only said that rebels destroy SAA tank on outskirts Tall Hadiya.SOHR Also SOHR said that the clashes are taking place in the vicinity of town Zorba in the southern countryside of Aleppo between SAA against the rebel in an attempt by the SAA to advance towards the town of Al Zorba.SOHR 95.134.186.238 (talk) 21:23, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

That's what I'm saying, Tel Hadiya is clearly under SAA/allies.Totholio (talk) 21:36, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Yes it's clearly under gov. control. Is this a joke ? Now even SOHR is listed as an unreliable source. I agree that the map should be just deleted, it makes no sense. This is now not a wikipedia article but a forum where everybody thinks it's his own right to decide what or what not should be changed. No admins are present on this article. DuckZz (talk) 22:39, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

DuckZz I agree that this map is a war itself but I still do believe that this map is the best representation of the reality (thou not ever being 100% accurate). What map if not this one? So please just keep fighting the fight your are fighting right now, I know you are one of the good ones! Rhocagil (talk) 23:22, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

SOHR reliable source but he is not said that the ICARDA and Tall Hadiya under rebels and Al-Barqoum contested. 95.134.186.238 (talk) 06:44, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

What's your problem duckz? you are posting a knows jihadist supporters twitter with 2 random pictures? Seriously? Sohr a pro orc source claims tow hit on Tal hadiya, what you think who controls it then? Not a single pro opp source claimed icarda and hadiya under their control sohr would've done it in 2 minutes. It's most likely contested if SAA is already at Barqoum.Totholio (talk) 07:38, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Rebels recaptured Banis farms near the village of Banis.(pro FSA)sourceSOHRAl Masdar 95.134.186.238 (talk) 08:49, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Bani farms are south of Banis village, currently accurately represented by a lime south arc to the Banis village.Ariskar (talk) 11:51, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Of course we can not use the following, since it is a) a map and b) pro-opposition. But it at least shows the claims of pro-opposition side: [14]. Notice that reliable sources reported that SAA took Hamraa and Khalasah yesterday, so this pro-opposition map is most probably incorrect there. Other deviations: Pro-opposition map shows Rasm Sahrij, Tal Hadiyah, ICARDA, al-Barqoum, Tel-Eiz (west of al-Eis) and Sa'ibiyah under rebel control. It appears to me, that it might be the case that SAA initially captured the mentioned locations west of al-Eis some days ago and retreated at this front in the meantime. Of course this is just speculation without proper sources. So, in the interest of being objective, we should look out for any reliable sources talking about these locations. Schluppo (talk) 19:29, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Relaible source confirmed that the SAA advance toward Al-Zerbah to north from al-Barqoum.[15] SOHR

Also map from another pro opposition source showed that the Rasm Sahrij under SAA.here But we can edit map only based data from relaible sources(not on based of amateur maps or data from twitter). SOHR clear said that SAA captured Barqoum,ICARDA base and Rasm Sahrij but not said that SAA retreated or that the rebels retake these objects. So that lets we will wait more data from relaible sources. 95.134.186.238 (talk) 19:54, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

But I agree that the Sa'ibiyah under rebel control because not a one from the reliable sources not said that SAA captured this village. Also pro-SAA map(for 13 Nowember) from Petro showed that this village rebel-held.[16] 95.134.186.238 (talk) 20:05, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Ayn Issa

Opposition source reported that fierce clashes now in the surrounding of ‪town Ayn Issa‬ between ISIS and YPG and that ISIS advancement toward the town and YPG retreated toward Ayn Issa‬.sourcesource 37.52.29.111 (talk) 09:41, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Two unidentified Facebook posts? Are those sources? No, those are meaningless posts of an unknown author. We don't use those sources on this map.

Social media is generally not allowed as a source, however,an exception CAN be made if there is a general consensus among the editors of the map. The only exception to this rule is Twitter. It is unfathomably rare that we use that as a source. DaJesuZ (talk) 02:38, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

121st Artillery Regiment near Hasakah

Several opposition sources confirmed that YPG has captured the Eastern half of the Military Base of the 121st Artillery Regiment near Hasakah after heavy clashes with ISIS.herehereherehere also neutral source reported about clashes between SDF and ISIS at regiment 121 in Hasaka that ISIS take from the government forces in the July 2014.here 95.134.186.238 (talk) 18:03, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Facebook and Twitter do not help. We need reliable sources. Schluppo (talk) 22:48, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

I´m not changing anything, but I do think it´s fair to say it´s contested.Rhocagil (talk) 23:14, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Facebook can be used as a source if there is a general consensus among editors. Twitter hasn't been used to change anything on the map for quite some time, and is almost always ignored as a source.

The area will not be shown as contested.DaJesuZ (talk) 02:39, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

But there's no consensus (thank God) about using Facebook, Twitter, Reddit or other untrustable social media, as they are 90% of the times highly unreliable sources. By the way, Im removing dozens of links based on social media, in order to adhere to Wikipedia editing policy. Im so fed up of trolls using that shitty social media as they were reliable sources, in order to made their POV-pushing look backed by something.--HCPUNXKID 19:50, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Al Zerbah

town of Al Zerbah under control by rebel groups.SOHR and SAA attempts to advance towards this town. 95.134.186.238 (talk) 11:01, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Added, also arc representing SAA attackAriskar (talk) 11:52, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

IS in Kafr Hamra?

That's what SOHR states, but that looks strange if we look to our map, as IS is suppossedly km. away east of that town. So there's only 3 options:

• SOHR is wrong (one more time).
• Our map is wrong.
• IS can infiltrate the insurgent side and attack them later.

--HCPUNXKID 19:59, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

fourth option: a group of insurgents has defected from their parent organization and pledged allegiance to IS. --AliMD7176 (talk) 21:33, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

This is quite interesting. I would suggest that we get a second source to confirm such news.188.25.120.247 (talk) 23:28, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Kurds/ SDF

I want to change the description of the yellow marks/dots from "Kurds" to "Kurds & SDF". Anyone has an opinion on this? If more FSA-factions join SDF 1 2 3 4 maybe there need to be bigger changes on the map... I have no idea but I´m raising the question. Rhocagil (talk) 01:24, 19 November 2015 (UTC)

Jabboul Lake Front

These locations can be changed to red (Government control) 1:‘Umm Zilaylah
2: Tal Ayyoub
3:‘Umm Al-Marra
4: hilltop of Tal Humaymah

Source : ASMasdar: the Syrian Arab Army and their allies imposed full control over the villages of ‘Umm Zilaylah, Tal Ayyoub, and ‘Umm Al-Marra
--212.75.52.4 (talk) 08:32, 19 November 2015 (UTC)MapMaker