Template talk:Talk header

Arbitrary placement

Hello! Why shouldn't this template be added to any talk page? I've seen numerous examples in which having it in place would improve the talk page layout, as people wouldn't put new discussions on top, would sign the posts, etc. IMHO, and based on my experience, placing {{Talk header}} on any talk page can only be a good thing. Thoughts? — Dsimic (talk | contribs) 22:04, 17 July 2015 (UTC)

I guess I worry that the more verbosity resides in peach-colored boxes at the top of talk pages, the more they will be disregarded and potentially even scare off noobs who are wondering onto talk pages for the first time to report factual errors, broken links, or the like. I prefer cleaner-looking talk pages, personally. – voidxor ^{(talk | contrib)} 02:52, 18 July 2015 (UTC)

Maybe some kind of a solution would be to slightly redesign the {{Talk header}} template so it visually fits better? It's just that I've seen much fewer misplaced or unsigned posts on talk pages that included the header. — Dsimic (talk | contribs) 03:00, 18 July 2015 (UTC)

I haven't noticed this at all. Do you have some examples? Oiyarbepsy (talk) 17:09, 18 July 2015 (UTC)

It's somewhat hard to provide exact examples as it's based on my experience and I haven't collected a list of exact talk pages. However, I'm not trying to skew anything, it's a honest observation. :) — Dsimic (talk | contribs) 21:15, 18 July 2015 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 9 September 2015

Would be great to be able to add additional instructions to the template. For example if I wanted to tell people to please respond on my page, not on theirs.

Zackmann08 (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 17:05, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Not done: You can put whatever instructions you like at the top of YOUR talk page. WP:Subst the template onto your talk page and edit the result to your tastes. Regards, Bazj (talk) 17:33, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

@Zackmann08 and Bazj: Subst:ing isn't an ideal solution, as it leaves a mess of unnecessary wikicode at the top of your talk page. I mocked up a cleaner way to seamlessly include extra instructions in Template:Talk header/sandbox. You can either use |custom_header= for extra text in the header (where |bottom=yes puts its text) or |custom_text= to put an extra bullet point in the white box. Of course, I wouldn't implement anything without consensus here. --Ahecht (TALK
PAGE) 18:10, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 13 September 2015

Please change this:

}}{{#ifexpr:{{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}|User talk|1|0}}*{{#ifeq:{{{disclaimer|}}}|yes|1|0}}|
{{userpage}}
}}

To this, for more preciseness:

}}{{#ifexpr:{{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}|User talk|1|0}}*{{#ifeq:{{{disclaimer|}}}|yes|1|0}}|
{{usertalkpage}}
}}

—Skyllfully ^(talk | _contribs) 04:01, 13 September 2015 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit protected}} template. The only difference appears to be to change {{userpage}} to {{usertalkpage}} when the |disclaimer=yes parameter is engaged. The former is a true disclaimer, while the latter is just a "Welcome" template for talk pages. I don't see you garnering consensus for this; however, if you feel strongly about it, then you are welcome to try. Painius  20:37, 13 September 2015 (UTC)

 Done – Mybad – I went to {{user talk page}}, an entirely different template. Painius  21:26, 13 September 2015 (UTC)

Addition of essay

@SlimVirgin: Please remove the essay you've added to the full-protected template. An essay has no business being included in such a widely-seen template. --Izno (talk) 12:41, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

• I'll add that you don't have any business making a change like this to a template-protected template without any discussion at all. Oiyarbepsy (talk) 14:48, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

 Done This change was already reverted by SlimVirgin. — xaosflux ^Talk 15:02, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

@Izno: I've self-reverted. The essay, Wikipedia:Maintaining a friendly space, seems informative and appropriate there; this was the edit. It advises people how to frame questions, how to deal with harassment, etc. Do you object to the content, or just that it's an essay? SarahSV ^(talk) 15:03, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

Moreso the latter off the cuff--I didn't review for content when I noticed the edit. I think we should avoid referencing pages which don't have an obvious consensus as a guideline (or policy) in a widely-used template (and especially without discussion, which I suppose is being held now). Maybe there is value in including the content in the already-included Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers or at the least the link in the see also section there. Heck, maybe we should rename "bite the newcomers" to a name similar to "maintain a friendly space" to make the intent clearer to everyone for WP:BITE. --Izno (talk) 16:21, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

@Izno: it offers good advice that's absent from the other two links and wouldn't be appropriate to add to them, because it's not about civility or newcomers alone. I believe it's being used in edit-a-thons and so on. It was written by Harej, who is on the board of Wikimedia DC, so it's not something that has no consensus. SarahSV ^(talk) 16:38, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

You know that the chapters have little to do with en.WP consensus, and that we don't judge a document based on who wrote it but on what the document says. Similarly, we don't judge consensus by presumption but by actually requesting and providing evidence to show that a document indeed has consensus. There is a clear process to show consensus, and that page has not gone through that process i.e. it does not have consensus (as a guideline). I will stick to what I said earlier and say that the things we should be linking to in this template should clearly have consensus on en.WP; the suggested page does not. --Izno (talk) 16:47, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

To clarify, I copied the essay from Meta because I thought it was a good essay, not as a reflection of my role on Wikimedia DC's board. It's based on the (quasi-)policy used on Meta for the Wikimedia Foundation grants programs, and there is a similar friendly space policy in force at Wikimedia Foundation-sponsored events such as Wikimania. I do like that there is some interest in promoting friendly space recommendations, but it is more important that there is broad Wikipedia acceptance of what the essay says. If Wikipedia at large were to accept the values of the essay, then linking to it from this template would follow naturally. Otherwise it's just words on a page. Harej (talk) 21:19, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

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