Talk:Sun

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Edit request- "faint young sun" section

Contrary to the above mentioned section in this article,(Sun#Faint_young_Sun_problem) there is actually NO consensus for the faint young sun paradox. The paper cited in this article is from 1986, since then a number of other papers have been published which categorically dispel the Greenhouse gas explanation.

Like this one published in Nature the journal in 2010 - Examination of Archaean sediments appears inconsistent with the hypothesis of high greenhouse concentrations. Instead, the moderate temperature range may be explained by a lower surface albedo brought about by less continental area and the "lack of biologically induced cloud condensation nuclei". This would have led to increased absorption of solar energy, thereby compensating for the lower solar output.

G2 color inconsistent with Stellar Classification section of wikipedia

This article declares the color of the sun as white, but the Class G section of the Stellar classification page (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stellar_classification#Class_G) refers to Sol as yellow. And the temperature in this article also places it in the realm of yellow. Which article is correct?

The Sun's color is rather close to white, but the conventional color description is "yellow". Don't ask me why that is. This has shows some black-body colors on a three-color diagram with the Sun being closest to the whitest circle. --JorisvS (talk) 18:18, 14 July 2016 (UTC)

Hello JorisvS, This white yellow thing has bugged me for years as a photographer. This morning I researched the question from NASA to Stanford, and everything in-between. I read all the arguments, saw all the graphs, and the preponderance of the evidence is that the Sun is definitely "white", and if it leaned toward any color in the spectrum, it would actually peak in the green. The Sun is "all colors", which means it is "White". I truly don't think the subject can be more thoroughly researched than my efforts this morning. This is probably the most basic and academically relatively simple explanation out there: http://solar-center.stanford.edu/SID/activities/GreenSun.html - Pocketthis (talk) 18:20, 15 July 2016 (UTC)

I would also like to get one other point made here, while we're on the subject: The statement that the "unsigned" editor makes above, about two articles having different facts, is actually, (in my opinion) the 2nd biggest problem we face here on Wikipedia. The first, of course, is vandalism, which we all spend way too much time on, because of Wiki's "anyone can edit wikipedia" policy. That aside, "Conflicting Information" h_{Subscript text}as to be number 2. Just in my own experience as a reader of articles here, I have noted over 100 articles that conflict with each other. That's just me. That means there must be multiple thousands of articles that give conflicting info on the same subjects. One problem is that there are too many articles that are similar in nature, and should be combined. For example: Precipitation has more articles than rain drops. So many of my friends that know I'm an editor here, tell me this place has no credibility because facts are conflicted, from one related article to the next. I recently made a point of making all "twilight" related articles have basically the same facts. Bottom line: If there's an article claiming the Sun is yellow, as the OP suggests, it should be changed to match our Sun article. There is no excuse for conflicting info on this encyclopedia. Thanks - Pocketthis (talk) 18:48, 15 July 2016 (UTC)

Do you know what could be done here? Part of the problem is that "yellow" is the common descriptor for these, even if not accurate, and that has to be documented. This and the other color words have crept in the common terms for these. Can we find something that sufficiently satisfies WP's common-name policy without being misleading? --JorisvS (talk) 20:37, 15 July 2016 (UTC)

Unfortunately, I am a photographer, and not a science editor. Even though I have a college degree, it certainly isn't in science. You guys must obtain a consensus in this particular subject, and as far as the multiple conflicted articles are concerned, we need a comprehensive plan on how to eliminate this problem. Thanks- Pocketthis (talk) 22:37, 15 July 2016 (UTC)

Regardless of that, you can certainly participate in looking for conflicting information, coming up with a plan, and executing it. --JorisvS (talk) 07:40, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

• Of course you are right. I don't need a degree in science to research an issue or fact. I guess I was just letting go of some steam yesterday about my pet peeve here: Conflicting articles. The problem as I see it, is multifaceted. You have an author that starts an article that is very similar to an article that is already here. It then attracts a group of authors (editors) that contribute to it, and it becomes its own beast, with little or no regard for any other articles that may have conflicting facts. For instance, our Sun article is very large, and covers many associated topics, which usually branch off into their own article (like the one mentioned above), and takes on a bias of facts that may conflict with the original article it evolved from. The last time I got myself in the middle of trying to fix a mess like that, was in "Desert Island". That article should be called "Uninhabited Island", or "Deserted Island" because a true desert island is one with an arid climate, and the vegetation to match. If you read the talk page on that article, you will see that my efforts were ignored, and the article actually got named Desert Island because "it sounded cool" to the group of editors designing it, even though there are at least three other articles on this site that completely disagree with the facts in "Desert Island". It was an exhausting effort on my part, with no resolution. Fixing the conflicted article issue here will be a mammoth task, and with the egos attached to some editors here that write articles, an entire policy change would have to be implemented to begin fixing the problem. In the mean time, my suggestion to all editors that are concerned about the problem, is to try and do little tweaks to a conflicting article when you run into one. Even a minor edit that may go unnoticed, yet may lean a statement more toward the real facts, without causing a major war, can be helpful in making articles jive with each other. However, I truly believe if we want to really fix the issue, many articles will have to be combined, and some eliminated completely. Also, I think articles are started too easily here, with little or no regard for the existence of an article that already covers the subject in question. Been fun JorisvS...happy editing - Pocketthis (talk) 17:33, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

I see the escape velocity is given in the box on the right at the "surface" of the Sun. Aside from the problematic concept of the Sun's "surface", I wonder if it would be useful to also include the escape velocity from an orbit at the Earth's distance from the Sun? If so it is 41.76 km/s at aphelion, 42.47 at perihelion and for the average distance of 1.50E11 m, it is 42.06 km/s. (which is only 3.7 - 3.8 times the escape velocity from Earth at Earth's surface - meaning once you've 'escaped' Earth, you still are bound to the Sun and need almost 4X more speed/energy to escape the Solar System.)71.29.173.173 (talk) 17:07, 14 July 2016 (UTC)

• https://books.google.com/books?id=JnoZTbVLx0MC&pg=PA37

--66.75.3.58 (talk) 15:08, 30 July 2016 (UTC)[[Google.com|Go Google Search

Re the colour "contradiction"; the stellar classification of low or yellow-green refers to the part of the spectrum in which the output of the sun peaks. Despite that, the sun's output at all wavelengths is powerful enough that it appears white in appearance. As an analogy, an incandescent light bulb has peak output at infrared wavelengths, and yet there is enough output at all wavelengths for it appear white or almost white to humans.At least I try (talk) 12:26, 6 December 2016 (UTC) At least I try (talk) 12:26, 6 December 2016 (UTC)

Critical comments

I've read part of this article (as of Aug 27, 2016) and see several areas that, imho, need improvement. Here are the problems/issues I encountered:
1. The lead claims that the Sun "has not changed dramatically" in the past 4 billion years. This demands the reader have some sense of what is and is not "dramatic". OK, it (probably) entered the Main Sequence well over 4 billion years ago, and since then its evolution has been fairly smooth (as far as we know). The problem I have is that many people reading the problem text will conclude that the Sun has not changed in the last 4E9 years, and that is wrong. The Sun's core is slowly changing the hydrogen found there into helium (other products are rare, at best). The Sun is emitting a enormous number of neutrinos, protons, electrons, and alpha particles. So, it is loosing mass and is slowly changing its volume and its brightness is increasing (among other changes).
2. The lead also contains the phrase "after hydrogen fusion in its core has stopped". That is nonsense, the H fusion doesn't ever stop, but it diminishes to a point at which the Sun is no longer in hydrostatic equilibrium. The core experiences a marked increase in density and temperature while the Sun's outer layers expand. The Sun leaves the Main Sequence and enters the Red Giant branch.
3.In the section Characteristics:"The Sun is a Population I, heavy-element rich, star. It seems to me that that bald statement needs a lot more clarification. What does it mean to be "rich"? What are the other classifications (extreme Population I stars, intermediate population stars, intermediary disc population stars, Population II, and Population III (hypothetical)) The Sun is an intermediate population I star. I'm not sure it is useful to mention this classification. It would be more useful, imho, to mention when the Milky Way experienced its peak star formation rate 4-6 billion years ago, and that our Sun is a relatively middle-aged star, with another 5-6 billion years on the Main Seq. This same paragraph is confusing: if the Sun formed after the formation of Population III stars, and after formation of Population II heavy-metal poor stars, why not just say so? It is NOT true that the reason it is a Population I star is due to the abundance of gold or uranium in "the Solar System". Its Pop I status is exactly the result of the abundance of those as measured in its spectra. It also could be clearly stated that we have good evidence that several supernova (probably of Population II stars) contributed to the elements making up the Sun and our Solar System. As it is, speaking about endothermic fusion and neutron absorption is far too technical for the level of treatment otherwise being expressed.
4. Also in the Characteristics section, the AU is discussed and it is implied that it is the Earth's average distance to the Sun. Well, yes and no. I recently read that the average distance was 1.0003 AU, but perhaps this is too insignificant to quibble about. (It also depends on what is meant by "average": average taken second by second (over time) or average kilometer by kilometer (over distance or orbital circumference), another quibble.)
5."in its outer parts its density decreases exponentially." Should, imho, be changed to "above the photosphere the Sun's density decreases exponentially".
6."For the purpose of measurement, however, the Sun's radius is considered to be the distance from its center to the edge of the photosphere, the apparent visible surface of the Sun." First it is the top edge, not just edge. Second, like the Sun itself, none of these zones have sharp boundaries. This is dramatically different from the surface of Earth and the rocky planets where we can determine the surface to within fractions of a millimeter.
7. In the Photosphere section:"[The Photosphere] is the layer below which the Sun becomes opaque to visible light." It's not wrong, but begs the question HOW FAR below that layer is light no longer visible? kilometers? tens of km? hundreds? thousands?
8. Same section "Above...sunlight is free to propagate into space and its energy escapes the Sun entirely." This is just plain wrong. Some (admittedly, not much) sunlight is absorbed and scattered well above the Photosphere. The word "entirely" is far too absolute and definitely wrong. How about "almost all of its energy escapes the Sun entirely"?
9. Finally, for some really bad reason the REAL center of the Solar System (geometrically speaking) is never mentioned. Nor is the fact that the Sun orbits this (moving) point - the barycenter. Granted, the barycenter is believed to be, baring discovery of some really really massive planets out beyond Pluto, 11,000 km below the Sun's photosphere, hence inside the Sun. But the center of the Sun orbits this point. (Like a paper disk being pinned to the wall near its edge and being rotated around that point.) It should at least be mentioned in this article.173.191.76.21 (talk) 16:35, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

Can you make these edits yourself? FYI, in the mix of everything contained in this article, I don't think your point 9 is very important. Isambard Kingdom (talk) 17:56, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

Seconding Isambard Kingdom, a core value of Wikipedia is to be bold! But also be careful and don't get upset if people revert some of your edits. Have at it! A2soup (talk) 18:06, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 23 October 2016

2602:306:308D:9E10:CDD0:A710:9548:75C3 (talk) 19:06, 23 October 2016 (UTC) The Sun is the center of the planets and gives us day and night and warmth in the day but not at night. :O ITS TRUE GUYS IT IS--2602:306:308D:9E10:CDD0:A710:9548:75C3 (talk) 19:06, 23 October 2016 (UTC)