Talk:Motherfucker

Origins of motherfucker

The term "mother fucker" is an awakening or realisation of youth who are being abused by their Father. He would be using a heteronormative script to orchestrate a state of emotional turmoil for his child to avoid all responsibility in the childs upbringing but insist on "claiming back" from the child for his sacrifices.

The term "mother fucker" or "mofcker" refers to a man who has sex with someone else's mother, specifically with a woman in some kind of tight spot (e.g., economically) who agrees to sex with that man only out of desperation. The woman doesn't really want to sleep with this man, and she isn't a prostitute in the professional sense, but this man presents an alternative to watching her children go hungry.

The term gained tremendous traction during WWII, originally amongst black American GIs, and was applied literally to American soldiers (black, white, or otherwise) in war-torn Europe who would trade food, money, or anything of value (cigarettes, chocolate, booze) for sex with desperately poor or starving French and German women. Many of these women were home-makers whose husbands had been conscripted away, killed, or imprisoned, leaving the women to support the couple's children alone. Many lacked trade skills, and the war damaged the local economies so badly that they had few, if any, alternatives.

So calling a man a "mother fucker" meant that he was A) taking advantage of poor and downtrodden people with no options, and B) incapable of seducing non-desperate women. Anyone with experience growing up in desperate poverty, or who saw his own parents humiliated by circumstances beyond his control, would probably consider that kind of behavior to be a pretty low thing.

In the last sixty or so years, the term has entered the popular slang as a term of derision ("That Richard Nixon is a real mother fucker, you know?"). More recently, it's been used as an indicator of extraordinary intensity, not necessarily in a derisive sense, but usually still carrying some implications of harshness ("I fell asleep out in my lawn chair, yesterday, and got a mother fucker of a sunburn.") or intimidating awesomeness ("That Shaft, he's one baaaad mother fucker.").

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The preceding all sounds made up. Where are the citations?

Bobby Seale, Seize the Time (Random House, 1970), p. 408.--98.114.178.63 (talk) 05:27, 16 March 2015 (UTC)

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Ahh, I hear the term "motherfucker" a lot. I doubt that it means to fuck somebody's mother. :3

It is all made up. The term and the concept date back into antiquity. See Leviticus 18:7 -- "Dude, don't fuck your mom."

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I was always intrigued by the use of the motherfucker insult in American movies, thinking "well why is there a problem with having intercourse with mothers" but recently I've read a number of pulp fiction crime books from the 30s, in particular ones by black authors. I noted that there are a lot of insults using the term "mother rapers" and I believe that the modern use of the term is actually derived from this - ie. someone who rapes mothers would (at least in my mind) be a derogatory term. It's just been changed, probably within the black community to the seemingly more powerful "mother fucker" though to outsiders it's less strong, and now in modern black culture the original meaning has now been lost.

Dr Dre invented motherfuck?

Does anyone buy this? This is incredibly dubious and seems to scream the whole phenomenon of pop-culture co-opting reality. Just because he's the first one to rap it in a song as a verb hardly makes him the first person to use it, particularly when the construction already allows for the because of the adaptability of "fuck". Maybe Dre popularized it, but isn't it even more likely that Dre just picked it up from common usage of people around him? Maybe you can credit him with popularizing it, but I think that whole thing should be removed it doesn't get cites - Dre claiming to have invented it at the very, very least.

Motherfuck is a word of the people until proven otherwise. 68.100.128.43 (talk) 09:31, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

The word motherfucker was used by many people, many times, before Dre was born. Nietzsche 2 (talk) 01:30, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Indeed, Prince uttered that word to his Father in 'Purple Rain', circa 1984. That could well have been the first mainstream-filmed use of the word, although clearly it had been used in stand-up comedy before that. FungasUK (talk) 20:50, 20 February 2011 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.69.237.5 (talk)

: "The Rose" (1979) was earlier. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.222.9.250 (talk) 09:14, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

Famous use in films

If Carlin's use of motherfucker is relevant enough to include in the article, why are "Yipee kay ay motherfucker!" from the Die Hard tetralogy and "...motherfucking snakes on a motherfucking plane" from Snakes on a Plane not relevant enough to be included? Nietzsche 2 (talk) 01:35, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

While you bring up a good point, Die Hard and Samuel Jackson films don't cause Supreme Court cases. backstabb 23:09, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Indeed, there are numerous films in which the term was used. Why bother with a list of them? Surv1v4l1st ^{(Talk|Contribs)} 21:23, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

"The famous catchphrase of Bruce Willis's character John McClane in the Die Hard movies, "Yippee-ki-yay, motherfucker", has been named "the greatest one-liner in movie history"." ....by one film critic who is not the authority on the matter. Is this really worth noting?!

Common

Motherfucker (sometimes spelled muthafucka, mofcker or mutherfucker) is a common[citation needed] insult <- [leaving the house needed] @ whoever added that [citation] tag

Origin in American slavery

This word originates from American slavery, and does not reference incest. It originally described a slave owner who raped his female slaves.

According to the Hidden Colors 4: The Religion of White Supremacy, it does reference the incestuous relationship between slaves in forced breeding programs & thus proliferated into American vernacular. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.135.95.216 (talk) 17:38, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

Drb9s (talk) 03:50, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

This term did not originate in WWII.. this term originated during the slavery era in the US

I have no idea who came up with the WWII origin, but I took an African history class, and I distinctly remember the textbook and the teacher saying this term originated during the slavery era in Unitedstater's history. The terms refers to a male, often muscular, that the slave-owners would pick to impregnate the women, so they would have strong offspring, and thus- "good" slaves. There is no nice way of saying it.

Are we posting the truth here, or are we going to gloss over the sadder, more morbid parts of Unitedstater's history?

When I find the textbook, I'll be back.

70.225.180.96 (talk) 05:55, 1 February 2010 (UTC)brainsaber@yahoo.com

Yeah yeah, and maybe you're going to insist that "picnic" is derived from "pick a nigger"? This is the grossest folk etymology I've ever heard -- if there's ever been such a function, why call it a "motherfucker", not just "fucker" or "inseminator"? any linguistic evidence of a calque from some African language? Actually, you can find insults concerning sex & one's descent in every culture, and other European languages have exact counterparts, cf. Russian "Yob tvoyu mat`" ("may your mother be fucked".

Dialloriddle (talk) 23:11, 14 September 2016 (UTC)I want to cosign this explanation. This is based on African American Oral Tradition and should at least be referenced in the Wiki-Page on the subject. It will be tough to find written evidence of this as slaves weren't ALLOWED to be literate and those who were, for many reasons, wouldn't have committed this profane word to the page at that time. The first recorded use of the word in it's modern sense is a African-American soldier to his Draft Board in 1919. That's not a coincidence. There's a word that means "shit" in every culture, but the way Motherfucker is used today started in the rural slave communities of the South. Hoping to find written evidence of that is probably futile but the circumstantial evidence in the oral tradition is there.Dialloriddle (talk) 23:11, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

Please check this page for conflict of information or sourcing

Check the Origins Section , it says " its a term for someone who had sex with someones mother"

Now take a look at the section Variants, where it says "Usually"

I would propose this page for deletion since this page totally lacks any encyclopedic merit. But like its counterpart on articles about other swear words, someone is bound to come and clean it up.

The wording on this totally sucks and appears to have some from a site that deals with urbanology of wording. —Preceding unsigned comment added by JasonHockeyGuy (talk • contribs) 07:35, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Article should be flagged for clean up

This article doesn't read well at all. I am doubtful it meets Wikipedia standards. Oceanonwiki (talk) 22:14, 6 February 2010 (UTC)oceanonwiki

Bad article

This article is horrible. The origins of the word are unsourced, and I believe wrong. The rest of it is filled with trivial nonsense. It should be deleted, or at least cleaned up.Mk5384 (talk) 10:14, 21 February 2010 (UTC) One more thing; could anyone tell me what was so bad about the edit by Ying Soon Cheong Desmond that it was permanently removed rather than reverted?Mk5384 (talk) 21:26, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

I would like to nominate this article to be partially merged with Fuck

I think we should close this article, and merge the following info into Fuck

"Like many widely used offensive terms, motherfucker has a large list of derivative terms. Motherhumper, motherfugger, mothersucker,motherlover, you motha, mofo, motherflower, and many more are sometimes used in polite company or to avoid censorship.[1] The participlemotherfucking is often used as an emphatic, in the same way as the less strong fucking. The verb to motherfuck has a wide variety of meanings, although it is less common.

Conversely, when paired with an adjective and/or the word "one", it becomes a term denoting such things as originality and masculinity.

Usually the word 'motherfucker' is used in place of an adjective in a sentence, such as: That trig problem was a real motherfucker. In this case, it was used in place of the word 'bitch'. It can sometimes be used in a variant of Fuck you, i.e., Motherfuck you.

Some other examples include:

Why did you touch me, motherfucker? Get in the motherfucking car.

Usually, the word does not mean someone has had sex with another person's mother. Instead it is understood as a swear word, most related to "fuck".""

Article's definition limited?

As I have always understood the word, its offensiveness comes from the assertion that a motherfucker is someone who has sex with his/her own mother. Its implication of incest and the visceral disgust having sex with your own mother arouses is why the term is just so offensive. I was unaware that this wasn't the normal meaning of the term. I can accept its historical origins as outlined in the article, but I think in contemporary use the definition I have given is the common meaning or at least a commonly held understanding of the term - yet this is ignored in the article. 121.73.7.84 (talk) 09:14, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Find some sources to back up your assertions, and you are perfectly free to add your ideas to the article. 71.77.20.119 (talk) 15:12, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

Words can have different meanings and even different origins in different cultures. The article could even do with a link to Oedipus ! --195.137.93.171 (talk) 12:11, 25 December 2011 (UTC)

Adolf Hitler is a real mot­herfuc­ker, you know?

{{editsemiprotected}} "Adolf Hitler is a real mothe­rfuc­ker, you know?"

Please remove this arbitrary and entirely unnecessary example. --87.78.120.24 (talk) 00:19, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

I removed the entire section, it was unsourced, and I don't think it added anything to the article. If someone wants to restore any of it, please find sources and provide citations for the material to be restored. --Nuujinn (talk) 00:43, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Bad ass mother fucker

i added a brief mention of this phrase. this is a good place to mention that the acronym for this, bamf, is often used on WP as a type of vandalism, as the letters can look like a title or degree or other formal use, as in "Steve austin, PHD, BAMF". of course, this article needs better sourcing, etc, but i hope my addition will help people who look up BAMF in various forms.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 05:09, 7 March 2011 (UTC)

Possible clue

I don't know how reliable a source http://encyclopedia.jrank.org/articles/pages/749/Motherfucker.html is or whether the citations it makes are accurate. It suggests that the term moved from US Black English usage to wide familiarity among "white" US people as well via racial mixing in the military. Jack Waugh (talk) 20:28, 11 March 2012 (UTC)

Invariably male?

I would like to edit this article to remove the line from the opening paragraph, "a personal direct object referred to as such is invariably male.[1]" From my own experience this is not true, and it is not in fact supported by the external link it cites, which is to Dictionary.com and mentions nothing about the sex of the person this term is applied to. I would also like to see some citations for the earlier part of the sentence (which may indeed be true) "Due to the semiotics, it is not generally applied personally to females."

Unfortunately, I can't figure out how to edit this article, could somebody else make these changes please? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.72.5.174 (talk) 16:43, 1 August 2012 (UTC)

Do you have a reliable that says that women are often called motherfuckers? Jim Michael (talk) 22:28, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

Protection for related page

Could someone consider protecting BAMF, the disambig page which states that BAMF is an acronym for bad ass mother fucker. its gotten some abuse.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 05:13, 7 October 2012 (UTC)

ssss — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.201.110.115 (talk) 12:25, 20 May 2013 (UTC)

OR removed
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
I believe the term "motherfucker" is rather new to the English language, but its meaning dates back to the dawn of agriculture and matriarchal societies( Neolithic) . it generally means to go against an established order...whether the order be rational or not. in early societies nature was considered female and life giving and the female human was also seen as a life giver/nurturer and therefore wise. a person choosing to ignore custom or challenge it (usually men) was considered dangerous and possibly outcast. many of our greatest discoveries and advancements came from people challenging established orders and would have been seen initially as "motherfuckers". in other cases certain people just caused trouble for short term gain of little consequence. these people would be seen as real "motherfuckers"!

Citation not needed

No citations are needed to prove "motherfucker" (mofo,ma-fucker,mf,etc.) is, taken literally, somebody who fucks his mother. It's obvious. The word comes from 2 original words, "mother", and "fucker", joined together in a common and ordinary way. In the same way "dogfucker", "pigfucker", "cocksucker" and "crocodilerimmer" all mean exactly what you'd think, as indeed do "motherliker", "motherhelper", and "fatherfucker", so does motherfucker. It's just two incredibly well-known words, one after the other. Why *wouldn't* it mean the bleedin' obvious?

Where would you even expect to find a citation of this? Who would ever think it needed writing down, and where would they look to confirm it's true?

All that said, the word is almost never used literally anyway, and is so obvious that no literal explanation is needed. These points mean there's no real need to even have such an explanation. Somebody with some authority, fix it one way or another.

Asking formally, either remove the "citation needed" tag, or remove the whole "literal definition" altogether.

188.29.165.66 (talk) 22:22, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template.  ^B E _C K ^Y _S A ^{Y L} E _S  23:28, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

Lets talk

How can i read other languages CalvinTing (talk) 13:37, 25 August 2017 (UTC)

Comment by IP 74.83.49.65

The definition of origin represented here are so different and many it's more responsible to say "origins unknown". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.83.49.65 (talk) 01:23, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

The Miles Davis anecodote

I read the "after thanking him for the compliment" as a bit of humour on the part of the author rather than an indication that "motherfucker" is literally considered a compliment by jazz musicians. MaxBrowne2 (talk) 01:33, 7 January 2019 (UTC)

Jamaican slaves

This originated back when Jamaican were captured and put on slave ships. The white man would offer put a bag over a strong male and his mothers head and make him have sex with her in front of the other slaves to insert dominance. Some of you are ignorant and need to go back to a REAL history class. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.138.178.209 (talk) 20:06, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

Please be WP:CIVIL.

Is there a WP:RS to support this claim? Paradoctor (talk) 22:19, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

Slavic or Spanish connection?

I often visit Slovenia, which used to be part of Yugoslavia, and I'm struck by the fact some of the cruder swear words are in fact borrowed from Serbo-Croatian - perhaps a leftover from military service in the Yugoslav army, where that was the working language? One of the commonest ones, which is casually dropped into conversation (almost invariably by men), literally means "into (your) mother's vagina" - though of course the word used is more vulgar than that. Another Slavic language, Russian, also has a crude expression referring to sex with someone else's mother. And Latin American Spanish has a similar phrase, which is so commonly heard that in Mexico, at least, the ordinary word for 'mother' ('madre') apparently tends to be replaced by "mamá" when referring politely to anyone's mother... Since so many Hispanic and Slavic immigrants have come to the USA, and the MF expression originated there (I never heard it when growing up in 1950s and 1960s Britain), I wonder if it spread into American English from one of those languages. But there's probably no way of knowing.89.212.50.177 (talk) 10:25, 17 May 2019 (UTC)