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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Dreamy Jazz Bot (talk | contribs) at 09:44, 5 March 2024 (Replacing Template:Ds/talk notice with Template:Contentious topics/talk notice. BRFA.). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.


[Untitled]

Please don't blank the page - if you don't like the redirect that's there - fix it! I've reverted it to as was as I don't know the subject. Brookie: A collector of little round things 08:14, 1 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Horn of Africa

A user has attempted to re-route the re-direct of long-standing to another re-direct page, North East Africa, which he had also attempted to re-direct to the North Africa article (both pages originally pointed to the Horn of Africa page). Besides the fact that only a portion (the smaller portion, at that) of North Africa lies in the Northeast, it's the Horn of Africa, as far as large regions are concerned, that is primarily associated with the label (c.f. [1]). Middayexpress (talk) 10:19, 4 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

look here [2] --Prince jasim ali (talk) 17:46, 4 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
That's a link to random Google hits, not reliable sources that support your contention. See WP:GOOGLE. Middayexpress (talk) 17:53, 4 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
take these [3] , [4] , [5] , [6] , [7] --Prince jasim ali (talk) 20:24, 4 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Those are not links to definitions of what constitutes Northeast Africa, but links to random pages mentioning that Sudan geographically lies there. The only links that actually define the territory as a whole are an outdated map from the 1900s and another modern map [8] that of course includes the Horn countries in that designation. That modern map, however, does not include most of the territories in North Africa because the majority of North Africa (i.e. the Maghreb) actually lies in the North West. Middayexpress (talk) 16:08, 5 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
then where is your sources, I know one thing for sure , that you can't talk about northeast africa without sudan and egypt which is part of north africa and middle east , horn of africa is well recognize by it's name !!--Prince jasim ali (talk) 05:05, 9 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
My sources, as always, are already linked to above. Egypt is in Northeast Africa as is Sudan, but the rest of North Africa (where they're both listed and which you have attempted to re-direct the page to) isn't. In fact, most of North Africa (the Maghreb) is in the North West. The Horn of Africa, however, is entirely in Northeast Africa. That is why the expression North and Northeast Africa even exists i.e. to differentiate between the two areas. Middayexpress (talk) 10:06, 9 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Northeast Africa region needed

There seems to be a racial bias to not have a region called Northeast Africa and it's for this reason I am appealing to CSB. The region is mentioned in many important publications, however, the Wikipedia editors who favour a Eurocentric view of Egypt have taken hold of this matter and opted to not have a Northeast Africa region. Egypt from its historical records had more relations and connections with its southern Nile neighbours than with any other region, however because of racial bias the editors have purposely refused to have a Northeast Africa region page as it will connect Egypt to what they cal, however, these same people don't have a quibble connecting Egypt to Western Asia. This has left many pages that referred to the region all dangling and looping on the Horn of Africa even though the cited references state the Northeast Africa region. What's worse is the region is being scraped by certain editors from Wikipedia and replaced with the Horn of Africa region, this seems to be an orchestrated plot to not have that region mentioned as it will link Egypt to Sudan which is castigated for racial reasons in its talk page. It's for this reason CSB should correct this egregious and orchestrated misinformation. Arboleh (talk) 15:22, 8 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Ancient Egypt's relations and closest ties were with its Semitic Middle Eastern and Libyan North African neighbours. Memphis and the Nile Delta are far closer to Canaan and eastern Libya than to Nubia. Egyptian language was closest to Berber languages of North Africa, not Nilotic or Cushitic languages of the Upper Nile regions. 142.116.178.22 (talk) 09:21, 22 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Deleting the Northeast Africa page

@El C: Northeast Africa is redirecting to Horn Africa which is a different region and since 2005 as per the message from user Brookie noone contributed to this page to fix it for whatever reason, could be racial, geopolitical, religious, whatever the reason if for 14 years no content has been added then content will never be added and so as of WP:A3 I tagged it for deletion. Dalhoa (talk) 02:48, 7 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

But it's a redirect, so that criteria doesn't apply, since no new content is to be expected, no? El_C 04:04, 7 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@El C: No it should have content just like Southeast Africa but it is incorrectly associated with the Horn of Africa, a totally different region. There are in fact 3 redundant WP:CSD#F1 regions North East Africa, Northeast Africa, and Norteast africa. All are devoid of content, don't know what is going on but it does not seem normal to have 3 variation names of the same region all setup to redirect to the same region. Dalhoa (talk) 06:14, 7 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
It sounds like an WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS type of argument to me. At any case, these are all redirects right now. If you would like to change that, that is a content discussion you are free to have. But your request to delete the redirect outright is declined. El_C 08:24, 7 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@El C: You keep ignoring the main reason which is that Northeast Africa is not the Horn of Africa. You have not provided any reason for the edit reversal you have done, this is R'n'B reason small "a" target not consistent as if Norteast africa. did not exit, and then you have user Onel5969 who says Same rationale as prior - needs more sourcing to show that this is actually a widely used term, in fact there is no reason of this whole redirect, I can't find any real reason for it, the only time a redirect is mentioned is in the Horn Africa when user Andrew Lancaster questions it. It seems like it all started because some editors at the time did not want to include Sudan in North Africa for racial reasons, so others created Northeast Africa to include Sudan but no content was added and later they just decided to redirect to Horn Africa instead. Since then, Sudan is added to North Africa and so this redirect has no reason to exist, it is also misleading and inaccurate to have a region called Northeast Africa that does not include Sudan/Egypt. Dalhoa (talk) 17:52, 7 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I'm having a bit of a difficult time following your train of thought. Maybe launch an RfC with a question that gives a clear choice into what you propose...? El_C 19:11, 7 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@El C: I am having difficulty understand what is going too, we are being told the Northeast Africa term in not widely used when it's got over 350 Million results in Google, the term and its variants are also used in many Wiki places, and most importantly the term is not considered the same as the Horn Africa term, even in the Cushitic people wiki page the term is used along side the Horn Africa term to separate the two regions as per the used sources, so this redirect is completely misleading, they should either create a disambiguation page as Andrew Lancaster has suggested or delete the page and so until this mess is cleared up it is best to remove the redirect because it is inaccurate. Dalhoa (talk) 00:20, 8 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Dalhoa, if you think a dab page is the solution, by all means: be bold! El_C 11:37, 8 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to North Africa

The region of Northeast Africa, regularly attested to in academic studies, refers to Egypt and much of what is modern Sudan, which are included in North Africa. Redirecting Northeast Africa to the far eastern Horn of Africa is confusing many readers of Wikipedia. 142.116.178.22 (talk) 09:22, 22 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

On second thought, the original article was more appropriate specifically defining Northeast Africa according to sources. 142.116.178.22 (talk) 09:28, 22 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Northeast Africa is not the same as the Horn of Africa

Northeast Africa is a valid academic and geographical term. There is even an academic journal of Northeast African studies: This distinguished journal is devoted to the scholarly analysis of Ethiopia, Eritrea, Djibouti, Somalia, and Sudan, as well as the Nile Valley, the Red Sea, and the lands adjacent to both.142.116.178.22 (talk) 09:43, 22 March 2020 (UTC)</block quote>[reply]

Fair enough, IP. So long as there are no objections from other editors, I'm willing accept your view and corresponding changes. El_C 09:51, 22 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Removing Countries from Northeast Africa

Hello, so I noticed a new user keeps removing other countries that are specifically mentioned in the listed sources (I have read them and they are clearly mentioned, including one I added that was removed). The user has already been notified about unconstructive edits: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Aksumiteking#November_2023 The issue is, Northeast Africa as a region has always encompasses more nations than those this editor only wants included. According to the references, the Nilevalley nations especially like Sudan, Egypt are mentioned, and even Libya is considered based on its location, but the person has now inserted Kenya, and removed the others. Keyboard Editor (talk) 19:40, 4 November 2023 (UTC) (Blocked sockpuppet)[reply]

Here are some of the sources, from the edit before one was reverted, they mention the Nile Valley civilization regions before the new user made changes.
NORTHEAST AFRICA AND THE WORLD ECONOMIC ORDER on JSTOR
Coastal Sites of Northeast Africa: The Case Against Bronze Age Ports on JSTOR
The Development of Nomadism in Ancient Northeast Africa - Karim Sadr - Google Books
Geoscientific Research in Northeast Africa - Google Books
The Ecology Of Survival: Case Studies From Northeast African History - Douglas H Johnson, David M Anderson - Google Books
Ethiopia, the Sudan, and Egypt: The Nile River Dispute | The Journal of Modern African Studies | Cambridge Core
From Britannica: Egypt | History, Map, Flag, Population, & Facts | Britannica Sudan | History, Map, Area, Population, Religion, & Facts | Britannica
Oxford mentions Sudan: Northeastern African States, c. 1000 BCE-1800 CE - African Studies - Oxford Bibliographies
Other (unreliable): Northeast Africa | Policy Commons
Recent Research Into the Stone Age of Northeastern Africa - Google Books
There are also many archeological works like the above, and other peer reviewed material with surveyors and researchers or geneticists referring to the areas of study (the territories of the Republic of Egypt and Sudan in this case) as residing in Northeastern Africa. Keyboard Editor (talk) 20:09, 4 November 2023 (UTC) (Blocked sockpuppet)[reply]
@Keyboard Editor You have provided a range of sources. I agree that the previous, long standing version should be restored. There is no valid reason for content removal with reliable sources. WikiUser4020 (talk) 19:12, 5 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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