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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Intothatdarkness (talk | contribs) at 19:47, 23 May 2024 (→"Greatest to have ever lived": Reply). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

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1861 in Texas

Earl Van Dorn and ' on April 17 and then headed for the last remaining regular U.S. Army soldiers in Texas at Indianola, forcing their surrender on April 23' Not accurate:the last force in Texas , the Eight US Infantry, surrendered to Van Dorn near San Antonio on May 9, 1861.

Source Handbook of Texas Online, Kevin R. Young, "Adams Hill, Battle Of," accessed July 20, 2017, http://www.tshaonline.org/handbook/online/articles/qka01.

Uploaded on June 9, 2010. Modified on March 1, 2011. Published by the Texas State Historical Association.

Earl Van Dorn and 'Van Dorn was summoned to Richmond, Virginia, and appointed a colonel in the 1st C.S. Regular Cavalry on April 25' Confusing chronology: Van Dorn was not summoned to Richmond until mid-August; on Sept 17 he was in New Orleans on his way to Virginia. See page 90 in

Van Dorn: The Life and Times of a Confederate General By Robert George Hartje Timatsanantonio (talk) 10:23, 20 July 2017 (UTC) Timatsanantonio (talk) 10:20, 20 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  • Don´t know about the days in Texas of the formulation stuff, if it is wrong and you have prove then I´d assume you´re free to change it. But about his promotion; that was the day his promotion was dated/ranked. That doesn´t mean that he had to be in Richmond at that time, just a date put in writing. The fact that he was written to be in Texas just two days before in the line above should make this pretty obvious. ...GELongstreet (talk) 10:36, 20 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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Camp Van Dorn

Camp Van Dorn (1942-1945) has a controversial racist history. Camp Van Dorn Slaughter. This could be mentioned in the article. I am not sure a camp that no longer exists should be mentioned in the introduction. This is a good source article: Camp Van Dorn Mississippi Encyclopedia. An Honors section can be added to the article. Cmguy777 (talk) 15:22, 5 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

More work needed

I edited this yesterday, and today edited the article for the Van Dorn House, neither of which explain the family's slaveholdings, which I believe exist, and should be included to explain this man's personality. Ancestry.com's search feature is usually helpful, but less so for Earl, although I did note from the census cited that the findagrave.com page cited in the bibliography is inaccurate about his second wife and children (his first wife, Earl Jr and Olivia were all alive in 1860). The trouble generally is handwriting digitization, but army officers also moved a lot. Anyhow, before my laptop ran out of power yesterday, I checked the 1830 census for Claiborne County to try to figure out why I could find no record of his father, Peter Van Dorn. I do believe he used slave labor on his plantations, and slaves are enumerated on the 1830 census for Claiborne county, but I could find no name that resembles his (perhaps squashed together or misdigitized). I don't know whether a page was missing from that census (in 54 pages of decent handwriting), or the dates/locations of his other plantations. Normally, ancestry.com's digitization yields better results, and I didn't have time to read his will (probated, obviously by another judge in 1837), which seemed to be available on that site. Since Peter Van Dorn drowned en route to visiting a plantation near Natchez, which is in Adams County, a careful scan of that 1830 census might be worthwhile, but not given my personal time constraints. For what its worth, I also added a rootsweb link to the Van Dorn House article because a couple of the current links had gone bad and it and the NRIS I managed to find were both better than the article as it started out. My laptop power's again running low and I don't have time to clean up Peter's article. Someone may want to search whether Peter Van Dorn was a clerk of the Georgia legislature before moving to Mississippi, or that sentence in the house article I marked as needing a citation might be the result of an earlier editor's carelessness, since my citations say he was a clerk for the Mississippi legislature. Jweaver28 (talk) 17:40, 18 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Now I see why it didn't preview--somehow the section header was omitted. Also, although many U.S. Army officers had personal slaves, not all did, and Van Dorn's financial links to slaveholding may be through his wife's Godbold family, or the Sullivane family (his sister's husband and father of his aide de camp).Jweaver28 (talk) 17:48, 18 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I edited this yesterday to explain his womanizing, and the possible reason for the findagrave discrepancy--his wife stayed home in either Alabama with her folks or in Mississippi with his family, and he took a laundress in Texas as a mistress and had 3 children by her. Also, I apologize to citing to blogs re the pregnancy of his killer's unwed daughter, but that story seems plausible and several sources say there's a book about it--I'm not sure whether its history or historical fiction but the blogs are definitely about history. That mother/daughter situation rather than simple womanizing would also explain his ostracism by fellow Confederate officers, who might not have cared about the mistress away from home. One of the blogs goes into detail about the head shot (explaining it wasn't in the back, but as VanDorn taunted the pistol-wielding doctor rather than plead for his life as he had nearly a month before). I also included an internet archive version of his sister's book, but didn't take time to read it.Jweaver28 (talk) 18:05, 20 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

General Order 11 and Holly Springs Raid

The content in this article regarding the relationship between General Order 11 and the Holly Springs Raid needs to be tightened up. As written, it seems like the raid was conducted to delay the implementation of General Order 11, when there is no evidence cited that the relationship between the two events was anything but incidental. Why is this link between these events mentioned multiple times and so prominently in this article? CrudTaylor (talk) 05:31, 26 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"Greatest to have ever lived"

This article is currently making the very strong claim that Van Dorn "is considered one of the greatest cavalry commanders to have ever lived". While admittedly I haven't read a standalone biography of Van Dorn (I have a print copy of Hartje's work somewhere but haven't read it) this is not something I've ever seen in the related literature that I've read - including works on CSA cavalry and some of Van Dorn's operations (Holly Springs, Pea Ridge, Second Corinth). This is currently sourced to a History Press book, and I frankly don't believe that publisher is strong enough for extraordinary claims. I propose to remove this material unless someone can provide stronger citation(s) for this. Hog Farm Talk 19:32, 23 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I quote from Hartje's introduction:

"[After failure in army command] Relegated to the secondary role of cavalry commander in Mississippi and Tennessee, he showed courage, energy, and vision as he achieved some success in a type of operation for which he was better adapted. Cavalry came into its own in the West in late 1862, and Earl Van Dorn was one of its most successful commanders. Enemy outposts, railroad lines, bridges, roads, and supply depots were his targets as he continually harassed the armies of Generals U. S. Grant and William Rosecrans and helped hold off their final push. But even in these campaigns, his weaknesses sometimes shone through. Although his battle plans were well conceived and his overall objectives were well chosen, he never seemed to master all the details necessary to bring great success. Van Dorn was a good officer, but he could not adjust well enough to changing situations to be called a great leader."

My emphasis in bold. Pickersgill-Cunliffe (talk) 19:47, 23 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've never seen anything remotely like this, either. I've seen him described as "skilled," but usually with qualifiers of some kind. Intothatdarkness 19:47, 23 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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