Talk:Bowser/Archive 1

Archive 1

Archive 2

Bowser-Voldemort

In New Super Mario Bros. Bowser is killed in the lava in the first level of the game, but in the final castle, Bowser Jr. gives him back a more powerful body using a potion, similar to voldemort.

and in Luigi's Mansion, Bowser's dead (somehow) and is ressurected by King Boo, and is transferred into a painting at the end of the game. However, Bowser's body was left in the Roof-Dimension inside the mario painting. Could it be that the Bowser head we see in the ghost Portificationaizer along with King Boo is a ghostly part of Bowser, possibly a frament of Bowser's soul, Similar to Voldemort's horcruxes!

It is possible, that as long as the painting of Bowser and King Boo remains intact, Bowser is immortal.

But it is a Mario Game. Maybe the plot shouldn't be read so much into.

Bowser's Death? 2

How do we know Bowser died before Luigi's Mansion? Madame Clairvoya merely states Bowser was "soundly defeated". How does this imply death? I'm not saying he didn't die; King Boo could be using Bowser's corpse, but there is the possibility that Bowser was laying low and King Boo was using a robotic (or even magical) Bowser suit. I think both options need to be stressed, not one of the other. --206.8.10.4 06:07, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Well, madame Clairvoya's exact words are: "Bowser? how can this be? I see the Hideous form of BOWSER?! I don't believe it, yet I see it. Could King Boo have found some way to revive Bowser?"

Is it not clear that this is nintendo's way of explaining what happened? surely she would have said something along the lines of: "Bowser?! I don't understand, could King Boo have revived bowser? or is he just using some nefarious Bowser suit - thing?" I know that we should register the 'its a bowser suit' argument as possible, but I personally feel that is is stupid, when nintendo have plainly given us a preferrable and much more interesting story.

I don't think there would be so much shock and disbelief if Bowser was merely in hiding, one would just assume he'd come out of hiding. Also, why would King Boo need to revive Bowser, if he was just hiding?

Thanks for the exact words. I guess this does imply Bowser really did die. If someone wants to change the article, they can (as I am the one who added the suit information). I just needed a source to confirm the death. Thanks again. --206.8.10.4 19:15, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Bowser's Death?

For those pepole who saw the game video of the new super mario bros where he fell into the pit of lava and coming back without flesh on: He doesn't die! The fact is that he is a fake verson of bowser and the real him is at the final level. Bowser is everyones favourite villian and even though he always get owned by mario he will never die.

Besides, we've seen from screenshots of Super Paper Mario that he's clearly still going to be alive for that one.

Actually, Bowser does die in the new game, in a sense. He becomes an undead Dry Bones like monster until Bowser Jr. uses a magic potion to restore his father to his normal self. Bowser did die, but he was brought back to life (the same thing could have happened in Luigi's Mansion, meaning that the game is not the last game chronologically. --63.226.134.36 02:27, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

I'd rather think of him as Nintendo's Juggernaut, personally. He's a-gon hit Mario wit his own pimp. Papacha 17:31, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

GameCube renders

Can anyone find any Nintendo GameCube renders of Bowser to put on the article?

I found one on Gamekult that from the DS, but it's still a 3D render.

http://img2.kult-mag.com/photos/00/00/53/55/ME0000535573_2.jpg

Just thought I should run it by first before uploading it. Agent CH 15:58, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

SMW2 - Bowser's first encounter with the Mario Bros?

In Super Mario World 2, we really do learn that he first encountered Mario as a baby. i'm putting that back in. Meelar 18:50, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Nonsense. Mario is a plumber from Brooklyn who had been working in the sewers prior to actually being orientated with the Mushroom and Koopa kingdoms. That block of info your adding has just as much in my mind as if to add to Adolf Hitler, "He was infamous for his evil acts of slaughter in the Holocaust." And it looks like you're making some grammatical errors, that is, no caps on your second sentence, not to insult you. --Marcus2

No problem, I usually catch those. Anyway, I maintain that Nintendo's promotional material clearly links the two Marios, so we should include it. Meelar 21:27, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Promotional material is not to be relied upon. It may be misleading or contradictory. Remember the expression, believe half of what you see and none of what you hear. --Marcus2

I'd like to repeat my request here--find one source that says Mario and Luigi didn't meet Bowser in Super Mario World 2 (not counting fan fiction). If you can't, the info should stay. Meelar 21:44, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC)

See my response to this on your talk page. This is not a biography or a science project. --Marcus2

This may not be a biography or science project, but it is an encyclopedia article. As such, it must contain, accurate, verifiable information, and this information should not be removed without reason. Unless you can provide such reason, from credible source material, the information will remain. Meelar 05:51, 13 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Having played and completed Super Mario World 2, as well as many of the other Mario games, I side with Meelar. I also think Marcus2 should follow his own advice, because I think the idea Mario is from Brooklyn comes mostly from promotional material. I'm not sure if Shigeru Miyamoto, for all intents and purposes the creator of Mario and writer of his history, ever stated that Mario is from Brooklyn, though he has stated he's a plumber (and it's implied Mario was originally a carpenter in Donkey Kong). It's possible that Miyamoto has said this but if so, I'd like to see a source. --Furrykef 19:31, 13 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Marcus2: If you continue this edit war, I may suggest that this topic be locked. All nintendo games are cannon, even if they contradict. Rather than removing content, perhaps just extend to article to say that the SMW:2 storyline conflicts with the other possible story. Tacvek 02:56, 15 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Yes. The correct procedure in cases of discrepencies in story lines are to document the discrepencies in good NPOV fashion. Sherlock Holmes fandom has been doing this for years. Same with comic book fandom for retcons in continuity. Also Edgar Rice Burroughs fandom. For the comic book character Archie there are at least two separate stories of how he first met Veronica, both of them contradicted by the L'il Archie series about Archie and the gang as very young children.

Document. Don't argue about which is right. If promotional material says something, then cite the exact promotional material (which will encourage other readers to cite other promotional material confirming it or to document other statements in contradiction). If you can't cite it, don't spread it. jallan 20:00, 15 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Most people consiter Baby Mario (BM) and Mario (M) as two characters. Up until the "Partners in Time" game, they've been seporated and always have been. Any events BM might experience are not part of M's past unless noted so. At least, that's my opinion. --Wack'd About Wiki 16:57, 26 November 2005 (UTC)

Huh. I always though that the Brooklyn story was an outdated experiment of Nintendo of America, and was solely used in the cartoons, comics, and movie instead of the games (except for the cameo in the English SNES Sim City manual, but that's the only exception I can think of, and it isn't an in-game reference). My understanding is that fans used to merge this and the SMW2YI backstory to merge the pre-SMB games and the post-SMB games together, but it was nothing official... At least, I don't remember it being so. I think we can rule that the SMB2YI story works for the games, and the Brooklyn story works for the non-games, unless there's some big game evidence that I'm somehow missing out on besides the common old North American promotions (which also usually promoted the non-game material as well).

Yeah...I also agree with the person above. The only case in which I've seen that says the Mario Bros. live in Brooklyn was in the Mario Bros. Movie.

... and the TV-show...

To the topic of Baby Mario and Mario being two seperate characters, shouldn't it be obvious that Baby Mario is the same person as Mario? SMW and SMW2 (YI) are a series of games in which both feature Yoshi. I would think that, comparing the two, SMW2 would be a prequel to SMW, thus completing the fact that Mario is the same character as Baby Mario. And Nintendo should make it's character and game stories clearer. GamePlayer623 00:43, 4 July 2006 (UTC) 17:43, 03 July 2006 (UTC)

Why Disambiguation?

Why is this article at the disambiguating link Bowser (Nintendo character) instead of Bowser which is a redirect? Until someone creates Bowser (the guy from Sha-na-na) I think we're fine at the unambig link. If no one has any objections, we should delete the Bowser redirect, and move this article there. - DropDeadGorgias (talk) 17:39, Jun 17, 2004 (UTC)

Usual appearances

Bowser's usual appearance in colors, orange, green, and yellow was never from video games in the first place. His first appearance in the video games was in colors, pale, blue, and grey. His usual appearance was first seen in the Mario Anime series. After his appearance in the Super Mario Bros. 3 Anime series, Nintendo took that design of him and replaced his first appearance in the video games to his appearance first seen in the Mario Anime series for Super Mario World in 1990. -ZachKudrna18@yahoo.com

Nickname

Should his nickname be "Bow" or "Ser"? Most people nickname him "Bow" and that "Ser" is a stupid nickname. --ZachKudrna18@yahoo.com

How about "Bowse" or "Koop"? 81.232.72.53 12:25, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

I've never heard any of these nicknames... Tyciol 19:14, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

Nicknames for a video game character are useless. Just call them by their real name. GamePlayer623 00:50, 4 July 2006 (UTC) 17:50, 3 July 2006

Princess Peach???

How did this rumor start that Bowser was in love with Peach? How do people know? Peach hates Bowser so much!! She does not love him or his seven children, the Koopalings. Bowser's trying to make Peach the mother of the Koopalings.

Rumor???!!! It was stated in Paper Mario 2 in Bowser's first scene, were 2 Hammer Bros. say that he was staring at a picture of her affectionatly. Although we do not know if the Hammer Bros. were just joking or not, it could have happened. I favor a theory of Bowser just wanting to marry Peach to take over the Mushroom kingdom. ~ Ultimate Perfect Chaos 04:46, 3 February 2006 (UTC) ~

While I agree that Peach generally rejects Bowser's affections, that doesn't mean he isn't after her. I'd also like to add Super Mario RPG as evidence, when they save her from Booster's cake in the wedding town, he attempts to kiss her. Aha! Tyciol 19:14, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

On a secondary note, Bowser Jr. says Peach is his mother in Super Mario Sunshine, and she believes him. Makes you wonder if there was anything between her and Bowser in the past (or it could just be Peach is as dumb as a stick).

Uh, it also mentions it in the first Paper Mario when you have the option of reading his Diary/Journal

Bowser's behavior

Bowser doesn't act much of a king, he behaves like a demon, and Mario acts like a much nicer king than him. --ZachKudrna18@yahoo.com

Well, Mario isn't a king now is he? Bowser is far from acting demonish, he is simply a villain, and there are many more characters from different series that act alot like him. Bowser has several less than good character traits, glutony, wrath, etc. But these villianous traits do not make him demonic. There are many more evil kings or emporers that are much, MUCH, worse than Bowser. ~ Ultimate Perfect Chaos 04:53, 3 February 2006 (UTC) ~

Bowser's not a bad king at all. And Mario isn't a King period.

"Bowser Koopa"

Somewhere along the line the two names merged, and he is now known in America as being Bowser Koopa, with "Koopa" as his, and his children's last name.

I haven't seen Bowser ever referred to as "Bowser Koopa" in official materials, although admittedly the most recent Mario game I've played is Super Mario 64. Can anybody provide an example? --Furrykef 19:39, 13 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I doubt that there is any referrence, However that said i know that it must be either Bowser Koopa, or Koopa Bowser, and the first makes more sense. Tacvek 02:56, 15 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I still don't buy the idea that his name is "Bowser Koopa". As far as I know, in Japan it has always been "King Koopa", and in the United States, it was "Bowser, King of the Koopas" in canonical sources (the games), and "King Koopa" in some non-canonical sources (the cartoons). I've never seen the form "King Bowser Koopa" even in such non-canonical sources. - furrykef (Talk at me) 22:09, 22 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Well, I agree with you that you don't usually see it written that way in video games, but if the Koopa Kids are any indication, it's his name nonetheless. They all have names like "Wendy O. Koopa" and so on, so presumably it's a clan and a surname. Just as if my name were John Doe, you could call me (somewhat archaically) John, King of the Does, or Leader of the Does, or some such. Using this example, the names King John and King Doe both work, as well. Andre (talk) 22:17, Jan 22, 2005 (UTC)

Things get difficult along this path. In the original Japanese, he is known as Koopa (クッパ, kuppa). In the original SMB, he was Great Devil Koopa (大魔王クッパ, dai maō kuppa)! (I'm not sure at the moment if he's even been "King Koopa" before and not just "king of the Koopa.") "Bowser" is something the folks here at Nintendo of America (NoA) created, to my chagrin (though I admit, it fits well). Likewise, in Japan, the Koopalings' don't have Koopa as their surname; they're just Larry, Morton, Wendy O., etc. Thus, I'm against the "King Bowser Koopa," especially since it's an inference (though admittedly a valid one). Either we should stick to the Japanese info and mention the American info (my choice since the Japanese info comes from Nintendo itself and Miyamoto himself); stick to the American info and mention the Japanese info (which I'm not wont to do); or create an amalgamation of the two, which would likely be a bit confusing. I think we should do "King Koopa," "Koopa," and "Bowser" and not "King Bowser" (unless supported) or "(King) Bowser Koopa." (Not to mention that "Bowser Koopa" sounds pretty lame ...) -- J44xm 03:38, Feb 20, 2005 (UTC)

Well your argument against "(King) Bowser Koopa" is something I'll have to think about. However, what's wrong with "King Bowser"? There's a screenshot from SMRPG saying that further down on the page. Andre (talk) 21:51, Feb 20, 2005 (UTC)

You're quite right about that, so "King Bowser" is in. ^_^ (Sorry for the delay in replying.) -- J44xm 12:59, Apr 26, 2005 (UTC)

Was he not called "Bowser von Koopa" in one game on the NES or SNES? I seem to recall that Germanised version of his name. -- Nicander

Sometimes he's also referred to as "Mr. Koopa" while he doesn't want anyone to know his given name. --ZachKudrna18@yahoo.com

Nicander, You must be thinking of Ludwig Von Koopa. The only other explanation may be from the cartoons, where I remember he played dress-up a lot like King K. Rool.

I don't know if anybody would consider this to be "canon" but, Mario Party 7 refers to Bowser as both his US name (Bowser) and his Japanese name (King Koopa). He's even called the "King of the Koopas". He is even called "Bowser" and "King Koopa" in the story and characters section of the instruction booklet. SaturnYoshi|TALK 15:05, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Quotations

Dear Goddess that's a lot of quotes. I think we should move them to WikiQuotes or just get rid of them. Are they all from the TV show? Nifboy 04:26, 22 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Apparently. A move to wikiquotes would be ok with me. Andre (talk) 02:07, Mar 23, 2005 (UTC)

I agree that the quotation section is overpowering. Joyous 04:05, Mar 31, 2005 (UTC)

Most of them. Some of them, though, are from the games and comics. User:Nintendo Maximus

Requested move

Bowser (Nintendo) → Bowser - A majority of the links point here. Note that the dis-ambiguation page itself can be named Bowser (disambiguation) and none of the other pages the dis-ambiguation page links to will change their titles. Georgia guy 02:11, 23 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one sentence explanation and sign your vote with ~~~~

• Oppose Bowser is a disambig page with several other meanings that could just as easly make a better case for that name. Since Bowser is so common, it should be the disambig page. We have no way of knowing how many people type in Bowser and actually go to the other pages. The fact that some users put in a bad link should not be a reason to remove a disambg page or to move it. Also note that more then 50% of the redirects are from 5 redirects that have bad links. Those will be fixed shortly. Vegaswikian 07:30, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)
• Oppose Fix links as necessary, I don't see any case this is the overwhelmingly most common sense of the unqualified word. Alai 03:52, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Template:Notmoved violet/riga (t) 10:57, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Since I visited this page more recently than the closed debate, I'm a bit miffed. I would have supported the above. See the example set at Mario where the unambiguated article clearly refers to what some would otherwise title "Mario_(Nintendo)"... I think, that since the mutual archnemeses Mario and Bowser are so inexorably linked, they should probably follow the same article-naming pattern. — FREAK OF NUR_xTURE (TALK) 07:53, Apr 27, 2005 (UTC)

• A stronger point too: look at Mario (disambiguation) and Bowser (disambiguation) ... and you will find there are several times more name-uses of "Mario" than "Bowser"... and yet the Nintendo character Mario is an ad hoc favorite and Bowser is not?? weird. — FREAK OF NUR_xTURE (TALK) 07:53, Apr 27, 2005 (UTC)

• I move to reopen the debate. — FREAK OF NUR_xTURE (TALK) 07:53, Apr 27, 2005 (UTC)

Name Change

I suggest we change the name to King Bowser. We have Princess Peach, so we might as well have King Bowser. --A Link to the Past 00:49, May 7, 2005 (UTC)

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one sentence explanation and sign your vote with ~~~~

• Support, I prefer King Bowser to a title with parens. Andre (talk) 01:47, May 7, 2005 (UTC)
• Oppose. I'm pretty sure I've never heard him referred to as "King Bowser". They haven't used that terminology in any of the recent Mario games, either. Bowser (Nintendo) is fine. -Doozer (Talk) 00:22, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
• Strongly oppose There seems to be no attempt to argue this is the most common name for this character, as per the naming conventions, If this is an attempt to re-open the "get rid if the disambig" debate, above, then it's dishearteningly soon. Alai 00:53, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
  • It has nothing to do with the disambig debate. Kammy Koopa calls Bowser King Bowser. So, what you're saying is that the fact that his title as a King being fact can't compete with him not being called it everytime someone refers to him? He is a King. There is no reason to not refer to him as King Bowser when it's undeniable fact that his title is King. There's no difference between his situation and the situation of Princess Peach; if you are arguing that this is his name or whatever, what's that then? Why not call her Peach? King Arthur's article is King Arthur, not Arthur (Britain). King Bowser is a better term than Bowser (Nintendo), because it's not only 100% true, but it's also a better name. No one will be confused, some people would type in King Bowser occasionally (no one would do it now without previously knowing it). Absolutely no reason to not change it. Can you actually make a feasable argument? I don't mean to be rash about this, so I'll be a little less serious... Sir, your arguments are bunk. BUNK, I say!--A Link to the Past 09:51, May 21, 2005 (UTC)
    • Can you actually cite a reason to make such a move, other than the above "no reason not to!" assertions? And here's a reason not to: the "most common name" rule, as I said before. "King Arthur" is clearly the most common reference to "King Arthur", so the comparison isn't at all compelling. Alai 23:36, 22 May 2005 (UTC)
      • It's his official title. Has anyone ever referred to him as Bowser (Nintendo)?--A Link to the Past 03:24, May 23, 2005 (UTC)
        • That's not WP policy, though, which (as I keep saying) is to use most common names. Which in this case would be to "Bowser". From your rhetorical question I gather you indeed are quibbling with the "(Nintendo)" disambiguation, then? Alai 03:44, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
          • The policy is foolish. King Bowser isn't called King Bowser for the reason that he's not Mario's King. If a character is more commonly referred to with a nickname than his actual name, should it be his Wiki name? So, you're saying that his official title, his superior name, is not the one appropriate for Wikipedia because he's more often referred to as Bowser? And Nintendo can't be called Nintendo Corporate Ltd, because it includes Nintendo of America and Nintendo of Europe, IIRC. There is no reason to keep it as Bowser (Nintendo). King Bowser is his official title, established by Nintendo of America. Okay? Okay. Okay, wow, characters who aren't under the rule of Bowser don't call him King Bowser, while his minions and Nintendo call him. No one really calls Henry VIII King Henry VIII, because he's not a likable King. Arthur is. King Bowser isn't.--A Link to the Past 05:57, May 23, 2005 (UTC)
            • I want to ask why, using that logic, we shouldn't rename the Mario article to his full name, Mario Mario. Nifboy 07:37, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
              • Here's a game - show a canon use of Mario Mario. Excluding Dr. Mario, that's just a title given to him for the sake of the game. Also, King Bowser is NOT rarely used. Unless you don't count Paper Mario, TTYD and Mario & Luigi as games. Lucas doesn't factor in the Star Wars Christmas Special into the series, and Miyamoto doesn't factor in the Super Mario Bros. Movie into his series. -- A Link to the Past 08:30, May 23, 2005 (UTC)
• Oppose. "King" title is rarely used and even more rarely used before "Bowser" (Mario RPG uses "King Koopa" and refers to him as Bowser). If the parenthesis bother you so much, use his full name, "Bowser Koopa," instead. Nifboy 07:53, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
• Oppose absolutely. Bowser, and only Bowser. No Koopa, no King, no nothing except (Nintendo) if necessary, and that's a different argument. No King. --Golbez 06:08, Jun 6, 2005 (UTC)
• Strongly Oppose. The only reason Mario's girlfriend Peach is at Princess Peach is because Peach infinitely more often refers to the fruit. I am sure many Nintendo gamers (such as my dad, who has only played the Mario Kart series) are not aware that Bowser proclaims himself king of anything. I, however, have played various Mario titles since the early 90's. When talking about the games, I always referred to (and still do refer to) Princess Peach simply as "The Princess," because before playing Mario Kart I was unaware that she was named Peach. — FREAK OF NUR_xTURE (TALK) 06:39, Jun 6, 2005 (UTC)
  • On a side note, I think Bowser is at least as worthy of One-name entity status as Mario, if not more so. Note the high number of other people named "Mario" and the low number of others named "Bowser"! — FREAK OF NUR_xTURE (TALK) 06:39, Jun 6, 2005 (UTC)
    • I don't see why people are horrified at using an official, superior alternative as opposed to one part of his name and acknowledging what game he's in. -- A Link to the Past 05:16, Jun 11, 2005 (UTC)
      • I must call BS on the use of "superior" as an adjective describing the proposed change; at least five people so far disagree with that. As for "official," I still maintain "Koopa" (which is equally "official") is more common than "King" in reference to Bowser. Nifboy 05:41, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
        • King Bowser was used in TTYD, M&L and PM. TTYD came out after SMB. How exactly is Koopa more common? Bowser is constantly referred to as King. -- A Link to the Past 16:31, Jun 11, 2005 (UTC)

Template:Notmoved Alai 00:32, 12 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Further discussion

This name change does not seem to have been posted to requested moves, and hence has just rumbled on and on, without ever being formally closed (and not moved). And prior to this month-long move discussion, there was a move request, which also did not reach a consensus. Can we let this alone for a while? Alai 16:56, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

• This is a much more reasonable move. People refused to do the other move because it would ruin the disambiguation page, while people refuse to do this because it's

1. Not official (false)
2. Never used (false)
3. Dumb to use titles (use Peach (Nintendo) if you think Bowser (Nintendo) is a appropriate)

I guess I could leave it alone. But the naysayers are being stubborn; no one is harmed by this - the title is more official than Bowser (Nintendo). -- A Link to the Past 17:16, Jun 11, 2005 (UTC)

What about because: it was voted against, long since (true), and it's against the naming conventions policy (true)? Isn't persisting in debating the point further in the face of this somewhat, well, "stubborn"? Alai 22:16, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Well, it does make sense that because it's used less than Bowser, it WOULD be against naming conventions. But has anyone ever called him Bowser (Nintendo)? What are you saying? Does it cause problems? Nope. Does the quality of the name increase? Yup. Are we using an official, canon, 100% approved by every division of Nintendo? Yup. Is it still used? Yup. -- A Link to the Past 22:46, Jun 11, 2005 (UTC)

Poll: Name move

My King Bowser move failed, but if this does, humanity phales. *chortle* Anyway, considering the fact that Bowser is a main character in one of the most popular characters in the Mario series, the most popular video game ever made, I would go on a limb and say that this character is far more well-known than a Canadian politician, a common name for pets and the guy from Sha Na Na Na. - A Link to the Past (talk) 00:26, August 27, 2005 (UTC)

Support

1. A Link to the Past (talk) 00:26, August 27, 2005 (UTC)
2. After discussing the situation with this article with A Link to the Past, I think that the current disambiguation page at Bowser should be moved and replaced by the current Bowser (Nintendo) article. We do not have any other full-length article on any "Bowser" topic, and the vast majority of incoming links to "Bowser" as of this writing are for the Nintendo character. - RedWordSmith 01:01, August 27, 2005 (UTC)
3. Agree, I don't think anyone typing "Bowser" in the search bar would be looking for any of the other things mentioned on the disambig page.Amren ^(talk) 01:02, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
4. I still can't figure out why this was disambiguated in the first place. Nifboy 01:42, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
5. Sounds alright to me. Andre (talk) 03:44, August 27, 2005 (UTC)
6. --Apostrophe 03:54, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
7. Support. I agree 100% with RedWordSmith. — FREAK OF NUR_xTURE (TALK) 04:58, August 27, 2005 (UTC)
8. Support. After discussing this with A Link to the Past I agree that it would be best to move the pages. Jtkiefer ^{T | @ | C} ----- 05:53, August 27, 2005 (UTC)

Bowser as an object

A bowser is a petrol pump, in Australian English, for one. Dysprosia 05:51, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

I added that to the main Bowser page. Zscout370 (Sound Off) 06:00, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

=King Bowser move

Phales more like Fails it --SPUI (talk) 00:31, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

So, you want to move Bowser to Bowser (disambiguation) and move this page to Bowser? If so, and if the others have no problem with it, I can make the move. Zscout370 (Sound Off) 00:30, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

This article has been renamed after the result of a move request. Apparently Zscout already took care of this. Dragons flight 03:30, September 2, 2005 (UTC)

I'm bringing up the King Bowser move again. Honestly, you can't argue the more-common thing; it's not a fair comparison, as the only people who usually talk are the heroes, who do not think of Bowser as a King. In the RPGs, however, whenever one of his minions refer to him, they call him King. Like King Arthur, that IS his official title. There's no disputing that. He's never been Prince Bowser, or just Bowser, or Bowser Koopa, or whatever. Since he has been introduced, he has been a King. His name has changed, but his title has not. - A Link to the Past (talk) 22:18, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

Object

• I prefer just plain Bowser. Even his minions call him that. Andre (talk) 01:49, 6 October 2005 (UTC)
• The games very rarely address him as King Bowser. However, the games frequently mention "Princess Peach" and "Princess Daisy." I think whatever the character is best known as should go. Putting "King Bowser" would be like listing Mario as "Mr. Mario Mario," though some people would argue that that is correct. Also, I think a good standard would be Nintendo's official literature and promotional art, none of which ever refers to Bowser as "King Bowser". Kidicarus222 04:42, 9 October 2005 (UTC)

Comments

• No, his minions call him King. Paper Mario, one of the few games to have speaking minions, uses the King term several times.
• We use King Bowser in the article, so why not in the title? - A Link to the Past (talk) 00:06, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

Image

For one, yes, it is more realistic, but how often is Bowser ever realistic? Arguably, the SSBM Mario image could be considered the better image, but it is not how he is normally depicted. - A Link to the Past (talk) 00:06, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

No, he's been portrayed in 3D more. The Mario article has the 3D image and not the cartoon (as do several other game characters). Bowser should too. --DrBat 00:24, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

But that model is not even from a Mario game. If a 3D image should be used, it shouldn't be SSBM's. He's been depicted more often as a 2D sprite. - A Link to the Past (talk) 04:07, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

Since he's been in so many games before there was 3-D, he's definately appeared more often in 2-D. Why can't we just use in image of 3-D Bowser later in the article?Kidicarus222 06:38, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

Since technology has been improved, he's been shown in 3D more. And he looks like a little kid in the Paper image. --DrBat 11:08, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

O_o That didn't even make sense. HOW does he look like a little kid? Also, you're arguing that because technology has improved, that he's been in 3D more? If he's been in 2D more, he's been in 2D more. No matter the technology. - A Link to the Past (talk) 22:26, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

It was only in 2D due to technological limitations. Once they were able to improve it, they did, and ever since Super Mario 64 he's been three-dimensional (except for the paper game, which its gimmick is paper figures in a three-dimensional world). Im sure Mario has been in more 2D too, and yet he has a 3D image for the main article. --DrBat 23:09, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

Yes, but *drumroll* the lead image is NOT SSBM's Mario. - A Link to the Past (talk) 01:18, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

I dont see whats the big deal. Its still Bowser. But fine then, use this (it was posted at the top of this page). --DrBat 01:34, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

But the super-realistic Bowser is not a popular depiction. - A Link to the Past (talk) 04:23, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

Anthropomorphic fan art

Is is just me, or does this not belong in the artile? Kidicarus222 22:41, 27 October 2005 (UTC)

It totally belongs in the article. Bowser fan art—especially of the gay, beefcake and even adult-oriented variety—are all over the place. This is relevant because it's an extremely popular fan use of Bowser. Wikipedia isn't simply a canonical Nintendo publication nor an official press release center. It's neutral, and it covers the facts, both corporate and popular. I can provide sources of Bowser fan art and fan fiction in furry, kemono and oyaji genres. Bowser is middle-aged or older, he's muscular, he's chubby, he wears leather and spikes, he has chic hair, and he's badass—he's a magnet for gay fans. Some of it's pretty and tasteful, and some of it's quite ugly and not what you'd want to show to your children or your mothers, but this is a natural consequence of fans (many who have been playing the franchise since they were children) expressing their diverse appreciation for a favorite character. So do you want the sources? - Gilgamesh 03:59, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

Actually, come to think of it, if we should be using a neutral point of view, we should discuss Bowser's long history as a fan art subject, of which a portion is gay and beefcake, and a portion is not. It's important to note that Bowser isn't exactly a gay icon per se, but rather an object of attraction, particularly among men who like bear, chubby, leather, oyaji, etc. In layman's terms, a lot of people think he's hot. - Gilgamesh 04:08, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

User:A Link to the Past brought up an excellent point about the commonness of themes in fan material and doujinshi. However, I still think they deserve mention. In this, articles like oyaji already do this a great degree, but I think something brief is still worthy of mention, such as "Bowser has long been a very popular subject of art, fiction and doujinshi made by fans young and old," or something similar. This has been used and is accepted in many articles, such as for Final Fantasy topics. Though FF players tend to start playing those games older than Mario players, I don't see why this mention of older fan involvement is less deserving here than it is in those articles. Get my drift? (Heh, personally I browse a lot of gay art, but I don't have interest in anything I couldn't show my straight friends. Bowser's nice-looking, but I hate porno and BDSM.) - Gilgamesh 04:22, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

Then if it really is a big deal, I feel like there should be a link to some of it. I mean, we're supposed to cite our sources, right? Kidicarus222 07:19, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

Are you getting tired of Bowser as the villain?

Are you getting tired of Bowser as the villain because I am. Thief Lord 21:20, 2 December 2005 (UTC)

Fenk, Wario even has his own software company (WarioWare, Inc.) now. Surely Bowser can star in his own game for once. --Matharvest 07:54, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

Ah, but HAS he? Nope, not once. It's not usual that the villain gets to be controlled in games. GamePlayer623 01:02, 4 July 2006 (UTC) 18:02, 3 July 2006

Yoshi's Safari

The rail shooter game 'Yoshi's Safari' (1993) is not mentioned in this article. In the game, developed and published by Nintendo for the SNES, Bowser and the Koopalings invade the Jewelry Kingdom and Peach dispatches Mario and Yoshi to vanquish them.

Last name

Since Bowser's kids in SMA4: SMB3 are the Koopa kids and not the Bowser kids, it is possible that in the US Koopa is Bowser's last name --Wack'd About Wiki 16:52, 26 November 2005 (UTC)

Voice?

Where did this information about Frank Welker voicing Bowser come from anyway? While I can't (at the moment) check Mario Party 5 or Mario Kart DS's credits (or M&L:PiT, for reasons obvious), I know he didn't voice Bowser in SM64DS. I checked them earlier, and Frank Welker was not one of the four voice actors listed. Plus, I checked Google, and nowhere on the Internet besides Wikipedia itself says that Welker voiced Bowser. Okay, I've checked Mario Kart DS's credits, and Frank Welker isn't there either. But Scott Burns is. Agent CH 05:26, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

Well, I've been seeing Scott Burns's name on the list of credits ever since Super Mario Sunshine and usually as the third name on the list, below Charles Martinet and Jen Taylor. I've always assumed him to play Bowser. Isaac Marshall did his voice before he had speaking roles, right? Ron Stoppable 07:56, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

That's what the article says, but back then, he always had generic roaring sounds that have been used outside of Mario games as well (an episode of ReBoot, for example). I know Marshall was listed in the Mario Kart 64 credits for Toad, at least. Agent CH 15:47, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

Problem with Sephiroth comparison?

I made a comparison to Bowser using disguised clones in Mario Bros. to how Sephiroth does this in FF7. I don't feel that this is inaccurate, and shows it's influence on later games, probably in others I have not thought of. Why was it removed? Tyciol 19:14, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

Ocarina of Time, Talon and Malon, WHAT?

• Talon and Malon both wear Bowser lanyards in Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time.

I have to contest this... first off, what is a lanyard, and how is this in any way related to Bowser? Malon wears a dress and Talon wears overalls. This needs to get specific. Tyciol 07:47, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

A lanyard is a cord worn around the neck to hold something like a whistle. So lanyard wouldn't be the right term here - Bowser appears as the medallion on the cord, not the cord itself. But it's still a cameo appearance by Bowser, and as such would belong under "Cameo appearances" where it is. Agent CH 18:17, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

Wow, I never noticed that, guess I'll have to beat the entire game over from the beginning to check this out... :) Not knowing what Lanyards were, when they said 'bowser lanyards' I was picturing Malon and Talon in shells. Does Info where one? Must be a family heirloom, which does raise some questions... as well as fanfic ideas. Tyciol 15:00, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Bowser's Neck

Anyone ever notice that Bowser's head is green and his body is orange? If you zoom in on his trophies in Super Smash Bros. Melee, you can look under his spiked collar and see the delineation between the two colors.

Bowser's name

I thought Bowser's name was King Morton Bowser Koopa, Sr.? Because of Morton Koopa, Jr.King Shadeed 00:38, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Morton is a reference. Morton Downey, Jr. - A Link to the Past (talk) 18:48, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

He is a royal for gods sake!!! The name must King Bowser Morton Von Koopa I, and Morton jr and Bowser jr´s must be, Prince Bowser ``Morton´´ Von Koopa II and Prince ``Bowser´´ Morton Von Koopa III.

What are you talking about? It's just King Bowser Koopa. No II or Mortons or Vons. Why would Von be in the name anyway?

ludwig ``VON´´ koopa, and all kings using the roman numbers when their kids have same names!

Fan Joke

I took a line out that read: One fan has joked that, "Bowser isn't really evil, he just likes to kidnap people." It seemed to be one person's opinion and did not furthur anyone's knowledge of the subject. I think most people will agree with me. Robocoppitiesthefool 15:35, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Super Princess Peach

I noted that there was no information about Bowser's appearance on Super Princess Peach, so I added some on the Platformers section. As I haven't finished the game yet, I hope someone can complete/correct this addition. wilerson 17:50, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Bowser over the years

I modified a picture from this site. Should I replace the old one? As one can see, in my version, it contains a more modern Bowser at the end and all of the Bowsers have been flipped in one direction. Well, all except for that Mario Cart one. --MrRandomGuy 07:55, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Before: File:Bowser over the years in 8 - 32 bit games.JPG

After: File:YearlyBowser11.jpg

Contridiction..?

"Nintendo has never explained if Bowser has had a wife, though it was once revealed in the Nintendo Official Magazine U.K. that his wife's name was Clawdia"

Doesn't this contridict itself a bit?

Relationship with Peach?

I think this article should mention Bowser's relationship with Princess Peach. It's not fan speculation at all. It's painfully clear that Bowser is in love with Peach, and this is made even more clear by his lines in Super Paper Mario. She doesn't return his feelings, but she still recognizes them, and in Super Paper Mario, she seems to notice how hard he is trying to prove himself as a good husband. Also, I think it's worth mentioning that they were married by Count Bleck, and by the end of the game, the marriage was never broken. Technically, wouldn't Peach still be Bowser's wife, or was this a detail Nintendo overlooked and forgot to cover?