Talk:Republic of Ireland national football team

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was move. —Nightstallion (?) 13:09, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Republic of Ireland national soccer team → Republic of Ireland national football team – Page moved when no clear consensus to do so. The Category:European national football teams uses the term “football” rather than “soccer” in all except the Northern Ireland and Republic of Ireland articles, both which where recently moved even though their is no consensus to do so. Djegan 00:24, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

Voting

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one-sentence explanation, then sign your vote with ~~~~

• Support as above. Djegan 00:24, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• support, agree with the above statement. The use of football in Ireland, Republic or Northern, does not exclusively refer to the Gaelic version. --Boothy443 | trácht ar 00:36, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support, as on Talk:Northern Ireland national soccer team. Demiurge 00:39, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Oppose, as on Talk:Northern Ireland national soccer team. Lapsed Pacifist 00:51, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support, as on Talk:Northern Ireland national soccer team. --Angelo 01:08, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support, follow standards. -- Elisson • Talk 01:30, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support as on Talk:Northern Ireland national soccer team. MartinRe 08:57, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support. Julien Tuerlinckx 11:32, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support, as on Talk:Northern Ireland national soccer team. Oldelpaso 14:15, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support, as on Talk:Northern Ireland national soccer team. -- Arwel (talk) 16:31, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support as per reasons listed above - Master Of Ninja 17:38, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support CTOAGN (talk) 18:49, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support Per note on Talk:Northern Ireland national soccer team. Guliolopez 10:15, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
• Support, as on Talk:Northern Ireland national soccer team. Stu 10:22, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Discussion

Add any additional comments

• Their is a similar move request at Talk:Northern Ireland national soccer team. Djegan 00:30, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

Move

I propose to move this article to Republic of Ireland soccer team. There is more than one type of football played in the Republic, and "national" is redundant.

Lapsed Pacifist 14:31, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

All of the teams under Category:European national football teams are in the style "country national football team" so this maybe worth baring in mind. Djegan 19:29, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

Agree with Djegan, also considering that the org that supports the team is also know as Fotball Assn. of Ireland.--Boothy443 | trácht ar 02:40, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Given the popularity of the GAA, to talk of football as if there were only one kind being played in Ireland is insulting.

Lapsed Pacifist 16:54, 4 February 2006 (UTC)

At this point their is no need to reiterate what I said at Talk:Northern Ireland national football team, as it is equally valid. Djegan 16:57, 4 February 2006 (UTC)

Ditto.

Lapsed Pacifist 21:04, 4 February 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Steve Staunton

does anybody agree with me that Steve Staunton was in fact poor at football ? I don't think he makes the list.Palx 00:35, 17 November 2005 (UTC)

• He's more than notable enough - Staunton received more caps than any other player, was captain and is now coach. --Kwekubo 02:54, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

He was quite an accomplished defender whilst at Liverpool. So good in fact that after Souness left Liverpool purchased him back from Aston Villa. --Lochdale 21:57, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Souness didn buy him back off Villa, it was Houllier

Granny Rule

I do not believe that other national sides' pages have such a defamatory section, and propose that it should be removed from here. A player has entitlement to represent any national team for which he has legal entitlement to a passport, so long as he has not previously represented another nation at U21 or full international level. The England team has featured players who have less claim to be English than sons of the diaspora have claim to be Irish (John Barnes, Graeme LeSaux, Matt LeTissier among others); there were many cases of interchangeable nationality between Spain/Italy and Argentina Uruguay in the past. Kevin McE 11:33, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

Nobody having argued to the contrary iin the month since I posted this, I have removed the defamatory section. If a player is eligible for citizenship, and has not represented any other nation at senior level, why apply a derogatory label to his selection? Kevin McE 13:38, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

I think there should be some mention of the "Granny rule" as Ireland was infamous for shamelessly exploiting this ridiculous rule. They have been MANY players who have represented Ireland who in my opinion should not have done, the only reason why was mainly because they were not good enough to play for England and so it was their only chance to play international football. It really was pathetic to see Jack Charlton resort to researching family trees to see if the players had a grand parent born on the emerald isle. Some of those players no doubt had never even visited Ireland prior to playing for them! There was even the amusing story of the US Immigration staff during the 1994 World Cup who were surprised that many of the "Irish" players travelled on British passports! Regarding Graham LeSaux and Matt LeTissier - they are both British and, as such can play for any of the FA's of the UK and at least John Barnes grew up in the country he went on to represent!Duarcain (talk) 22:40, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

The Reps???

Has anybody heard this nickname? I certainly haven't, and I suspect it might be no more that a shorthand reference used among an editor's circle. But I won't delete it yet, incase anyone knows otherwise... Kevin McE 23:03, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Never heard that nickname before. The 'boys in green' is the closest thing I have ever heard to a nickname for the national team. --Lochdale 21:59, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Never heard that in my lifebefore - no one in Ireland refers to the country the Republic - it must be a British media term —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.104.110.99 (talk) 15:51, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

I've never heard this term used in the British media either. User:Lord Cornwallis 01:01 19 Febuary 2008

Fifa Rankings

The Republic of Ireland's current Fifa Ranking is 31. Does anyone know what their best, and worst, rankings have ever been? Shouldn't this information be recorded for all International teams?

6th (August 1993: the first set of rankings published) and 57th (November 1998). The info is available at http://www.fifa.com/en/mens/statistics/rank/compare.html?static=5 and changes could be made to the infobox to include them for each country, but I can't see me going through all that... Kevin McE 15:25, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

...but I made a start on it. If the original enquirer or Lochdale, or any one else, thinks its worthwhile, please pop over to Talk:FIFA World Rankings#Help please to give a hand Kevin McE 00:34, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Good question. Personally, I think the rankings are a joke and I think it's a view shared by a number of football commentators. I would not include the rankings in this article. If anything, the bookies odds are a more accurate indicator of the quality of a team (though I would not advocate putting them in this article either). --Lochdale 22:00, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

The current ratings system has been in place for less than a month, so it is somewhat precipitate to call them a joke. Besides, as discussed on the international teams infobox talk pages, this ramking is official and encyclopedic, whether or not you consider it accurate. Kevin McE 14:47, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

So the fact that they are widley disregarded by fans, pundits and teams alike is meaningless? That they are as much about promotion and advertisement as about actual rankings doesn't mean anything? Feel free to add the rankings though I will also add the caveat that they aren't considered to be particularly accurate or decisive. --Lochdale 15:21, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

. I did not say that the criticisms were meaningless (I have added detail to the criticisms on the relevant article), but their existence is a fact, and their official status makes them encyclopedic. I am unclear as to how a ranking is ever "decisive", of intended to be: their accuracy I believe to have been greatly improved by recent substantial changes in the calculation. Kevin McE 00:40, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Well I'm not sure what you are basing that on. For example, the US was ranked higher than both Italy and Ghana in the last world cup (all of 6 weeks ago) yet not one bookie had them favourite to win either game. That's an improvement? The rankings are questionable, at best. --Lochdale 02:47, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Of course rankings are questionable: but that does not mean that they are invalid. The rankngs are a calculation based on historic performance, not a predictor of specific match outcomes. As to your saying that you do not know what I am basing my opinion that the new formula is an improvement upon, I have stated twice that the formula for the rankings has now changed. You have clearly not even taken the trouble to look at FIFA World Rankings to inform yourself as to the date or nature of these changes, and yet you continue to argue your point here. The purpose of an encyclopedia is to provide information, and to do that you need to do your research before you contribute. Kevin McE 10:09, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

• Of course they should be included. As Kevin McE said they are factual and this is supposed to be an encyclopedia. It doesn't matter what your opinion is of them. --Dodge 10:28, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

It is, however, important that it is noted that the rankings are not considered dispositive and are not given much weight in the football community. --Lochdale 17:14, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Its not important on this page. It maybe important on the Main article on the rankings buiut on the Republic Of Ireland page, the numbers should be noted and nothing else --Dodge 18:49, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. Lochdale 17:26, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

Here is how the fifa rankings are fixed.When Ireland drew 2-2 with Isreal when their keeper spent half the game on the floor Ireland dropped from 11th to 22nd.When England lost to Northern Ireland they went up one place.Now ,no offence to Norther Irish people,but losing to northern ireland is much worse than draw against isreal.(if anybody could get me the correct amount of time the isreali keeper spent on the ground 'injured' that would be a great help.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by -the-muffin-man- (talk • contribs) 21:04, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Asst Manager

After reviewing the almost painful efforts of an anonymous editor over the last few days to include Bobby Robson's role, I have done this by editing the infobox. Although I recognise that his title and job scope are not strictly defined by assistant manager, trying to change this will introduce an inappropriate box on many other international team articles, so please let this slight inaccuracy ride. Kevin McE 14:44, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

I agree. Nice job. Lochdale 07:40, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

I've tried a different way of incorporating both Robson's role, and that of Kevin McDonald who is actually assistant coach.Johnny Magorey 16:52, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Additional Links

Would it make sense to include a link to an Irish soccer website such as www.eleven-a-side.com or an Irish soccer discussion board such as foot.ie? I have no connection to either site but just curious to see what people think. Lochdale 07:40, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

Gary Breen and some additions

I have removed Gary Breen from the team list as he recently announced his retirement. I have also added Dayrl Murphy to the Strikers list as he was called up and should get a run out on Wednesday against Holland. Lochdale 01:43, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

I can't even bring myself to discuss Saturday's match. Don't want to add Jay Tabb or any else to the squad. Lochdale 16:16, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Terry Dixon

Can somebodywith a bit more knowledge on Spurs/the underage sides do a page on Terry Dixon. I understand it'll be short at the moment, just think that little bit of red looks bad on the squad section Dodge 15:05, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

I'll try and do some research on the Spurs home page as they have a decent reserves/juniors section. I agree though, we need a little more on Mr. Dixon...assuming he ends up playing for Ireland! Lochdale 18:51, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

Squad section

Does anybody else think the squad section has far too much whitespace? Also due to changing nature of the squad, it could be updated almost monthly. I'd much prefer to see a situation like the Northern Ireland national football team squad section. Any thoughts? Dodge 15:19, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Trivia Section

Should there be one at all? If there is to be one, surely we can get more interesting titbits than the one there now? My own preference is for removal. Thoughts? Dodge 13:44, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

I've removed it now Dodge 00:57, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Possible item of information worth including in such a section: Although not used currently, I believe that the colour of Germany's common green away top (see the 1990 and 1994 World Cups for recent use) was chosen as Ireland were the first nation to play the Germans in a friendly after World War II. I've been looking for some sort of verification of this on the web but am not having much luck. The best I can find is on a chat-site, here.--Danny Invincible 06:09, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

• To the best of my knowledge the story about Germany wearing green as an away shirt because of Ireland is untrue. RedsIndependent.com 17:08, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

• Ronnie Whelan said that why Germany wear the green jersey as an away jersey is because it's apparantley an apology for when Ireland was accidentally bombed during WW2.

That bit about Ireland only beating three teams that have qualified for major competitions in away games is nonsense... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 194.125.86.198 (talk) 22:35, August 22, 2007 (UTC)

Famous/Infamous games

No other national football team page attempts such a section, and although it might contain anecdotes that are of interest, and even noteworthy in an encyclopedia, I would suggest that the title, at lease, cannot be anything but POV. If I were Brazilian, I would not think that match infamous: far from it. It is infamous only from an Irish supporter's point of view, ergo it is POV. Kevin McE 21:36, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Agree completely. I think it should be removed. Dodge 22:19, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

The England game should be removed anyway.It was English fans who started the riots,probally because they losing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by -the-muffin-man- (talk • contribs) 21:06, 14 November 2006 (UTC) Somebody put in a lot of time adding those paragraphs, but they have not come here to defend them. I propose to delete them in a week unless discussion here takes a different turn than the statements above.Kevin McE 10:43, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Kevin, I vote to keep the famous/infamous games list, as it adds some historical context to past performances. They are key moments in the history of the team, after all. BrianO'H 11:44, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

It seems that recently, every game is either a "famous" or "infamous" game. The Cyprus game was certainly a poor showing, and the San Marino game was certainly better, but both games will likely be forgotten in a couple of years. It would seem that some standard for a famous/infamous game should be created or a time delay before a game may be added. Having said all this, I really like the section and think it should stay, I just don't want it diluted with recent games that aren't that noteworthy. Captkrob 22:14, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

To be frank, I doubt the Cyprus game will be forgotten. It was an utter debacle. Also, we still remember the 0-0 match with Lichenstein. Lochdale 03:53, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Surely the one-nil win against holland to qualify for 2002 should be listed? not only did we qualify unexpectedly, we knocked one of the giants of world soccer out in the process.plokt

KEEP. This info is difficult to source on the web PalX 09:34, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Remove them, There is a section in the top-right of the article for notable games and alot of the games mentioned need not be featured. Adzer 23:44, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

National Football Team

Eog1916 22:06, 24 January 2007 (UTC)eog1916

The 'Republic of Ireland' is not a 'Nation' nor is 'Northern Ireland'.

The old pre partition 'Irish League' formed the national football team. One could argue therefore that there is no national football team because the 'League of Ireland' and the 'Irish League' are seperate associations and until they unite we are left without a national team. Why either of them qualify as national teams at international level is somewhat of a puzzle!

The people of the Republic of Ireland have a shared culture. This defines them as being a nation. It is therefore correct to say Republic of Ireland national football team.
Northern Ireland debatedly does not have this status. PalX 13:00, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

What constitutes a "current squad"?

Until recently, 45 players were listed as being in the current squad. This at a time immediately before 2 international matches when there was a group of c. 25 at a national team gathering. Does it actually make any sense to describe anybody as being in a "current" squad when the next match is several weeks away, and the issue of what players might be selected is a matter of speculation? Is the "current" squad actually encyclopedic, or is it recentism to want to list it? Maybe these are questions that should be considered more widely as they affect all international teams, but opinions of those visiting this article would be interesting as a starting point. In the meanwhile, can we please call a halt on adding players who we remember were in a squad not long ago/think might have been in the most recent if they had not been injured/should be in the squad if the manager had a clue etc etc etc. Kevin McE 00:50, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

This is one for Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football/National teams. I note that the template Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/National teams/Template doen't include a "current squad" section at all. Which doesn't necessarily mean there should be none; probably it means there's a lot that hasn't been standardised or agreed on. jnestorius^(talk) 01:02, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Selected Former Players

What is the criteria for inclusion? Secondly, as they all played for Ireland is there any point in having the flag beside their name?--Vintagekits 15:51, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

I don't think there is one, although I may be wrong. Hopefully we can sort something out, with criteria something along the lines of a minimum number of goals/caps and inclusion in the finals of tournaments. Dan K (talk) 19:41, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

Peter Murphy

Is listed as unattached on his wiki and yet at Carlisle United on the current squad please sort out

Current squad

Anyone getting sick of the "current squad" bit being changed for each game. I propose that if a player has played or been chosen to play in the team for any game (including frendlies during a campaign should be included in the squad for the remaining duration of that campaign. agree? disagree?--Vintagekits 00:27, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

I would refer you to my comments above under "what constitutes a current squad?". Accumulation of players as you suggest would lead back to the situation of 45+ being listed at once: no side has a squad of that size, and if there is a squad gathered together, then listing others as being in the squad is simply untrue. My preference would be to remove such sections altogether: they encourage use of Wikipedia as a news source rather than as an encyclopedia, and by definition they fail the 10-year-test to avoid recentism. I would also suggest that any squad listed other than in the time between announcement of a squad and completion of that set of matches is either supposition or anachronistic. It was not true, for example, last week to say that Robbie Keane was in the squad, as the squad was in USA and RK was on his holidays somewhere; it is supposition to put him in the squad for the next game against Denmark, because no-one here knows what Staunton's plans for that game are. I have invited discussion here but no-one has bitten yet. Kevin McE 10:20, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Not a bad suggestion Kevin. I would be open to listening to all solutions - but I think we both recognise that the current state isnt satisfactory.--Vintagekits 10:29, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Instead of a list of current squad members, why not have something like a list currently active players with more than 10 caps? Dan K 07:39, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Ireland FA.gif

Image:Ireland FA.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 07:43, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Page has been vandelised —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.96.114.68 (talk) 19:35, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

Introduction

I've been trying to improve the intro so it gives a brief summary of the whole article without bogging down in detail which is mentioned later on, while improving some of the language used, but someone doesn't seem to like it at all. I was hoping if we could please ascertain exactly what information we want in the introduction rather than just relegating this to an edit war. Dan K (talk) 19:31, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

Irish Players Abroad

I would like to see a section similar to that of the Scotland team which lists Irish players who play abroad even players with dual nationality and ones who can represent Ireland through the parents / grandparents. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.254.234.251 (talk) 13:32, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Inter-regnum

So who is regarded as the Manager until May? I know there are no matches, but is anybody minding the shop? And if Trappatoni does not take the job until May, is it (a) false, or (b)Crystal balling, to include him in the infobox and table. I would rather have a prose line stating that he is due to take on the post at such and such a date. Kevin McE (talk) 16:12, 15 February 2008 (UTC)