Talk:World's Columbian Exposition

An event in this article is a May 1 selected anniversary (may be in HTML comment)

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World??

I thought it was the World's Columbian Exposition.

World's is correct. See http://columbus.gl.iit.edu/ I seriously doubt they've got it wrong. Pinktopaz

The contemporary literature and the souvenirs of the fair itself say "World's". Currently "World's" redirects to "World". Presumably, it should be the other way around. Any volunteers? Wahkeenah 21:19, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

I agree. I'll request a page switch and I'll help go through the links after the switch is made. Many pages already link to the correct name. -- DS1953 22:21, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

If I read correctly, since the redirect page did not have anything in the discussion page, a simple "move" was all that was required and unless I am truly confused (I am a newbie after all) I was able to make the change. There appear to be hundreds of pages that already linked to the correct name and the old name now redirects to the new one so presumeably anything that linked to it is working still. Pinktopaz 22:48, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

Copyright

"The man who created it was American and never copyrighted the song, putting it straight into the public domain."

I know that's not how copyright works today, is there any reason to believe that registering a copyright was necessary back then? This smells like bullshit if you ask me. - 8:11, 4 August 2008 (PDT).

That is how copyright works today, since 1976. Prior to that, registration was, if not absolutely required (I'm not sure), much more important. 63.87.189.17 (talk) 20:24, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Also, late in the article it reads "The Exposition drew nearly 26 million visitors." but the opening reads "Over 27 million people (equivalent to about half the U.S. population) attended the Exposition"

Grade inflation? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.113.19.217 (talk) 03:14, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

Pabst was blue ribbon before 1893

In the section of the article "Famous firsts at the fair" I deleted Pabst Blue Ribbon because it wasn't really a "first." Pabst had won awards at earlier World's Fairs and had been using blue ribbons on the bottle since 1882.

A source for the first use of blue ribbons on the bottle is http://www.pabstblueribbon.com/history.htm

HH Holmes

I'm surprised this article doesn't mention the fact that HH Holmes (AKA Herman Mudgett) was seeking victims at this fair. It is unknown how many people that attended the fair were killed by him, but it was enough that it should warrant a mention.

Better Photo

Does anybody feel up to obtaining the photo on this page: http://www.hydeparkhistory.org/images/ColumbianExpo.jpg for use it the article? It looks like it is in the public domain. Explanatory caption is here: http://www.hydeparkhistory.org/pavedbeach4.html Speciate 00:50, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

I have several books a photos from the event, from 1893, so might be able to come up with something similar. By the way, don't forget to sign your posting 'cause I'm much more likely to respond to a user. Carptrash 01:00, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Skyscrapers?

I was under the impression that the fair had skyscapers... I'm not sure though.

• The only "skyscraper" at the fair was the Ferris Wheel. Wahkeenah 04:03, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
• There were a few elsewhere in Chicago at the time, however. Well, what they called skyscrapers, at least. 63.87.189.17 (talk) 20:27, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Merge

Support merging the unique info in Chicago Columbian Exposition (if any) into this article and removing that article, which uses an alternate and unofficial title for the fair. The Chicago Columbian Exposition article also contains misinformation, such as stating that the Ferris Wheel was part of the White City — it was actually on the Midway Plaisance, not part of the fair proper; and the White City was really just the area surrounding the Court of Honor, since the rest of the fair was much more polychromatic. Kevin Forsyth 17:34, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Support merging the article per Kevin Forsyth. ChicagoPimp 17:43, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Support merging with this as the destination page. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 17:51, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Support merging, very little of value in this article, but Chicago Columbian Exposition is the proper name. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tobyfee (talk • contribs) 20:21, May 1, 2007 (UTC).

Support merging both articles into this one. The World's Columbian Exposition was a tremedously important cultural event for Chicago, and probably the most influential World's Fair ever held in The United States. I'm surprised this isn't already a much longer article. Whyaduck 23:14, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Support and keep in mind that the official title was World's Columbian Exposition, not "Chicago Columbian Exposition" nor "Chicago World's Fair". Those were informal names or colloquialisms. Wahkeenah 00:12, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Support. Be bold and go ahead now. I'm sure you won't get any complaints. -- DS1953 ^talk 02:58, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Support I concur with all of the above comments.Internazionale 21:20, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Court of Honor

I corrected and completed the list of Court of Honor ("White City") buildings. The Women's Building was on the Lagoon, and the Ferris Wheel was in the Midway, so I removed both from the bullet list of Court of Honor buildings. Kevin Forsyth 17:38, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Issue of Racism

How come there's no mentioning of the fact that no Af-Americans were allowed to set up exhibitions at the fair? Can someone please not ignore this undeniable part of history?

Absolutely correct - this was a major issue at the time for African Americans. Of equal importance was the fact that women were all but excluded from the "White City" (a name that also has clear racial connotations, in addition to the meanings discussed in the article) as their exhibits were confined to the "Women's Building" on the edge of the "city."

Historians have discussed the 1893 fair extensively - in fact it's almost a cliche to talk about it in works dealing with the late 19th century. It has been discussed as a critical window on American attitudes toward race, gender, civilization, and imperialism in the late 1800s. The failure to discuss the race and gender issues represents an egregious omission, and in general this article should incorporate much more of (indeed it should be based largely upon) the historical scholarship. I might try to add some stuff (the first chapter of Gail Bederman's Manliness and Civilization is not a bad place to start and I have it handy), but this is definitely something we need to work on. The Chicago World's Fair was considerably more interesting than is portrayed in this article.--Bigtimepeace | talk | contribs 08:25, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Change picture caption - Daniel Chester French's Republic (replica)

Does anyone object to changing the caption on the first picture? It makes it sound like there was an exposition in Chicago in 2004 (that is the year the photograph was taken). The replica pictured here was dedicated in 1918. I will drop a note to the photographer about adding more info about the replica to the photo's description page.

Current caption: One-third scale replica of Daniel Chester French's Republic, which stood in the great basin at the exposition, Chicago, 2004

Change to: One-third scale replica of Daniel Chester French's Republic. The original stood in the great basin at the World's Columbian Exposition. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gingerwiki (talk • contribs) 04:49, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Surviving buildings?

Besides the Museum of Science and Industry, what buildings survive? There needs to be boldface wording for this -- I mean, it needs its own paragraph. --Ragemanchoo (talk) 13:01, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

It is erroneous that only one building survives. Two others are the "Dutch House" now located in Brookline, MA, and Maine's exposition pavilion, known as the "State of Maine" building, now located in Poland Springs, ME.

On the former, here is a web source http://www.town.brookline.ma.us/Planning/Zoning/update-novdec2002.pdf One of the three remaining buildings of the 1893 Chicago World’s Columbian Exposition is in Brookline, MA. Known as the "Dutch House", the unique building stands facing the Riverway brought to Brookline by Captain Charles Brooks Appleton in 1894. The original building stood in Jackson Park and was a copy of the brick Town Hall of [sic] Franker in Holland built in 1591. The present building is forty feet square and was designed by M. Guillaume Wyuen and constructed in Holland and Belgium before being erected in Chicago. It was the building which represented the Van Houten Cocoa Company and was one of the few private buildings to win a medal. The doors and carved panels came from Hindeloopen, while the front doorway is an adaptation of one of the orphanage door at Enkhuizen. Appleton became so captivated with eh structure, he purchased it at auction and had it dismantled and shipped to Boston. The firm of Kingsbury & Richardson designed its reconstruction which included new Portland cement on the exterior. The house contains over 1000 square feet of leaded green glass. Appleton wished the house to be a haven for artists; it was long the home of Leo O’Donnell, an artist, book designer and professor at Massachusetts School of Art.

Contact Information: Greer Hardwicke, Preservation Planner; Telephone: 730-2617 or greer_hardwicke@town.brookline.ma.us Roger Reed, Preservation Planner; Telephone 730-2089 or roger_reed@town.brookline.ma.us

For an image of the Franeker stadhuis: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Franeker_stadhuis_03c.JPG

For an image of the Brookline, MA "Dutch House" http://www.town.brookline.ma.us/TownInformation/BrooklinePhotos/78.htm

On the later, here are two web sources:

[1] http://www.framingham.com/collecting/polandspring.htm While in Chicago, Hiram Weston Ricker bought Maine's exposition pavilion, known as the "State of Maine" building. He had it dismantled by Maine workers and shipped back to the resort. Reassembled, it opened with great pomp and celebration in 1895 and served as a library and art museum for guests. It's one of two Columbia Exposition pavilions still in existence.After the Turn of the Century, the automobile made travel easier and society's tastes and habits changed. The resort began a decline although it retained some allure for the famous, such as John Barrymore, Gene Tunney, and Babe Ruth, who used the resort to escape the public eye, train, and golf.

[2] http://maine.gov/local/androscoggin/poland/ Also on this site (Poland Springs, ME) is the Maine State Building which was built to represent the state at the Chicago World's Fair, known as the Columbian Exposition, in 1893. The building was disassembled, shipped back to Maine, and then reconstructed on its current site. It now serves as an art museum for the public sponsored by the Poland Spring Preservation Society. 151.203.5.19 (talk) 01:30, 26 May 2008 (UTC) 151.203.5.19 (talk) 12:35, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

There is also a copy of Jefferson's Monticello from the 1893 exposition still standing at Maryville, North Road and River Road, in DesPlaines, Illinois. It was donated to the school which was rebuilding after a fire of a number of years before. It is not in first rate condition but a little spent on it would make it an worthwhile Chicago land mark. (Alfric)

"Discovery"

I changed the intro line from "Columbus' 'discovery' of the New World" to "Columbus' arrival in the New World". While I agree that CC didn't discover the New World per se, adding quotes around the word "discovery" seems, well, rather arch to me. I hope that "arrival" is a bit more neutral. Kevin Forsyth (talk) 16:07, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Bates, "America the Beautiful"

As the very reference cited, http://www.falmouthhistoricalsociety.org/05/klbates.htm, makes clear, it was not the White City that inspired Katherine Lee Bates to write America, the Beautiful. The trigger for the poem is usually said to be her visit to Pike's Peak somewhat later. The White City inspired only the reference to "alabaster cities."

(Incidentally, a pet peeve of mine is that the song is often sung as if the speaker were asserting that America's alabaster cities are, in fact, "undimmed by human tears," whereas it is perfectly clear from context that what she is praising is not the grim conditions of U. S. cities as they were in the 1890s--the cities of Riis' How the Other Half Lives--but the "patriot" dream of a better urban future. Even more conspicuous is the customary omission of the stanza in which the speaker prays "God mend thine every flaw." We apparently don't have much tolerance for patriotic songs that talk of American "flaws.") Dpbsmith (talk) 16:32, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Controversies that should be discussed

I wrote an essay on the World's Columbian Exposition for my history class and from skimming this article, I see a few big omissions when it comes to controversies surrounding the fair.

I know that the issue of racism has been mentioned, but also lacking is any reference to: -sexism -union labor (constructing the fairgrounds, Chicago Building Trades Council strike, closed shop policy) -the debate over Sunday opening (and the Sabbatarians) -and also the contentious selection process for the host city of the fair.

I will try to get on top of some of this, but help and comments would be greatly appreciated..

Mannymanny1 (talk) 04:25, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

Missing: Japanese presence and influence

Having just seen the end of the first hour of a PBS program titled "Expo: Magic of the White City", directed by Mark Bussler and narrated by Gene Wilder, I came here to read more.

Unfortunately, there is no mention here of what seems was the shocking presence of the hitherto secretive Japanese. The program provides some insight into this appearance, which I believe must have added passion to the budding area of Landscape Architecture, and which certainly influenced subsequent garden design for years, not to mention lighting an interest in Japanese craftsmanship/furniture and decor, and even awakened the West to their political ambitions.

From family heirlooms, books, and photos, I can see how influential the Japanese presence was on my Western-European ancestors.

It would be my hope that someone with a historical background could expand the article to account for this.

-tw Tekwriter (talk) 16:06, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

Four New Images

I just posted four images that I believe were taken of the World's Columbian Exposition by my great grandfather. The family may have more of these kind of images. I am not sure that all of them are of the Columbian Exposition and if they are not please let me know. One in particular was interesting to me in that it showed the inside of an exhibit hall that I hadn't seen similar images of. Please feel free to delete this gallery after a bit. Any extra information that people could provide about the images would be appreciated. Thanks.

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  Wisconsin Building

City on Fire

Am I completely crazy or didn't a big part of the fair burn down after it was over? Did I make that up? I don't see mention of it anywhere in the article except in a vague picture caption. Maybe I read past it a couple times? 67.171.216.243 (talk) 04:36, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

• Okay I see a mention of the fire now, but it's completely buried. It seems like that should be a big chunk of the article - what happened to this massive, beautiful, epoch-altering place? Where did it go? How did the fire start? When was it exactly? What was the aftermath? etc. 67.171.216.243 (talk) 04:40, 23 June 2009 (UTC)