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The Watsonian Vice-Counties divide Great Britain and Ireland, and does not include the Channel Islands. Hence the 112 vice-counties of Great Britain and the 40 in Ireland, giving a total of 152. The reference provided states that Watson's invention was the division of Britain (and included the Isle of Man) into biogeographical recording units, and subsequently Ireland was divided into a widely accepted scheme on a par with that devised for Britain. The Map shown on page 51 is labelled "Vice-county boundaries of the British Isles" and it does indeed show a map of the British Isles (including the Channel Islands), but clearly excludes the Channel Islands from being a vice-county. J.E. Dandy's report and recommendations on the Watsonian Vice-County system to the BSBI in 1950 also reiterates that there are 112 vice-counties of Britain and Ireland. Regarding the Channel Islands, I've seen some studies include the Channel Islands as an "extra" vice-county, but nowhere have I seen the Channel Islands officially listed as a "Watsonian" vice-county. Can I suggest that the simplest solution is to make a separate point, stating that when studies are done of the complete British Isles, the Channel Islands is sometimes reported as a vice-county. Or something similar. --HighKing (talk) 15:44, 1 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
The Channel Islands inclusion in the British Isles is indeed a moot point, but how do you account for your ommission of the Isle of Man? There is no justification. If you think this exchange is covered by BRD, then you have misunderstood the intention of that page. My edits were not "bold"; they were edits that any reasonable person would condone. You know that there is no consensus for your edits, and you know that there is consensus for mine. Please stop making these edits that merely waste everyone's time. --Stemonitis (talk) 18:13, 1 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Hi Stemonitis - there is no omission. The Isle of Man was included by Watson himself as a vice-county. When people refer to the vice-counties of Britain (or vice-counties of Great Britain, or vice-counties of England, Scotland and Wales), they don't exclude the Isle of Man as this is numbered as vice-county 71 - check the diagram on the article. The inclusion of the Channel Islands as part of the British Isles comes up in a number of topics, but not in this case. Where articles refer to the 152 vice-counties, it excludes the Channel Islands, and refers solely to the vice-counties of Great Britain and Ireland. --HighKing (talk) 18:49, 1 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
From the report by Dandy, it states The result was a system of 112 vice-counties, numbered consecutively from 1 (West Cornwall) in the south-west to 112 (Zetland) in the extreme north and further on states By dividing Britain into unit areas of suitable size, we can conveniently record, or index, our information about the horizontal distribution of plants and animals within the country
The British Bryological Society shows a map labelled "Vice-county map of Britain and Ireland" but describes it as "the boundaries of the Watsonian Vice-counties for the British Isles". Note though, that the map itself does not provide a designation for the Channel Islands, but that the "Channel Islands" is assigned a letter "C".
The Biological Records Centre takes a different approach though, and often assigns the Channel Islands with a vice-county number 113. --HighKing (talk) 19:25, 1 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
The ODNB entry for Hewett Watson does not mention counties of any description. This map (press bottom but one)shows that The "Watsonian" sytem only covers Britain - Wherever the Irish Category comes from they are not "Watsonian". Were these subdivisions created by Watson or subsequently named after him? MacStep (talk) 20:03, 1 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
No, that's because that site is run by a UK-specific organisation. It says nothing about whether or not Watsonian vice-counties cover Ireland, merely that they present UK data categorised by Watsonian vice-counties. The Gateway's "About" page states "This is the National Biodiversity Network's Gateway. Use it to explore UK biodiversity data, as contributed by participating data providers." You would not expect it to cover the Republic of Ireland, and it does not. There are good references that discuss Watsonian vice-counties, and they are unanimous in including Ireland. Misreading a website cannot alter that. I would also draw your attention to this text.
How does the answer to your final question matter? Watson created the first definition, and they were subsequently named after him, even after the system was expanded to cover a greater area than originally envisaged. There is no dispute among biogeographers as to the meaning of the term, or what area it covers. --Stemonitis (talk) 20:15, 1 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
If you were correct H40 Londonderry would be included in present UK data categorised by Watsonian vice-counties - It isn't. Your Reference points to 112 counties - surely it is a British Sytem and does not cover Ireland - where are the WP:V references to support the inclusion of Ireland? MacStep (talk) 20:28, 1 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
