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=== Statement by El_C ===
=== Statement by El_C ===
I'm not sure how practical this may be, but long before the flareup at Syrian Kurdistan, I've been calling for a sanctions regime that would encompass the [[Kurds]] topic area, overall. Note, for example, the Kurdish-related disruption on the part of {{noping|Emblemmor}} whom I've just indeffed mere minutes ago after {{u|Semsûrî}} brought their disruption to my attention. Not to put you on the spot, Semsûrî, but I invite you to summarize to the Committee some of the problems that you have been forced to deal with in the topic area for such a long time. [[User:El_C|El_C]] 17:24, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
I'm not sure how practical this may be, but long before the flareup at Syrian Kurdistan, I've been calling for a sanctions regime that would encompass the [[Kurds]] topic area, overall. Note, for example, the Kurdish-related disruption on the part of {{noping|Emblemmor}} whom I've just indeffed mere minutes ago after {{u|Semsûrî}} brought their disruption to my attention. Not to put you on the spot, Semsûrî, but I invite you to summarize to the Committee some of the problems that you have been forced to deal with in the topic area for such a long time. [[User:El_C|El_C]] 17:24, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
:The massive disruption and vandalism throughout all of 2019 and perhaps into last year has dwindled down to sporadic disruption. I could make a thorough summarization but most of it wasn't actually pertaining to Kurdish topics in Syria but everything else. --[[User:Semsûrî|Semsûrî]] ([[User talk:Semsûrî|talk]]) 18:35, 6 January 2021 (UTC)


=== Statement by {Non-party} ===
=== Statement by {Non-party} ===

Revision as of 18:35, 6 January 2021

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Requests for arbitration

Arbitration Committee proceedings
Request name Motions Initiated Votes
Syrian Kurdistan   6 January 2021 0/0/0
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No arbitrator motions are currently open.

Syrian Kurdistan

Initiated by GPinkerton (talk) at 07:34, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Involved parties

Confirmation that all parties are aware of the request
Confirmation that other steps in dispute resolution have been tried

Statement by GPinkerton

User:Paradise Chronicle, User:Levivich, and I have run into difficulty in a content dispute with editors with whom it has become clear there are conduct and POV-pushing issues; namely the other parties identified in this case. It has become clear that though Syrian Kurdistan is covered by the General Sanctions applied to the Syrian Civil War articles, the issues with it and numerous Kurdish-related pages across the Near/Middle East fall outside the direct remit of WP:SCW sanctions, which have proven unable to resolve the project-wide dispute. Numerous editors have received blocks for their contributions to this topic (including myself, including for having raised multiple ANI reports on the subject). Meanwhile the disruption has continued, as evidenced by the numerous diffs collected by interested parties at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Kurds, with accompanying disruption: this edit for example.

The geopolitical "Kurdish Question" has long been salient in international politics. Kurdistan, the cultural homeland of the Kurds, spans four modern states (Syria, Turkey, Iran, Iraq) and the Kurds are a repressed minority long subjected to state suppression, including 20th-century military offensives, ethnic cleansing, and genocide. Problem behaviours have included:

  1. denying the existence of a (Syrian) Kurdistan.
  2. erasure or "whitewashing" historical events, including denial of ethnic cleansing in the Arab Belt.
  3. removing well-sourced mentions of matters relating to Kurds.
  4. removing mentions of Kurdish populations and names, including moving articles to non-Kurdish place names (such as those changed under the Arab Belt).
  5. using unreliable sources to contradict academic sources.
  6. quoting selectively, misquoting, and misrepresenting sources.

On the Syrian Kurdistan page (and elsewhere), editors have been seeking to deny that the Arab Nationalist Ba'ath Party perpetrated a campaign of ethnic cleansing known as the "Arab Belt" in Syrian Kurdistan, and moreover, have questioned that the existence of the place, in the face of numerous reliable sources. (In Iraq, the same party later organized the Anfal genocide.) Editors (particularly User:عمرو بن كلثوم, User:Supreme Deliciousness, and User:Thepharoah17) argue that the historically Kurdish-majority borderlands of Syria and bordering Iraqi Kurdistan and Turkish Kurdistan were not historically populated by Kurds until the post-WWI French Mandate of Syria.

This conduct is beyond the pale in light of the well-attested fact that the national socialist Ba'ath Party's Arab Belt ethnic cleansing plan in the newly renamed Syrian Arab Republic, denied Kurds' civil rights on the fictitious grounds that they were illegal 20th-century immigrants escaping persecution in the Turkish Republic; this exclusion endured until the Civil War. From the 1960s on, it has been a central myth of Syrian Arab nationalism that Kurds do not belong within Syria's modern borders and that Syrian Kurdistan is a figment of Kurdish nationalists' imagination: there is evidence of propagation of this idea on Talk:Syrian Kurdistan and on many other articles. This is akin to Holocaust denial. GPinkerton (talk) 07:34, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]


Statement by Paradise Chronicle

I was going to request a case myself but on the wider Kurdish issue. The Kurdish issue is really in need of an ArbCom Case. That the topic banned but really influential editor (leading editor) in the article Syrian Kurdistan, GPinkerton chose this way to be able to take part in the discussion, is understandable. How to describe or even if the Kurds should be described on Wikipedia is a long lasting conflict (not only content dispute, but behavioral issue and dispute) and there can be provided similar diffs as extensively presented in the Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Kurds for a way longer time span if needed. The issues presented for Syrian Kurdistan are clearly relevant and often also count for the Kurdish issue in general.Paradise Chronicle (talk) 14:43, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Levivich

Not much to add other than that the stuff at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Kurds and Talk:Syrian Kurdistan isn't a content dispute (and I really don't understand how anyone can think it is). TBANs are long overdue. A dozen ANI threads hasn't fixed this. Half a dozen editors already sanctioned. Admins divided. And it continues every day. Asking whether Syrian Kurds exist is like asking whether German Jews exist. I'm embarrassed by my colleagues who treat this question as if it were a legitimate question. Levivich harass/hound 16:21, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by عمرو بن كلثوم

My first reaction to this case is really shock to see it come from an "editor" with so many problematic behavior issues across a wide topic of areas. There has been a case against them almost every month at the at the ANB, with the last one being this lengthy discussion about their WP:BATTLEGROUND behavior in at least eight different articles covering a wide range of topics (e.g., Holocaust in Bulgaria, Bulgaria during World War II, Hagia Sophia, Murder of Samuel Paty, etc.). This case is just another piece of evidence confirming that. Their edit-warring behavior is complemented with a very aggressive personal attack attitude. See these examples they wrote against me: here here, here. Their Talk page is full with warnings about WP:Edit warring, WP:Civility issues. Warning and cases are just too many to count, but here are some recent examples:

They were indeffed by Guerillero here on 4 Dec. but then the block was converted to a tban of Middle East post 1453, which of course that they never respected. Here are some warnings after the indef was lifted and during the tban:

I think I'll stop here for now out of respect for your time, but the list really goes on and on. As for the content dispute, this lengthy difference gives you an idea (no need to post walls of text here). Cheers, Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم (talk) 10:03, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Attar-Aram syria

This is a content dispute. Its baffling that the editor who started this is comparing the content dispute to Holocaust denial!!!.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 13:01, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Thepharoah17

As I have already stated, I am done and have no further interest in the Kurds issue. I still don't know a lot of features on Wikipedia such as an ArbCom or how to nominate an article for deletion. I just learned about the three revert rule a few days ago (not that I ever needed to know because I never edit warred). My main goal was to get rid of the Irish sockpuppet who repeatedly caused trouble in Northern Ireland issues and so decided to come here and cause this mess and I have achieved this goal. I will just say this for the record, though. This is maybe an idea you guys are missing. Kurdistan is a secular idea. It doesn't exist because it has no reason to exist. Most Kurds are Muslims. Why would Muslims want to separate from a Muslim nation? The ones who want an independent Kurdish state are the non-religious Kurds. The Ottoman Empire even gave Kurds their own province called the Kurdistan Eyalet. Even when Erdogan said Turks and Kurds are brothers, he meant Turks and Kurds are both Muslims. See for example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Movement_of_Salah_al-Din_the_Kurd. That's why there isn't really such thing as a Kurdish name. They're just either different pronunciations of the Arabic name or a translation. See for example: Erbil and Ras al-Ayn. Thepharoah17 (talk) 08:33, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Supreme Deliciousness

GPinkerton is topic banned from making Middle East edits, so she is not allowed to file this, so it should be speedily closed and GPinkerton blocked. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 07:51, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

GPinkerton, You forgot to mention User:Konli17, that was edit warring, and was the main disruption at the article, why didn't you mention him?--Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 09:20, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Cullen328, There was large amount of edit warring before by a sockpuppet Konli17 adding fake maps into the article, but as soon as he and GPinkertion got banned the article got calm. There is still content disputes at the talkpage, but I don't believe an arb case is necessary. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 08:06, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Levivich, no one ever said Syrian Kurds doesn't exist.--Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 18:04, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]


The main problem at the Syrian Kurdistan article was a now blocked sock User:Konli17 who kept on adding fake maps and edit warring/disrupting the article. Hes the one that started everything. The other main problem was GPinkerton who arrived at the article and also disrupted and edit warred and made it impossible to edit or have a normal discussion at the talkpage because of her behavior.

Take a look at this AN discussion to see the history of GPinkerton and all the disputes she has been involved in:[1]. Any topic she touches she wreaks havoc at. Syrian Kurdistan is just another one in her long list. She will continue one to other articles after and do the same thing there. Why anyone lifted her indeef block is beyond me. Unfortunately GPinkertons current topic ban is only temporary and she will come back and continue her disruption at Syrian Kurdistan. As soon as GPinkerton and Konli17 was removed from the article it became calm.

The third and last problem is Levivich who with a newly implanted source restriction rule has veto power and has removed large amounts of undisputed historical information and maps. Anyone who disagrees to this will be blocked. The solution to fixing the problem at Syrian Kurdistan is easy: Permanent block GPinkerton from the topic area (and frankly from Wikipedia altogether as she will just continue disrupting anther topic area) and remove the newly implanted source restriction rule at the Syrian Kurdistan article. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 18:04, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Cullen328

GPinkerton fails to make the case that this is anything other than a routine content dispute. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 07:48, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Ymblanter

I am not in any way involved in this dispute, and I do not see what ArbCom can do here at this point. However, the area was recently put under community general sanctions (added to Wikipedia:General sanctions/Syrian Civil War and Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant), which have caused some amount of controversy (see the AN discussion cited above, Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard#Admin_introducing_source_restriction). It might help if the case get resolved by motion and standard discretionary sanctions in the area get introduced. This will not significantly change the situation, but will make more clear who may do what and which are enforcement and appeal avenues.--Ymblanter (talk) 14:23, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by El_C

I'm not sure how practical this may be, but long before the flareup at Syrian Kurdistan, I've been calling for a sanctions regime that would encompass the Kurds topic area, overall. Note, for example, the Kurdish-related disruption on the part of Emblemmor whom I've just indeffed mere minutes ago after Semsûrî brought their disruption to my attention. Not to put you on the spot, Semsûrî, but I invite you to summarize to the Committee some of the problems that you have been forced to deal with in the topic area for such a long time. El_C 17:24, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The massive disruption and vandalism throughout all of 2019 and perhaps into last year has dwindled down to sporadic disruption. I could make a thorough summarization but most of it wasn't actually pertaining to Kurdish topics in Syria but everything else. --Semsûrî (talk) 18:35, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by {Non-party}

Other editors are free to make relevant comments on this request as necessary. Comments here should address why or why not the Committee should accept the case request or provide additional information.

Syrian Kurdistan: Clerk notes

This area is used for notes by the clerks (including clerk recusals).

Syrian Kurdistan: Arbitrators' opinion on hearing this matter <0/0/0>

Vote key: (Accept/decline/recuse)

  • Awaiting more statements. In response to one of the comments so far, GPinkerton's filing of the request for arbitration is permissible. Newyorkbrad (talk) 11:29, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • No opinion yet on whether this is a case which needs an ArbCom case. However, I am prepared to say that I am not currently in favor of Ymblanter's suggestion that we put this topic under DS. Some arbs will only do DS after a full case, which has some logic but isn't my stance. If the community is going to do GS - and I think it should which is why I've closed a couple of discussions that established consensus for GS - then I think it should also build its own capacity and come to its own understanding on how to clean stuff like this up. ArbCom should be solving problems the community can't. Just because it might be more expedient for us to do something within our authority is not a reason for me to believe the community can't cleanup the inconsistencies identified in that AN thread. Best, Barkeep49 (talk) 15:44, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
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