Talk:Flare gun

Mistaken belief Very pistols are "illegal in the UK"

In the UK, I believe that flare guns are actually illegal, and are thus not "commonly found in rescue kits". I know this applies to the Very pistol. Does anyone know the situation in the rest of the world? (maritime distress flares in the UK are fired from a hand-held tube, a little like a "roman candle" firework) --Canthusus 15:07, 14 October 2005 (UTC)

No they are not "illegal", but a Firearms Certificate is needed to own one. It It in the articleBilllion 09:39, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

It is of course true they are "not found in rescue kits" in the sense that the firearms certificate holder is responsible for their securityBilllion (talk) 16:49, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

how does it work

Does anyone know the difference between how a firearm operates vs how a flare gun operates. What is the difference in the "process"? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 206.194.127.112 (talk • contribs) . They are about identical, a rear impact by a pin, similar to a revolver , propels a signal. 64.26.148.160 18:27, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

This link will take you to a report by a forensics investigation of a flare gun. It shows the thing taken apart and shows the data on its firing characteristics. CSI view of a flare gun Michael Daly 22:15, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Single action trigger mechanism, hammer action, centre fire pin. Pretty much like a shotgun but with a pyrotechnic projectile.Billlion (talk) 22:49, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Entertainment references

The article seems to become a magnet for "a flare gun is used in game/film x" which to me does not seem to have a place in a serious encyclopedia article on the subject.Billlion (talk) 05:27, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Frank Zappa

The section on the Frank Zappa incident might be important i the history of Frank Zappa but to me it does not seem that important in the long history of vary pistols. Suggest it be merged in to Frank Zappa with a link from here?Billlion (talk) 08:39, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

It is not even clear from the FZ article it was a Very pistol rather than simply a flare taht was fired.Billlion (talk) 08:41, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

This isn't an article on Very pistols though (and it's Very, not vary), it's on flare guns.

How many widely publicised flare gun accidents are there? This one gave rise directly to a song (not a Zappa song) that is still one of rock's best known guitar riffs. Andy Dingley (talk) 09:17, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

"Very" is a accepted as a synonym for flare gun; Billion's point is that there's no proof that it was a flare gun, as opposed to a non-gun flare. As Billion says, it may have a place on the Frank Zappa page, but it is utterly ridiculous to put such trivial and fancrufty content here. Nick Cooper (talk) 17:51, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

Very pistols are flare guns, but few flare guns (only the larger ones) are Very pistols (sorry, "vary pistols"). You accuse the article of being fancrufty, yet you invent a synonym like this on no basis whatsoever.

The casino fire is well-recorded. It was caused by a flare, fired upwards into the ceiling decorations - one reason why it wasn't quickly extinguished and why it spread throughout the hall. This is unlikely to have been a Very pistol, given the location it was probably a moutain rescue flare gun (a far simpler device), but it definitely wasn't a simple hand-held flare.

As to the rest, an iconic fire that destroys a major landmark in a Swiss town and has an enormously well-known song written about it - that's notability. We're into "Casey Jones" and "The Raft of the Medusa" territory here, for popular song culture inspired by a tragedy. If you don't who Zappa or Deep Purple were, or just how big a song this was, then I suggest that's simply WP:IMTOOYOUNGTOREMEMBERTHAT. Andy Dingley (talk) 08:24, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

As far as going upwards it could have been a parachute flare fired from a single use tube. This is a rocket rather than a gun.Billlion (talk) 15:50, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

That's about as valid as claiming "Hoover" can't be used as a synonym of "vacuum cleaner," even though it patently is. You also don't strength your case by resorting to condescention. Nick Cooper (talk) 12:33, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Very pistols are rare, especially in civilian hands. Far more common are the simpler "pencil" flare launchers used by yachtsmen and mountaineers. It's likely that the Montreux fire was caused by one of these (although I don't know if it was ever recovered - I don't think the culprit was found either). It would thus be reasonable to remove this from "Very pistol", as first claimed above - except that this article is about flare guns, not just Very pistols.

Your next claim was that it didn't belong because it was just a hand-held flare, not a flare gun. Except that the evidence is firmly that it was a flare gun, because the fire was started high up in the ceiling.

So that's two attempts to remove it, both for reasons that simply don't stack up. What's going to be the next line? Poor references? It's one of the few flare gun incidents in this article that is referenced. Andy Dingley (talk) 13:24, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

RfC: Frank Zappa incident

Given the generic nature of the page subject, is it appropriate to highlight this one historical incident so prominently? Nick Cooper (talk) 12:47, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

• Comment It doesn't seem appropriate to include such a specific thing here; it seems much more relevant to the history of rock music (or the bios of the musicians involved) than to the history of flare guns. Also, FYI, it would be helpful in a summary of the dispute for RfC, if you mentioned WHICH historical incident you mean. It's obvious from the article, but people browsing RfC may pass it by because it's not clear. siafu (talk) 16:34, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

It's identified in the above heading. Nick Cooper (talk) 19:24, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

It is here, but not on the RfC page. siafu (talk) 19:48, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

• Remove It may be interesting but it does not belong here. Martin Hogbin (talk) 17:53, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
• Remove as per my earlier comments above. Nick Cooper (talk) 17:56, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
• Remove as my earlier comment. It lives in the Frank Zappa article and even then it is not clear a Very pistol was used. Billlion (talk) 18:39, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
• Remove for reasons stated above. Gerardw (talk) 20:32, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
• Keep but not in a separate section -- simply remove the section header (also remove the third sentence ("Zappa shouted "Fire!" ...") for conciseness). It fits well enough in the "Use as weapons" section -- setting an occupied building on fire, intentionally or not, is surely an aggressive act -- and the incident seems as notable as the Sgt. Jeffreys, USS Borie, and Alex Kimbal incidents. Herostratus (talk) 16:07, 24 May 2011 (UTC)
• Keep but de-emphasize section either by (1) merging into above section per Herostratus' comment; or (2) re-naming the section to "Incidents" (leave section text alone) with the understanding that other incidents can be added into the "Incidents" section in the future. Although the material is not especially significant, it is documented and falls within this article's purview. --Noleander (talk) 19:58, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Comment but was it a very pistol or just a flare? Billlion (talk) 22:41, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Good question. I'm presuming the sources say it was a flare from a "gun". If no one can produce a quote from a source that says it was a "gun", then the material should be removed. --Noleander (talk) 00:25, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

No-one knows who set the fire, so no-one knows whether they used a flare, a flare gun, or a lighter. However what is very well recorded is that the fire started in a large auditorium, in decorations hung from the ceiling high above the crowd. This is significant, because it's why the fire couldn't be extinguished until the building was already well alight. So by all means re-name it to, "Incident with a flare gun or else some really tall guy with very, very long arms".

As Billlion keeps pointing out, this probably doesn't belong in the article for Very pistol. However it isn't in that article, it's in this one, on flare guns instead. Andy Dingley (talk) 09:23, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

• Keep This incident is sufficiently notable to be rightly mentioned in at least seven other articles: (Smoke on the Water, Deep Purple, Frank Zappa, Claude Nobs, Rolling Stones Mobile Studio, Beat the Boots II, Montreux Casino). It would be most strange if an incident about a flare gun was mentioned in all of these, but not in flare gun itself. Andy Dingley (talk) 09:34, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

It wouldn't be "strange" at all. There are plenty of incidents involving specific types of firearms, but they don't get mentioned in the pages for those firearms. This is just fan-cruft of the worst type. Nick Cooper (talk) 10:46, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

I'm coming across this rather late, but...the reference to "flare gun" may quite possibly be a matter of the writer of the lyrics of "Smoke on the Water" taking creative liberties in describing the event, rather than referring to the actual sequence of events. Zappa himself stated (perhaps in The Real Frank Zappa Book? I've long forgotten exactly where, though) his belief that the perpetrator actually fired a bottle rocket. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 17:28, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

Flare calibre

26.5mm is not 1 inch (25.4mm) Is that a different metric standard for flares? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.183.50.187 (talk) 07:40, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Stud on Barrel

I have corrected the erroneous caption on the British pistol, that the stud was for attaching the pistol to a vehicle or aircraft because it was not. It is for the location of a Schermuly Line Thrower extension. As an aside, anyone who has ever fired a 1" pistol will know that the recoil would rip that small stud off (there is only one BTW) after one or two shots. The 1.5" pistols that were for attaching to an aircraft have a much more substantial interrupted thread. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.170.24.122 (talk) 10:41, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

This is not the case, although I am hard pressed to provide any documentation. First of all I have fired it and it has very little recoil, secondly I was shown the flare port in a restored WWII plane where it fits. I am not disputing that there may also be 1.5" ports as well. Maybe however this needs to be settled with some reliable sources rather than our own experiences.Billlion (talk) 22:30, 13 September 2014 (UTC)

Actually I have just found this picture http://www.cyber-heritage.co.uk/schermuly/sra.jpg which looks very much like the Molins on a Schermuly line throwing apparatus, although one cannot see the lug. Left the figure caption with no explanation of the lug until details can be found in a book.Billlion (talk) 22:50, 13 September 2014 (UTC)

Сигнал Охотника

I think this is what is called in the UK a pen flare, and is not peculiar to Russia. Not sure it especially due to gun control, maybe more that they are easy to carry. Billlion (talk) 21:08, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

A description of a case of Verey light injury

"Plastic Surgery of the Face" by Sir Harold Gillies, a work recording mostly the work of the author in facial reconstruction of WWI wounded, describes a case of a Verey Light injury to the face (an accident in this case). May be of some relevance, considering the extensive description of the injury. Here is a link https://archive.org/stream/plasticsurgeryof00gilluoft#page/254/mode/2up I leave this here in case it is of any future use Lucasdealmeidasm (talk) 10:30, 1 January 2016 (UTC)

Firearm (tool)

The purpose of the link to Firearm is really for people who do not know what "firearm" means, ie a hand portable gun. I am not sure what the purpose of the article Firearm (tool) is but in this context someone who did not know might be think that the distinction between firearms and guns is that the former is not used to kill people! I think this just muddies the waters. Billlion (talk) 15:47, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

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Israeli navy officer used flare gun at the battle of Marsa Talamat during '73 war

During 73 war between Eygept and Israel, a naval officer (lut. Nimrod Erez) shuts 5 flares from a flare gun on Eygeption patrol boat at the Marsa Talamat battle. It was reported that the boat exploded and sunked from this act. (see Marsa Telamt battle on vikipedia). נמרוד ארז (talk) 08:41, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

What is the etymology of "Very pistol"?

I can't seem to find where the term "Very pistol" comes from. I'd guess that it's someone's name, or a company's name, since it's capitalised, but I can't find anything via an Internet search about it. Perhaps if someone has a source, an explanation for that term can be added to the article? Regards, DesertPipeline (talk) 08:31, 9 March 2021 (UTC)

See Edward Wilson Very. catslash (talk) 00:17, 10 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks. I'll add an Etymology section to this article. DesertPipeline (talk) 03:09, 10 March 2021 (UTC)

Wait a minute... I'm not very smart, am I? It's right there in the article already, and I somehow missed it... how embarrassing :) DesertPipeline (talk) 03:18, 10 March 2021 (UTC)

Hunter's Signal

Maybe add a link to the hunter's signal for more insight? For example https://lik-o-dil-es.blogspot.com/2018/02/15-mm-signalnye-patrony-so-strelyayushchim-mekhanizmom-signal-ohotnika.html --Estimata698 (talk) 17:08, 19 March 2022 (UTC)

White light

They have a specific military use to produce instant white light, in contrast to the white light from a parachute flare (the sound of the rocket firing may give troops time to take cover). White light may also be used in a search and rescue context to illuminate the ground or sea. If any editor can source this, it would be worth adding. All good wishes, Springnuts (talk) 07:04, 23 April 2023 (UTC)

Flare gun

Hello I was just wondering what country are you guys in 101.190.138.29 (talk) 06:34, 3 February 2024 (UTC)