Talk:List of Netflix original programming/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Archive 4

"Foreign language series"

I think we should reconsider this, it doesn't apply anymore since Netflix went international, I understand is an American company and most of their Originals were on English language, but Netflix has plans to continue doing more foreign films and series, I watch them too, either with subtitles or dub, since they give you those options it doesn't make sense to have them separated, any of these series is meant to be watched internationally. I think we should put them in their respective category and just point out the language in which they were shot. Andres balbuena (talk) 14:43, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

Also I notice the genre column has a lot of space, maybe we could do "genre/language" and put it in there. Just an idea, so that way we don't have to do another column.Andres balbuena (talk) 14:52, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

I agree. There's no justification for splitting foreign language series out. To be honest, I have a bit of an issue with splitting by genre too (media.netflix.com lists them all as "series"), and Marvel content should also not be listed separately. --Rob Sinden (talk) 08:57, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

I know I am not alone as far as coming to this page to see what is new on Netflix, or what is coming soon, etc. There is no other page out there that has it this organized. For that matter I think it is important to have it categorized by genre. Every TV network/industry/awards have it separated this way. Specially when Netflix will have close to 600 original tittles by the end of 2020. That is a lot of series/movies that would have to be organized properly. But as far as foreign should be consider the same. Anyone else thinks is good idea to change it? Andres balbuena (talk) 14:50, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

It's just the splitting of Comedy and Drama (and the Marvel split) that I have an issue with, Stand up, documentaries, etc, is fine. But yes, let's merge the foreign language in! --Rob Sinden (talk) 15:05, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

We have comedy-drama series in both the comedy table and the drama table. Merging the two tables would avoid that... --Rob Sinden (talk) 15:21, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

Another option would be to find appropriate sub-genres (thriller, sitcom etc.). That way the separation would make more sense. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 15:46, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

We certainly don't want to be breaking it down any further. Netflix only use "series" - we should probably mirror that... --Rob Sinden (talk) 15:51, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

You misunderstood me. I'm saying let's leave the main categories Drama and Comedy as they are, but go into more detail under 'Genre'. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 16:04, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

I think we probably have sufficient detail regarding genre as it is, enough that if we merged the two, it would still be more than clear what they are. --Rob Sinden (talk) 16:22, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

Also, where are we taking the information regarding where to draw the line between comedy and drama? OITNB has won Emmys for both comedy and drama, so choosing to put it in one table rather than another is borderline WP:OR. --Rob Sinden (talk) 16:24, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

No, put it back the way it was. It looks a lot messier now, and is harder to read. In the future it probably will be necessary to further split by genre, because of the number of series that Netflix is putting out. Citing media.netflix is a bit misleading as they only list new future programming there, and this page actually organises future programming in a similar way. More separation will be needed on this page in the future, not less. Somethingwickedly (talk) 16:30, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

There is no justification for splitting foreign language series out whatsoever. Oh, and you're wrong regarding media.netflix.com, all items are mentioned... --Rob Sinden (talk) 16:34, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

As someone who studied genres way back when, I don't think the WP:OR really applies here, at least not if you go into sub-genres. Genres arn't hard science and are always a bit open to interpretation. The sub-genre/sub-genres can be backed up through a combination of sources from others and interpretation of the material. As for the big ones Drama and Comedy, we can just go with what the press or Netflix puts out. OITNB is a very special case, but it is regarded as a drama now. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 17:15, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

Separating this genre is really easy, I don't know why is so difficult? Just search it on Netflix, and they will say what category is in, they also put sub categories too. And I agree it should be separated, but only on the main ones and if is a lot. For example it doesn't make sense to have animated sitcoms on it's own, there is only 2 shows now with a third one coming up, it could sit on comedy, but once they have more than 6 I think it should deserve its own category/section. Just like what happened with Marvels shows. Same thing if in the future they decide to come up with a lot of sketch comedy or sitcoms it could always get branch out. Specially since Netflix is trying to appeal to everyone and have a big variety of everything we should separated accordingly, but only if there is a lot of them. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Andres balbuena (talk • contribs) 18:16, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

Netflix has OITNB as "TV Comedy Dramas" and "US TV Comedies". It has Club de Cuervos as "TV Comedy Dramas", "TV Dramas" and "TV Comedies"... See the problem? --Rob Sinden (talk) 10:24, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

Exactly! it does says it, and whatever comes first its the main genre. Plus there is such a thing as dramedies that's where all those shows that people don't know where they fall into should be like OITNB, Lilyhammer, Grace & Frankie, club de cuervos, flaked, etc. Maybe we should consider that its own category. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Andres balbuena (talk • contribs) 13:34, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

There's nothing to suggest that whatever is listed first is a definitive genre. You cannot make that assumption. And a definite no to giving Comedy-dramas their own split, or splitting these tables down any further. All scripted series should be combined to form a single table to avoid this subjective genre pigeonholing. --Rob Sinden (talk) 13:42, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

I think it's better to keep english language and non-english language content separately. As it was said earlier, Netflix is ramping up production and is producing a lot of series. If everything is under one section it will be more complicated to sort through the titles. 03:17, 17 January 2017 (UTC)Goldeneyed (talk)

I agree. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 06:24, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

• Why? Why shouldn't something like Narcos be included with all the other content? --Rob Sinden (talk) 08:29, 17 January 2017 (UTC)

It would be with all the other content, but in the foreign language section. We obviously wouldn't be removing it from the page entirely. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 06:24, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

Narcos does not belong under "foreign language" because it is conducted in both English and Spanish. Indeed, the protagonist/narrator speaks in English. Had the entire show been conducted in Spanish, then it would belong under "Foreign Language."147.0.110.10 (talk) 01:23, 19 January 2017 (UTC)

If it is believed that Narcos is being miscategorized then that can certainly be looked into further and discussed. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 08:02, 19 January 2017 (UTC)

There was a long discussion thread on this topic, but somebody must have deleted it recently.I'm not sure why. It was widely agreed upon that a foreign language category was best for multiple reasons: 1. Netflix is legally considered to be an American corporation which has its articles of incorporation, board members and principle place of business all in America. 2. This particular Wikipedia page is written in English, therefore, it is perfectly acceptable for the categorization to reflect that. If this Wikipedia page was written in Japanese, then the category classifications would likely reflect that. 3. Netflix, itself, has always had a foreign language category. Right now, it's referred to as "International." 4. Because Netflix is ramping up their production, this increases the need for creating a foreign language section because things will get too complicated. 5. Separate categories makes it easier for those who specifically seek out foreign language series. 6. Separate categories for foreign language series allows for better sub-genre optimization based on the language used. 7. Combining the categories creates category confusion. After reading this thread, it is infinitely clear to me that there is absolutely no consensus for you to have made that change, especially when this subject matter has already been discussed at length in the past. You were wrong to have changed it without having checking the history first and/or obtaining consensus. Indeed, this page has used had a foreign language section for the vast overwhelming majority of the time and you have not presented an affirmative argument for making that change. An argument in the negative is no argument at all. If you do not fix this, I will.Jaydangerx (talk) 06:47, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

The previous discussion was in the archive where this topic was discussed at length, and it was decided to have a separate section. Here is the discussion for reference. I too find it bizarre that the changes were made BEFORE it had been discussed on the talk page, and would support changing it back to its previous state. Somethingwickedly (talk) 12:07, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

You have a very good point, but things are changing. That was before when Netflix was not international, plus international can still mean that is English language (England, Australia, etc) So if you go by just the foreign language situation, then we will have to further break those down too onto comedy and drama, and that's where is doesn't make sense. Right now it is not a big deal, but it will be eventually when half of the Netflix content is international/foreign language. I think it's just easier to have a language column and that's it. People can always categorize it by language at the top. Andres balbuena (talk) 12:19, 19 January 2017 (UTC)

That discussion was from this past August, well after Netflix had already gone international. Also, the section is "foreign language" not "international". -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 20:42, 19 January 2017 (UTC)

So that doesn't really make any sense because Netflix is incorporated in America that has been engaged in international distribution for a few years now. You also haven't addressed the fact that this is the English Wikipedia page for Netflix original programming. The categories should reflect that. There are Japanese, French, Spanish etc. Wikipedia pages for the same subject and those pages would likely reflect those languages as well. You have not responded to any of the points being made. I have been courteous by giving you a chance to respond before reverting back to the way it has always been, but I will change it back unless you can offer some convincing responses. You need consensus before you change things like that.Jaydangerx (talk) 23:46, 20 January 2017 (UTC)

I don't understand how people can argue that we should keep non-english content with english content, yet no one is complaining about the fact that there is a separate section for the Marvel series. Secondly, why is the language included in the Genre column? If things stay the way they are, which they shouldn't, will be way too many types of genres. So even with sorting it will still be complicated. You will have types like "japanese drama, portuguese drama, historical drama, etc." It can be endless. Right now, english language content for dramas is the big majority of the titles available. Therefore with Netflix being an American company, this being an english language Wiki page, and the majority of the content being in english, it only makes sense to have a foreign language section.22:47, 21 January 2017 (UTC)Goldeneyed (talk)

See below regarding Marvel. The fact that this is the English language Wikipedia is irrelevant. Netflix is now an international concern. You seem to want to somehow demote the foreign language content, content which is just as accessible to English speakers due to subtitles, etc. There is no justification to list this separately, purely because it has been made in a different language. All Netflix produced series should be listed together regardless of language. --Rob Sinden (talk) 09:58, 23 January 2017 (UTC)

Why do you see it as some sort of demotion? They're categories, not rankings. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 10:20, 23 January 2017 (UTC)

An editor had hidden it down below the kids programming. --Rob Sinden (talk) 15:01, 23 January 2017 (UTC)

At some point, you need to come up with an affirmative reason to not have a foreign language section. Your only argument has been that there is "no justification" and you keep repeating it, but multiple reasons have been given. Also, the language of the Wikipedia page argument is not countered by the notion that Netflix has international distribution because the first issue is not predicated on the second issue being true. I also have difficulty accepting your position because it is entirely predicated on your belief that there should be no genre categories at all which is a wholly different discussion and is also negatived by the survey results below. Jaydangerx (talk) 00:25, 26 January 2017 (UTC)

Also note that the "In partnership" programming has not been split by genre or language either. We need some internal consistency here... --Rob Sinden (talk) 15:01, 23 January 2017 (UTC)

How to handle "Netflix Exclusive Regions" column

I do think the column is useful, but the information in it is just not accurate a lot of times. No surprise considering how in flux the Netflix catolog is. I propose we simply put an external title link from http://unogs.com in the column. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 12:12, 8 January 2017 (UTC)

Well first, I don't believe "unogs.com" is a reliable source. The name itself is "unofficial" and there doesn't appear to be any sort of oversight into how the find the countries for each title (do people do it, is it a bot?). So third party reliable sources should be found if at all possible. But given as you said the Netflix catalogue is constantly in flux, is it even worth this research if it will continually be changing? - Favre1fan93 (talk) 15:50, 8 January 2017 (UTC)

Unogs automatically scrapes Netflix's API, it's extremely accurate and reliable, whether it counts as a reliable source is another question.--occono (talk) 18:58, 26 January 2017 (UTC)

In my experience unogs is the most reliable and up-to-date crawler (a certain kind of bot) for Netflix out there. A global official one for the public does not exist. Since it is a crawler, unogs will update itself, so the constant change isn't much of a problem. There will still be some errors, things like that can never be absolutely stopped with a data base as giant as Netflix, but it will certainly be better than the state now. Humans just can't really keep up with the amount of curation required when it comes to that part of the list. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 16:44, 8 January 2017 (UTC)

Specials

In the Specials section we currently have three listings ("Ever After High: Spring Unsprung", "Sense8: Happy F*cking New Year", and "Project Mc2: A Royal Pain") that aren't classified as specials by Netflix, but rather are considered to be episodes as part of a regular season. On the Sense8 page, for example, it even specifically says "More Episodes of Season 2 Coming May 5". Unless a special has it's own listing (for example "Marco Polo One Hundred Eyes" is listed separately from "Marco Polo") it shouldn't be listed in the specials section. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 21:48, 14 February 2017 (UTC)

Imo by the time the season the special is part of is out it should be taken of the special list and should be counted as an episode of the season, but not before. "Ever After High: Spring Unsprung" is a bit of a fringe case, because while it is part of the series on Netflix, it also is its own season. Imo it should stay under specials for that reason. As for "Sense8: Happy F*cking New Year", and "Project Mc2: A Royal Pain", both of them were named as specials, probably for the very reason that they came out before the actual season. "Sense8: Happy F*cking New Year" came out as "A Christmas Special" (and was also widely reported as special by the press) and "Project Mc2: A Royal Pain" is specifically called a special on this list. Abyss Taucher (talk) 00:44, 15 February 2017 (UTC)-

References

RfC on section breaks for this article

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

Should this article be split by genre, language or franchise? --Rob Sinden (talk) 15:27, 23 January 2017 (UTC)

Survey

• I oppose breaking the article down into small groups, especially those for language ("Foreign language") and franchise ("Marvel Cinematic Universe"). The reader is best served with all of this information being listed together. There is no justification to split out programming into a separate section just because these shows were filmed in a different language. The shows in this section share little else in common other than this. The MCU series are clearly marked "Marvel's" in their names, so these is sufficient for the reader to distinguish if these are merged back in. Regarding genre, this is not quite so much of an issue, but the lines between "Comedy" and "Drama" are blurred these days. Netflix has OITNB as "TV Comedy Dramas" and "US TV Comedies". It has Club de Cuervos as "TV Comedy Dramas", "TV Dramas" and "TV Comedies". OITNB has won Emmys for both comedy and drama, so choosing to put these in one table rather than another is borderline WP:OR. An editor has chosen to put Santa Clarita Diet in "comedy" rather than "drama", but as a "comedy-horror", it could just as easily have been placed in "drama". I'd like to see these two sections merged together in order to avoid this subjectivity. --Rob Sinden (talk) 15:27, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
• I support the use of sections on this page as it has been for years. I also oppose all changes and proposals on this subject matter offered by Robsinden whose idea to combine all shows into a single category flys in the face of how this page has operated for multiple years. At no point did he offer a single affirmative reason for doing it this way. This page has long utilized different sections and one individual's desire to eliminate those sections should not undo the years of precedent. Indeed, the animated sitcom, foreign language and (to a lesser extent) the Marvel Cinematic Universe sections have been existed on this page for a long time until someone recently changed them. Thus, I restored the sections to what they were. He decided to undo those restorations without seeking a single modicum of consensus and then left comments in the edit section which suggested that he was unfamiliar with the editing history of this page. Thus, I undid those changes. Jaydangerx (talk) 18:31, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
• I support the use of sections. The sections are necessary to parse the information. I would personally prefer having the MCU series as a subsection of Drama rather than its own separate section, but I would be against any other changes. One giant list would be absolutely ridiculous. Rob Sinden's argument that the Emmy's gave both comedy and drama awards to OintB is misleading; it is true that it has won awards for both, but not at the same time. I believe the first season was classed as a comedy, but from then on it became eligible for the drama categories only. As Netflix continues to increase the number of series, sections and sub-sections will become increasingly important. The acquired television section is already a bit orf a mess, and while I don't advocate changing that part, it is a sign of what would happen to the rest of the article if sections were abolished. Somethingwickedly (talk) 19:31, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
• I support the use of sections. Listing everything in one giant mess of a list is a ridiculous idea. There is absolutely nothing wrong with listing things in different categories and genres. It presents the information in a far more useful and easy to read manner. Categories are also not rankings. Just because a show may be listed in a different category than what you want does not make it more or less important than any other show. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 20:07, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
• I support the use of sections. It separates everything and makes it quicker and faster to find what your looking for. Vmars22 (talk) 20:29, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
• I support the use of sections as well. There will always be a bit of discussion on what belongs in a certain section and what doesn't, that's simply the nature of genres in general, but that doesn't mean we should get rid of the sections. Apart from the fact that in most cases the categorisation is way easier than OP makes it out to be (for example 'Santa Clarita Diet' is clearly a comedy, the promotional material leaves no doubt about that), Netflix is going to add about 1000 hours of OC this year. I really can not see how 'The reader is best served with all of this information being listed together'. The justification for sections is very simple: You need them to easily find a genre (and sub-genres within) that you're lookiing for. If for example a parent is looking for a kids show, should he/she really have to look through one gaint list of TV shows that is only getting bigger? The List of original programs distributed by Amazon is nowhere near as big as this one and it uses sections, because even for a smaller list sections increase usability. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 20:57, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
• I support the use of sections. The MCU section should be subsectioned under "Drama", as all the series are drama, with additional genres after. I also don't know if Foreign language needs to be its own section. Those series could fold into great genre headings such as "Drama". - Favre1fan93 (talk) 06:01, 24 January 2017 (UTC)
• I support the use of genre sections, but oppose the use of a "Foreign language" genre section.--occono (talk) 12:23, 26 January 2017 (UTC)
• Support - the use of sections, but reliable sources should always be used to determine the applicable section the shows belong in. Isaidnoway (talk) 15:12, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
• I oppose the use of sections based on franchise, genre, or language. It seems less disputable and more consistent with other list articles to organise this page alphabetically. So, while I would not approve of separation via those characteristics, I would support an A–Z listing of shows in this article. –Matthew - (talk) 21:23, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
  • If one list is determined, it shouldn't be alphabetical. It should be by original release date, with the sortable option to sort by the other columns. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 22:02, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
    • I think the best option would be to have the shows all listed in a single list, with columns for Title, Original premiere date, and Status. The current column for Length in regards to runtime seems unnecessary. Additionally, I don't think a Genre column should be included either, for the same reason it isn't included on pages like "2014 in film"; genres are subjective and would have to be backed up by a verifiable source in order to be reliably included, and it would therefore be easier to remove the Genre column altogether. –Matthew - (talk) 04:17, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
      • I agree that genres arn't always a 100% definitive, but they're not subjective most of the time. You can almost always find one that fits perfectly and is also backed-up by press etc. House of Cards for example is a political drama, no question about it. You don't even need outside sources to back that up, the series itself is a clear enough source for that. - I know that that could be seen as individual research, but imo it's not. There isn't really something to research in a case like that, it's just obviously from the source itself. - But if one would have a problem with that, there is always Netflix as a direct source, we could even use the micro genres to find a more acurate genre then just Drama or Comedy within Netflix. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 06:37, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose Don't make people search for information that can be provided in one place. Damotclese (talk) 16:30, 2 February 2017 (UTC)
• Comment: The bot sent me. The RfC does not make clear what is being proposed here. Can someone please give me a few pros/cons on this issue? I see the article as is, I've looked at the Amazon list. What exactly will change and the benefits? Thanks. SW3 5DL (talk) 22:47, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

European co-productions named in press release

A bunch of European productions named here we have under 'Exclusive international television distribution', but Netflix says they're co-production. Here is the important part:

"These add to a growing line-up of European co-productions including Marcella (ITV), Kiss Me First (Channel 4), Watership Down (BBC), La catedral del mar (Antena 3), Rita (TV2 Denmark) and El ministerio del tiempo (RTVE) [...]"

Not all of them are under 'Exclusive international television distribution' but a lot of them are. The problem I see here is that we don't know when Netflix entered as a co-producer, so there is no way to decide what to put under 'Continuations' with the season the co-prudction started and what under 'in partnership'. - And of course there is the question of how much we take Netflix's word for it, since I can't remember most of them ever being named as co-productions anywhere else (I remember finding a source for 'Rita' being a co-pruduction with Netflix since season 3, but I couldn't find the date season 3 landed on Netflix, so I haven't put it in yet). - Anybody has any idea how to handle this? -Abyss Taucher (talk) 17:29, 1 March 2017 (UTC)

I'm honestly not sure what to do. There is obviously a difference, because otherwise there would be no reason for Netflix to separate them in the press release, but what exactly is the difference? I can't find any evidence from other sources that Marcella and La catedral del mar are co-productions, whereas I can for Kiss Me First and Watership Down, which is why the latter are under co-productions, and the former are not. The thing is why would Netflix say they're co-productions if they're not. I think it might be better to keep them all where they are until we get a better (external) source, but I don't know. I'll continue to have a think about it. Somethingwickedly (talk) 20:15, 1 March 2017 (UTC)

Took me a while to find it again, but here it is. Netflix has claimed co-production before with no other sources I know of backing it up:

"Netflix is co-producing series including Star Trek with CBS, The Alienist with Paramount TV and the just-launched, hit ABC series Designated Survivor with E One, sharing windows globally with original broadcasters and ensuring early financing."

Yeah, I don't really know what to make of this... I just can't believe CBS, ABC etc. would be okey with Netflix putting that out as a official press release if it weren't true...-Abyss Taucher (talk) 23:20, 1 March 2017 (UTC)

References

Is 'H2O: Mermaid Adventures' a true Netflix Original or distributed?

The Wikipedia entry claims it is and the Netflix Media Center has it as Original, but as we know, that has been wrong before. Whatever the case it should at least be listed under 'Exclusive international television distribution', but I wanted to see if anybody can back-up the Netflix Original claim before I do that. Nothing I could find is a 100% clear, but the series does not have 'A Netflix Original Series' in the openig credits. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 05:45, 4 March 2017 (UTC)

References

More info under each show table

Pardon my ignorance on coding, as what I'm about to suggest I don't know if is possible at all. But can we have an option in each show to have an arrow on the table as when you click it more information shows up underneath it. If we are able to put this it will help to hide more important information that sometimes is needed but not crucial. I think once we do it could open the possibility to keep things organized while at the same time provide more information for the show. Andres balbuena (talk) 15:54, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

It is possible to have things collapsed. However, we really should not be adding more info that what is currently given at this article. If readers want to know more about the show, they can easily click the link to the article on it, if it exists, to read more about it. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 17:27, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

I think it will be useful for things like Wet Hot American Summer, where there is different titles but same show. (Not so much info but grouping things under the same umbrella). Also Chefs Table is another case where they have the France edition. Specially for the "specials" could be underneath each show, like Sense 8 special holiday episode (which we all know it's season 2 first 2 episodes, but not really) and Marco Polo special one hundred eyes, Bojack Horseman, Trailer Park boys and so on, Netflix doesn't seem to stop there, so that way we can keep things organized better corresponding with each show. Andres balbuena (talk) 20:52, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

I agree with Favre1fan93. Let's not make the list more complex than it already is. I have the feeling having a collapse funktion will result in more errors being made while editing the page. If we really want to provide extra information we can always use explanatory footnotes as we already do in some cases. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 06:36, 14 March 2017 (UTC)

I think its essential with each IP to stay together regardless if is an special or another show, it is not about more information, it's just needs to be organize better. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Andres balbuena (talk • contribs) 13:37, 16 March 2017 (UTC)

If you can come up with a better way to organize the list feel free to propose it. The list could certainly be improved. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 13:50, 16 March 2017 (UTC)

Should we try to get an editing block for IP users?

One or more IP users (IP could have switched while editing) just made close to 30 edits on the list. Not only is it very hard to follow what has been changed, because none of the edits have summaries, but some of the edits are also simply wrong on a technical level (like putting explanatory footnotes in the references). I have noticed that that sort of thing happens a lot more with IP users than with registered users. Since the list gets edited pretty much daily I would like to know what others think on getting a lock on the list. I will not make it a survey for now, just feeling the water. Thanks for your guys feedback.-Abyss Taucher (talk) 05:32, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

You don't need to get other user's opinions on this. If you feel the page needs protection, make a report at WP:RPP. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 16:52, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

Good to know. I thought a lock needed consensus before making the report. I will think about making one.-Abyss Taucher (talk) 18:12, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

Ideas for Improvements

Here's some thoughts and ideas I've had about changes to the page. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 22:56, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

Anyone have other ideas for changes for improving the article? Feel free to add your own ideas or comment on ones already there.

• Uniform column widths

- Even though a lot of the tables feature the same columns, most of them are spaced and positioned very differently without any real reason or need for that to happen. For example, if you're looking at episode lengths, you start in the dramas. Then as you go down you shift way to the right for the MCU run times, then back to the left for the Comedy run times, then back to the right for the Animation run times, etc. I think it's mainly the "Status" column that causes this, but I think we could figure out good widths for the columns to accommodate everything. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 22:56, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

I really will like to implement this, and yes the problem is the status column, so I don't know how it could be solved. Maybe there is an option to make them fix all at the same length and it will just get span two lines vertically. Andres balbuena (talk) 15:56, 18 April 2017 (UTC)

I agree with that as well. Could be hard to do, because of how packed the status column sometimes is, but if someone can figure it out I am all for it. Abyss Taucher (talk) 21:58, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

• "See Also" Section

- Could have links to the similar pages for Amazon and Hulu -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 22:56, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

• Film Section

- Instead of having Films be a section under "Original Programming", we could split the section into two: "Original Series" and "Original Films" -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 22:56, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

I agree with you on this. Andres balbuena (talk) 15:56, 18 April 2017 (UTC)

Agreed, but the change should also apply to the "Future Original Programming" section as well. They need to be consistent. Somethingwickedly (talk) 14:04, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Agreed, also with what Somethingwickedly said. Abyss Taucher (talk) 21:58, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

• Documentaries Under Films

- I feel like "Documentaries" should be a subsection under Films since they are films (and we have a separate section for documentary TV series). -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 22:56, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

I agree with you, after all documentaries are perceived as a type of movie format by most, hence it has it's own category in the Oscars. Andres balbuena (talk) 15:56, 18 April 2017 (UTC)

Agreed. Somethingwickedly (talk) 14:04, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Agreed. Abyss Taucher (talk) 21:58, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

 Done

Stand-up comedy

Stand-up comedy section is getting really long, and it is only going to get bigger, there is almost 30 stand up only on this year (2017) and we are not even half way. I think we should start categorizing them by year and make them drop down, once you click on the different years. Andres balbuena (talk) 16:22, 21 May 2017 (UTC)

Let's create mockups here (or in a sandbox page) to see what they look like figure out the best option. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 20:53, 22 May 2017 (UTC)

By the way, do you know where to put the new stand-up comedy series called The Standups (coming to Netflix the 4th of July) ? cf https://twitter.com/fortunefunny/status/866764605371985921 In the comedy section ? or each episode separately with the other comedy specials Armos (talk) 07:23, 23 May 2017 (UTC)

That is a trick one, if is an ongoing short stand up episodes for less well known comedians, it will need to be on its own section inside the stand up. But I guess we will know later how Netflix will proceed with that. In the meantime it can be put on stand up section. Andres balbuena (talk) 17:29, 24 May 2017 (UTC)

Mystery Science Theater 3000

MST3K is showing as MST3K "The Return" in the Netflix page, and they are saying is Season 1, not season 11. I think it should be moved from continuations and put on regular Comedy. Even though is says the return, I think Netflix is seeing it as a reboot more than a continuation. Andres balbuena (talk) 15:45, 18 April 2017 (UTC)

Not sure. Sites like IMDB are listing it as its own entity, but within the actual episodes it's identified as "Season 11". I.E. Reptilicus' experiment number is 1101, not 0101. Minion Max (talk) 16:55, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

It shows as S1:E1 on the Netflix page, which I think is what we should follow. What you are talking about is more like an Easter Egg, making sure they are remembering the past or where it comes from. Andres balbuena (talk) 16:31, 29 April 2017 (UTC)

I agree. Netflix has it as season 1 of "Mystery Science Theater 3000: The Return" so that's how we should list it. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 22:56, 17 May 2017 (UTC)

For me it shows as 'Mystery Science Theater 3000' just like the old show. - Which would make it very odd to put it on one season. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 14:02, 30 May 2017 (UTC)

What you linked to is the old show. It's a collection of original episodes. The new version ("The Return") is [1] -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 02:55, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

Ah, my bad. I have made the change. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 06:16, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

How will we address the fact it's not a global original and only available in a few territories?Minion Max (talk) 14:15, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

I would say not at all, at least for now. We have that sitation with a couple of Originals. 'Voltron: Legendary Defender' is one for example. What is important is that Netflix was the first to air it and that it had Netflix Original branding back then. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 17:52, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

References

Remove Date Released on Movie Acquisitions

I propose we remove the date released column for movie acquisitions under "Exclusive international film distribution." We don't have that information for television acquisitions, and there are some movies that are listed in foreign territories that are difficult to add because there's no sources to cite for when they were added. For example, Bad Moms and The Space Between Us are listed as Netflix Originals in Japan (and possibly other territories as well), but in addition to not being listed on the Netflix Media Center, I can't find any release info on the internet. Rather than listing by order of release, I think we should go alphabetical like we do with TV acquisitions. Minion Max (talk) 14:08, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

I support this, especially since when the first release was has nothing to do with Netflix. I also propose to take 'Acquisitions' of the page entirely and make a new one for them. Acquisitions are not Netflix Originals, but Netflix Exklusives, the fact that Netflix doesn't brand them that way doesn't change that. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 15:59, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

I'm thinking it may be time to do that (separate the acquisitions). What would we call it? "List of programs exclusively distributed by Netflix"?-AnonWikiEditor (talk) 03:34, 16 June 2017 (UTC)

Either that or we go a little bit simpler and call it "List of Netflix exklusives". - Then again, we should probably be consistent and go with the pattern we have here already and call it "List of exklusive programs distributed by Netflix". Speaking of being consistent. I vote we do it for the Amazon list as well. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 14:12, 16 June 2017 (UTC)

The column is gone now and I'm still fine with it, but I just had an idea and wanted to share it. - There is an online source that lists the release date on Netflix: http://unogs.com. Bad Moms for example was added 2016-12-13 04:03:03. - But there is one problem with that, technically it's possible that a titel was added without Netflix Original branding in one region and later with brandring in another. If that happens the data would be wrong, because the system doesn't know the difference between these two cases. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 23:09, 16 June 2017 (UTC)

The Curious Case of "El Chapo"

We now have an interesting case with "El Chapo". The show from the start was announced as a Netflix co-production with Univision. [2]. As we know, there are many shows like this (Lilyhammer, Frontier, Anne with an E, etc.). But unlike every other co-production, "El Chapo" is completely devoid of any Netflix branding - not in the logo, nor in the credits.

So I'm wondering what we should do, if anything, regarding this. I think perhaps add some sort of note explaining? What are everyone else's thoughts? -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 08:39, 16 June 2017 (UTC)

The series has all the branding: Logo on thumbnail, logo at the beginning and "A Netflix Original Series". Only difference is that "A Netflix Original Series" is in Spanish (around 2:50).

P.S. Okay, that is strange... The US version is indeed without branding. All other markets seem to have it.

P.P.S. Found the error. Univision is an American Network (it was falsely written as Mexico based on the list). Netflix just waited and also aired the show in the US after Univision had already done so. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 16:54, 16 June 2017 (UTC)

Mystery solved by detective Abyss Taucher! -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 04:42, 20 June 2017 (UTC)

Medici: Masters of Florence is a Netflix Orginal Series in some countries, but no co-production?

'Medici: Masters of Florence' has all the brandings of a true Netflix Orginal in the US (and 'Netflix Presents'), but afaik Netflix isn't part of the production in any way. IIIRC we never had a case like that before. How you guys think we should handle it? -Abyss Taucher (talk) 20:32, 25 June 2017 (UTC)

We've had many cases like this before. "Netflix Original" is applied to any series that Netflix holds all exclusive rights to, dependent on the territory they've licensed it for. For example, they've exclusively licensed the BBC's Peaky Blinders for the US, and Australia's Comedy Network series Pacific Heat in the US as well, so they both get the Netflix Original branding since they're the only place you'll be able to watch it. They also actively do this with American shows outside of the US. The CW's Riverdale is a Netflix Original in Canada. ABC's Designated Survivor is a Netflix Original in many territories, and AMC's Better Call Saul is a Netflix Original in most of the world. These shows go under List_of_original_programs_distributed_by_Netflix#Acquisitions with territories appropriately listed.--Tv's emory (talk) 07:42, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

This is different. I know that Netflix brands exclusive rights content as "Netflix Original" and you are absolutly right that these shows go under List_of_original_programs_distributed_by_Netflix#Acquisitions. However acquisitions never had the "A Netflix Original Series/Film" line in it afaik (Edit: Actually films did, bot no series so far afaik), 'Medici: Masters of Florence' does. As I said, it has all brandings of a true Netflix Orginal, meaning: logo on thumbnail, logo at the beginning and "A Netflix Original Series".

P.S.: Okay, you're right. I never released it, but Netflix seems to indeed put "A Netflix Orginal Series" on exklusives now. They didn't before, for example 'Penny dreaddul' doesn't have that line here in Germany, at least on the first episode of season 1, which I went back to and checked, but they aparently do now. - Which is stange, now there is now way to distinguish between Original and Exclusies based on the content alone. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 09:34, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

Sense8 Episode Renewel

That's why I love Netflix. They really DO care for their subscription base. Renewing Sense8 for a two hour final for no reason other then to appease fans of the series and give them closure is something I think only Netflix would do or be able to do. They aren't going to get much out of it themselves. TheMovieGuy (talk) 22:47, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

Tables

The List of shows in each category is increasing and getting longer every month. I think this format looks more organized and easy to read, in my opinion. Thoughts? --Rudeby88 (talk) 04:27, 27 July 2017 (UTC)

This looks good. Part of me is hesitant to get rid of the full original release date, but I wouldn't oppose it either if everyone else likes it. These tables do look cleaner. I definitely think that we should go with the slightly smaller font size no matter what. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 03:07, 28 July 2017 (UTC)

"Part of me is hesitant to get rid of the full original release date". That's my problem with it. That informationen can be useful. It would be in the wls of course, but I also don't think the new design looks that much better or even different. I'm not against it, I just don't really see the additional benefit. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 16:20, 28 July 2017 (UTC)

Drama

Year	Title	Genre	Seasons	Lenght	Status
2013	House of Cards	Political drama	5 seasons, 65 episodes	42–59 min.	Pending
	Hemlock Grove	Horror, thriller	3 seasons, 33 episodes	45–58 min.	Ended
	Orange Is the New Black	Comedy-drama	5 seasons, 65 episodes	51–92 min.	Renewed for seasons 6 and 7
2014	Marco Polo	Historical drama	2 seasons, 20 episodes	48–65 min.	Ended
2015	Bloodline	Thriller	3 seasons, 33 episodes	48–68 min.	Ended
	Sense8	Science fiction	2 seasons, 23 episodes	45–124 min.	Renewed for final episode
	Narcos	Crime drama	2 seasons, 20 episodes	43–57 min.	Renewed for seasons 3 and 4. Season 3 to premiere on September 1, 2017
2016	Stranger Things	Science fiction, horror	1 season, 8 episodes	41–55 min.	Season 2 due to premiere on October 27, 2017
	The Get Down	Musical drama	1 season, 11 episodes	50–93 min.	Ended
	The Crown	Historical drama	1 season, 10 episodes	55–61 min.	Renewed
	The OA	Mystery	1 season, 8 episodes	31–71 min.	Renewed
2017	A Series of Unfortunate Events	Black comedy, mystery	1 season, 8 episodes	42–64 min.	Renewed for seasons 2 and 3
	13 Reasons Why	Teen drama, mystery	1 season, 13 episodes	49–61 min.	Renewed
	Gypsy	Psychological thriller	1 season, 10 episodes	46–58 min.	Pending
	Ozark	Drama	1 season, 10 episodes	52–80 min.	Pending
Upcoming
2017	Mindhunter	Drama	TBA	TBA	To premiere on October 13 Renewed

Comedy

Year	Title	Genre	Seasons	Lenght	Status
2015	Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt	Comedy	3 seasons, 39 episodes	23–36 min.	Renewed
	Grace and Frankie	Comedy-drama	3 seasons, 39 episodes	25–35 min.	Renewed
	Master of None	Comedy-drama	2 seasons, 20 episodes	21–57 min.	Pending
	W/ Bob & David	Sketch comedy	1 season, 5 episodes	27–33 min.	Ended
2016	Love	Romantic comedy	2 season, 22 episodes	27–40 min.	Renewed
	Fuller House	Sitcom	2 seasons, 26 episodes	25–36 min.	Season 3 (part 1) due to premiere on September 22, 2017
	Flaked	Comedy	2 season, 14 episodes	30–34 min.	Pending
	Netflix Presents: The Characters	Sketch comedy	1 season, 8 episodes	27–38 min.	Ended
	The Ranch	Sitcom	2 seasons, 30 episodes	28–34 min.	Season 2 ongoing
	Lady Dynamite	Surrealist comedy	1 season, 12 episodes	26–35 min.	Renewed
	Easy	Romantic, anthology series	1 season, 8 episodes	26–30 min.	Renewed
	Haters Back Off	Comedy	1 season, 8 episodes	29–36 min.	Renewed
2017	One Day at a Time	Sitcom	1 season, 13 episodes	26–31 min.	Renewed
	Santa Clarita Diet	Comedy-horror	1 season, 10 episodes	26–29 min.	Renewed
	Mystery Science Theater 3000: The Return	Comic science fiction	1 season, 14 episodes	86–94 min.	Pending
	Girlboss	Comedy	1 season, 13 episodes	24–29 min.	Ended
	Dear White People	Satire, Drama	1 season, 10 episodes	21–33 min.	Renewed
	GLOW	Comedy-drama	1 season, 10 episodes	29–37 min.	Pending
	The Standups	Stand-up comedy	1 season, 6 episodes	27–29 min.	Pending
	Friends from College	Comedy	1 season, 8 episodes	28–34 min.	Pending
Upcoming
2017	Atypical	Coming-of-age comedy	1 season, 8 episodes	TBA	To premiere on August 11
	Disjointed	Sitcom	1 season, 20 episodes	TBA	To premiere on August 25
	She's Gotta Have It	Comedy-drama	1 season, 10 episodes	TBA	To premiere on November 23

References

HIGHWAYMAN

Separate reports are rarely made for stuff like this. Just like with BUBBLES. When made public, it's usually a sealed deal - or it wouldnt be public. Studios don't go into negotiations to go into negotiations. They go into them because they plan on acquiring the properties. It wouldn't be negotiations if they weren't sure they were gonna pick up the property. That's called bidding. I feel it'ssafe to say it's a Netflix property. Like i said, updates are rarely offered in the cases of negotiations. It's just the Way it is. TheMovieGuy (talk) 17:45, 23 June 2017 (UTC)

It's just the Way it is is not an argument that counts here. What counts is what the sources say. When things like "Netflix In Early ‘Highwaymen’ Talks" or "Kevin Costner, Woody Harrelson Eyed" are right in the title, it's not a done deal. Is 'Highwayman' likely to get picked up? Yes, but unless we find a good industry outlet (EW, Deadline etc.) or Netflix itself supporting that a deal is done (as was the case with 'Bubbles' later), I can not see why it should be on the list. The list should try to be fact based not likelihood based. - I think thats a very simple concept for an encyclopedia and the fact that you even want to debate it bewilders me greartly. It would be great if others could join the discussion, so we can come to an consensus on this once and for all. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 21:06, 23 June 2017 (UTC)

No harm is done by putting the piece in the place. Early or not - to go into negotiations is to close a door. I'm a business man. That's what we do. We don't go into negotiations unless we are taking the property. Also, who made you keeper of this page? TheMovieGuy (talk) 02:37, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

Also, didn't mean to offend or provoke. So apologizes if that's how it read. TheMovieGuy (talk) 02:39, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

"No harm is done by putting the piece in the place." It is if the information turns out to be wrong. - And I'm not saying that that will be the case, only that the source doesn't lock the deal down. "The Keeper of this page", if anything, is consensus, which obviously isn't the case here. Let's wait until others had their say and then we go with the group. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 05:23, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

Personally, I would exclude it until we have more definitive reports on whether this is going to be a Netflix production. "Early talks" are not definitive, so i would remove it for now. I jyst don't understand the rush to include it on such flimsy evidence; it's not like they're even filming yet. Somethingwickedly (talk) 17:43, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

I think that has been up long enough now. 2 to 1 is only barely a majority, but good enough. I will take it off the list for now. The moment it's confirmed it gets back on. Abyss Taucher (talk) 03:23, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

References

Sum of content running time

It should be possible to summarize the running time of the content released, and do a graph to see how it changes over time. Good idea?

Do you have an example? I'm not fully sure what you mean. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 04:56, 9 August 2017 (UTC)

Perhaps something like Q1 2017: 403h 30m, Q2 2017: 483h 25m etc...

Where would you get a accurate count of that info? This is also just a list of shows. If such a graph were to be added, I perhaps the regular Netflix article would be a better place. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 18:38, 9 August 2017 (UTC)

I meant for the original content (tv-shows and movies), and the accurate info would be to look at the running time of them :)

"PRIVATE LIFE", "IBIZA", "LAND OF STEADY HABITS" and "ALEX STRANGELOVE"

All four of the above titles, ("PRIVATE LIFE" starring Paul Giamatti, "IBIZA" starring Gillian Jacobs, "LAND OF STEADY HABITS" starring Ben Mendolsohn and "ALEX STRANGELOVE") are in principal production or post production and are in need of Wikipedia pages because they are notable. Please, all who read this, pick one not yet crafted and create it. TheMovieGuy (talk) 03:59, 4 September 2017 (UTC)

Exclusive international television distribution: Unbranded entries

Is it not of value of to include the examples of shows that Netflix has first-run rights to in a country that aren't branded as "Netflix Originals"? For example in the UK and Ireland (and various other countries): Rick and Morty, Once Upon A Time and Pretty Little Liars. The only functional difference between them and the listed examples is they don't have the Netflix Original label. Perhaps under a different section. They were there before, and there is sources confirming them as (first-run broadcast) exclusives.--occono (talk) 21:47, 5 September 2017 (UTC)

Only content that has the Netflix Orginal label should be listed here, since the list is about "original programs distributed by Netflix". There was even talk about making an extra list for "Acquisitions", because they're only originals by name even if thy have the Netflix Original label. When it comes down to it they're Netflix Exklusivs and so is of course content for which Netflix has first-run rights without putting the Netflix Original label on it. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 05:17, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

Is Real Rob a continuation program?

Real Rob is currently under the table of Continuations section, stating that Season 1 was previously premiered on Independent; and Season 2 was commissioned by Netflix. My understanding is, however, that there is no such previous channel named Independent and both Season 1 and 2 were commissioned by Netflix, according to Real Rob Wikipedia page. Please let me know whether Real Bob is a continuation program from Season 2, a Netflix self-commissioned program from Season 1, or an acquired one. This show is distributed by Netflix, but not as a Netflix Original program in my country Japan. So I have limited sources to confirm the category. Thx. --Mis0s0up (talk) 04:56, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

Season 1 of Real Rob was self-financed and produced by Rob Schneider himself (see [3]) - not Netflix. Season 1 also bears no Netflix Original branding. That changed for season 2 with it becoming a "Netflix Original" (see [4]). So it is a continuation as season 1 was independently financed and produced while Netflix took over for season 2. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 05:08, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

 Resolved Thank you for the quick and crystal-clear answer. It helps better translation. Putting Independent in the Previous network(s) column makes me confused. I will make the column blank with a section footnote on Japanese Wikipedia page. Mis0s0up (talk) 06:22, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

American Crime Story is not a Netflix Original program

American Crime Story (ACS), an Fx’s TV drama, should be removed from the list of Netflix Original programs. The show is currently listed under the section of Acquisitions. According to Netflix’s definition, Netflix Original titles are ONLY ON NETFLIX in certain countries. ACS does not fulfill the requirements because Netflix acquired exclusive VOD streaming license only. This means Fx sold distribution rights to other TV broadcasters. That is why you cannot find ACS when you search all Original titles by alphabet on Netflix Media Center. For more information, please refer to the official press release posted on the Media Center. --Mis0s0up (talk) 03:15, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Good catch! It is indeed for only SVOD rights only and lacks Netflix original branding. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 03:37, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Kantaro: The Sweet Tooth Salaryman

@Mis0s0up: Do you know anything about the Japanese show Kantaro: The Sweet Tooth Salaryman? An IP address kept trying to remove it because some of its information in the table is listed as TBA, but as far as we understand it is released (or possibly releasing weekly) in Japan so it should remain even though we may not know the full episode count. But if you know any more details or any of the missing info (like episode count or runtimes), that would be helpful to have. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 00:51, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

 Comment: Thanks for the ping. I was about to respond to the recent rewrite about Kantaro. As I mentioned in the talk section of Million Yen Women, there are so many Japanese titles contain incorrect info. At this very moment, I am working on fixing them in accordance with the on-going translation project from English to Japanese , so you will see the results by the end of today (in Japan time). I believe the recent dispute can be solved by giving the right and reliable references. Cheers, ---Mis0s0up (talk) 01:22, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

 Resolved Five Japanese titles including Kantaro were relocated from the self-commissioned foreign language section to the co-production one. I also added relevant references, which will help you for better understanding. FYI: each episode was added on a weekly basis and Kantaro Season 1 has been just completed in late September. Not sure whether they will renew or cancel the program. Many of Japanese TV programs are not usually renewed for Season 2 except ones based on manga (comics). --Mis0s0up (talk) 07:50, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

What happened to Milion Yen Women ?

I thought it has been in this list, but I can't find it. It seems to be a coproduction with TV Tokyo. 18:06, 15 August 2017 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Armos (talk • contribs)

Anyone know anything about this show "Million Yen Women". It's branded as a Netflix Original (at least in the US) and apparently just released today? From what little information I've come across, it may be a co-production with a Japanese network. https://www.netflix.com/title/80170687 -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 05:39, 16 August 2017 (UTC)

EDIT: Oops, I didn't look before posting and just saw that this was brought up by Armos already.

If it is a co-production, it also has the NF Original branding on Japanese Netflix. Perhaps like the continuations that are co-productions, we should list TV Tokyo as a co-producer in parentheses? Minion Max (talk) 15:00, 22 August 2017 (UTC)

 Investigating... Hello from Japan. Not only Million Yen Women but also most of Japanese contents listed under the Foreign Language section seem to be co-production, not self-commissioned. Therefore, all of them should be relocated to Co-production section. If OK by everyone, let me relocate them after I reconfirm status of Japanese contents and then publish the Japanese Wikipedia article. During the course of translation, I'm checking the accuracy of the English list and found some bugs to be fixed. Mis0s0up (talk) 08:12, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

The important part is whether they premiered exclusively on Netflix in Japan or not, I think, not just if they had a Japanese production partner.--occono (talk) 16:33, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Million Yen Women is not exclusive for Netflix because it was co-produced by TV Tokyo and thereby it is available both on Netflix and on TV Tokyo. However, this title is branded and labeled as Netflix Original in Japan. I guess this categorization is the same as Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency co-produced by BBC America & Netflix. That is why I pointed out that Million Yen Women is located in the wrong section. ---Mis0s0up (talk) 02:04, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Dirk Gently isn't available on Netflix in the US. (Hulu actually has the rights oddly enough). As far as I know, none of the other co-productions in the table are released as Netflix originals in the home country the show's co-producer - though the table is certainly not limited in that way. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 05:12, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Million Yen Women is definitely co-production. It was aired on TY Tokyo etc. in Japan as shown on the official website.I am also 100% certain that the show is labeled as Netflix Original with the official logo. For your reference, please visit Netflix Japan's Official YouTube site - you will find the original logo on the trailer. This is a business arrangement named Production Consortium (ja: 製作委員会方式) widely accepted in Japanese content production & distribution. Million Yen Women Production Consortium (「100万円の女たち」製作委員会) has the copy right, and Netflix is one of the members of the consortium. This business custom is not so popular outside Japan, hence many of Japanese Netflix Original titles are currently located in the wrong section, I guess... -Mis0s0up (talk) 08:48, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

If you can confirm that content from Japan should be under co-production go ahead with moving it. I had my suspicions for a long time that we probably organized some of it wrong. I would say nobody here is in a better position to correct it than you, simply by the fact that you can read orginal sources. Just make sure that they're actually co-productions and not something like "X presents", " in partnership with X", "in association with X" etc. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 11:55, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

 Resolved Five Japanese titles including Million Yen Women were relocated from the self-commissioned foreign language section to the co-production one. I also added relevant references, which will help you for better understanding. -Mis0s0up (talk) 07:44, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

Is Hibana also on Japanese TV as well though? That one seemed more high-profile and higher budget.--occono (talk) 23:36, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for your interest in Japanese contents. Hibana was co-commissioned by Netflix and Yoshimoto Kogyo (one of the leading comedian/talent agencies). Hibana has been streamed on Netflix Japan and labeled as Netflix Original since 2016 spring till now. From Feb 2017 to Apr 2017, NHK (Japanese national public TV broadcaster like BBC in UK) aired Hibana nationwide. This deal was made as licensing from Netflix/Yoshimoto to NHK. You maybe wonder why the partner of Hibana is not NHK (TV broadcaster) but Yoshimoto (talent agency). This drama is based on a novel written by Mr. Matayoshi who is a comedian and works for Yoshimoto. NHK merely acquired a one-time broadcasting license from Netflix/Yoshimoto. All the details I mentioned are found in Hibana (novel) page in Japanese. Hope this helps.

FYI: among Japanese series, Blazing Transfer Students (to be streamed from November 11) still remains in the Foreign Language section because I cannot confirm whether it is a co-production or self-commissioned by Netflix. But very likely that Blazing Transfer Students is also a co-production by Netflix with Johnny & Associates (another leading talent agency). This drama is based on a comics (manga). Its main casts are occupied by idols from Johnny & Associates. No Japanese TV broadcasters is trying to air the show at this moment as far as I know. Thus, Johnny & Associates plays a pivotal role to make it happened on Netflix worldwide. It is probably the same deal structure as Hibana. -Mis0s0up (talk) 01:07, 6 October 2017 (UTC)

According to what you said, I think Hibana should be left in the Foreign Language section as it is labelled Netflix Original in the whole world and has been released globally at the same time. I mean, the MCU series (Daredevil…) are co-commissioned by Netflix and Disney/Marvel and no one thought they should belong in the co-production section. Armos (talk) 08:25, 6 October 2017 (UTC)

Okay, probably you cannot read the article about a business arrangement named ja: 製作委員会方式... Let me try to explain it here. It is widely accepted by but only in Japan, and more importantly different from the MCU scheme. In short, 製作委員会方式 is so-called project-based joint venture for co-production in entertainment industries. In other words, 製作委員会方式 is very similar to limited liability company (LLC) or special purpose company (SPC) in Western film industries - technically speaking, 製作委員会 is not a legal entity but a project-based consortium. Therefore, in Hibana case, Netflix and Yoshimoto co-commissioned (i.e. in the financial term). Yoshimoto is not a production studio, a vendor, a licenser, nor a licensing brokerage. If a co-production series earns some revenue through merchandising or advertisement fees etc, the members of 製作委員会 will split the profit in a certain way. This is how the members monetize and hedge investment risks in the long run. To renew the next season or cancel depends on 製作委員会's decision, not on Netflix alone. On the other hand, MCU cases are based on a licensing scheme, not co-commission. MCU first licenses out televising rights to Netflix. Then, Netflix self-commissions Marvel series. To renew or cancel is totally up to Netflix. I tried to clarify the differences carefully because not only Netflix users refer to this Wikipedia page but also investors and corporate guys do so. -Mis0s0up (talk) 10:54, 6 October 2017 (UTC)

I think this article shouldn't really be so concerned with the behind the scenes contractual details of shows, just whether a show is exclusive to Netflix at launch or not. By your account, Hibana is, from a viewer's perspective, no different to House of Cards or OITNB, which aren't exclusive to Netflix after a certain period, they air on TV after Netflix in certain countries (And in some they air on TV first and Netflix a year later) and go to DVD and iTunes and other purchase options. If Hibana premiered on Netflix exclusively in Japan for a certain period, I think it belongs to be listed as a full Netflix Original. I think we should scrap the "Co-Production" section and merge it with international acquisitions, and maybe indicate what level of exclusivity Netflix has titles instead. The difference between Hibana, Riverdale, Designated Survivor, House of Cards and Stranger Things in terms of production is very complicated for a list article, I think we should be concerned with the simple matter of exclusivity periods and territories instead.--occono (talk) 22:10, 6 October 2017 (UTC)

Please refer to the new section on this talk page: #Definitions of Self-commissions, Co-productions, Continuations, and Acquisitions. I explained why exclusivity is not the key to define Netflix Original. Merging co-production into acquisitions is not accurate, and rights holders will get upset. Editors of Wikipedia pages are supposed to tell the facts, not express their opinions. In my opinion, Netflix should use a different branding name to distinguish commissioned programs and acquisitions. But this is just a strategic opinion from a user perspective, not the fact. Please be noticed that I almost complete the translation project. As soon as I have done, I won't revisit this page frequently. Should you have any questions regarding to Japanese contents, you can leave a message on the Japanese Wikipedia talk page about Netflix Original. Some other Japanese editors maybe take your question. They have been continuously contributing to the Netflix Original article. I am a short-term translating editor. -Mis0s0up (talk) 05:36, 8 October 2017 (UTC)

We should put co-productions to exclusive international distribution

Hi Guys (and Gals),

I suggest that we put co-productions under exclusive international distribution, but we retain a subtitle that these shows are co-productions. These shows are produced by local TV companies and netflix only gives money to them to stream the show later on netflix later. Therefore they are hardly original programming by strict standards. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 185.160.110.4 (talk) 17:42, 7 October 2017 (UTC)

"These shows are produced by local TV companies and netflix only gives money to them to stream the show later on netflix later". It could be just money, since the term "co-producer" is very vague (and that would still mean giving money during the actual production), but it can also involve a lot of other things. At the end of the day, "co-production" and "exclusive" are similar, but still different terms (one involves production and the other distribution) and shouldn't be mixed. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 18:34, 7 October 2017 (UTC)

N Sorry but I do not agree with the proposed idea. In acquisitions, Netflix is the licensee who merely got a streaming right from licenser(s). On the other hand in self-commissions or co-productions, Netflix is the licenser who can give a distribution right to the third parties. This definition is very important because acquired programs can be terminated by licensers. Thus, the acquisitions list represents the current status, which may be frequently changed. --Mis0s0up (talk) 03:43, 8 October 2017 (UTC)

N I also disagree with this suggestion (for reasons already stated by others). -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 22:22, 9 October 2017 (UTC)

Correct runtime for stand-ups

Can someone please go through the stand-ups and set the runtime to the correct value? I dont have Netflix, so I cant do it, but I really doubt that six consecutive stand-ups are 1 hour, 1 min. long. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.134.80.94 (talk)

Thank you for pointing this out. I corrected the run times for 13 different stand-up specials. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 02:58, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

Foreign Title (Domestic Title) or Domestic Title (Foreign Title)?

So, I don't think we ever reached a consensus on how to list foreign titles on the wiki article, and it's kind of up to whomever lists it. We should probably unify which makes more sense/looks better.

Should we go Foreign/Domestic:

• Fe de etarras (Bomb Scared)
• O Matador (The Killer)
• Las chicas del cable (Cable Girls)

Or Domestic/Foreign?

• Bomb Scared (Fe de etarras)
• The Killer (O Matador)
• Cable Girls (Las chicas del cable)

It's rather inconsistent right now, because something like Suburra's prequel is just listed as "Suburra: Blood on Rome", but the foreign title is "Suburra: la serie" (and not listed). The Japanese titles are Domestic (Foreign), while everything else is Foreign (Domestic). Since we're based on the English Wikipedia, I'm inclined to side with Domestic (Foreign) since that's how the shows are titled on US Netflix, but I'd be interested to hear what you all think. Minion Max (talk) 14:38, 13 October 2017 (UTC)

At the beginnig I was for Foreign/Domestic, because in general the original title should come first. The problem with this is that most of the people who visit here can't read the original title or the wl attached to it should there be one, so it has pretty much zero use for them. So yes, we should go Domestic/Foreign. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 20:29, 13 October 2017 (UTC)

WP:Commonname. --Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 20:37, 13 October 2017 (UTC)

Multilingual titles should be written in English first (mandatory) and foreign second (optional). For example, Midnight Dinner is written as 深夜食堂 and pronounced as Shinya Shokudo in Japanese. Many of the editors cannot set the correct sort key if they do not speak Japanese. Korean, Arabic and other non-alphabet languages have the same issue. Hence the sortable table does not function if you put foreign titles first. Mis0s0up (talk) 23:42, 13 October 2017 (UTC)

I am all for Domestic/Foreign. (Picsovina)

Thumbs up for Domestic/Foreign. (Kurumputyi) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.193.171.150 (talk) 14:45, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

Netflix Templates

• I noticed that Template:Netflix specials is very out of date and missing the vast majority of specials.
• Template:Netflix original series also seems to be missing a number of series that should be listed.
• I haven't taken too close of a look at if Template:Netflix films and documentaries is missing anything.

I'll add some when I have time, but I wanted to bring this to attention in case anyone else feels like adding to them. -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 05:51, 20 October 2017 (UTC)

Should The Day I Met El Chapo be in the foreign language section ?

Or should we let it in the docu-series ? Armos (talk) 07:12, 20 October 2017 (UTC)

I would let it stay where it is. The genre is more important than the OV imo. - Besides, the foreign language problem must be adressed anyway and when it is we probably won't have a foreign language section anymore. -Abyss Taucher (talk) 15:38, 20 October 2017 (UTC)

Separating Series and Films

It has been brought up a few times in the past and generally I think editors were in favor of it, but the next step of actually making the change has never been taken. So now I formally proposing separating the "Original programming" into "Original series" and "Original films" (and will actually go ahead and do it if there are no objections).

The change would result in there being the following four main sections:

1. Original series
2. Original films
3. Future original programming
4. Acquisition

I personally don't feel it is necessary to have separate "Future original series" and "Future original films" sections since the subsections of "Future original programming" already broadly and neatly group everything into their specific mediums (series, films, etc.).

Thoughts? Objections? -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 00:03, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

No objections from me. I would also think about taking 'Acquisition' off here and making a new page for them, since they arn't really 'Originals' when all is said and done, but that would be a fairly big change and would also need to be done for the list for Amazon Orginals (Hulu doesn't have it). -Abyss Taucher (talk) 12:43, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

I think I might have been one of the people who was for this originally, and still am, so I've implemented it as suggested above. I'm not sure what to do about the "Acquistions", and I;m not sure there actually is a "perfect" solution, but I'll have a think about it. Somethingwickedly (talk) 21:23, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

Idea: Hello from Japan. I'm working on translation of this English list to Japanese. Apologize in advance if I make my English not so clear. Here is my idea of categorization. The original programming list on English Wikipedia and that on Japanese do not have to have the identical categorization, so taking the following idea or not is totally up to you.

1. Commissioned by Netflix
   1. Self-commission
      1. TV
      2. Film
   2. Co-production
   3. Continuation
2. Acquisition
3. Future original programming
4. Past original programming

Some Wikipedia users in Japan requested us to give the first priority to categorize programs on a basis of types of IP ownership (i.e. self-commissioned programs, co-production, continuation and acquisition.) In other words, separating TV and films has been done already by using sub-sections, and therefore it's not high priority. The reason is that exclusive distribution rights for non-self-commissioned programs can be sold to other distributors in the future. Please take into account the possible change in distribution right ownership when you re-categorize the original programs.

 Comment: I think taking Acquisition off from the list is subjective. The definition of Netflix Original is made by Netflix, not by users - many of Netflix users including me do not like Netflix labeling acquisitions as original though. Please keep in mind the purpose of Wikipedia articles. Editors are supposed to mirror the fact, not to express their own opinions.

 Comment: Re: the name of categorization, you may be confused in which category you put one-time specials and stand-up comedies. These are neither series nor films. Hope this input helps. Mis0s0up (talk) 01:49, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

I like this idea. I hate having to scroll all the way down to reach the film section. This would make it so much more convenient, f I could just click to close the tab belonging to the series and just be at the film tab. TheMovieGuy (talk) 17:59, 21 October 2017 (UTC)

Should we treat trademark applications as prove for an original content order?

All the trademark applications from Netflix Studios, LLC turned out to be a content order without fail so far afaik. The newest is 'Paradise PD' (https://trademarks.justia.com/875/98/paradise-87598474.html) The application is among other things for 'Entertainment services in the nature of an ongoing comedic drama television series; providing online non-downloadable video clips and other multimedia digital content containing audio, video, artwork, and/or text from or related to a comedic drama television series'. That would be enough information to include it in the list, but I'm hesitant to put it in, because technically Netflix could apply for a trademark and then never do anything with it, even though that hasn't happen yet.-Abyss Taucher (talk) 12:12, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Hey, I studied IP in law school. I think you should trust your hesitation. There's a distinction between holding a tm, applying for a tm and actively using tm. There's a lot of wackiness in-between and I think it's best that we not wade into that the crazy. Jaydangerx (talk) 11:52, 27 October 2017 (UTC)