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Livingston's Jewish Population

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The Essex County, New Jersey and Livingston, New Jersey articles have conflicting statements.

The former states "...and especially Livingston, where the population is reportedly nearly 60% Jewish", while the latter states "Livingston is approximately 30% Jewish, one of the higher percentages of Jews in any American municipality".

60%, while certainly possible, seems innacurately high and I would be very interested in seeing the data to back it up. LoveOfFate 22:39, 9 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

A local rabbi in Livingston updated the Livingston article, changing 60% to the 30% that he felt was more reasonable. My concern is that neither number has a source provided. There are sources available, and we shouldn't be using best guesses, whether in the Livingston, New Jersey article or for Essex County, New Jersey. Alansohn 23:42, 9 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with Alansohn about the need for sources. I am that local rabbi. I had lunch with David Katz, the most recent mayor of Livingston last week and he too agreed that 60% was extremely over-inflated. (And it would be incorrect for the Essex County article as well, obviously). Documented stats are hard to come by, but I will attempt to see if the Federation has done any demographic studies for the MetroWest federation to support a specific number. In the meantime, if someone wants to change it a less speicifc reference ("Livingston has a very large number of Jewish residents, one of the...") or something like that it might put the issue aside for the moment. MKaiserman 00:11, 10 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
After a little searching, I found the results of the 2001 NJPS survey on the web and I put up the Jewish population numbers based on that on both this page and the Essex County, New Jersey page. That's about as an authoritative a source on Jewish populations that there is, so it seems like the best place to cite. MKaiserman 05:18, 10 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Rabbi Kaiserman, please be assured that no disrespect was intended. My concern was that the numbers should be based on a source, not just on a best guess (even one as seemingly reliable as yours might be). And I must say that the National Jewish Population Survey is definitive. I looked through the results in the link provided, and Livingston is one of the few communities in the New York City area with a number at the municipality level. My home of Teaneck and the Five Towns, and virtually every other distinct Jewish community in the metro area is part of a group of multiple municipalities that would make it impossible to calculate Jews as percentage of population at the local level for too many places other than Livingston. Does the NJPS publish any more detailed data? Alansohn 05:47, 10 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Alansohn, I am in complete agreement with you. When I saw the original entry listing Livingston at 60% and as "one of the highest percentages..." I was surprised and dubious about both the number and the claim. When I made the change to 30%, I figured it was on the same "verifiable" data as the original poster of that data. The 46% is based on real data - although I still find the number too high, I have no contravening data and NJPS is usually pretty good. So I think we are now on better ground to state a real number and percentage. The number of Jews in Livingston and Essex County and the percentage are both now documented information.
As to the statement that it is one of the highest pecentages of any municipality - well, I don't have concrete data to show that - nor am I the original poster whot added that sentence in. In fact, it was that sentence here and in the Essex County article that originally got me to edit this page. The NJPS certainly has more detailed data in the full 2002 results report. I don't have a copy of it and couldn't find it in more detail online.
I have no problem with someone changing the article here or in Essex County to comment on what we can prove. Since 46% seems to be a verifiable (even if surprisingly high) figure, I would think it does make it one of the highest percentages in the country. That the report singles out Livingston when so few other towns of her size are noted lends weight to that thought. I didn't see any other smaller town so listed with such a percentage, but I only skimmed the whole 50 states. I can't say (nor do I feel a burning need to say) that Livingston has one of the higest percentage of Jews of any municipaltiy definitively (even though it very well might be true), so please, edit away to statements that you are more comfortable with and that are more encyclopedic in their data and proof. MKaiserman 13:11, 10 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I must say it never occurred to me the percentage is that high. I suppose it’s mainly because what, for lack of a better term, I’d have to call the Jewish “feel”, is less apparent than in various other municipalities in the metro area with a large Jewish presence.
In any event, I’m glad we now have the data to support a specific figure.
As for speculating on the percentage vis-a-vis those of other municipalities, I think your wording is both relevant and vague enough to withstand criticism.
Were we to have access to enough data to draw up a list, I think most people would agree Livingston would rank amongst the top ten percentage-wise.
The fact the NJPS lists Livingston separately, while lumping so many other significant communities together is indeed curious.
It may very well be as you suggested – that the combination of the community’s size and that it constitutes a high percentage of the total is its distinguishing characteristic. (As opposed to say New Square, which certainly has a higher percentage of Jews, but a smaller population.)
However that leads me to question why Lakewood wasn’t listed independently too.
Anyway, thanks for clearing things up Rabbi Kaiserman.LoveOfFate 21:02, 10 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

There may also be lots of non-practising Jews, who identify as such when asked by surveyors but never in any other way participate as Jews. It may have less religious and or culturally committed Jews in the overall percentage than some other areas. -JohnPackLambert

History of East Hobart Gap Rd

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I was wondering if anyone knew the history of East Hobart Gap Road. A VERY long time ago, I saw a photo that was taking from where the fire department is, looking eastward. The photo showed the road making a right hand turn just after Burnet Street, into what is now East Orange Water Works, which struck me as odd. Having grown up on the road, I searched and searched and never saw anything that even remotely looked like a road. Many thanks for any help!

A guess - an access road to a once-upon-a-time town well. David notMD (talk) 18:12, 17 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
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Places of worship

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Most towns have a list of current and past places of worship. David notMD (talk) 18:13, 17 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

"Most" is a tremendous exaggeration, but there are many that do include. If you have the reliable sources that list them, go for it. Alansohn (talk) 02:41, 18 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Started a list. In process, shocked to learn that Temple Emanu-El closed June 2017 David notMD (talk) 10:32, 19 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]
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Hello fellow Wikipedians,

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