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Template:Did you know nominations/MLS Cup 2009

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Yoninah (talk) 02:16, 20 December 2018 (UTC)

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MLS Cup 2009

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5x expanded by SounderBruce (talk). Self-nominated at 07:51, 5 November 2018 (UTC).

  • The full review will be to follow, but right now, the statement "The two teams were from Western Conference, marking the third edition to be played between two teams from the same conference" is unsourced, and the article needs clarification on the term "expansion team". According to the article, RSL was "the second expansion team to participate in an MLS Cup Final"; however, RSL joined the league in 2005, and as far as I know about the term expansion team, it usually is only used to describe teams in their first season (for example, the Vegas Golden Knights in 2017). Maybe this needs to be clarified somehow (i.e. that RSL was the second non-"original" MLS team to make it to the Cup Final)? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:13, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Narutolovehinata5: I'll take care of the unsourced sentence in a bit, though I am having trouble finding a proper source (as MLS statistics from a decade ago are hard to track down). The term "expansion team" can persist for decades, especially in leagues like MLS, NHL, and MLB with clear legacy or original teams; the NY Times source calls them the second expansion team to contest the final, so I went with their wording instead. SounderBruce 01:33, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I've taken care of the unsourced statement. SounderBruce 01:56, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Given that I've nominated MLS Cup 2002 for the December 9 slot, I would prefer this hook to run on the 9th anniversary of the match (which was played at night on November 22, which corresponds with November 23 on GMT). SounderBruce 08:04, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
@SounderBruce: I was about to approve this, but reading the article made me confused. So at the time, the MLS Cup Final had a format which could lead to the possibility of two teams from the same conference reaching the final, right? But neither the article nor the 2009 MLS playoffs article discuss how. I got confused as to how Real Salt Lake (which as of 2018 is in the Western Conference) was apparently bracketed with the Eastern Conference teams in that season. Were they in EC at the time? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 17:19, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
The conference crossover is explained in the MLS Cup article, rather than each playoff entry, but does appear here as "four wild card teams in the next positions regardless of conference". SounderBruce 22:24, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
I see. @SounderBruce: Would it be okay to reword the relevant statements in the article then? To avoid confusion. Once this is done I will approve this seeing that there are no more issues that I could find. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:34, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
The use of wild cards is fairly common and is linked here, so I don't think we need to add a bloat-y explanation, especially since it would need to be replicated across most of the articles. SounderBruce 06:26, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
It still seems very confusing to be honest, especially with the part about "Conference Semifinals". At the very least, maybe something here needs to be mentioned how, despite being called "Conference Semifinals", it actually had no regard for conference. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:21, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
Again, it's all explained in the MLS Cup article, since it applies to multiple editions of the competition, so I don't want to add it in here. And the Conference Semifinals/Finals do have regard for the conference, but the wild card seeding does not. SounderBruce 00:35, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Seems we're stuck here and we can't come into an agreement on whether or not the article wording is clear enough. The article meets all the DYK requirements and a QPQ has been provided, but I'm requesting a second opinion on the wording of the playoffs discussion. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 12:57, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
- The article appears clear enough for me to have no concerns. Length, Date, Cite (one electronic, one offline which is AGF), QPQ, and Earwigs check. Both hooks approved, hold for December 9. Mifter (talk) 22:53, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Hi, I came by to promote this, but I was wondering where you got all those facts and figures for the Summary of results and Details sections? Could you add some cites? Yoninah (talk) 18:01, 19 December 2018 (UTC)
@SounderBruce: See above request for cites. Best, Mifter (talk) 21:41, 19 December 2018 (UTC)
  • @Yoninah: Typically, soccer articles do not cite specific details in the summary table and matchbox due to the statistics being repeated from the prose or supported by the linked match report. SounderBruce 01:49, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
  • @SounderBruce: I knew you were going to say that, so I combed the article to verify the charts. I simply don't see all those player and referee names in the article. Yoninah (talk) 02:01, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
  • What linked match report? Maybe you could link it again for the charts. Yoninah (talk) 02:02, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
  • @Yoninah: The match report is linked below the score and above the penalty-takers. The summary of results tables are supported by the prose above them, under each team's subheader. SounderBruce 02:05, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
  • Now I see it, thank you! Restoring tick per Mifter's review. Yoninah (talk) 02:10, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
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