User talk:BradPatrick/Archive 4

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What about a "Cease and Desist" template to avoid future confusion of this kind?[edit]

Another user (apparently I shouldn't say whom) has offered (apparently I shouldn't say where) an adequate explanation on your behalf of what you wrote at Talk:Water Fuel Cell#No Legal Threats, but what about creating a boilerplate template with wording carefully chosen to avoid confusion in future cases of this kind (although I hope there won't be many)? I humbly suggest something like this (to be placed in the talk pages of articles A,B,C):

The WikiMedia Foundation has received a cease and desist letter from Company K. Please avoid mentioning topics X, Y, Z in this article until further notice. This request applies only to articles A,B,C. Your cooperation will speed the process of resolving this matter in a manner consistent with the goals of the Wikipedia.
--Brad Patrick, (date and time) General Counsel, WikiMedia Foundation

Just an idea.---CH 08:46, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

For what it's worth, I started on something similar at User:William_Pietri/Legaldispute for a different situation. That's now past, but perhaps it would be helpful to you. William Pietri 01:02, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

I'd offer a different version:

The WikiMedia Foundation has received a cease and desist letter from Company K. Please do not reference this in this article or discuss the dispute on the talkpage in order to avoid further legal problems. Your cooperation will speed the process of resolving this matter in a manner consistent with the goals of the Wikipedia.
--Brad Patrick, (date and time) General Counsel, WikiMedia Foundation

--ScienceApologist 21:01, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Paul McKenna[edit]

Hello Brad. In reference to your removal of some legal information from the McKenna article, an editor finds it necessary to have your comments regarding this removal included in the article. I have removed the information twice, as it can be construed as a WP:BLP violation (negative info sourced by a self-sourced cite). A minor revert war is now in progress over it. You might want to express your opinion about this inclusion on the talk page. I did not think that it is a good idea for this section to be included in the article. Here is the diff of the section in question. - Crockspot 20:55, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Gibbs High School[edit]

You asked me to check your user page for your contact information and Wikipedia to find out how many registered users the site had after eight months. I am unable to find either. Could you point me in the direction of the location of each? -- 23:09, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

You can email me by clicking "E-mail this user" over here <-----, assuming you are registered. As to statistics, start at Wikipedia:Modelling_Wikipedia's_growth and root around from there.--Brad Patrick 16:49, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
Ah, that's why then. I'm not registered because I'm trying to limit what I register to and I haven't seen much need to edit pages so far. Also, after looking around on that page, I see only statistics regarding articles, which is unrelated to the statistic I am looking for. I'm trying to compare Wikipedia's usercount to DSmeet's (soon to be ABXY's) usercount after an equivalent duration of existence. -- 19:12, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Checkuser Privacy[edit]

I've fielded several questions on IRC lately regarding the importance of privacy regarding the checkuser permission, and in order to give those who have similar questions some answers, wrote up a draft of m:Checkuser Privacy on Meta. If you have a moment, would you mind giving it a peek and seeing if I've covered all the important bases and if there are any beans issues that perhaps I'm overlooking or places where it should be expanded? Or for that matter, if the whole thing should be scrapped? :)

Thanks for your time! ~Kylu (u|t) 02:46, 5 October 2006 (UTC)[edit]

This article is full-protected, since August 15, with the message "pending rewrite; legal issues". Can you check on the status of this? —Centrxtalk • 22:16, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

It has been noted that is an WP:OFFICE action. However, the article itself is not categorized as such. Might this be updated while issues are resolved? -- Kesh 03:11, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
I updated the {{protected}} to {{office}} --Trödel 15:13, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Honoring Nazi and Al-Qaeda copyrights[edit]

(cross-posting my question from the policy pump)

Why are we honoring Nazi and Al-Qaeda copyrights? Examples:

Is it even legal under U.S. law to honor these? Does the Foundation have an opinion? - CrazyRussian talk/email 03:18, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

IANAL, but as signatories of the Berne Convention I'd imagine the copyrights are still quite in force in the U.S. TINLA. ~Kylu (u|t) 18:33, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
As a signatory to the Berne Convention, yes the copyrights are very much in force. In fact the copyrights of content created by a (recognized) terrorist would still belong to him. But such a person or organization cannot make a legal representation for himself in the US. 15:01, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Drug dealer using Wikipedia for advertising.[edit]

See here. Does simple reversion suffice? Possibly should the dif be deleted? Does Wikimedia have any obligation to contact the police about this? JoshuaZ 20:18, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

It could be a hoax on these people to get them in trouble or just a joke. —Centrxtalk • 20:24, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
Revision has been deleted, the anon contributor has been blocked for 24 hours by Antandrus. ~Kylu (u|t) 04:29, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
Looks like the situation has been corrected. Thanks.--Brad Patrick 11:23, 10 October 2006 (UTC)


Brad I'm looking for help with a user abusing the system, would you be so kind as to contact me? --Edited By a Professor of Life 01:29, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Your situation is already being handled elsewhere. ~Kylu (u|t) 03:19, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Fair use images in portal namespace[edit]

Hi Brad, could you take a look at this and give your opinion? Wikipedia:Fair use/Amendment/Fair use images in portals ... It hasn't been clear to me for some time why it is ok to use fair use on the main page (which is just a portal IMO) but not in other portals. Some examples of fair use images on the main page:

There's a poll on the talk page of the amendment, but I think that is rather silly, I think we should follow the advice of the Wikimedia lawyers, which would be you :) So I think your input here would be very helpful. Take care, jacoplane 20:43, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for responding. I actually agree with you that we should not seek to compromise our ambition of creating a Free encyclopedia, even if the law permits us to use fair use materials. I just hope that the same standards will be applied in the future for the main page as for other portals, since the inconsistency can be rather frustrating. Cheers, jacoplane 05:01, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

John Doolittle[edit]

I think that talk:John Doolittle article could do with a little homily from foundation on undue weight as applied to knocking copy. Guy 22:07, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Editor's individual legal responsibility for their edits[edit]

Hello there, and thanks for all the work you do for us! I was wondering if you could weigh your legal opinion in over here: there's a discussion regarding blanked pages and the legal responsibility of reverting editors to make sure that the article that they're reverting the blanking to is free of libel. As none of us are lawyers, some clarification could be helpful if you have a free minute to put your thoughts down (the idea of being held liable for reverting vandalism is something that has some ramifications for us, so I know that I at least would love some "official" guidance on the issue). Thanks very much for your time, Snoutwood (talk) 19:22, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Your participation would be appreciated. There are statements to the effect that editors and admins who revert articles to versions that may contain unknown libelous content could be held responsible for that content as if they were the original author of it. That standard would have a chilling effect on the patrollers who revert obvious vandalism, and have the paradoxial effect of leaving more defamatory content in articles. -Will Beback 04:32, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
Whoops... sorry, I missed the banner on the top of this page. Sending you an e-mail. Snoutwood (talk) 06:43, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

"Food for thought" ... Pacific Western University[edit]

I'm not sure you ever saw my response to your "food for thought" response on my user page to the PWU query I'd left on your talk page a few weeks ago. I've asked this article be unprotected, at least briefly to allow adding the draft article I prepared. Feel free to veto, edit, approve or ignore as you see fit. --A. B. 22:10, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Shoot on sight policy (AKA Corporate vanity policy enforcement)[edit]

Hi Brad.

I am relatively new to Wikipedia, but I have already, through my new page and recent edits patrolling, become quite familiar with the guidelines.

I have recently started reminding fellow new page patrollers to go easy on the newcomers by also placing the speedy deletion template on the user's talk page. However, the shoot on sight edict is being used as an excuse to be rude to the newcomers.

May I request, if it has not already been done, that the policy guidelines are updated to reflect the sentiments expressed in the edict? If they have been updated, would you be able to point me in the right direction, as I have searched unsuccessfully?

May I also suggest that if Wikipedians were less aggressive and more welcoming that the number of phone calls from "self-aggrandizing authors screaming bloody murder" would be reduced.


LittleOldMe 12:36, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

About disputed POVs on articles related to post-communist Eastern Europe[edit]


I’m writting this message to you, and to User:Mindspillage and User:Joy, because I still don’t have a full knowledge of how to proceed about Wikipedia administration/mediation/arbitration.

Well, I see there’s a kind of probelm regarding the creation (by myself on november 8) of the article 1999 NATO bombing of Serbia, which I’ve redirected to NATO bombing of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia. There’s an edit war going: pro-Serbian users are trying to delete my redirect, and even when people (including myself) manifested against the deletion, the user which requested the deletion made the request again.

Please if you can help me to solve this question.

PS: Above all these problems, I don’t know about you, but I think sometimes there’s a kind of “Serbian Volunteer Guard Cabal” of users here in Wikipedia that try to make Wikipedian articles related to Serbia, Kosovo and Yugoslav Wars appear clearly pro-Greater Serbian/pro-Milosevic POV, making these articles to show an interpretation of facts very different from most of the press and academic sources around the world. A similar thing is happening now on Transnistria article, that show a clear pro-Transnistrian government POV, with a long war of arguments going on the discussion page of the article. Well, I don’t know what you can (or can’t) do about all of this, but if you have some answers pplease write to me. Best regards, --MaGioZal 13:53, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

I am so completely not the right person to address these issues...sorry.--Brad Patrick 20:00, 10 November 2006 (UTC)


FYI, I've sent an email to you regarding a foundation legal issue. JoshuaZ 00:16, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

Fishing expeditions[edit]

I posted the following to Wikipedia talk:Requests for checkuser#Fishing expeditions

I know that we generally don't just run checkuser to see who posted certain comments, but came across this death threat and thought I would bring up the issue. Should checkuser be used to identify and block vandals that perform specific eggregious acts. For example:

  • posting user's name address phone number and children names (in the edit summary as well)
  • death threats
  • threatening lawsuits against Wikipedia

My view is that we should in some cases - i.e. we shouldn't have to identify potential socks if there are multiple instances of any of the above. I know a "I'm going to kill you" said in haste (or as an excited utterance) is probably not a true threat. But wikistalking followed by a threat to kill - we should treat as a potential threat and deal with the user more harshly. --Trödel 20:37, 21 November 2006 (UTC) |} User:Essjay suggested we get your opinion on when specific egregious acts could justify a checkuser request without pre-identification of suspected sockpuppets. Addionally, if the threat involves minors, there may be an additional duty imposed on editors from child protection acts to report such violations (especially those editors who may meet the definition of a professional in their local jurisdiction). (cross posting to the Juriwiki-l mailing list) --Trödel 19:07, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

My suggestion to consult you was based on this comment

Death threats are legally considered assault (not to be confused with battery), which could be a felony in some jurisdictions. List them in the IP check section and ask for the results to be forwarded to the appropriate law enforcement agency. Failure to do this could be considered misprision of felony. Jesse Viviano 20:21, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

It occurs to me that before we begin having scores of requests to run checkusers and pester the FBI, we should have a decision from the Foundation counsel on our legal responsibilities and Wikipedia's best practice in such a situation. Essjay (Talk) 03:23, 24 November 2006 (UTC)
I replied. Thanks.--Brad Patrick 23:39, 24 November 2006 (UTC)
Thank you Brad. :) Essjay (Talk) 00:23, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
Yes thank you --Trödel 01:05, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

National Portrait Gallery claiming copyright[edit]

Brad, I wanted to bring your attention to this, just posted to WP:AN:

I'm not certain where to post this, but an IP registered to the National Portrait Gallery (London), (talk · contribs), seems to pop up every few months to slap on a copyright violation directly at the top of certain articles ([1] [2] [3]), most recently yesterday at William Herschel (as such). This strikes me as extremely unprofessional if, in fact, the person really does represent the NPG. I left a note, but I believe this calls for direct attention by admins, if for the copyright question if nothing else. Thank you. --CalendarWatcher 16:54, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Is this something you or someone at the Foundation would want to look into? Thanks. Chick Bowen 17:23, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Not sure if this is normal....[edit]

Hi there Brad, ive just found something on a different site i think is a bit odd, but im wondering if wiki admins know about it. I was bored, and did a yahoo search for squadnleedah, which as far as i can make up is fairly unique. A couple of the usual hits came up, but then i saw a strange one coming up under, a site i have never had anything to do with let alone signed up for. What it showed was a direct copy of the page Category:User ubx-3 . I had a play and it seems either they have a complete copy of the wikipedia on their site, or are directly linking their pages with yours, because they have a fully working wikipedia on their site. Is this normal? I saw your name on the admins list, and with the extra bit on your name there i figured you might be the best to ask :) Cheers, Chris Squad'nLeedah 20:22, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Chris, see Wikipedia:Mirrors and forks (hope you don't mind if I respond to this one, Brad). Chick Bowen 21:54, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Proposed Admin Oversight Board[edit]

On the list of Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals, some time ago, I created a proposal for an Admin Oversight Board. It generated a lot of response, much of it rather heated, with no clear consensus, and is currently residing in a kind of limbo. I was wondering what if anything you thought of the idea. If you find it to be irrelevant or at best probably less than useful, please remove it from the list. If you think that it has any potential, but requires rephrasing, I would be very grateful if you could fix the phrasing. Basically, I have the feeling that your opinion in this matter is probably the best informed of anyone out there, and am quite willing to accept whatever decision you might come to. Thank you for your attention in this matter, and my apologies if I placed this comment on the wrong page. Badbilltucker 15:30, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Indefinite blocking of User:Fordmadoxfraud[edit]

When sources such as Reuters are reporting on the Iranian sex tape scandal, I am unclear on how NPV reporting of said event here on Wikipedia is a blockable offense? If the idea that Iran might stone (or, well, actually, lash) a woman to death (or, well, 99 times, but then, stoned, as in killed makes for better condemnation) for a sex-tape offends you, that might be better taken up with Iran than the person who wrote a researched & annotated article about the incident? How does a discussion about the posting of link (a link originally removed by Ford MF, but reinstated as per his understanding of Wikipedia:Pornography) result in an indefinate block? Even if the link bears removal per Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons, blocking a user for good faith & NPOV contributions on a controversial subject is hardly appropriate. Well, I suppose he can always appeal his block by writing to...I guess that would be you. I guess my point is simply that rewarding a user with close to a thousand edits who has tried to follow WP policy while keeping a NPOV (along side being flamed in non-Wikipedia context) with a block does not seem to me to be the best course of action. --mordicai. 21:26, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Two things - I spoke with someone by telephone today who is deeply concerned that the effect of this posting will be (a) Iran banning Wikipedia outright (b) the jeopardy of the life of the woman involved. This person has already been in contact with Jimbo, who I have asked to do what he thinks is right. I responded to a real-life threatening situation and popped Ford MF pending further investigation. This doesn't need to be decided until Jimbo takes a look at what happened and weighs in. Further, Ford MF's swooning over Jimmy commenting on his "work", plus his own pride in making an "international incident" on his blog [4] make me uninterested in encouraging him to contribute to this article. I am at pains to say, what is the point here? Having a link, so the rest of the non-Iranian world can see video, but thereby condemning a woman in Iran to death? Count me in the group that would first seek to do no harm, *then* address the broad and controversial thicket of issues around the topic as a whole. People in jeopardy for their lives is serious indeed. I don't see that the benefit outweighs the risk at all.--Brad Patrick 21:55, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for the quick reply, Brad. Firstly, as to (a) on Iranian Wikipedia banning. Censorship in Iran (an article on FMF's created/heavily contributed list, by the way) seems to state that Iran has already banned Wikipedia. As to (b), Reuters & the The Guardian UK have both reported on the story. While the woman is in danger of 99 lashes, I don't think a media black-out of the event is likely to serve her interests best. As to Ford's swooning over Jimbo's edit, I hardly think that the recognition of internet celebrity or mention of the event in his diary are cause for your disdain. What you interpret as pride for making an international incident seems more to me like good-natured chagrin. His Livejournal was flamed on a number of occasions for his work on the article, from a number of different IPs in seperate nations. It is a misrepresentation of his contribution to focus on the link to the video, especially since he did not add it originally, & in fact removed it initially until reverting his removal as per his understanding of Wikipedia's pornography policies. Not only that, he created a forum on the talk page to discuss the validity of the link. Considering that most of the other content on the page is his, a ban for a link, especially one already removed by another editor (in this case, Jimbo) seems like a false move. The argument about whether the link is fit content is superfluous to the discussion of FMF's block. Making a judgement on an editor due to the controversial nature of a subject would seem to encourage putting blinders on, rather than careful dealing with the subject. Whether or not the link is fitting, Ford MF consulted policy & edited accordingly. Punishing him because Iran has capital punishment for adultery is, I believe, a mis-step, as would ignoring the subject of the "sex-tape incident." An act more in-line with care & caution on the subject would be to lock the article (already semi-protected, on FMF's suggestion), rather than to ban a user who's edit history has no evidence of bad faith. I understand that you have passed the authority on to Jimbo, but I wanted to make my point known. --mordicai. 22:29, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for taking the time.--Brad Patrick 21:42, 18 December 2006 (UTC)


Hi Brad! I have been contributing extensively to wikipedia for some time now and feel I have come up with somethin that could potentially be huge that would be of enormous benefit to the world.

I propose a new major sister project of wikipedia WikiLanguages or WikiLinguistics which specializes in the teaching of all languages. I have looked over the internet and have found some sites which do have several of the major languages giving knowledge of learning them but this wuould be huge and would provide all the information for learning languages such as most of the 250 languages that already have wikipedias. Learning a language is a major infomration source but wikipedia does not have this in detail. I beleive this wikipedia sister project would be developed into an extremwely valuable resoruce not only for achieving knowledge of major languages but also other world languages which are not always readily available to learn.

If it is created I would hope that say five years down the line we should have the ultimate language learning resource in the world. If everybody contributes from their respective countris and knowledge of their languages we could see a resource which could allow you to potentially become fluent in hundreds of languages. Ernst Stavro Blofeld 12:08, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

I strongly beleive this is what providing free easily accessible information is what wikipedia is all about and think this is an extrmely valuable component missing from the Wikipedia Foundation. E.g if I wanted to learn Norwegian or Czech or FInnish at the highest possible level or whatever this resource would be there to provide this knowledge. WikiLanguages would be divided into 250 or whatever massive sub projects e.g WikiFrench WikiSpanish WikiNorwegian WikiFinnish WikiDutch WIkiItalian WIkiPortuguese WIkiThai WikiJapanese etc etc dedicated to providing an English encylopedia of languagesErnst Stavro Blofeld 12:13, 21 December 2006 (UTC).

Imagine if this major sister project could incorporate translation technology - imagine the immese benefit for learning but also for tranlsation from foreign wikipedias. This would be a highly useful tool for Wikipedia itself. The site could also incorpate audio technology so the resoruce would not only provide you with the detail to reading and writing a language fluently but provide you with the knoe how to pronouncre and speak a language well. Ernst Stavro Blofeld 12:28, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Please let me know if you think this is a good idea. I would like to organize a proposal petition with the top wikipedia foundation administrators to decide to start this. WikiLanguages would also provide specializes knowledge of localized dialects or whatever -the ultimate global language resource.

Bondpedia Advertising[edit]

I am a representative of 'Bondpedia' (Bondpedia - James Bond encyclopedia). A wiki-based James Bond encyclopedia and we need to advertise. I was thinking, can I advertise on Wikipedia's 'James Bond' article where we will atract most of the good bond fans that we need? please

--Highfields 13:58, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

ps. reply via my talkpage please

--Highfields 14:55, 28 December 2006 (UTC)