Talk:Albania

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GDP not correct[edit]

As Wikipedia estimates in the "Albanian Economy" page, the GDP of Albania is 25.035 billion $, not 24 as in the "Republic of Albania" page. The GDP per capita, is not adjusted and above all, doesn't reflect the change in population, with the actual resident population 2.83 mln and not 3,1 mln, as in "Wikipedia" actual estimate. You can consult my findings in Albanian Institute of Statistics, www.instat.gov.al. The laters publication of census, also shows an reductions in greek minority, in 0.87% of total population and fall of percetange of muslim religion, in 56%.

Suggestion by klevisgjoni@yahoo.com

Poorly explained revert[edit]

About this [[1]] the sentence begins with "large parts of Albanians believe...." But no citation supports this view. Most important is that this part recycles the previous sentence: nationalists, various intellectuals organizations and political parties in Albania have expressed their concern that the census might artificially increase the number of Greek minority, which might be then exploited by Greece and it follows this almost recycling the same Large parts of Albanians, similarly fear irredentist claims on northern Epirus following Albanians changing their nationality to Greek due to monetary and other benefits. The same meaning (with the exeption of "large parts" which is unsourced).

Last but not least the results of this census are known to the public, so the entire part is useless. As far as I know this was added even before the preliminary results of the 2011 were known, so each side had some reasons to fear.Alexikoua (talk) 19:36, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Then remove the Large word , but not the sentence as it is multisourced . For more WP:REMOVAL and WP:IDONTLIKEITGjirokastra15 (talk) 19:48, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

(ignore trolling) As I've said this is completely unsourced (the so-called "large parts") and if not properly sourced (with exact quotes) it will be soon removed.Alexikoua (talk) 19:51, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Using your logic then the part of the 300.000 ethnic greeks should be removed because we have the official census results . I kindly ask you to see WP:IDONTLIKEIT and WP:REMOVAL thoroughly . Removal of sourced ( in fact more than 5 sources ) , unique and essential content would make me report you . I hope you will relfect . Gjirokastra15 (talk) 20:01, 9 September 2014 (UTC)
I agree with Alexikoua. None of these sources supports the sentence. This is source falsification and original research WP:OR. If you revert again, I will file an edit-warring report about your conduct. Δρ.Κ. λόγοςπράξις 20:14, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Removal of well referenced text and copyvio[edit]

With this edit (diff) well referenced text was removed from the article justifying it with wp synth. The removed text provides necessary background of the establishment of the Prizren League. It was initially supported by the Ottomans (also confirmed by the tertiary source already used in the article) and based on the religious solidarity of Muslim landlords and people connected with the Ottoman administration who emphasized Muslim solidarity and called for defense of Muslim lands, including present-day Bosnia and Herzegovina. This was the reason for naming the league The Committee of the Real Muslims (Albanian: Komiteti i Myslimanëve të Vërtetë). The source used to support this assertion is contemporary (2006) source published by the Central European University Press and authored by multiple authors specialized in the subject. It is obvious that WP:SYNTH accusation is not justified so I will restore removed text.

Besides removal of well referenced text the same editor probably created a wp:copyvio issue by copying the text from the 2007 source to the article (diff), instead of rewording it. That is why I will also restore the version of the text before creation of the copyvio issue.--Antidiskriminator (talk) 12:38, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

You are massively trolling the Albanian section . I could write exactly here , what you have done , but i prefer to forward this matter to wikipedia noticeboard ( changing the text not in accordance with sources , wp synth , POV pushing , and removing other sourced material ) . Here for example you have changed the text , while the source was saying word per word this sentence > > control until AD 548 when the lands now known as Albania began to be overrun from the north by an ever increasing numbers of Slavs who gradually settled in the western Balkans < .

Said otherwise , you present a source here , yet you write totally different stuff from the sources presented . What is even more ridiculous , is that you fill up a whole paragraph with that POV pushing not sourced non sense of yours . Said even more simple the texts that you write do not comply AT ALL with the sources that you bring ....

Gjirokastra15 (talk) 16:48, 16 October 2014 (UTC)
You accused me for changing of the text of the sources. To avoid copyright violations editors can not copy/paste "word by word" what sources say. Wikipedia editors have to change the text of the sources. I used multiple secondary contemporary sources to support the text I added, so your accusation that text I added is "not sourced non sense" of mine is not justified. Gjirokastra15 Please revert yourself.--Antidiskriminator (talk) 17:10, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

Please familiarize yourself with WP:NOTRELIABLE , WP:SELFPUBLISH and generally WP:VERIFICATION ! Until you provide verifiable sources here , do not change anything , until it can be verifiable . It can be that simple .

Yet again i see that Alexikoua , as always present where trouble is , reverted the edit in your favor . So as per consensus we leave it as it is , said otherwise your text has been restored , and yes that text is sourced enough , and reasonable , although it needs some minor clarifications which i will contribute when i ll have the time for it Gjirokastra15 (talk) 19:07, 16 October 2014 (UTC) (edit conflict)

Pointing to list of policies and guidelines does not justify your removal of well referenced text (diff). With your edits you removed multiple reliable secondary sources written by experts in the subject whose works are extensively used in articles on wikipedia. They include:
  • Kopecek, Michal; Ersoy, Ahmed; Gorni first4=Vangelis, Maciej; Kechriotis; Manchev, Boyan; Turda, Marius (2006), Discourses of collective identity in Central and Southeast Europe (1770-1945) 1, Budapest, Hungary: Central European University Press, p. 348, ISBN 963-7326-52-9, retrieved January 18, 2011, The position of the League in the beginning was based on religious solidarity. It was even called Komiteti i Myslimanëve të Vërtetë (The Committee of the Real Muslims)... decisions are taken and supported mostly by landlords and people closely connected with Ottoman administration and religious authorities..  |first6= missing |last6= in Authors list (help)
  • Elsie, Robert. "Albania under prince Wied". Archived from the original on January 25, 2011. Retrieved January 25, 2011. pro-Ottoman forces ...were opposed to the increasing Western influence ...In November 1913, these forces, ..., had offered the vacant Albanian throne to General Izzet Pasha ... War Minister who was of Albanian origin. 
  • Jelavich, Barbara (1999) [1983], History of the Balkans: Twentieth century 2, Cambridge, United Kingdom: The Press Syndicate of University of Cambridge, p. 103, ISBN 0-521-27459-1, retrieved January 25, 2011, peasants..willing listeners to Ottoman propaganda... attached the new regime as a tool of the beys and Christian powers 
  • Vickers, Miranda (1999). The Albanians: a modern history. I.B.Tauris. p. 81. ISBN 978-1-86064-541-9. He gathered round him a group of discontented Muslim priests ... and proclaimed himself the savior of Albania and the Champion of Islam. 
  • Elsie, Robert. "Albania under prince Wied". Archived from the original on January 25, 2011. Retrieved January 25, 2011. ... mostly volunteers from Kosova under their leader Isa Boletini 
Will you please be so kind to revert yourself.--Antidiskriminator (talk) 19:20, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

1 more time , the text has been already reverted by user alexikoua , what is so hard to understand ??????Gjirokastra15 (talk) 19:31, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

  • The text:

    when the lands now known as Albania began to be overrun from the north by an ever increasing numbers of Slavs who gradually settled in the western Balkans.

was a verbatim copyvio from the reference. Please do not restore. I will check for more copyvios. Δρ.Κ. λόγοςπράξις 19:41, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

Hmmm , you changed it to > The territory remained under Roman (Byzantine) control until the Slavs began to overrun it from 548 and onward, <

Yet it should be written as > The territory now known as Albania remained under Roman (Byzantine) control until the Slavs began to overrun it from 548 and onward, <

I think that part is essential , and it does not constitute a copyvio ... Unless any objections , i will change it to that format Gjirokastra15 (talk) 19:45, 16 October 2014 (UTC) (edit conflict)

Thanks Δρ.Κ. Gjirokastra15, please stop with IDHT. No doubt you saw that less than third of 6,612 characters of the text you removed (diff) were restored by another editor (diff). Will you please be so kind to restore remainin part of the well referenced text you removed from this article. Thank you and all the best.--Antidiskriminator (talk) 19:48, 16 October 2014 (UTC)
(edit conflict) @Gjirokastra15: Hmmm , you changed it to... Please understand that I did not change it to anything. I simply restored the old version and erased your copyvio. Δρ.Κ. λόγοςπράξις 19:51, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

Edit warring to insert double images of Skanderbeg I and Skanderbeg II[edit]

With this edit Gjirokastra15 edit warred to replace appropriate maps of Albania which are here for years with images of Skanderbeg I and II which are already found in this article further in the text, in appropriate gallery. This is (another) violaton of long standing consensus, WP:BRD and WP:MOS. Gjirokastra15, will you please be so kind to revert yourself? Please read what is written at the top of this page about editors who repeatedly or seriously fails to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process. --Antidiskriminator (talk) 15:14, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

I see no violation whatsoever . In a paragraph talking about Skanderbeg i placed a photo of Skanderbeg ( the most important Albanian national hero , and a symbol of Albania s resistance .... )! You see it can be that simple . On the other hand , you have taken the initiative of writing in total 40.000 kbts of text for the Albanian history on your own in a period of 3 days . Please refrain yourself from not standing accusations ... Gjirokastra15 (talk) 15:39, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Regarding the term occupation[edit]

The source Morrock, Richard (11 October 2010). The Psychology of Genocide and Violent Oppression: A Study of Mass Cruelty from Nazi Germany to Rwanda. McFarland. p. 55. ISBN 978-0-7864-5628-4. The nationalist Balli Kombetar, which had fought against Italy, made a deal with the German invaders, and formed a “neutral” government in Tirana which... 

>and then it continues by saying word per word > Italy invaded and occupied albania...... ( and keep reading from there ) Page 55 !

So i fail to see why did you revert my edit Alexikoua? It says multiple times that Albania was occupied and invaded ... For what is worth this was from the source that Antidiskriminator already brought here ...

Gjirokastra15 (talk) 15:46, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Section about the Communist Era needs revision[edit]

It reads as incredibly biased right now. Portraying the entire Communist era in a negative way. That is not in keeping with the impartial neutral tone expected of an encyclopedia article. I am aware the people likely editing this page are biased but still, they need to control themselves. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.158.163.211 (talk) 01:29, 30 November 2014 (UTC)