Talk:Prime minister

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
WikiProject Politics (Rated Start-class, High-importance)
WikiProject icon This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.
Start-Class article Start  This article has been rated as Start-Class on the project's quality scale.
 High  This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.
 

are the external links here all necessary?[edit]

I would suggest moving the external links to more specific pages, rather than linking to every official prime ministerial page in the world from this one. For example, move http://www.premier-ministre.gouv.fr/en/ from here to Prime Minister of France; move http://eng.forsaetisraduneyti.is/ from here to Prime Minister of Iceland; and so on. Any objections? --Delirium (talk) 20:42, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

List of prime ministers by country[edit]

The removal of Palestine from the list of PM's by country has been reverted and the following message left on my home page. Surely this article discussion page is a better place for the explanation.

Hi. I reverted your last edit to that article, I'm afraid. You removed Palestine from the list of prime ministers by country, arguing that Palestine is not a country. While this is obviously technically true, I don't think it is an uncontroversial edit. As such, I think you should discuss on the talk page first whether or not Palestine should be removed from the list. If, then, consensus is reached that it should be removed, you are of course very free to remove it again. I hope this is okay with you, and you should by no mean think that your contributions are not appreciated. -Lilac Soul (talk • contribs • count) • I'm watching this page so just reply to me right here! 16:43, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Doright (talk) 17:40, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Lilac Soul, justifying your inclusion of Palestine in the List of Prime Ministers by Country, by asserting your belief that correcting the list is not an "uncontroversial edit" is inadequate. Please feel free to provide a substantive argument for why an entity that is not a country should be included in the list of Prime Ministers by Country. Your demand that your (as yet) unjustified reversion, should stand, a priori, is not supported by WP policy. I am therefore restoring the correction to the list. I hope this is okay with you, and you should by no means think that your contributions are not appreciated. Doright (talk) 18:01, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
It's a list of Prime Ministers. Palestine has a Prime Minister so it should be listed here. Catchpole (talk) 18:09, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Not quite. It is a list of PM's by country. Palestine is not a country. However, the Palestinian National Authority does have a person identified as PM, but it also is not a country. I have therefore now corrected the list to say "Government" instead of "Country," so that an entry might be included for this PM. I have also corrected the identified government to Palestinian National Authority from Palestine. It would be nice if, consistent with WP recommended guidelines, there was some effort to improve edits rather than merely reverting. Doright (talk) 18:42, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Catchpole, I see you immediately reverted not only my earlier edit, but now my current edit which was an attempt to both correct errors and still accommodate your POV. Ironically, even the link in your POV version of the list showing Palestine as a country is redirected to the article Prime Minister of the Palestinian National Authority not List of Prime Ministers of Palestine. You are linking to an article that does not exist because Palestine is not a country and does not have a Prime Minister. It's not that complicated. Please revert yourself or explain what you are doing. Doright (talk) 21:23, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Catchpole must have reverted you by mistake, since he knows as well as anyone that Palestine is not a country, and the List of Prime Ministers of Palestine is a redirect to Prime Minister of the Palestinian National Authority. I've fixed both problems. One day there might well be a country called "Palestine", and then we'll have to update the list. Please take more care in the future, Catchpole. Jayjg (talk) 00:16, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
You better let the United Nations know then, so they can tell the 100 odd countries that recognise Palestine that they're incorrect. Catchpole (talk) 09:05, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
You know, I went to the United Nations website, and looked in its list of member states, and it didn't mention Palestine as one of them. In any event, there is no such office as "Prime Minister of Palestine", there is only an office of "Prime Minister of the Palestinian Authority". Jayjg (talk) 01:43, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Okay, I originally reverted Doright's edit, so I guess it's time for me to jump in here. First of all, I did not originally put Palestine on the list, so please don't take all of this as me being a priori in favour of including Palestine. However, I think the argument that it is a "list of prime ministers by country" is flawed. Yes, it currently says "Country" in the header of the table, however, nothing in the article as a whole indicates that only countries are allowed on the list. The opening paragraph of the article says A prime minister is the most senior minister of cabinet in the executive branch of government in a parliamentary system. Whatever Palestine may or may not be, it certainly has a parliamentary system and a person designated prime minister. As such, I think it is probably correct to include Palestine on the list, but perhaps to fix the table heading to read "Country or terrority" or some such thing. -Lilac Soul (talk contribs count) 21:40, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

  • Edit Ah, I see that Doright had already done this, but that it was reverted along with something else. I'll put back Doright's "government" change. Is that okay with everyone? If not, feel free to revert my edit and come back here and discuss some more. -Lilac Soul (talk contribs count) 21:43, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

I see no reason to keep Palestine out. Timeshift (talk) 21:49, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Except that it's not a country - not yet, at any rate. However, the Palestinian National Authority has a Prime Minister. Jayjg (talk) 00:16, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Lilac Soul, there were two parts to my correction that tries to accommodate your POV. You only restored one. What part of my [explanation and demonstration] that the Palestinian National Authority has a PM, not Palestine do you not understand? Did you even bother to click on the links that I provided you? Why do you insist on linking to a redirect? Did you try clicking on the link in your current version of the article? It redirects you to Prime Minister of the Palestinian National Authority, not Prime Minister of Palestine. Please restore my correction to the list that has been reverted. Doright (talk) 23:57, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Well, I was not the one who reverted your edit. I simply changed back to Government rather than Country. As for the link now pointing to a redirect, that should of course be fixed, and I'll happily do so, but please note that I was not the one reverting your second edit. -Lilac Soul (talk contribs count) 10:29, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Suggestion for lists section[edit]

I don't think we need information about the articles about the PMs of the countries here. It might be useful if it was a separate list article, but as a section of a larger article about PM positions in general it's unnecessary. Removing this info might allow us to restructure the list into two columns to take up less of the valuable article space. The section could alternately be changed to include some quick comparative facts about the position in each country. 67.181.62.180 (talk) 07:39, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Disagree. Timeshift (talk) 08:13, 2 June 2008 (UTC) PUTIN IS NOT THE CURRENT PRIME MINITER OF RUSSIA —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.169.34.52 (talk) 15:27, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

Legislative powers?[edit]

Are special legislative powers given to a prime minister? Do they or do they not have any sort of veto power over legislative bills that are not passed by a super majority, as US presidents and most American state governors have? All the article states is that a Prime Minister, "is expected with other ministers to ensure the passage of bills through the legislature." That does not clarify the degree of equality with which they are expected to pass bills, though the article does explain that a PM is "among equals". They are certainly not equal in executive power. How unequal are they in legislative power? This is not to confuse executive power to write decisions in accordance with legally proscribed executive authority with what effect a PM has upon legislative bills. Nor is this really concerning how a PM may often be given more time of discourse during sessions of parliament. Samuel Erau (talk) 08:25, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Really late reply ;). A prime minister is largely equal in terms of procedure within the parliament or the cabinet (other than being chairperson of the cabinet). However, by virtue of being the political leader, they have a lot of influence in legislative and executive bodies. Further, by virtue of being a party leader, they may have the power to expel members from their parties' caucuses, which can be extremely damaging to a member's political career. The head of state of a country with a prime minister usually holds various special legislative and executive powers (formation, dissolution, and prorogation of parliament; appointment and maybe dismissal of some legislators and of cabinet ministers; veto or limited veto over the passage of legislation; setting the legislative agenda...), the use of which can be to varying degrees directed by the prime minister. The degree to which a prime minister can/does leverage these powers determines how "equal" they are, which can change over time and between individuals. Caveat: my analysis is largely influenced by Westminster prime ministers, as these are the ones I'm most familiar with. SteveMcQwark (talk) 05:18, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Capitalisation[edit]

There seems to be some inconsistency, and possibly some confusion about spelling rules. My understanding is that the term "Prime Minister" either takes capitals for both words (Prime Minister), or for neither word (prime minister; except when this general use happens to be the start of a sentence: "Prime ministers come in many shapes and sizes".)

The article is titled "Prime minister", but wouldn't it be more correct to have "Prime Minister"? -- JackofOz (talk) 00:40, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

While I agree that either both or neither word is capitalized, the capitalized form is obviously when the phrase is a proper noun. The intro's not talking about any one PM! So I will be WP:BOLD and uncapitalize it. You can "mercilessly revert" me if you want, but please explain here! :D :D 118.90.25.253 (talk) 07:00, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
And I intend to uncapitalize even more terms right now. - Hordaland (talk) 11:44, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Milo Đukanović.jpg[edit]

The image Image:Milo Đukanović.jpg is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check

  • That there is a non-free use rationale on the image's description page for the use in this article.
  • That this article is linked to from the image description page.

This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --07:48, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Needs editing[edit]

IMO this article needs a very careful editing to make sure that statements about monarchs, monarchies and parliaments either are specifically British or are general, and that this is clear in the text. - Hordaland (talk) 13:22, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

education support[edit]

-PM or--- Hello Every body, This is massage from Nepal. This is one of the poor country in asia. only 30 percent are literate. people are living in stone age. we want to change it but not getting any support. we want to make it change it. so request you all to support economocally or technically. we are ready to support your plan that you make for us. contact us analogueturist@yahoo.com thankyou —Preceding unsigned comment added by 113.199.138.54 (talk) 09:56, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Weeding Prime Ministeral images[edit]

It seems to me that this picture gallery of every serving Prime Minister we can get a picture for has got out of all proportion. Do we really need twenty four different images?

Do they actually add anything to the article, telling the reader about Prime Minsters in general rather than in many, many specific and individual cases? There are far too many images there. Of course selectively weeding them out would be incredibly controversial - just what criteria do you use to decide who gets on the list - so I'll go one step further. I think we can get rid of the whole lot without losing anything of substance from the article. CrispMuncher (talk) 21:29, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

I wanted to suggest removing the photo of Julia GIllard (Australia), who is currently the incumbent PM following a close election, a result which could change at any time. Since this could soon be an outdated reference for a "current Prime Minister", and if we are looking to cull the photo gallery (which extends just past the length of the article on my screen), I thought this would make a good candidate for removal. However, when I made this edit, Timeshift9 reverted it (for reasons which I understand, as Gillard is still PM for now). If this stays, someone will need to remember to update this if/when the prime minister-ship changes hands. sroc (talk) 04:39, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Regional heads of Government[edit]

It seems to me that many of the Chief Ministers should be removed, since most of them are regional heads of government and not national ones, nor do they have the title of Prime Minister. There is already the Chief Minister page for them.Jkmyoung (talk) 16:12, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

File:PM-Yingluck.jpg Nominated for Deletion[edit]

Image-x-generic.svg An image used in this article, File:PM-Yingluck.jpg, has been nominated for deletion at Wikimedia Commons in the following category: Deletion requests September 2011
What should I do?

Don't panic; a discussion will now take place over on Commons about whether to remove the file. This gives you an opportunity to contest the deletion, although please review Commons guidelines before doing so.

  • If the image is non-free then you may need to upload it to Wikipedia (Commons does not allow fair use)
  • If the image isn't freely licensed and there is no fair use rationale then it cannot be uploaded or used.

This notification is provided by a Bot --CommonsNotificationBot (talk) 09:37, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Entry in to office[edit]

Japan[edit]

Is Prime Minister of Japan in the right category? Our article suggests that while the PM is first elected by the Diet, the are then formally appointed by the Emperor which suggests they belong in the same category as Ireland to me. I'm guessing as with the Taoiseach, the appointment is entirely ceremonial (i.e. the emperor can't appoint someone else or refuse to appoint a PM elected by the Diet) but from tje PMoJ article it does sound like the emperor makes the formal appointment. Nil Einne (talk) 12:00, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

Thailand[edit]

From Prime Minister of Thailand I'm also not convinced Thailand is in the right category. The description there isn't entirely clear to me but it sounds more like an Ireland or perhaps Spain type situation (it's not clear how someone formally becomes nominee to me). To be fair, Thailand has gone through so many constitutions perhaps things have changed and sources are confused. In particular, it's not clear whether either this article or the PMoT article are referring to the situation after the 2007 constitution Nil Einne (talk) 12:29, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

Suspected vandalism by User 115.147.64.63[edit]

It seems that this user has been very busy lately, removing the pictures of several current PMs, If he/she continues there will be none left. I have tried to undo some of the edits but the pictures don't come back. I hope someone is watching as I suspect this same IP has been used to vandalise many other articles.Jodosma (talk) 12:13, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

PRC premier[edit]

Removed statement that there is a foreign/domestic split. It's more of a CEO/COO relationship. Roadrunner (talk) 02:41, 9 April 2013 (UTC)